Author Topic: Snake loads (Read 4244 times)

44 Man · « **on:** April 21, 2013, 02:54:04 AM »

Well, got some changes going on. We live in Michigan 6 months and winter in an RV in Texas 6 months. Except now we have rented a house just outside of Medina TX, in the hill country. So we will now be staying 8 or 9 months down there and will become Texans (Texans are not politically correct and they don't care! Love it!) in the next couple years. So now that we are staying into the 'hotter' months, snakes are a real concern according to the locals. We will have both rattlesnakes to deal with and cotton mouths since we are right by the river. (nice location!) I picked up some .38 speer shot capsules for the snubby, and I bought a box of Speer Blazer shot cartridges for the Charter 44 spl truck gun. Of course this is the 'Single Action' forum so my next concern is .45 colt shot loads for the (soon to be cut from 5 1/2"), 3 1/2" SAA. I have loaded some shot loads before using #9 and gas checks. I didn't feel these were too useful here in Michigan as I was trying to down starlings at the bird feeder. The range was 10 to 15 feet and I never was able to bring down a starling, so I went back to my Single Six for them. But I will need something for ranges from 5 to 7 feet for a snake. Do you have any experience? Is the gas check method acceptable (have you priced those lately! Wow!), or would I be better getting some Speer shot capsules for the .45 also? Any experiences are appreciated. Thanks! 44 Man

Oldshooter · « **Reply #1 on:** April 21, 2013, 03:11:07 AM »

Quote

Speer shot capsules for the .45

Thats what I use, Thing is, dont use enough of them to make a fuss about it. One or two a month is all.
dont cha just love the hill country. I like my S&W governor with an assortment of 45 and 410 loads in it. I keep a shotshell in position just for our slithery friends. A rattle can make your adrenaline pump for sure.

bulletstuffer · « **Reply #2 on:** April 21, 2013, 04:01:59 AM »

I'm not familiar with the gas check method but those speer shot capsules work great on snakes! I've used them in a 38 and 44 with 9 shot. I use the recipe printed on the box. A lot easier dispatching a snake with one of those than trying do it with a prairie dog rifle at point blank range when you forget to bring your side arm

Best of luck to you down in Texas,

Bulletstuffer

tacklebury · « **Reply #3 on:** April 21, 2013, 03:37:18 PM »

Hey bud. I've been making quite a few of these Speer style in .45 Colt and use them at point blank ranges out to 10 foot or so with great success. I get about a 6" pattern at 6 foot with #6 shot. By 10 foot it's opening up and starting to donut from the rifling. I like #6 for it's general usefulness on small game as it has a bit more heft. I use 6 gr. Unique powder and I set the capsule so it's just short enough to fit inside the cylinder and allows it to spin. I didn't have any luck in longer rifled barrels, like my .45 Colt carbine, however, due to the increased donating. Good luck and hope this helps.

Oldshooter · « **Reply #4 on:** April 21, 2013, 03:46:32 PM »

Quote from: tacklebury on April 21, 2013, 03:37:18 PM

Hey bud. I've been making quite a few of these Speer style in .45 Colt and use them at point blank ranges out to 10 foot or so with great success. I get about a 6" pattern at 6 foot with #6 shot. By 10 foot it's opening up and starting to donut from the rifling. I like #6 for it's general usefulness on small game as it has a bit more heft. I use 6 gr. Unique powder and I set the capsule so it's just short enough to fit inside the cylinder and allows it to spin. I didn't have any luck in longer rifled barrels, like my .45 Colt carbine, however, due to the increased donating. Good luck and hope this helps.

Uhhhh! put me down for a box o those Pardner!

