Cali gov signs bill to speed up gun confiscations.

[powderman]

California governor signs bill to speed up gun seizures  Published May 02, 2013
Associated Press     

•    June 30, 2011: California Gov. Jerry Brown signs the state budget. (AP)

SACRAMENTO, Calif. –  Gov. Jerry Brown announced Wednesday that he has signed legislation expanding the ability of state agents to seize firearms from nearly 20,000 Californians who are not allowed to have them.
 
They collectively own more than 39,000 handguns and 1,670 assault weapons but are prohibited from owning firearms because they have been convicted of crimes, ruled mentally unstable or are subject to domestic violence restraining orders.
The bill authorizes $24 million for the state Department of Justice's Armed and Prohibited Persons program. The money will go to hire more agents to confiscate the weapons and reduce the backlog over the next three years.
 
The program, which is unique to California, cross-checks five databases to find people who bought weapons they are no longer legally allowed to own.
SB140 by Senator Mark Leno, D-San Francisco, authorizes $24 million to hire more agents to confiscate the weapons and reduce the backlog over the next three years.
The bill is the first of numerous firearms bills introduced by lawmakers in response to recent mass shootings in Connecticut and Colorado. The Democratic governor signed the bill without comment.
 
"California is leading the nation in a common-sense effort to protect public safety," Attorney General Kamala Harris, who oversees the state Department of Justice, said in a statement.
U.S. Rep. Mike Thompson, a Democrat from St. Helena, introduced HR848 earlier this year to create a U.S. Department of Justice grant program for states that want to develop similar programs.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/05/02/california-governor-signs-bill-to-speed-up-gun-seizures/?intcmp=HPBucket#ixzz2S8ngGd2n

[coyotejoe]

How many times have we heard "we're not out to take anybody's guns"? That bit about "cross checking five data bases" to learn who has guns illegally is the scary part because California sets trends which spread like cancer. I have long wondered how long it would take my state to get around to cross checking hunting licenses against the list of persons prohibited firearms.

[mcwoodduck]

So we now have a police agency that is actually doing what it is supose to do and take firearms out of the hands of people that have been incriminated.  Of course it will first go after anyone like us that has a restraining order by a vindictive newly ex wife.  But we now have proof that instant back ground checks do not work, that waiting periods do not work.  As clearly a few throusand people were sold guns that are not allowed.  This is what the NRA has asked for for a long time.  Making sure that the firearms are taken from the people that are not allowed to have them.  As this is being done it will get the smart ones to walk into gun shops and sell what they have legally so they will get $ for the gun rather than have it taken and more court troubles. 

[powderman]

Out of 20,000 supposed criminals there will almost assuredly be some who will fight and be killed, probably taking a few enforcers with them. How have they determined that 20,000 KNOWN gun owners are now illegal?? This could get bloody.
Headlines, convicted armed felon shot and killed in shootout with police, or whoever the duty is assigned to. The antis will love this. Bad times  coming. POWDERMAN. 

[Lizzie-6]

How many times have we heard "we're not out to take anybody's guns"? That bit about "cross checking five data bases" to learn who has guns illegally is the scary part because California sets trends which spread like cancer. I have long wondered how long it would take my state to get around to cross checking hunting licenses against the list of persons prohibited firearms.

Which category of prohibited violent offenders would you wish to remain armed?

[Lizzie-6]

Out of 20,000 supposed criminals there will almost assuredly be some who will fight and be killed, probably taking a few enforcers with them. How have they determined that 20,000 KNOWN gun owners are now illegal?? This could get bloody.

Headlines, convicted armed felon shot and killed in shootout with police, or whoever the duty is assigned to. The antis will love this. Bad times  coming. POWDERMAN. 

This is not a new law.  It is the governor authorizing funding to enforce a laws which have been on the books for decades.  He's correcting an unfunded mandate.

