Author Topic: ? for those that have them, 375 or 416 (Read 3950 times)

wallynut · « **on:** February 25, 2004, 03:38:41 PM »

I'd really like to get info from guys that have these caliber rifles. I've done research on the ballistics, but sometimes "seat of the pants" performance opinions can be helpful. I will probably never get to Africa, but would like to have a large bore that can do a variety of work. From what I've seen, there's a lot of guys here with 375's, not sure if there's a following for the 416's.

Lawdog · « **Reply #1 on:** February 26, 2004, 02:38:16 PM »

wallynut,

I have three different .375(.375 H&H, .375 Weatherby and a .378 Weatherby that I just got a while back and have only just sighted it in) and I also shoot a .416 Rigby. What is it you would like to know? Lawdog

wallynut · « **Reply #2 on:** February 26, 2004, 04:00:33 PM »

I know that my question was kinda vauge, did that on purpose to see what type of response I would get, real experience with certain cartridges trumps opinions any day. If I can purchase a large bore of this caliber, it will most likely be the only one I do buy. I've read about the versatily of the 375 H&H and my use will mostly be here in the U.S., but would like to go to Alsaka. On the other hand, 416's, from what I've seen, are great on power, but lack on bullet choices.

I know that rifles for the 375 or 416's are usually modestly priced(if there really is such a thing for the average joe) compared to the larger cartridges that are normally chambered in doubles. I'm only interested in bolt guns.

oso45-70 · « **Reply #3 on:** February 27, 2004, 08:55:08 AM »

WALLYNUT,
In my opinion the 375 h&h is hard to beat, you have a good selection of bullets available plus the 375 can be loaded up or down to fit the needs
of about any kind of job that you need it to do, I don't have a 416 now but have had them in the past and i still think you can do almost any thing with your 375 that you can with the 416, BUT theres no getting around the fact you are going to get more bang out of the 416, and if you are looking at a mad buff or a big grizz the 416 would sure feel better i'm sure,
thats my 2,, good luck, and keep your powder dry. Joe

Lawdog · « **Reply #4 on:** February 27, 2004, 02:29:43 PM »

wallynut,

Let me put it this way. The .375 is about the most versatile big bore cartridge you can get. The .375 H&H has much going for it. Almost flawless chambering with that sloping neck. A wide choice of bullets to choose from. You can load it down and use it for deer hunting or power it up and take on elephants. One last point in favor of the .375 is cost of factory ammo. Don't overlook the .375 Weatherby Magnum instead of the .375 H&H when thinking about a .375. It will do everything the H&H will plus in a pinch shoot the H&H cartridge if you were to loose your Weatherby ammo. And it will do it 150 to 200 fps. faster.

I really like my .416 Rigby and prefer it over the .416 Remington just because it is more versatile. I can load my Rigby down to the level of the Remington or up to near the level of the mighty .416 Weatherby Magnum. If it was me trying to choose one cartridge I would go with the .375 Weatherby. Forget the .378 Weatherby, overkill. Lawdog

wallynut · « **Reply #5 on:** February 27, 2004, 03:07:36 PM »

Thanks guys,

I'm leaning toward the 375 H&H at the moment. Guy I know has both 375 and 416 Taylor, and has offered to let me shoot both in a few weeks. Also met someone that has a 375 on a Winchester action that might be willing to sell.

CptCurl · « **Reply #6 on:** March 13, 2004, 01:16:22 PM »

Wallynut,

For what it's worth, I'm a great fan of the .375 H&H. I've had three over the years. You can load it with the various 300 grain bullets if you want to stomp something. You can load it with the 235 grain Speer if you want to make a .338 out of it. It is a great long range round in an accurate rifle. I used one loaded with 235's to hunt elk for a number of years. Killed a nice 6 pointer with it in 1987 at a measured 330 yards. You can get about 3000 fps out of that bullet and it flies on the same trajectory (for all intents and purposes) as a 180 spitzer out of a .30-06.

As with any big-bore there is recoil. You need to shoot it a lot and you will get used to it. Pretty soon it will feel normal.

