9mm for deer

[Squib]

I've seen enough crap go wrong with ANY round/caliber I've used before that I just shoot them in the neck (center or higher) anymore.  there is a bonanza of tissue to hit and any of it will be fatal with a centerfire and a lack of a miracle in favor of the deer.  I've done it with midrange loads from a .357 mag, not the same due to bullet construction and all, but not far off on power and nose profile.  In that instance I shot the deer's throat out because I failed to break the neck- instead of dropping it ran around in a few circles spraying blood 25ft out and screaming then flopped over... sounds bad but I've seen them last longer from heart shots from centerfire rifles. 

Everyone argues that .223 ain't a deer round either... through and through on neck though.  What deer lives on with a thumbsized hole in the middle neck?  None for me yet.  Probably never.

They're even easier to drag with a broken neck, the body lays low and the neck is loose enough that the deer isn't dragging on it's butt half sitting up.  (I use a harness tied to the neck or antlers)  The muscles are still stiff, but it's not the same without solid bones for those muscles to anchor to, I swear a couple broken vertebrae really loosen them up.  I actually need to blood some cz-75's this coming year, this chat has motivated me for the task.  You all can hate on me too.    boo-yah!

[Redhawk50+]

I hunt with 45 ACP revolvers, allowing bullet pressure curves and bullet nose profiles not usually see in semiautomatic pistols.  My second suggestion is to chamber a round with SWC profile followed by absolutely reliable magazine rounds.  The WFN LBT bullets in 10mm or 357 Mag are area of research for me.  The 180 grain .357 Mag cast being superior to JHP gives food for thought.  To date I have used nothing below the Remington Gold Saber 185 JHP from a S&W 1955 6.5 inch for deer.  A 180 gr .357 Mag may be my next deer load experiment.

[SHOOTALL]

Back in the 1970's in one of the hunting magazines there was an article about two guys who hunted with Browning High power pistols. They used as they put it machine gun bullets . The  article was about them getting ready to hunt big bear in AK.  with the 9mm's . There was to be an article after the hunt to report their experience. There never was a second article that I saw . 

[Froghunter]

OT...Maybe they were eaten! 
 
The only experience I have had with the 9mm on a live animal was in Iraq. One of the gun Hummers hit a cow one night in our sector and broke it's front legs. The cow was on the road trying to move but can not. If was decide to kill the cow and move it off the road. I was task to shoot it because a had a M9 pistol. I shot the dam thing right between the eyes, it reared up and started moving toward me. I was thinking "Soldier dies from being crashed by 1,000 pound cow" I step to the side a placed another 9mm hard ball in it's ear, which ended the action for the night. Sure not like shooting hogs on the farm with a 22 RF for butcher! We used chains and the gun hummer to move it off the road.  I continue to carry the M9...not because I wanted to, but because I had too.
 
Enjoy,
 
Froghunter

[Squib]

a friend/mentor told me he put an old heffer (dying of tumors/cancer) down with a 22-250 and it took four shots to the neck and face from almost touching distance..... cows aren't built like deer or people.

[Couger]

So while I am sure all here mean well it seems no one that has responded here so far (with the exception of Big easy)has actually done this.
I am well aware that it is not or would not be the best choice ,BUT that is not the question I asked.
I am also well aware of the hunters responsibility for a clean a kill as possible,which is why I asked the question in the first place.
I am seeking Data in that I want info on penetration and expansion etc .
I am really not interested in oppinions(however well intentioned they might be)on whether or not deer should be hunted with a 9mm Handgun.

That descion will be made by me After I see what kind of penetration and expansion are reported by those who have done this.
I really am interested in this and would like input from those who have done this.Recent information that is as I have read muych written by Lee Juras and George C Nonte about hunting with Auto pistols in which they describe the terminal results .

I see that there is a reference to speciality bullets being anything other than a FMJ?
Give me a break ,thats absurd.Even if JHP bullets were "speciality bullets "and they are not,so what?

I also see that I am taken to task for even asking and relegated to stunt status.
Asked why do so when other weapons are better suited?
In the first place I didn,t ask for oppinions on whether this was the BEST tool for the Job.
I asked about performance from those who had actually done so.
BUT seeing as to how this has been brought up ,why not just use a rifle and forget the Handgun?
Why use bows?
Why use 30-30 when so much better is available
Point is guys we all choose what we want to hunt with .
NOW IF I find out that a 9mm when shot out of a handgun at a deer at 25-35 yards or so will not penetrate to the vitals and destroy enough tissue to give a Humane kill then I will CHOOSE not to use it.
Please get off the spouting of oppinions and get to the meat of what my question was and is.
Has anyone here used the 9mm on deer and what kind of penetration and expansion did you get?What load did you use?  Thanks  Craig

Your thread here intrigues me.  From a survival perspective I think knowing what to expect (when hunting deer size prey) when using a 9mm, .40S&W or .45ACP could be a good thing!
 
No not optimal, but still worthwhile.
 
Those chamberings are what my famm would be using in a SHTF scenario if their sidearm wasn't a wheelgun. 
 
The shot/s would be @ 30-40yds give or take, from a stand hopefully.

[SHOOTALL]

Well you are correct I have never shot a deer with a 9mm , only with a 357 mag and a 38 spl. One the equal , better or worst and one better if only marginally depending on ammo. Nether was all that impressive compared to better suited rounds but they will work as will lesser rounds. The two deer I shot with the 38/357 were both finishing shots . 

[Groo]

Groo here
 Yes IF!!!!!!!!!!!!
 A 9mm was all I had,  I could get close enough to hit, Could hit many times, so me and mine could eat...
 In other words  " If I HAD too"

[bikerbeans]

Sure am glad I didn't post about my plan to take my Camp 9 on a hog hunting trip this May.


BB

[SHOOTALL]

Sure am glad I didn't post about my plan to take my Camp 9 on a hog hunting trip this May.


BB

In a rifle barrel it is a different critter.

[goofyoldfart]

I feel that I have to jump in on this, also. I've been hunting and shooting for 62 yrs. plus reloading and casting for 59 yrs.  it is my opinion that in a survival situation ANYTHING can and will be used. That said, I personally would like something that is .40 or above in caliber (if my life depended on it for food or defensive sitution--.44 or .45) in a handgun and preferably .30 cal or bigger in a rifle. Now a deer, if offered the shot, can be taken with anything if one is in a survival situation and in my opinion a head or neck shoot is the best anchor shot.

I don't think that it was so much the caliber of 9mm as it was the tone of response to the answers received. I DO realise that the written word is very hard sometimes to understand the "tone" of, and that this leads to misunderstandings. If all I had was the choice between a 9mm or a .22mag, I would feel more qualified with the ,22maggie.  I realise this is not the question nor probably the answer that Bcraig asked. Just my .02 cents worth. God Bless to all and theirs.   

                               Goofy  aka Godfrey. God Bless to all.

[bikerbeans]

+1 GOF.


I think folks that carry a 380 or 9mm for protection should read the comments in this thread regarding the use of these "small" handguns against bad guys. 

Lots of comments about the conditions (shot placement) needing to be perfect to kill a deer with a 9mm.  These comments are completely correct, regardless of the round being used.  I have gun hunted for deer since 1970 and predominantly on state lands.  I  have found many deer that others have shot with slugs that missed the "mark".  The deer weren't recovered by the shooter and became food for scavengers.  Shooting deer is like real estate, it is all about location, location, location.   


BB

[pastorp]

Old post I know but if Phil Shoemaker, Alaska bear guide can kill Alaska brown bear with a 9mm and lets his daughter carry a S&W model 60 in 357 mag for bear protection then I believe the 9mm will kill a deer. 

[Graybeard]

I certainly won't say it will not but I'd not intentionally do it.

[ironglows]

Perhaps I am a bit too logical here, but if I read it correctly, the man asked if a 9mm would work acceptably well for the purpose, and not for advice as to what else he should use.

  So often on questions like this things go way off base.   For instance, somebody asks if his .22 magnum rifle is adequate for fox..and sure as shooting, somebody will ignore his question..saying only a .22 Hornet and on up, is enough for a fox.

 ..But clearly, that is not what the man asked. Perhaps we are just seeing well meaning answers though .

[Lloyd Smale]

heres my take on it and im sure some wont agree. I kill a deer because im going to eat it not because it did me wrong and I don't want it to suffer one tiny bit more then it has to. Ive been called a wanabe macho on here and other fourms because ive posted about killing deer with 500 linebaughs, 300 mags and even my 458. Macho? Hardly. What's macho in my opinion is shooting an animal with the lowest power gun you can use so you can brag that your so talented you don't need the power. What's macho is walking around in bear country with a 9mm and bragging that its big enough for you. What's absolutely stupid is letting your daughter walk around in brown bear country with a 357 snubby!! You might get away with using that 9 once. You might even get away with it miraculously twice. But your basically playing Russian roulette. One day your number is going to be up. If you cant handle at least a 41 mag then take a rifle hunting. Even a lowly 3220 or 30 carbine has near twice the energy of a 9mm pistol and very few would hunt with them. Now in a pinch if shtf and I was in the woods with my 9mm and a deer showed up.  I wouldn't run back to the house to get my 06. But to intentionally take a 9mm out to kill a deer is a nothing but a macho stunt. Please have enough respect for the animal your hunting to do your best to kill it quickly.

[pastorp]

Phil is one of the premier registered guides in Alaska. He’s a proven commodity. You should read up about him. He also believes the 30-06 is a very good Alaska hunting rifle.

[Lloyd Smale]

well im sure chuck Yeager could give a guy some dangerous advice when it comes to flying too. Sorry but anyone giving advice to someone for bear protection that includes the 9mm is not only giving dangerous advice but is smoking crack. Maybe hes cool headed enough to calmly put a 9mm in a bears brain bucket at just the right angle that it wont deflect and drop it in its tracks (but I doubt it) but to go on record saying it and the 357 are all an average guy needs is just plain stupid and takes away any chance im going to respect his opinion on anything. I don't disagree with him on the 06 though. With todays modern bullets it will kill about anything but bottom line is it has more killing power at 500 yards then a 9mm does at the muzzle. I once saw a pole on what Alaskan guides use for back up guns and the highest percentage used 375 H&Hs with 338s in second. Not one said he protects his clients with 9s or 357 mags and why would I be so stupid as to take a rifle like that to protect you but think a 9 is good enough to protect my daughter!!!! Seems to me just another blow hole like jack O'Connor or brian pearce. Let me ask you this. I would bet my life ive killed more deer in my life then any of those three. Are you going to take every bit of advice I give you on what it takes to kill a deer to the bank without doubt or question?? . 

[kinslayer1965]

I certainly won't say it will not but I'd not intentionally do it.

+1

I do not as a rule hunt things that should I piss them off they kill and eat me so Alaskan Bear Hunting is not on my bucket list. Should I ever change my mind about such things I would not be happy to find my Alaskan guide carrying a 9mm for backup. Like LLoyd most of the info I find on line they tend to prefer .338WM or .375HHM and one  of those would probably be my choice to take for my bear hunting rifle.

All just my opinion of course.

CR

[ironglows]

I never hunted deer with a handgun, since I am more of a rifle man at heart.  However it does seem that it would make a big difference whether the 9mm was being fired from a handgun or a rifle.
  I know a fellow who used to sell guns to guys who live on the reservation. He claimed he sold many .22 mag rifles to them, that were intended for deer hunting..  Just saying ..

[billy_56081]

I really thought about giving one of the little bucks under my stand a dose of 9mm. Maybe next year.