Ranger99 · « **Reply #5 on:** April 21, 2013, 04:05:29 PM »

don't overlook the copperheads.
they're the most dangerous to
me because they're the hardest to
spot until you're right on top of them.
at least rattlers give a courtesy buzz
(most times

)

i've never used enough of the pistol
shotshells to justify loading them.
most all the ones i've had to dispatch
get a sharp shovel or hoe. the cci's i've
used do a good job. i'm told it's because
of the smaller shot they use.

good luck

Oldshooter · « **Reply #6 on:** April 21, 2013, 04:14:36 PM »

One note of caution! Rattlers are developing a no rattle policy (some out west are telling me) due to the Feral hogs hearing the rattle and locating them with it. I have always wondered.... if they find em and eat em....... how do the others know not to rattle?

Ranger99 · « **Reply #7 on:** April 21, 2013, 04:27:34 PM »

rural legend.

FPH · « **Reply #8 on:** April 21, 2013, 05:14:26 PM »

Quote from: Ranger99 on April 21, 2013, 04:27:34 PM

rural legend.

Not according to the G&F.....natural selection, if you don't rattle you live to pass on your traits.

FPH · « **Reply #9 on:** April 21, 2013, 05:23:48 PM »

I use CCI shot in .45.....patterns well.

Oldshooter · « **Reply #10 on:** April 21, 2013, 05:27:41 PM »

Quote from: FPH on April 21, 2013, 05:14:26 PM

Quote from: Ranger99 on April 21, 2013, 04:27:34 PM
rural legend.

Not according to the G&F.....natural selection, if you don't rattle you live to pass on your traits.

Ahhh! make sense! Haven't seen one quiet yet but ya never know!

FPH · « **Reply #11 on:** April 21, 2013, 06:20:27 PM »

Big news story in San Antonio Media last year. Ranch hand I know who hunts Hogs in Hill Country says rattlers are worse on the dogs he runs Hogs with.

Blackhawk44 · « **Reply #12 on:** April 22, 2013, 06:57:36 PM »

To make your shot loads far better, order a 5lb bag of #12 shot. Works far better than even #9. Growing up in Texas we were taught to watch the ground ahead of our steps rather than the next bend of the trail. Eyes to the ground, and never walk through brush. Walk around it. Really, even wearing a handgun in the brush for the last 50 years, a nice light stiff cane or walking stick works as well as anything. Just a tap on the head will do the trick. Its not too noisy either.

handi270 · « **Reply #13 on:** April 25, 2013, 05:59:32 AM »

Agree on the walking stick option. Grew up on the Red River in so. Ok. Killed many a rattler with a salt cedar stick, some as short as 24 inches.

Larry L · « **Reply #14 on:** April 25, 2013, 07:29:01 AM »

We had a ranch about 15 miles south, southwest of where yer at. We were off of the Tarpley to Hondo hiway. The county line of Bandera and Medina was at the front gate. We didn't have the snake problem as apparently you do. We'd see an occasional rock rattler but that was about it. Our other place though at Rossville seemed to be covered with snakes- copperheads, rattlers, corals, kings, coach whips, you name it I think we've killed them over the years. My normal carry gun when clearing brush was a 357 Python with #9 shot capsules I loaded. At about 5 feet, you could kill a snake pretty reliably. At 7 feet, it got iffy. If you have a larger caliber pistol yer gonna carry more lead in the air and it's going to be valuable to you. A 45 Colt seems like a good choice. Or if you can pickup a Contender with a 45/410 barrel would be a dandy. Mummies Feed Store in Hondo carries Rio shotgun ammo. They have the 36 caliber ammo that's just perfect for the 410 Contender as it carries a full load of lead at target velocities. A Contender can be carried on the hip or a shoulder holster. A snake Charmer is also a good option but a clumsy carry piece. I'll second or third the walkin' stick. They can be handy when you run across a bunch of tarantulas.