Some California firearms owners have disqualified themselves from eligibility to possess firearms.  They already know who they are.  Under existing law, there are a number of remedies such a person can take to be in compliance.  Most have already implemented a work-around solution that is appropriate to their individual situation. 

The governor is merely notifying them to get their stuff squared away before he has to send someone out to square it away for them.  It won't get bloody.`Few firearms will be confiscated, most will remain in private collections, and in practical terms, access to these items will remain unchanged.

Governor Brown would not take this step without Senator Diane's blessing.  If good enough for her, it's good enough for you.

[mechanic]

My only question is, since it is technically illegal for them to create a database of registration, what databases will they use.  The hunting license is one, as mentioned, but they could be using a bow.....
 
I really want guns out of the hands of those who should not have them, but I find myself distrustful of those who make that distinction....
 
Ben

[Lizzie-6]

My only question is, since it is technically illegal for them to create a database of registration, what databases will they use.  The hunting license is one, as mentioned, but they could be using a bow.....
 
I really want guns out of the hands of those who should not have them, but I find myself distrustful of those who make that distinction....
 
Ben

All FFL dealers are required to document every sale they make.  Police agencies document every firearm reported stolen, and those used as evidence and their  subsequent disposition.  In California, some folks voluntarily registered certain types of semiauto rifles in the 80's and 90's, but most did not.  Naturally, those who did not will not be getting a visit from the gun narcs.  Private sales are almost never documented. 

I was not aware that hunting licenses included firearm-specific data like caliber, serial numbers and such.  Can anyone shed some light on this?

[powderman]

I really want guns out of the hands of those who should not have them, but I find myself distrustful of those who make that distinction....
 

 
BEN, my point exactly. I sincerely doubt that most officials are competent enough to make life altering decisions like that. Libbys should not be able to make decisions like that, they are sickos to begin with. POWDERMAN. 

[mcwoodduck]

The people that they are checking are three fold.
1) the people that have restreaining orders against them.  The problem with a restraining oreder is you are not convicted of anything.  It is He/ she said and you could loose rights because of what someone thinks you could do not will do. 
2) people that have been convicted of a crime that had purchased a firearm in the past and have pleaded down jail time but are sill a felon.
3) People that have been adjudicated to be 5150. 
In the state of CA it is illegal ot load a handgun to others.  You can loan a rifle or a shotgun for a time, but if they find a handgun in your posetion that is not registered to you, they confiscate it.  You are not allowed to sell a handgun with out going through an FFL.  If you inherit a pistol or you move to the state you have to pay a fee and do a self registration for all handguns.  The state has a data base of what handgun you own by model and serial .  They also have a data base if you wanted to buy a long gun, but may not have the model and serial depending on the year you requested fro mthe state a back ground check. 
As we know a state even if it is not supose to keep a data base, with computers does. And everytime my drivers license is swiped into the computer for a back ground check they know who I am.
One of the guys at the club reciently was buying a handgun a month for the last year and a half.  thinking the conservitive view of the law as one gun a month as you should buy one a month not limited to one a month,  He was going to mexico for his wifes family stuff.  The police showed up  with a warrant and want to see all the handguns he had purchased over the last 18 months as they thought he was muling guns there. 

[Lizzie-6]

I really want guns out of the hands of those who should not have them, but I find myself distrustful of those who make that distinction....
 

 
BEN, my point exactly. I sincerely doubt that most officials are competent enough to make life altering decisions like that. Libbys should not be able to make decisions like that, they are sickos to begin with. POWDERMAN. 

At the state level, voters elect officials to make laws.  Police are hired to enforce those laws.  District attorneys prosecute the offenders.

You have every right to say your elected officials are incompetent sickos.  You elected them.  Some of your remarks make me wonder how old you are. 

[Lizzie-6]

One of the guys at the club reciently was buying a handgun a month for the last year and a half.  thinking the conservitive view of the law as one gun a month as you should buy one a month not limited to one a month,  He was going to mexico for his wifes family stuff.  The police showed up  with a warrant and want to see all the handguns he had purchased over the last 18 months as they thought he was muling guns there.

