Author Topic: Series 80 MK IV Enhanched  (Read 826 times)

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Offline Horse Thief

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Series 80 MK IV Enhanched
« on: February 24, 2004, 07:21:25 PM »
Could someone give me some Info relating to this gun. I have one and I don't know squat about it.    Please  :?  

I thought I was a Horse Thief till I realized my eyes were GONE and I thought ANNABELLE was a horse, this is real sad. I guess I need more of OTTO's Little Green Smart Pills
Thanks
Gary :wink:

Offline Mikey

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Series 80 Mark IV Enhanced
« Reply #1 on: February 25, 2004, 04:30:17 AM »
Horse Thief:  It is the last in the series of 'improved for safety' 1911A1s manufactured by the Colt Firearms Factory before they went banckrupt for the 4th time.  

By enhanced, they usually mean a beavertail grip safety with or without a flat mainspring housing; a lowered ejection port to keep brass from being dinged, caught in the port during ejection or bouncing off your forehead when it dings off the ejection port; somebodies combat sights, and possibly a longer trigger.  

As a colt factory piece you can not count on it having an improved or enhanced trigger pull (less than 10-13 lbs) AND, it contains colt's famous trigger pull dehancing 'safety before defense' firing pin block.  

Overall it is probably a decent piece, but because it's a colt, it's enhancements are politically motivated and politicallycorrect .  Otherwise, it's just another 1911A!  

I wouldn't buy another colt and if you wanted a 1911 to carry and shoot, trade it off for a Springfield, Kimber, Baer er sumptin else.  HTH.  Mikey.

Offline Horse Thief

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Wouldn't buy another Colt
« Reply #2 on: March 04, 2004, 09:34:52 AM »
Mikey did I read a post about your Double Eagle Colt. Is this new or did you have it before you told me to get rid of mine.
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Gary :wink:

Offline Jim n Iowa

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1911 colt
« Reply #3 on: March 04, 2004, 09:46:45 AM »
Mikey
How about a series 70 colt, is it a better piece than the 80?
Jim

Offline Mikey

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« Reply #4 on: March 05, 2004, 04:02:45 AM »
Jim:  I would go for a Series 70 colt before I went for the Series 80.  The Series 80 has the internal hammer block safety which a lot of fellas say really affects the trigger pull.  If I found another Series 70 the only thing I would do is toss that three pronged barrel bushing and install a standard one - or a tight fitting target one.  One of the worst things that can happen to those Series 70s is to have that bbl bushing come apart and jam the piece.

Horse thief:  Yes, that was my post on the Double Eagle.  I did not have that firearm when I advised you to get rid of yours and after handling the one my brother bought, my advice would be the same.  I recall that they were not all that stout (although I hope I'm wrong), the grip is a strange fit in my hand, and although the double action is long it is smooth but the trigger in single action would take some gettng used to.  It seems like it is a pre-Para Ordnance type action, that is, what they might have gone to in an interim step before going to DAO.  I think that if I were going to go for a DAO 45 Auto I would look at the Para or the glock..  Just my 2 cents worth though.  Mikey.

Offline Horse Thief

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Series 80 MK IV Enhanched
« Reply #5 on: March 05, 2004, 05:32:29 AM »
:grin: Mikey just kicking you around a little. I know everything around here is ones personal opinion. I've always wanted a Colt 45, no particular reason just wanted one, won't shoot it much but it sure is pretty and you know I'm crazy about horses. :wink:
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Gary :wink:

Offline Shootingamigo

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Series 80 MK IV Enhanched
« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2004, 06:41:09 AM »
Another part of the Colt Enhancement is a slightly lighter slide. I am curious, why does everyone lead in with 4 times bankrupt statement. I don't believe that it has anything to do with pistol making. More of a consumer lawsuits that were compounded with the constant whining about parts making. As a matter of fact til Bill Ruger asked everyone to pool their resources they were all in trouble. It shouldn't be a secret that the big mfgs were offered up first Ruger then Colt then Smith and Wesson. The problem here is that the 1911 was made for a max 850 FPS round tip bullet. Everyone in their intense need for speed has loaded their ammo at a minimum of 900-950 FPS, using flying ashtrays for bullets. You wanted them at 1000 FPS you wanted them to retain bullet weight at least 97% you wanted to drill the target with a bullet mushroomed to twice its original size. You even wanted to loosen you fillings and knock down the guy standing behind you with a shock wave. Now common sense would dictate a heavier spring perhaps and a shock buffer or maybe hitting the bullseye at 100 FPS slower. Maybe a 200 grain SWC with rounded tip. Nope, "ALL my manuals say the most accurate rounds are at 950FPS " Use a heavier spring or at least change the thing now and then. Pay attention to how you reload clean a primer pocket now and then. Take the time to camfer the case mouth. With a semi auto anything consistent ammo is an enhancement in itself. Clean your mags. Put a dab of oil or grease or whatever is the hot item this week on the feed ramp. Take the time to clean the chamber area. Pay attention to what you shoot. And IF the goonies come into your bedroom in the middle of the night REMEMBER they are going down if you double tap at 850 fps or 950 fps. The first thing everyone blamed was the use of cast instead of steel parts. WRONG!! Colt is one of the last of the period to turn to this. Second is the use of extra safety. WRONG!! I never had a trigger block safety go bad as a matter of fact I don't think it can. But keep shooting them with maybe a Cor-Bon cartridge at 1650 feet per second and a 165 grain bullet and it just might jump back into the box! Let me know if you don't want your Colt anymore I will buy them I think they will fit nicely with the other 5 I own and shoot. jmperch@aol.com Oh, by the way check out their web site they now offer a 70 series pistol all STEEL parts. You can have it engraved at the factory with the W-IV. Its the Whiners 4th BK Series pistol. remember they ALL make a 1911 type pistol but after the day is done it WASN'T A COLT!!! This isn't a flame anybody that takes it that way I apologize. Its ALWAYS the gun never the shooter or reloader. How come that is?

                                                    Take care
                                                         Joe

Offline Mikey

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Series 80s
« Reply #7 on: March 09, 2004, 09:08:28 AM »
Shootingamigo:  Joe, my friend, you asked the question "why does everyone lead in with 4 times bankrupt statement.  I don't believe that it has anything to do with pistol making."  Well, ummmm, maybe it does.  

Colt went belly up four times for a buncha reasons, and sone of them were the quality of their products as well as their quality control.  Their bankruptsy was indicative of both poor managment, which lead to poor quality control and well as overall customer dissatisfaction with their product quality and customer service.  With each successive bankruptsy and change in management, product quality and customer service got worse.  One of the final 'straws' was when one of their management staff was quoted as saying that Colt would not be held responsible for producing 'unsafe' firearms and that no pistol would leave his shop with less than a 13 pound trigger pull.  Sounds pretty safe to me, especially if you're trying to use it.......................

I can agree that many of the manufacturers thought that by pulling together they could survive bad economic times but I think it may have also been a concern that united we stand but become a bigger target and would lose some of the autonomy individual manufacturers enjoy.  

Anywho, it doesn't seem as though much has changed in old Hartford since the last chapter 11 filing, except that they have cut back their product line.  Many folks were as dissatisfied with the colt products as were dissatisfied with S&W for their sellout to the klinton/Hud agreement.  It is mostly personal choice but it is indicative of the arrogance with which some of the major firearms manufacturers see the American shooting public.  It is sort of like "here, this is what we are gonna give you and you can take it or leave it".  

Well, with so much competition out there, why take it?  

Now, as to the 45 ACP - mil-spec velocity for the 230 gn ball is 877'/sec.  Round nose semi-auto pistol bullets follow the design of the earlier revolver bullets and feed much better in semi-autos.  The need for flying ashtrays didn't come into perspective until a few years ago, not when the 1911 was designed.  

You also said:  You wanted them at 1000 FPS you wanted them to retain bullet weight at least 97% you wanted to drill the target with a bullet mushroomed to twice its original size. You even wanted to loosen your fillings and knock down the guy standing behind you with a shock wave.  Oh Yeah Man, I like the way you think.....( :-D ).  

On the hammer block safety - you're right.  I've never seen one go bad, or fail, but I have felt a significant difference in trigger pull twixt those and the Series 70s and earlier versions.  Some gunnies can really smooth them out but in most cases, the shooter is stuck with a trigger pull they may not care much for.   That's why I went with Springfield.  

Believe me Joe, I have had my share of Colts, still pack an early model lightweight Commander and like the feel of the older commercial models.  I am also impressed by the written reports of the accuracy of the newer Government Models but feel that for the amount of money to be spent on a new 1911 you can do much, much better with another brand.  

Now, as to why it's always the gun and never the shooter.............. LOL.  Mikey.