Anyway, it's truly a great round. That's why it has lasted so long and will continue.

Get one and enjoy!

CptCurl

pc · « **Reply #7 on:** April 02, 2004, 03:22:00 AM »

I own both a .416 Rigby & .375 in cz 550's. The Rigby is the King of Charm and has power to spare but the .375 is more practical and not such a specialized tool. However the .416 Rigby can be utilised with lighter 340 gr woodleigh bullets if you so desire.

Skeezix · « **Reply #8 on:** April 05, 2004, 09:21:33 AM »

I have Ruger #1's in both .375 H&H and .416 Rigby. I like the Rigby a lot and loaded with .300gr Barnes X-bullets at over 2800fps, or the Speer 350gr Mag-Tip loaded just a little slower, it will really reach out there and put a heavy duty hurt on anything that walks in North America, and most of the rest of the world. And loaded with 400gr premium bullets it will very effectively flatten anything in Africa (if you do your part).

But the choice and availability of bullets for reloading is not nearly as good as the .375, and the .416 components (especially brass) are more expensive. And if you buy factory loaded ammo (if you can find it), expect to pay $100 and up for a box of 20 rounds, whereas .375 ammo is available in the $20 to $30 price range and is widely available.

For hunting in grizzly or brown bear country, I wouldn't hesitate to use the .375. With the 210gr Barnes X or 235gr Barnes XLC, you can get velocity up over 2900fps (possibly even above 3000fps). But I had a friend that hunted exclusively with a .375 H&H Ruger loaded with Speer 285gr Grand Slams loaded to around 2650 to 2700fps, who took quite a few elk and moose and a few big bears with that load.

The .375 will be plenty of gun for what you say you want to do, and it's a lot easier on the shoulder and the wallet than the .416, which means you can tolerate and afford to practice more with the .375.

wallynut · « **Reply #9 on:** April 05, 2004, 03:25:13 PM »

Well, I ended up buying a 458 win mag in a Ruger #1 because it was a good deal. I also have a couple of bullet molds that will work for target practice, had them for the 45-70. Someday may still get a 375 or 416 just to have one, will have to see how the 458 works out.

Omaha-BeenGlockin · « **Reply #10 on:** April 06, 2004, 05:17:43 AM »

I looked into the .416's and .458's about a year ago----but the ammo cost put me off on that idea.

Decided that the .375 ammo was reasonably priced enough to get one----when I came across my Sako at the price it was at---I snapped up right on it--$849 NIB. Had them hold it over night and bought it the next day---when I was more prepared with trades to make that amount of cash.

Haven't got a chance to shoot it yet--as I've gone AR crazy lately---building a new one and accessorising the old one----neither of which is a cheap proposition.

pc · « **Reply #11 on:** April 08, 2004, 12:57:04 AM »

If you want a tad more power it is ver cheap to ream out to .458 lott if you wanted. This is a very powerful round, and quite versatile.

wallynut · « **Reply #12 on:** April 08, 2004, 11:53:53 PM »

PC, don't know just yet if I'll need more power. Hopefully this weekend I'll get a chance to shoot this rifle. Haven't shot anything this large since I had shoulder surgery a few years ago. Being a #1, I will probably play around with loads for awhile. Even considered loading with black powder and some 500gr spitzers that I have on hand, used to do that a lot when I had one of these in 45-70.

magnum308 · « **Reply #13 on:** June 25, 2004, 02:17:11 AM »

Wallynut,

They are fun rifles to have. My brother had a 458 WM some years ago on a Ruger M77 and it was fun to shoot. I have a 375 Chatfield-Taylor on a Ruger M77 fitted with a 2-7X33 Leupold (gives good eye relief). I have had this rifle for years but only a week ago decided to work up some serious loads. It shot very close to MOA at 100 yards from the bench (not all that pleasant from the bench) but at least I didn't flinch. One day I'll get after Water Buffalo in the Northern Territory (of Australia). Might bring it over to the US of A and use it on bear some day too.

You don't need a reason to have a big bore just a passion to have one.