This sounds a bit odd.  A warrant to "see" all the handguns he purchased over the last 18 months?  What "police" agency served a silly ass "warrant" like that?  Sound more like an April Fools stunt or bachelorette party to me.  How did your guy "deal" with his "cops"?

Beyond that, so what if a search turns up ZERO of the handguns registered to a private citizen.  No California law states that registered owners must store their firearms in California, or even in the United States.  California does not care where guns are stored as long as they're not in California.     

[coyotejoe]

My only question is, since it is technically illegal for them to create a database of registration, what databases will they use.  The hunting license is one, as mentioned, but they could be using a bow.....
 
I really want guns out of the hands of those who should not have them, but I find myself distrustful of those who make that distinction....
 
Ben

All FFL dealers are required to document every sale they make.  Police agencies document every firearm reported stolen, and those used as evidence and their  subsequent disposition.  In California, some folks voluntarily registered certain types of semiauto rifles in the 80's and 90's, but most did not.  Naturally, those who did not will not be getting a visit from the gun narcs.  Private sales are almost never documented. 

I was not aware that hunting licenses included firearm-specific data like caliber, serial numbers and such.  Can anyone shed some light on this?

In Colorado and I suspect in most states one buys a license for a specific season, archery license for the bow season, muzzleloader license for the black powder season and rifle license for the rifle season. Of course the license does not reflect specifics as to identify a particular rifle or shotgun but it does indicate that a person holding that license is probably in possession of a rifle or shotgun.
 As to what sort of "criminal" I would like to see armed I agree with McWoodduck that probably the vast majority of those prohibited persons have never been convicted of any crime but are just under a restraining order and while it is theoretically possible to get one's rights restored after having them taken, in practice it can be a very long drawn out, frustrating and expensive bit of legal wrangling. Many people are not even aware they are prohibited unless they attempt to buy another firearm and find they are "refused". No genuine bad guy is going to attempt to purchase from a dealer because they know they cannot pass a background check, only the unwary will fail a background check and they usually have no idea as to why they failed.
 Personally I like the system we see in old western movies where the guy has done his stretch in Yuma Prison and as he walks out the gate the warden hands him back his gun. I know that probably never really happened but I do think that a person who has served his time, paid his "debt to society" should be again endowed with all rights of citizenship including his right to bear arms.
 And as to our having elected these incompetent sickos, I doubt that anyone except yourself and perhaps one or two others on this forum ever voted for Jerry Brown or any Democrat. We unfortunately are subject to the "tyranny of the majority".

[mcwoodduck]

One of the guys at the club reciently was buying a handgun a month for the last year and a half.  thinking the conservitive view of the law as one gun a month as you should buy one a month not limited to one a month,  He was going to mexico for his wifes family stuff.  The police showed up  with a warrant and want to see all the handguns he had purchased over the last 18 months as they thought he was muling guns there.

This sounds a bit odd.  A warrant to "see" all the handguns he purchased over the last 18 months?  What "police" agency served a silly ass "warrant" like that?  Sound more like an April Fools stunt or bachelorette party to me.  How did your guy "deal" with his "cops"?

Beyond that, so what if a search turns up ZERO of the handguns registered to a private citizen.  No California law states that registered owners must store their firearms in California, or even in the United States.  California does not care where guns are stored as long as they're not in California.   

He said it was local Sheriffs department.  He said the cops were very cool about it. The multiple trips to mexico data base and the multiple hand gun back ground checks had the police asking where the guns were.  He said they looked, they counted, and they thanked him and left. 
IN CA you are not allowed to loan out a handgun so all of his handguns needed to be in his control. 

[Lizzie-6]

One of the guys at the club reciently was buying a handgun a month for the last year and a half.  thinking the conservitive view of the law as one gun a month as you should buy one a month not limited to one a month,  He was going to mexico for his wifes family stuff.  The police showed up  with a warrant and want to see all the handguns he had purchased over the last 18 months as they thought he was muling guns there.

