Author Topic: Metallurgy questions.  (Read 463 times)

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Offline Anna

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Metallurgy questions.
« on: May 30, 2013, 03:36:49 PM »
My dad had some firearms that dated back to the early 19 and 1800s. They are in great shape
but does gun metal fatigue over the years? Someone told me the broom Broom handle and the
Lugers would and the metal becomes very brittle. Is there any truth to that?
Also the two Colt SAA's are one first gen. and the other is a 2nd.
If this is true are American built firearms just as bad about this as the German ones are?
To me steel is steel but I thought it better if I ask. Thank you I knew some of you would know.




Offline mechanic

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Re: Metallurgy questions.
« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2013, 04:05:33 PM »
Anna,
 
There are literally hundreds of types of steel, but all older steels have some common characteristics.  The metal in  the older guns is usually safe with black powder level loads, but not always.  Shooting a gun until it's overheated will dramatically alter the integrity of the steel.  Other factors may as well.  The older steels were more "brittle" than modern steels, and will stress fracture more easily.
 
I recommend you contact Colt with your question, and more important have the guns inspected for any signs of stress, and shoot low level loads.
 
Personally, if they are otherwise in good shape, I would not be afraid to fire them.
Ben
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Offline Victor3

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Re: Metallurgy questions.
« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2013, 12:10:06 AM »
My dad had some firearms that dated back to the early 19 and 1800s. They are in great shape
but does gun metal fatigue over the years? Someone told me the broom Broom handle and the
Lugers would and the metal becomes very brittle. Is there any truth to that?

Also the two Colt SAA's are one first gen. and the other is a 2nd.
If this is true are American built firearms just as bad about this as the German ones are?
To me steel is steel but I thought it better if I ask. Thank you I knew some of you would know.


 With few exceptions, 'modern' carbon steel gun parts made 150 years ago (if left alone and not damaged in some way) will today have the same properties they had the day they left the factory. Their properties will not change (become more brittle or softer) over time by themselves.


 That said, there are a few things that can change a steel part's original properties:


Fatigue (due to repeated mechanical stress)
Certain acids used in plating/refinishing can cause hydrogen embrittlement in some steels
Two steel parts rubbing one another can cause either surface 'work hardening' (can result in cracks at some point), or loss of mass
Corrosion reduces the mass of a part and can change its surface in critical areas, allowing cracks to form under mechanical stress
Heating a part to its critical temperature will change steel's grain structure, making it either harder or softer, mainly dependent upon its carbon content and the time to heat/cool


 It's very rare that the above will cause a catastrophic failure if a particular firearm's parts appear visually to be in reasonable condition. One exception where a serious failure might occur is if the gun was involved a fire, destroying the original heat treatment of critical parts. Even that is very rare though.

"It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly, one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts."

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Offline m-g Willy

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Re: Metallurgy questions.
« Reply #3 on: May 31, 2013, 03:58:53 AM »
It's a good thing you posted this question.
Not only are those guns not safe to shoot , they are a danger just being in your house!!!
The best  thing to do is to dispose of them safely.
And it just so happens that I can help you out.
Just box those junk German pistols and worthless colts up and I will send you my address and you send them to me and they will be taken care of properly.
P.S. No need to thank me ,, I'm just here to help you out! ;)
 

Offline Old Fart

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Re: Metallurgy questions.
« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2013, 04:18:25 AM »
I have some oldies also. For me I reload and use light/reduced charges just because I don't want to stress anything.
 
 
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Offline Sourdough

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Re: Metallurgy questions.
« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2013, 04:45:02 AM »
I have an old Trapdoor Springfield, Made back in the Late 1800s.  I shoot it a few times a year using Remington factory loads.  No problems.  Have been shooting it now for 42 Years.  My Mom has my grandmothers Colt 45 from the 1870s.  We shoot it regularly as well.
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Offline Anna

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Re: Metallurgy questions.
« Reply #6 on: June 01, 2013, 03:41:49 AM »
It's a good thing you posted this question.
Not only are those guns not safe to shoot , they are a danger just being in your house!!!
The best  thing to do is to dispose of them safely.
And it just so happens that I can help you out.
Just box those junk German pistols and worthless colts up and I will send you my address and you send them to me and they will be taken care of properly.
P.S. No need to thank me ,, I'm just here to help you out! ;)
.
LOL, well now I will just do that right away. Can't be to safe you know but I do watch Pawn Stars.
And we did get an email back from Rick himself offering to help us out the same way.
I think those guys are all in cahoots because we now have heard from that count guy and a couple
of others. That count guy is cute though I may take him up on his offer to come and get all this old
car stuff.  ::)