Offline Shootingamigo

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Series 80 MK IV Enhanched
« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2004, 10:52:04 AM »
Mikey,
         Well seems as though you havent read the BK filing law yet. There were 2. Cant file 4 and only 1 Bk within a 10 yr period. As for quality right up until this point I say that is wrong as well. the first complaint was with the Lightweight Commander too light the frames werent strong enough. this 1911 design was for a 200 grain bullet at 820 fps. the government had decided the bullet was too light and too slow. the 1911 A1 design was for 230 grain ball ammo at 850 but actually chronoed at 830 FPS. The decision by Bill Ruger to enter everyone with 1 council not to team up but to better defend the lawsuits that were filed after Ruger almost went bankrupt due to lawsuits on carrying a revolver on an empty chamber was ignored by "experienced shooters" Smith and Wesson never did join the defense strategy and there was never a doubt about Smith and Wesson or product during the entire time. Everyone stopped buying Smith due to Government (US AND BRITISH) pressure to yield to product safety standards to named later for a release of lawsuits and promise to be THE gun manufacturer for Govt and Police contracts. Smith and Wesson didnt realize that Fed Govt doesnt control spending on the state level as defined in the Constitution. The Fed Govt didnt find it in their fair play agenda to invite Colt to the product meetings and therefore werent given the guidlines for what they wanted. Colt never competed and therefore lost contract for the 1911A1. Part of the explanation for this was a NATO approved round in 9mm to better serve the cause in ammo exchange. The 45 ACP cartridge was never designed or given consideration for revolver use. In WW2 the only country using a 45 revolver was the English with a 455 Webley later to 45 cal to accept our stockpile of ammo for use during the Blitz. With the loss of the 1911A1 Colts contracts went south on alot of other thinks as well. Turns out the partially Federally funded Housing Authority Police refused contracts as well for their police and Bill Clinton and the HUD poeople were brought to court for this and it was decided that the Housing Authority didnt have to yield to Federal Mandates as it is contributary and not fully funded by the US Govt. This was one of the points brought to the forefront during the impeachment hearings. As a result the HUD chief lost his job and Bill skated for another day. NONE of this was a quality control issue and never was. After these hearing it was decided therefore the agreement between Smith and Wesson and the Govt wasnt in fact an agreement the Govt could make and it was desolved and the company was sold to Americans. This company was in the red for years even when the experts were buying Smiths. Bill Ruger offered to shoulder the burden on 3 occasions til it was discovered that Smith and Wesson had been relaying the defense strategies to the FBI who in turn sent the to the proper attornies that were by this time suing on a city level. The folks that bought this gun maker bought it for pennies on the dollar and didnt at any time offer to pay or accept the payables. It was decided to sell the company for 1.5 million yes 1.5 million. They kept the name and the Corporation of Smith and Wesson was terminated it is listed under the NY Stock Exchange as a different Corp. Yes I do own stock in this and Ruger. The SEC grandfathered this Company in to satisfy the Governemt intervention into public owned companies. Now Mikey with all your knowledge and buying power do you think for a minute we really had anything to do with the sale of Smith and Wesson. I DONT THINK SO!!!!! If anytrhing we retained the right in the last election to pick a gun friendly Govt. If those product trials were given today do you really think Colt would be out. NOT!!!!! This was the first time in history an American Gun Maker wasnt allowed to compete. As a matter of fact it was the first time it was a closed cometition let alone a foreign maker winning. THERE ISNT A PROBLEM WITH COLT NEVER HAS BEEN. THERE ARE LEMMONS LIKE LEMMONS IN THE CAR BUSINESS. THE ONLY PROBLEM PISTOL I HAVE IS A SPRINGFIELD. VERY PICKY ON AMMO. I RELOAD DIFFERENTLY FOR THAT ONE. NEVER A PRODUCT IN THE 1911 STYLE MFG BY COLT MIKEY THAT WAS RATED FOR 877 FPS I DONT KNOW WHERE YOU GOT THIS INFO BUT IT IS DEAD WRONG MY FRIEND!!!! NOW MIKEY IS THERE ANYTHING OFF THE TOP OF YOUR HEAD YOU CAN THINK OF THAT I MIGHT BE ABLE TO CLEAR UP. I DONT WANT YOU GOING OFF OUT THERE WITHOUT THE PROPER KNOWLEDGE OF ANY SUBJECT THAT MIGHT APPEAL TO YOU. Just jacking with you there. Check out the other things Clinton and Company did in those 8 yrs. You would be amazed at the side deals this guy made there wasnt 1 federal contract given without support for his agenda period. And all the pressure on Senators cost all their jobs in 1 election. Publically he stated it was a shame what the NRA did to all the careers of these courageous lawmakers. I look to COLT SMITH AND WESSON AND RUGER period. Oh Colt is considering going public buy it Mikey a retired Marine runs it now and the situation is well in hand. Check out the web site and get you one of the 70 series W IV guns.