This sounds a bit odd.  A warrant to "see" all the handguns he purchased over the last 18 months?  What "police" agency served a silly ass "warrant" like that?  Sound more like an April Fools stunt or bachelorette party to me.  How did your guy "deal" with his "cops"?

Beyond that, so what if a search turns up ZERO of the handguns registered to a private citizen.  No California law states that registered owners must store their firearms in California, or even in the United States.  California does not care where guns are stored as long as they're not in California.   

He said it was local Sheriffs department.  He said the cops were very cool about it. The multiple trips to mexico data base and the multiple hand gun back ground checks had the police asking where the guns were.  He said they looked, they counted, and they thanked him and left. 

IN CA you are not allowed to loan out a handgun so all of his handguns needed to be in his control.

This still seems odd to me.

"Multiple trips to Mexico database"?  These sheriffs actually claimed there was such a thing?  California residents can drive in and out of Mexico, multiple times per day, without even showing a driver's license.

Would you care to state the county which these "sheriffs" claimed to represent?  If true, it's an outrageous and inexcusable act of harassment.  Why would any self-respecting firearms owner sit still for that?  Isn't that why folks join the NRA?

The "...not allowed to loan out a handgun..." line is a total red-herring.  Unless one has actually "...loaned out a handgun...", there is no way anyone can prove he has done so.  For the purpose of safe-keeping, a private citizen can store a firearm anywhere he wishes, and cannot be required to disclose the location.  Naturally, if your boy holds an FFL, other rules apply.


Deleted
Baiting is a no no! ............Moderator

[mauser98us]

They  are amongst us. Any time you leave the country your barcode on your legal document is swiped. Easy to see who comes and goes.

[FPH]

"Multiple trips to Mexico database"?  These sheriffs actually claimed there was such a thing?  California residents can drive in and out of Mexico, multiple times per day, without even showing a driver's license.


Deleted
Baiting is a no no! ............Moderator


I find that hard to believe.  We are required to present a passport these days in order to gain access to Mexico (Juarez) and the economy is largely based on trade between El Paso and Juarez.  We had a media push alerting everyone to the fact that a passport would be required.......no exceptions(busy Courthose and Post Offices).  Gone are the days of 5 cent crossings.  You canh get a fast pass where you are preapproved and use a designated lane.

[mcwoodduck]

One of the guys at the club reciently was buying a handgun a month for the last year and a half.  thinking the conservitive view of the law as one gun a month as you should buy one a month not limited to one a month,  He was going to mexico for his wifes family stuff.  The police showed up  with a warrant and want to see all the handguns he had purchased over the last 18 months as they thought he was muling guns there.

This sounds a bit odd.  A warrant to "see" all the handguns he purchased over the last 18 months?  What "police" agency served a silly ass "warrant" like that?  Sound more like an April Fools stunt or bachelorette party to me.  How did your guy "deal" with his "cops"?

Beyond that, so what if a search turns up ZERO of the handguns registered to a private citizen.  No California law states that registered owners must store their firearms in California, or even in the United States.  California does not care where guns are stored as long as they're not in California.   

He said it was local Sheriffs department.  He said the cops were very cool about it. The multiple trips to mexico data base and the multiple hand gun back ground checks had the police asking where the guns were.  He said they looked, they counted, and they thanked him and left. 

IN CA you are not allowed to loan out a handgun so all of his handguns needed to be in his control.

This still seems odd to me.

"Multiple trips to Mexico database"?  These sheriffs actually claimed there was such a thing?  California residents can drive in and out of Mexico, multiple times per day, without even showing a driver's license.

Would you care to state the county which these "sheriffs" claimed to represent?  If true, it's an outrageous and inexcusable act of harassment.  Why would any self-respecting firearms owner sit still for that?  Isn't that why folks join the NRA?

The "...not allowed to loan out a handgun..." line is a total red-herring.  Unless one has actually "...loaned out a handgun...", there is no way anyone can prove he has done so.  For the purpose of safe-keeping, a private citizen can store a firearm anywhere he wishes, and cannot be required to disclose the location.  Naturally, if your boy holds an FFL, other rules apply.


Deleted
Baiting is a no no! ............Moderator

OK when you drive back into the US they make note of your passport.  And yes the state department does track your movements back into the country. 
And if you loan me a hand gun and I do something stupid with it you are introuble.  If I am pulled over and the police ask to run the serial numbers of the guns (a CHP office did this with my SHOT GUNS at my last speeding ticket when I comming back from a wounded warrior fund raiser shoot and told the cop when he asked whare I was comming from than then gave me attatude when I said the east and west when he asked where I was headed)  If I had one your your handguns in my car with out you it is a NO no in CA.  Now if we were on the range and you were there I can shoot what ever you have.
Oh and part of the Assault weapons registration is I am not allowed to let anyone under 18 shoot or handle my registered assault weapons.  It is a felony to do so,   
There is a book the size of a NYC phone book on how to stay out of trouble and own a gun in CA.
On of my friends drove a 240Z and had his glock in the car (unloaded nothing in the mag) and a box of ammo the gun was in a case and locked the box of ammo was in a papper bag as he did not shoot all of it at the range.  Police pulled him over saw the gun and arrested him.  Gun was with in reach (the whole car was with in reach) and the ammo was not locked up.  Gun was locked up.  Lost the glock as part of the plea bargin. 
Now with the guy nad hte Sherifs department I am just telling you what he said at the range.  It could have been Riverside, Orange, Or San Bernardino I did not ask. 
SO tomorrow is the club shoot in Corona if you want to meet him and talk to him PM me and you can come out and shoot with him.

[Lizzie-6]

SO tomorrow is the club shoot in Corona if you want to meet him and talk to him PM me and you can come out and shoot with him.

That club shoot would not happen to be out at Mike's would it?

[FPH]

  California residents can drive in and out of Mexico, multiple times per day, without even showing a driver's license.\

You may be able to get into Mexico without a passport, but you ain't gettin back to the USA without one.

[Lizzie-6]

  California residents can drive in and out of Mexico, multiple times per day, without even showing a driver's license.\

You may be able to get into Mexico without a passport, but you ain't gettin back to the USA without one.

Simply incorrect. 

I was born in the USA.  I have NEVER been issued a passport by ANY country.  I have crossed in and out of the USA at San Ysidro and Calexico, both on foot and as the operator of a privately owned vehicle.

[FPH]

  California residents can drive in and out of Mexico, multiple times per day, without even showing a driver's license.\

You may be able to get into Mexico without a passport, but you ain't gettin back to the USA without one.

Simply incorrect.  I have NEVER been issued a passport by ANY country.  I have crossed in and out of the USA at San Ysidro and Calexico.

When?  Heck I use (operative word use) to cross back and forth on a daily bases......try it Monday.  I don't go to Mexica aymore since they started killing about 10,000 folks a year.

[FPH]

   http://gomexico.about.com/od/entryrequirements/f/need_passport.htm

[mcwoodduck]

SO tomorrow is the club shoot in Corona if you want to meet him and talk to him PM me and you can come out and shoot with him.

That club shoot would not happen to be out at Mike's would it?

Just south of there near lake mathews.  Would you like to go?

[mcwoodduck]

  California residents can drive in and out of Mexico, multiple times per day, without even showing a driver's license.\

You may be able to get into Mexico without a passport, but you ain't gettin back to the USA without one.

Simply incorrect. 

I was born in the USA.  I have NEVER been issued a passport by ANY country.  I have crossed in and out of the USA at San Ysidro and Calexico, both on foot and as the operator of a privately owned vehicle.