44 Man · « **Reply #15 on:** April 25, 2013, 12:50:02 PM »

Larry L, thanks for the information. I do have a couple of .45 single actions but my wife and I can keep the .38's with us most of the time. I do have a Charter in .44 spl and I bought a box of the Speer 44 shot ammo for that. The Charter is the 'truck' gun but I could keep it handy and put one of the .38's in the truck or a 1911. We'll just have to see how bad they are when we get back there. When we stayed at Koyote Ranch on the county line between Kerr and Bandara county they would see several rattlers and an occasional coral snake in the summer. Copperheads were not a problem there but where we are at in Medina is just off the river and I definitely will watch for them. And Tacklebury, those are some really impressive .45 colt shot loads. Now are you going to tell me you have a snake problem there in Mt Pleasant?
We do have a couple of walking sticks that you can pull the rubber tip off and that will expose a pointed steel tip for use on whatever is needed. But those won't be handy to keep with us as we work outside around the house while a handgun can be easily kept at 'hand'. Thanks guys, I appreciate all the advice. 44 Man

tacklebury · « **Reply #16 on:** April 26, 2013, 07:24:46 PM »

Nope, I got sick of fat little squirrels trying to climb me on opening morning or rough grouse trying to walk past me when I had my deer rifle. So I put one of these little buggers 4th & 5th in my Ruger .45 Colt and just have to rotate the cylinder a bit to line one up and bang dead squirrel.

theratdog · « **Reply #17 on:** April 27, 2013, 02:42:17 AM »

man i priced those shot shells the other day they are real pricey. i have two boxes i have not tried yet.

Oldshooter · « **Reply #18 on:** April 27, 2013, 04:08:22 AM »

They are pricey, but i rarely use one and I even get em to cycle in my 45 clock acp. with that thing I could hold off a banzai charge of cotton mouths!

popplecop · « **Reply #19 on:** April 27, 2013, 11:47:26 AM »

What's a rough grouse, think a deer rifle might be better for them. Just kidding, in Wisconsin it would be ilegal to shoot them with a handgun.

gcrank1 · « **Reply #20 on:** April 28, 2013, 09:03:52 AM »

The Rough Grouse probably lives in the same hood as the Highman Udad's that held us up for food ramson once........
Hey PC, its finally spring in WI today!
44Man, I wouldnt trust a 22shot load to do anything but irritate any of the rattlers Ive ever been near up here (yes, we have 'em, though rarely seen enough that people dont think about them). I often walk with n old alum. ski pole sans the snow ring at the bottom (salvaged from the local recycle center), it is a great walkin' stick and I practice flippin' sticks off my path so a snake would be at least a pole's length away from me if I see it (and that is close enough!).

Mike in Virginia · « **Reply #21 on:** April 30, 2013, 03:31:48 PM »

I'll get some flack over this, but I'm an old man, so take it easy. Try to keep in mind that with age comes a little wisdom. Very little in my case, but unless a man is going out snake "hunting," he does not need snake loads or a snake gun. I've got timber rattlers and copperheads galore in the mountains where I live, but I've never needed to shoot one to save me from getting bit. If you have time to draw your gun and shoot, you've got time to step back.

Not that you shouldn't kill the hateful things, but protection from a snake bite does not and never has come in the form of a firearm. If you see him, and he hasn't yet struck, you're okay in the sense that you can't shoot him quick enough to keep him from getting you. At least that's been my experience. I've killed them with sticks and rocks and guns, but I never had to do it to keep from getting bit.

As a side note, I was once bitten by a rattler while searching for bait in a small stream. He wasn't in the stream, but nearby, and he struck as I reached for a lizard. I was armed at the time, but that didn't save me.

With snakes, the trick is to not get bit. Do so by watching for them before you step. If you do get bit, it won't be by one that you saw before he saw you. Well, nearly so. You might see him an instant before, but not nearly soon enough to do anything about it.

