Author Topic: Question on 223 ammo (Read 1515 times)

tsalam · « **on:** June 14, 2013, 04:41:19 AM »

I found a box of Federal 223 Remington 55 grain FMJ at Walmart yesterday which was a great surprise since they haven't had any for some time. When I got it home I read the small print on the box which stated "Mil spec primer, for best performance use in AR style firearms." My question is, are these safe to shoot in my NEF 223? Thanks.

geezerbiker · « **Reply #1 on:** June 14, 2013, 05:02:00 AM »

I don't see why it wouldn't be OK to shoot them so long as they go bang when you pull the trigger. If not, take off the hammer extension...

Tony

tsalam · « **Reply #2 on:** June 14, 2013, 05:08:21 AM »

Thanks geezerbiker. I had read somewhere that military ammo is a little more powerful than "civilian" ammo so wanted to get some input from anyone who had shot it in our beloved Handis before trying it myself.

sluggo · « **Reply #3 on:** June 14, 2013, 05:41:13 AM »

......if it's headstamped .223 you'll be fine.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #4 on:** June 14, 2013, 07:39:47 AM »

mil spec primers have a thicker cup to reduce slam fires. M14's , M16's and A4's don't have springs to keep the firing pin from going forward as the bolt slams into battery. That way the spring can't break and tie up the pin.

Sourdough · « **Reply #5 on:** June 14, 2013, 07:59:23 AM »

Yes, shoot them, if they were not safe the warning would say don't shoot in non AR type guns. Like SHOOTALL said, they just have heavier primers. You may get some FTF, but it won't be your gun's fault.

gcrank1 · « **Reply #6 on:** June 14, 2013, 08:14:46 AM »

Consider it 'flinch practice'.......they will likely work fine, but if you get some FTF watch how you react; ie, flinch because of it or not.
As the ol' RO said,"Ain't no reason to go jumpin' around when the gun ain't going' off".

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #7 on:** June 14, 2013, 08:17:09 AM »

I really don't think you will have a problem unless you have a weak spring.

ironglow · « **Reply #8 on:** June 14, 2013, 08:29:10 AM »

The chief difference between milspec 5.56 and .223 is found in the leade of the chamber. Military has a longer leade, so military ammo may in some rifles cause the bullet to be jammed up against the rifling. That fact, along with somewhat more power can, but not always cause a spike in pressure. http://www.humanevents.com/2011/02/15/223-remington-vs-556-nato-what-you-dont-know-could-hurt-you/

My grandson who served as Marine Spec Ops in Iraq and is now a gunsmith, clued me in.. He builds custom ARs..and builds some of them with "Wyld" chambers, which allow either ammo to be safely used.

tsalam · « **Reply #9 on:** June 14, 2013, 08:38:21 AM »

Thanks for all the insight. I knew I could count on all of you. I will watch for the FTF and respond accordingly. I have two 223 handies so if one has problems I'll just use them in the other.

petemi · « **Reply #10 on:** June 14, 2013, 08:48:32 AM »

I have a Dumbassed Yankee question: Federal is not a rinkydink outfit...why would they prime .223 sporting loads with military 5.56 primers....makes no sense to me. If a box says .223 it should ALL be .223, not a blend of .223 and 5.56. That's almost enough to stop me from buying Federal.

Pete

gcrank1 · « **Reply #11 on:** June 14, 2013, 09:20:04 AM »

The market share for those with AR platforms is way more than our little niche. What they put on the box is likely more to 'comfort' that potential market than 'discomfort' ours.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #12 on:** June 14, 2013, 09:45:14 AM »

Quote from: petemi on June 14, 2013, 08:48:32 AM

I have a Dumbassed Yankee question: Federal is not a rinkydink outfit...why would they prime .223 sporting loads with military 5.56 primers....makes no sense to me. If a box says .223 it should ALL be .223, not a blend of .223 and 5.56. That's almost enough to stop me from buying Federal.

Pete

Pete, it's not sporting ammo if it's full metal jacket.

Tim

Quote from: tsalam on June 14, 2013, 04:41:19 AM

I found a box of Federal 223 Remington 55 grain FMJ at Walmart yesterday which was a great surprise since they haven't had any for some time. When I got it home I read the small print on the box which stated "Mil spec primer, for best performance use in AR style firearms." My question is, are these safe to shoot in my NEF 223? Thanks.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #13 on:** June 14, 2013, 09:48:26 AM »

Because if they offer 223 ammo and note it is for AR's they can say they offer correct ammo for the AR system. The AR has no return spring on the firing pin either.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #14 on:** June 14, 2013, 09:49:24 AM »

Or it is extra components they had left over from contracts and they are using it up.

squirrelslayer · « **Reply #15 on:** June 14, 2013, 11:38:52 AM »

One can truly come to appreciate the idea behind this ammo after encountering a "slam fire" situation with an M1 Garand

petemi · « **Reply #16 on:** June 14, 2013, 11:17:57 PM »

Daahh......FMJ........didn't think about that.

Pete

Littlepage · « **Reply #17 on:** June 15, 2013, 06:25:54 AM »

Federal has the contract to operate the the Lake City Plant. I know someone that once worked there, that's what I was told.

theratdog · « **Reply #18 on:** June 16, 2013, 12:21:22 AM »

i have shot a lot of that stuff even tula and wolf witch is made in the same plant but my handy doesn't like the 62 grain bullet's they key hole bad 1-9 twist barrel my a r loves them seen some at cal ranch bought some . next day they were all gone.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #19 on:** June 17, 2013, 01:17:15 AM »

One other reason for the stronger primer is pressure , M-16 barrels are built to take 10,000 more psi than standard AR barrels in many cases. So it is possible that mil. spec. ammo is of higher pressure in some cases.

Sourdough · « **Reply #20 on:** June 17, 2013, 08:34:35 AM »

Either some one screwed up and used Mil spec primers in a civilian run, so they rightfully let the buyer know. Or they might have been running short on standard primers, like everyone else. But knowing the market is screaming for ammo they decided to make a run with what they had. Either way it's ammo. I've shot Coyotes with FMJs also. This was during the winter when tracking them down was easy. Little hole in and a little hole out. Easy on the fur.

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #21 on:** June 17, 2013, 02:48:23 PM »

Quote from: squirrelslayer on June 14, 2013, 11:38:52 AM

One can truly come to appreciate the idea behind this ammo after encountering a "slam fire" situation with an M1 Garand

I'll bet it's an interesting story!

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #22 on:** June 18, 2013, 01:19:52 AM »

I saw a guy with a SKS that had to much packing grease in the firing pin channel empty a full mag when the firing pin got stuck in the forward position. They have no return spring either.

JustaShooter · « **Reply #23 on:** June 18, 2013, 01:30:36 AM »

Quote from: SHOOTALL on June 18, 2013, 01:19:52 AM

I saw a guy with a SKS that had to much packing grease in the firing pin channel empty a full mag when the firing pin got stuck in the forward position. They have no return spring either.

The first model the Russians made had a firing pin return spring, and there are aftermarket kits if you want to add one to a version that lacks it, but for sure most that you encounter "in the wild" aren't equipped with one.

OldSchoolRanger · « **Reply #24 on:** June 25, 2013, 06:18:58 PM »

Quote from: petemi on June 14, 2013, 08:48:32 AM

I have a Dumbassed Yankee question: Federal is not a rinkydink outfit...why would they prime .223 sporting loads with military 5.56 primers....makes no sense to me. If a box says .223 it should ALL be .223, not a blend of .223 and 5.56. That's almost enough to stop me from buying Federal.

Pete

Pete,
It's a combination of the following answers:

Quote from: SHOOTALL on June 14, 2013, 09:49:24 AM

Or it is extra components they had left over from contracts and they are using it up.

Quote from: Littlepage on June 15, 2013, 06:25:54 AM

Federal has the contract to operate the the Lake City Plant. I know someone that once worked there, that's what I was told.

Quote from: Sourdough on June 17, 2013, 08:34:35 AM

Either some one screwed up and used Mil spec primers in a civilian run, so they rightfully let the buyer know. Or they might have been running short on standard primers, like everyone else. But knowing the market is screaming for ammo they decided to make a run with what they had. Either way it's ammo. I've shot Coyotes with FMJs also. This was during the winter when tracking them down was easy. Little hole in and a little hole out. Easy on the fur.

My grandfather use to tell me: "When you don't have what you want, you make do with what you have." Guess Federal is just using some common sense to supply the demand.