When?  four years ago I had to beg to get back in when I was comming from Canada.  And had to explain why I did not have a passport. 

[Lizzie-6]

  California residents can drive in and out of Mexico, multiple times per day, without even showing a driver's license.\

You may be able to get into Mexico without a passport, but you ain't gettin back to the USA without one.

Simply incorrect.  I have NEVER been issued a passport by ANY country.  I have crossed in and out of the USA at San Ysidro and Calexico.

When?  Heck I use (operative word use) to cross back and forth on a daily bases......try it Monday.  I don't go to Mexica aymore since they started killing about 10,000 folks a year.

Late 80's & 90's.  Not since.  Even had my car searched at San Ysidro by pre-ICE, pre-DHS, border patrol.  They found my Colt Sporter and three mags (no ammo).  We were detained for several hours while they verified our ID and that rifle had not been reported stolen.  We were granted entry with the rifle and an apology from the station supervisor.

What else were they going to do, turn us away?  San Ysidro station is located IN California.  We both had valid California driver licenses.  My friend was actually born in Costa Rica, but no one asked and he volunteered nothing.

[FPH]

I my area they are adamant about the passport.  However, in your area there seems to be some controversy.  If I'm wrong my apologize.

[FPH]

  California residents can drive in and out of Mexico, multiple times per day, without even showing a driver's license.\

You may be able to get into Mexico without a passport, but you ain't gettin back to the USA without one.

Simply incorrect.  I have NEVER been issued a passport by ANY country.  I have crossed in and out of the USA at San Ysidro and Calexico.

When?  Heck I use (operative word use) to cross back and forth on a daily bases......try it Monday.  I don't go to Mexica aymore since they started killing about 10,000 folks a year.

Late 80's & 90's.  Not since.  Even had my car searched at San Ysidro by pre-ICE, pre-DHS, border patrol.  They found my Colt Sporter and three mags (no ammo).  We were detained for several hours while they verified our ID and that rifle had not been reported stolen.  We were granted entry with the rifle and an apology from the station supervisor.

What else were they going to do, turn us away?  San Ysidro station is located IN California.  We both had valid California driver licenses.  My friend was actually born in Costa Rica, but no one asked and he volunteered nothing.

For your weapon infraction you would spend months i prision now.  The even held a Police officer for two weeks here for violating the border with his weapon while in "HOT" pursuit of a stolen vehicle.

[Lizzie-6]

SO tomorrow is the club shoot in Corona if you want to meet him and talk to him PM me and you can come out and shoot with him.

That club shoot would not happen to be out at Mike's would it?

Just south of there near lake mathews.  Would you like to go?

It that range called Maywood?

[Lizzie-6]

  California residents can drive in and out of Mexico, multiple times per day, without even showing a driver's license.\

You may be able to get into Mexico without a passport, but you ain't gettin back to the USA without one.

Simply incorrect.  I have NEVER been issued a passport by ANY country.  I have crossed in and out of the USA at San Ysidro and Calexico.

When?  Heck I use (operative word use) to cross back and forth on a daily bases......try it Monday.  I don't go to Mexica aymore since they started killing about 10,000 folks a year.

Late 80's & 90's.  Not since.  Even had my car searched at San Ysidro by pre-ICE, pre-DHS, border patrol.  They found my Colt Sporter and three mags (no ammo).  We were detained for several hours while they verified our ID and that rifle had not been reported stolen.  We were granted entry with the rifle and an apology from the station supervisor.

What else were they going to do, turn us away?  San Ysidro station is located IN California.  We both had valid California driver licenses.  My friend was actually born in Costa Rica, but no one asked and he volunteered nothing.

For your weapon infraction you would spend months i prision now.  The even held a Police officer for two weeks here for violating the border with his weapon while in "HOT" pursuit of a stolen vehicle.

Those guys did not even suggest an infraction for the rifle.  What could it possibly be?  Failure to declare sporting equipment?   They found nothing else and let us roll.