44 Man · « **Reply #22 on:** May 01, 2013, 05:32:01 AM »

Mike, that's good wisdom for sure. The snake loads are not for 'protection' as such, but for eradicating them from around the deck and the rocky areas near the house we are getting. I'm told they are plentiful in the area and I just want to try to keep 'our area' clear of them. Not going looking for them either but when I find one, I will give him the option of co-existing with me. Thanks to you all (or should I say all y'all) for your input, I have found it very helpful. Thanks again. 44 Man

Larry L · « **Reply #23 on:** May 01, 2013, 08:02:14 AM »

Quote

[size=0px] Not going looking for them either[/size]

Wrong!. When you first move in you better be looking for them or you'll find them in the house and garage. The absolute best thing you'll ever do is go by the Animal Shelter in Bandera and pick up about 3 female cats and just turn them loose at the house. Feed them in the AM only and you probably won't have any snakes. Cats love playing with snakes and will kill them if they have a hunger. Females cats will stay, males will be leaving shortly after you turn them loose looking for females all over the county. Make sure they have water and enough food the first week and you won't be able to run them off. Good for bugs and mice too. After the first week cut the food down where they have the need to hunt. That's how country Texans handle it.

reliquary · « **Reply #24 on:** May 01, 2013, 09:50:38 AM »

I've been off the net for a while and just noticed this thread. Several points of agreements:

For occasional use by someone who doesn't want to set up to reload, CCI shot loads are about as good as it gets. They are expensive, but available.

When I do handload them for my .45C, I use #6 shot and a moderate load of Unique, to get the heaviest shot & densest pattern on target. I don't plan on shooting snakes over 5-6' away from me...biggest reason is the patterns open up too much to be reliable after about that distance, in just about every handgun I've used.

No snake load I've ever used in a pistol is 100% reliable, one-shot-kill-every-time, not even the Judge I used to have or the Governor I currently have. Most often, I carry an ASM .45C with CCI shotcaps...we live on a public lake and have more than our share of cottonmouths.

A good outdoor cat is a valuable companion.

My experience has been that shot loads in a .38 snubbie are almost useless. .22LR "ratshot" in any pistol is even worse. Most folks in the neighborhood just use a .22 handgun with HPs...simplicity works.

Oldshooter · « **Reply #25 on:** May 01, 2013, 10:06:12 AM »

Quote

or the Governor I currently have.

I love my Governor, If ya want effective the 410 # 5's or 6's work. I like to carry a couple in the cylinder first and then 4 LC's
I dont worry about any snakes but moccasins, they dont warn ya (you can smell em, if you are aware) and they are aggressive rascals. This may hurt feelings but i shoot big rattlers and mocassins on sight! Just a personal policy, call it a character flaw if ya wanna. If they are around my home or camp they are expendable.

gcrank1 · « **Reply #26 on:** May 01, 2013, 12:39:50 PM »

44, maybe ya should look for somebody who does rent pigs

'Uva Uvam Vivendo Varia Fit'

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #27 on:** May 03, 2013, 12:39:57 AM »

Heck pal it might be a good excuse to buy a new gun. I hate those rossi 410 handguns but it might be just the ticket for what your doing. Im sure a 3 inch or even 2 1/2 inch 410 would be vastly superior to anything you could make up. Either that or get your but back up here to Gods country where he wouldnt allow those things to roam!!

kynardsj · « **Reply #28 on:** May 03, 2013, 01:04:26 AM »

Like tacklebury I have some 45 LC's loaded with the shot capsules but mine have #8 shot in them. At 10 ft a snake is history.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #29 on:** May 03, 2013, 02:21:06 AM »

I have seen 410 shot gun shell cut down and when roll crimped were the right size to fit the chamber of a 45 Colt . Never tried them. I use the Speer capsule and have had good luck with them. Also tried Remington 45 ACP snake loads and they were not as good as the Speer. I have used factory Speer loads in 22 LR, 9mm, 40 S&W, 38/357, 44 spl./mag , 45 ACP and 45 Colt. I have never killed a rattle snake with a shot load so can't reflect on that but have killed quite a few copperheads some over 40 inches long. Most were killed with 38/357 speer loads anywhere from 4 to 10 feet. To be honest I have found the loads in a J frame with 2 inch bbl. work the best. When I load them myself ( they are pricy ) I just get some shells with 9 , 10 or 12 shot and cut them open. I have also tried 7.5 and 8 shot. Not sure why but a short bbl seems to work best.