Good shooting,
Magnum308

unspellable · « **Reply #14 on:** June 25, 2004, 07:45:53 AM »

As a practical all around North American rifle I'd vote for the 375. Aside from the reasons listed above it will perform well at long ranges for elk and such. You just don't need the 416's horse power and recoil except maybe as a back up rifle for brown bear and that's the PH's job.

I'd vote for the 375 H&H over the Weatherby as ammo is easier to find and cheaper to buy. It will load down to accurate meek and mild loads better than the Weatherby. Sharp shouldered "improved" cases are not fond of wimp loads. I run a cast 270 grain bullet at 1300 fps out of mine for a rabbit load. (Good practice. If you can nail a rabbit, you can nail the big ones.)

Rick Crabtree · « **Reply #15 on:** June 28, 2004, 01:35:10 PM »

My heart prefers the Rigby. My brain favors the 375 H&H. So I have both.

catblaster.375 · « **Reply #16 on:** July 08, 2004, 12:42:33 PM »

I have a Win M70 Classic stainless w/ Leopold Vari-x II 1-4x scope and I love it. When I first bought it everyone tried to discourage me about its recoil - but thats BS I'm only 14 and can eaisily fire 40 rounds without a problem. I enjoy shooting through railroad ties and blow'in up milk jugs filled w/water it is also my elk rifle (we grow em' big here in Oregon). I highly recommend this rifle and especialy the caliber. You also won't go broke from shooting it if you don't handload (Federal 270g SP-$24.99 for 20). I recomend the Hornady Heavy Magnum 270grain load it shoots 2900fps for 5000fpe at the muzzle (this load does sting a bit!).

257 weatherby · « **Reply #17 on:** July 08, 2004, 05:47:14 PM »

I think you'll really enjoy your Ruger 458. I have both 458 win. mag. and 375 H & H Rugers and I have shot 1 1/2" groups at 100 yds. with both. If you can find them the 458 win. loads by A-Square have always worked best for me. In 375 H & H I always shoot 300 gr. Nosler partitions.

magnum308 · « **Reply #18 on:** January 14, 2005, 12:44:55 PM »

Wallynut,

Don't know if you've "bitten the bullet" and got a big calibre rifle yet. But just to add something to the discussion. If you're an African hunting fan you'll have heard of John Taylor and his excellent book, African Rifles and Cartridges, out of print for decades but I understand was reprinted late last century (in the 1990s). See if you can get a copy and see what he has written about the .375 H&H (same will apply for the wildcat .375 Chatfield-Taylor which seems to have gained a small, but dedicated, following). He rates it as the most useful calibre for Africa. Same would apply for the US I reckon. Incidentally, there are some hunters in Australia who use it for hunting Sambar deer (about the size of Elk) as they inhabit thick bush and you sometimes only get a fleeting shot at them.

The .375 would be a lot more flexible and useful than a .40 cal. You can load them with 235 gr bullets for plinking (if you ever plink with a .375) or up with 300 (even 350) gr bullets for some serious big game hunting.

Regards,
Magnum308

crow_feather · « **Reply #19 on:** January 15, 2005, 06:20:14 AM »

If you are a handloader, you can load a 416 down to shoot like a 375. The Barnes 300 grain and Speer 350 grain both work very well.

You can not load a 375 to shoot like a 416.

I'm always reminded of the hunter that came within 20 yards of a lion before deciding that he needed more horsepower in his rifle. He dropped his and turned and grabbed his guide's rifle. The guide wouldn't let go (smart man) and the tug of war was ended when the guide's gun bearer dropped the hunter with a light tap to the head. The lion got tired of the fuss and left the area.

I can carry a 375 load in my 416 Rem Mag, If I feel that I need something larger, I will leave the guide's rifle alone and just slip in a heavier bullet.

BTW,
416 Rem Mag box of 20 $65.00
416 Rigby box of 20 $112.00

C F

Ramrod · « **Reply #20 on:** January 15, 2005, 03:10:04 PM »

.375 H&H box of 20 $28.50
If the .375 doesn't kill the critter with the first shot, shoot it again, the ammo's cheap!

while99 · « **Reply #21 on:** January 23, 2005, 02:06:07 PM »

I've owned two .375 H&H Magnums and one .416 Remington Magnum, all Model 70 Winchesters. The .375 offers more choices in both rifles and ammo and the ammo is better distributed. The .416 offers more power. Some African countries have laws that require a minimum of .40 caliber for hunting dangerous game. I like the .416 better than the .375 but it will never win the popularity contest. The .375 just had too much of a head start.

Spyro Andes · « **Reply #22 on:** January 24, 2005, 08:52:10 PM »

A gentleman in this thread has already put it perfectly, IMHO...

Heart says 416 Rigby but head says 375 H&H.

I own a couple of Rigbys... I hunt with the 375 H&Hs and the 375 Taylor (in a Browning Lever).

while99 · « **Reply #23 on:** January 30, 2005, 06:35:47 AM »

I wish more bullet companies would make lighter bullets for the .416. Right now there is the Barnes 300 grain X bullet and the Speer 350 grain Mag Tip. What we need is a spitzer in the 325 to 335 grain range that would be cheap enough to practice with and be constructed for deer-sized game. It would not have to be a "premium" bullet.

zimhunter · « **Reply #24 on:** February 12, 2005, 05:57:37 AM »

I currently have 5 375H&H's and 2 416 Rigbys. I have made 8 trips to Africa and taken most all of the common game there. I have ALWAYS taken a 375 in addition to one other rifle. I have shot EVERYTHING from duiker to elephant with the 375 and felt perfectly comfortable with it for everything except elephant. I lost the one elephant I shot with the 375. Missed the frontal brain shot and he made it back to the boundary with heart/lung shot. Have used 470NE or 416 Rigby for elephant eversince. Both 375 & 416 are excellent but if I were restricted to only one it would be the 375.

crow_feather · « **Reply #25 on:** February 12, 2005, 10:19:48 AM »

There are those that pick their rifle with their heart. They go for the good old boy that has worked for so many years.

And there are those that pick their rifles based on caliber, energy, depth of penetration, and other factors that help dispel your fear and steady your aim when you are being charged by that big brown bear that you thought you would never see and honestly thought would never charge.

That's when those rifles picked because of sentiment suddenly don't mean a whole bunch. Especially when there's no guide with a 470 Nitro backing you up.

Go for the most you can handle when your game might decide to fight back. If you get ate, you'll be visitin the St. Peter Rifle Shop asking to upgrade your 375 to something with more authority.

C F

oso45-70 · « **Reply #26 on:** February 12, 2005, 11:57:58 AM »

crow_feather,
I admire your stedfast unwavering opinion of the 416 Remington, Which is an american product and as far as i'm concerned is as fine a big bore rifle going. I have had other 416s....Rigby.....Taylor.....And now have the Rem.
and as far as i can tell so far the Rem is the cream of the crop. Ammo is no problem to obtain. Keep up the good work..........Joe.........

jro45 · « **Reply #27 on:** March 29, 2005, 05:11:32 AM »

The 375 H&H [is the one I own] can probably kill any animal in the world.
The 416 Rem mag [is the one I own] can kill any animal in the world. I hope this answers your question.

msorenso · « **Reply #28 on:** March 29, 2005, 05:15:33 AM »

IF COST MATTERS TO YOU AT ALL 375 HAS MANY FACTORY LOADINGS AVAILABLE PLUS ALOT CHEAPER TO SHOOT COMPARED TO EITHER 416 RIGBY OR REM MAG.

crow_feather · « **Reply #29 on:** March 30, 2005, 02:13:02 PM »

Quote

The 375 H&H [is the one I own] can probably kill any animal in the world.
The 416 Rem mag [is the one I own] can kill any animal in the world. I hope this answers your question.

That might be true, but the 416 will kill them faster and deader!

Humor aside, I honestly believe that people, in the presence of animals that can fight back, should have the most power that they can adequatly handle. In most cases that is something a bit above a 375 and a little less than a 458. If you can't handle the recoil of the 416, please use a 375. If the only recoil you can handle is the recoil of a 250/3000 Savage, don't go lion hunting.

oso45-70 - thanks
C F