                                              Take Care Mikey
                                                       Joe
P.S. I will buy them nasty Colts from you Mikey!
     





,

Offline Mikey

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« Reply #9 on: March 10, 2004, 04:35:41 AM »
ShootingAmigo:  Joe - thanks for the input.  

BTW, to answer your question before closing out this thread...."NEVER A PRODUCT IN THE 1911 STYLE MFG BY COLT MIKEY THAT WAS RATED FOR 877 FPS I DONT KNOW WHERE YOU GOT THIS INFO..." - got this from the 43rd and 45th Lyman Reloading manuals.  According to their loading data, 6.5 grains of Unique behind the 230 grn ball got you those velocities.  The loading tables for that bullet weight in the 45 ACP, from those two manuals, listed the factory duplication load at 877'/sec.  Been using this data for years, until the VV powders came along and I like those too.

Thanks again Joe.  Mikey.

Offline Shootingamigo

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« Reply #10 on: March 10, 2004, 05:56:12 AM »
Mikey,
          Factory duplication loads are dulicating loads from ammo manufacturers not the gun manufacturers. It was mentioned by another contributor that the Gold Cup was never intended for higher velocities but for ammo for Bullseye shooters henceforth the Gold Cup National Match name for the Bullseye competition at Camp Perry here in Ohio. This gun was tuned for shooting 825-850 FPS. As long as you keep a sensible velocity range the gun will feed as intended. If you are comfortable with 900 FPS that is fine change the spring every 1000 rounds, install shock buffer and replace before tattered. My home gun which is a stock 1991 Commander shoots to point of aim using a 200 grain SWC rounded edge plain base bullet Lyman mold 452460 which I produce for myself and my customers using an alloy blend of wheelweight and lino processed by me. I believe this bullet with a properly prepared case and using Winchester 231 will do whatever I intend God forbid and anything of the sporting nature and I am sure to put 2 where I aim very quickly. I can as well shoot this bullet at 900 fps with no ill effects but have changed the factory spring with a Wolff Spring and installed a shock buffer. I dont as a rule shoot this velocity. There is a reason when you have a pistol sent to the Custom Shop at Colt or reworked by a Cylinder and Slide they ask for ammo you intend to shoot. I was told to remove the extra safety Colt installed as it tends to slow the slide down a millisecond and some believe it throws the timing off on the hotter round actually sliding over the round before consistant feed especially if shooting a quick string. The 8 round mag feeds a little faster because of spring tension and can keep up with the slower slide. I cant say it is true or not makes sense but I am not going to remove it and havent. I use Wilson 8 round mags exclusively. Interesting note here a gunsmith at a gunshop I frequent told me a 200 grain SWC at 850 FPS will expand and is ideal for defense. He also stated the 45 ACP bullet is the only SWC able to do this due to short bullet nose. Brownells sells a grease to put on the sear that is a trigger job. It does work very well. Dont put this on the slide rails after a day of shooting I got the crap on my hands and wiped it on my clothes and it didnt come out. There a mutitude of horror stories on guns out of the box. It isnt the MFG but production quality control and that is human error. Call Colt customer service and I am sure they will fix what may be wrong and we all will get to read what wonderful customer service at Colt everyone will buy a Colt they go public I buy stock it increases I make a killing open my own company I send Mikey my new 1911A1 free he likes it I put Colt out of business Paraordinance sees no reason to continue to business here curtails production to just a cuple of states and I will send Mikey the 100000 pistol from factory free he is happy I am happy and we all live happily everafter. See Mikey if we all maintain our need for speed it all turns out for the better. Have a great day my friend Spring is coming reload now and dont miss one sunny day at the range. Oh, to show I am one sided here I think Accurate powder is great in a 1911A1as well.

                                        Take care my friend!!
                                                   Joe

Offline Mikey

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« Reply #11 on: March 10, 2004, 08:45:11 AM »
ShootingAmigo:  Joe - thanks.  And as regards that pistol - I'LL TAKE IT!!!  Thanks again.  Mikey.

Offline Horse Thief

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Series 80 MK IV Enhanched
« Reply #12 on: March 10, 2004, 08:49:47 AM »
Man did I get an education. I really do still like my Colt, I'm not sure if I understood everything. But mine is very good looking and I'm not going to sell or trade it. Being a Horse Thief (reformed kinda) I thinks it cool to have a little horse on my gun. :wink:  :wink:

HUH!! famous words by Roy D. Mercer
Thanks
Gary :wink: