Author Topic: Russia keeps losing generals  (Read 1144 times)

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Offline Bob Riebe

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Russia keeps losing generals
« on: March 21, 2022, 11:16:08 AM »
‘Snipers have been picking them off left and right’: Retired U.S. general explains why so many Russian generals are getting killed in Ukraine
David Meyer - 6h ago


Russia keeps losing generals in its war against Ukraine.

The latest death, reported Saturday by Ukrainian officials, was that of Andrei Mordvichev, who as a lieutenant-general was the highest-ranking of the Russian generals to have been killed so far.

He reportedly perished in a Ukrainian attack on an airfield near the Black Sea port of Kherson.

The previous week, Major-General Oleg Mityaev reportedly died in the Russian assault on Mariupol. Three other generals of the same rank—Andrei Sukhovetsky, Vitaly Gerasimov, and Andrey Kolesnikov, have also reportedly been killed in the war. So far, the Kremlin has only acknowledged Sukhovetsky's death.

As retired U.S. General David Petraeus told CNN on Sunday, it is "very, very uncommon" for generals to be killed in action. "This is in the first three weeks [of the Russia-Ukraine war] and these are quite senior generals," the former CIA director added.

What is going wrong for Russia?
When U.S. Major General Harold Greene died in Afghanistan in 2014, it was the first time that had happened in four decades, and it was an inside job—he was killed by an Afghan soldier.

As strategic studies professor Phillips O’Brien told Fortune last week, "If you have generals at the front and putting themselves in dangerous positions, it’s often because they need to be there…It would normally be the result of having a lot of screw-ups they’re trying to deal with."

Petraeus told CNN the Russian problem was partly related to insecure or patchy communications.

"The bottom line is their command and control has broken down," he said, citing reports of the Ukrainians blocking and intercepting Russian radio conversations.

The other issue may be the structure of Russia's armed forces, in which orders come down from commissioned officers, and—because there is a strategic focus on bombarding targets from afar—there is no non-commissioned officer (NCO) corps to facilitate more bottom-up decision-making on the ground.

"So, what happens? The column gets stopped. An impatient general is sitting back there in his armored or whatever vehicle. He goes forward to find out what’s going on because there’s no initiative," said Petraeus.

"Again, there’s no non-commissioned officer corps. There’s no sense of initiative at junior levels. They wait to be told what to do. So he gets up there. And the Ukrainians have very, very good snipers, and they have just been picking them off left and right."

Sukhovetsky was killed by a sniper, according to the Ukrainians, though the circumstances of the other generals' deaths remain more mysterious.

Yahoo News reported last week that, in the wake of Russia's 2014 annexation of Crimea, the CIA set up a covert program to train Ukrainian snipers.

"I think the training really paid off," an unnamed former senior official told the publication.

Again, it is not clear whether the elite units that emerged from this program were involved in the killing of Russia's generals during the current conflagration.

Also on the weekend, news emerged that the Ukrainians had for the first time killed a senior Russian naval officer: Andrey Paliy, who was the deputy commander of Russia's Black Sea fleet. Kyiv-born Paliy was apparently killed near Mariupol, a southeastern Ukrainian city that Russian forces are currently besieging and have largely destroyed.

This story was originally featured on Fortune.com


It seems the Russians should have battle tested more than  tech. weapons in Syria; the grunts needed to be tested even more.

Offline billy_56081

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2022, 11:24:04 AM »
Maybe!
99% of all Lawyers give the other 1% a bad name. What I find hilarious about this is they are such an arrogant bunch, that they all think they are in the 1%.

Offline Drilling Man

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #2 on: March 22, 2022, 04:54:55 AM »
  A little better than a maybe...  4 are confirmed dead and the 5th looks to be accurate info too...

  Unless you are one of those, that only believe it if you saw it happen...  lol

  DM

Offline mcbammer

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #3 on: March 22, 2022, 05:09:47 AM »
   some of their snipers  are women .

Offline Lloyd Smale

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #4 on: March 22, 2022, 10:31:27 PM »
i think some of these brave soldiers would argue with you on that. https://warontherocks.com/2014/08/general-and-flag-officers-killed-in-war/
blue lives matter
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Online gene_225

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #5 on: March 22, 2022, 11:07:10 PM »
i think some of these brave soldiers would argue with you on that. https://warontherocks.com/2014/08/general-and-flag-officers-killed-in-war/

Changes the complexion some doesn't it. We always tell ourselves we are different/ better/smarter. When really we are much the same.

Offline Dee

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #6 on: March 23, 2022, 01:38:16 AM »
Russia has a policy of top grade officers placed right along side the ranks in operations, unlike our methods. I assume any tank commander or APC commander receiving fire from high vantage apartment or other buildings is quickly going to put some munitions into the suspected fire sites.
.
.

A light general is the 1st off the helicopter, and the last back on in the 82nd Airborne.

When my dad was on his death bed I called the Red Cross to please notify my son, a SSGT in the 82nd.

A bird Colonel got on a helicopter with a satellite phone and flew directly to an ongoing firefight involving my sons firearm.

Had my son call me, and then told him to get his ass on the helicopter he was going home.

My point is: your full excrement, and don't know what your talking about.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline Dee

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #7 on: March 23, 2022, 06:55:23 AM »
Russia has a policy of top grade officers placed right along side the ranks in operations, unlike our methods.
.
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So, how am I full of excrement pointing out the Russian military has a similar policy as our own?
And explains why some Russian general's were killed..
Which you verified.

Seems you're full of venom looking to strike at anyone that crosses your path. It's your nature.
.

Here are your posts with contradicting views concerning our military vs the Russian  military. As I said,  your full of crap.
I don't have any of your so called venom. I just acknowledged that you don't know what your talking about.  You're all over the map.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline ironglow

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2022, 08:23:42 AM »
The Russian army hs  different philosophy than the Us army..and likely the UK. Canadian and other "free world" armies.

    THeir ideal was pointed out in Stalin's 1937 purge of the soviet army, where due to Stalin's fear of counter revolution, caused him to kill off a large share of their officer corps.  The remaining officers were intimidated in a major way.

  Even today the Russian leader's paranoia of revolt is strong,  after all, he is KGB trained.

  Russian general officers are always near the front, not for any altruistic reason, but because the Kremlin has closely examined and observed their general officers, and do not trust the lower ranks..
  So the generals must be on the spot, to make even minor decisions.

  Their generals aren't out front because they necessarily want to be, but rather that they must be, so as to give direct orders.  Most flag grade officers, both ours and theirs, have already seen their share of combat, so they have nothing to prove that way.

  The Russian army does not groom their chain of command to automatically step up when a superior gets killed or wounded..

  The US army onthe other hand, has a strong NCO cadre..and on the field the NCOs are critical..men who can move easily into a command slot if needed.

   Back in the days of Gen Washington, the Duke of Wellington, Fredrick the Great or Napoleon Bonaparte, generals had to be near the front, so they could get a real sense of what is transpiring on the ground.
  Today, with satellites, drones and superior communications, they need not be present in the action.
















 

    Unlike the US army, they have not built a strong NCO presence, and in the field the NCOs are critical.
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline ironglow

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #9 on: March 23, 2022, 08:33:03 AM »
   some of their snipers  are women .

  There seem to be plenty of women in the Ukraine who are snipers.  Some are even Mom's by night and snipers by day.
  Some apparently are real beauties. 
   https://news8daily.blogspot.com/2018/12/ukrainian-female-sniper-wins-beauty-contest.html

  In any case, if Putin brings in Syrian or Chechen terrorists to fight, word should be provided them, that some of them may fall to a female sniper.
  It has been said that, those Muslims figure they are eternally doomed, if they are "snuffed" by a
 female sniper..
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline ironglow

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #10 on: March 23, 2022, 01:06:09 PM »
  One quality of the Russian army is persistence..  The will fight doggedly on..however, another "quality' of the Russian military, is their willingness to sacrifice large numbers of troops to gain an objective.

  While western nations take special care to avoid unnecessary loss of lives among the troops.
  During WW2 the Russians lost far more troops than did Germany.

  I have no grudge against the Russian people, in fact my #2 grandson was married to a Russian girl for some years.

 It is their leadership that concerns me. 

   Here's how I see it... Since the USSR dissolved, some people who had lived under the communist thumb for manybyears are so institutionalized, that they long for the old , dictatorial lifestyle.

  At the same time, there were still around, some left over, usually KGB trained, tyrannical personalities who clawed their way to power, aided by their use of these confused folks.
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline Mule 11

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #11 on: March 23, 2022, 01:22:59 PM »
I had a history teacher who fought alongside the Russians in ww2. He was a rather strange fellow (meaning strange to us in his class) He would go on rants about the war and always would claim dominance over the Russian troops yet admitted they were (tentative) allies. He claimed to be an officer in the war and if memory serves me correctly on the Russian front. Interesting man who would not hesitate to whop you on the head...

Offline Dee

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #12 on: March 23, 2022, 01:28:34 PM »
Russia is ruining a lot of innocent Ukrainian lives just because he can,  but seems in troop fighting to be getting their asses kicked.

While I hope we stay out of the fighting, I hope we keep giving the Ukrainian folks all the hardware they need, and kick them out of the Ukraine.

And I'm still hoping for that Putin/bus collision.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline VA Rifleman

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Ammunition is like firewood. The more you have, the warmer you feel.

Offline VA Rifleman

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #14 on: March 24, 2022, 11:35:22 AM »
Better video of the Berdyansk debacle. Couple minutes in, two other ships escape the burning dock area.

One has white smoke coming from the Foc's'le area while another larger ship, burns just fwd of the bridge. Splashes alongside could be shell fire or debris from the exploding LST.

Bad day for the Federation navy in a previously uncontested port.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7g5ZVwDqLRg
Ammunition is like firewood. The more you have, the warmer you feel.

Offline Drilling Man

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #15 on: March 24, 2022, 04:33:31 PM »
  Any yet, I saw a video of a guy laying on the bank/shore, firing a shoulder fired missile, that hit the ship...

  DM

Offline Drilling Man

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #16 on: March 25, 2022, 02:21:06 AM »
  Any yet, I saw a video of a guy laying on the bank/shore, firing a shoulder fired missile, that hit the ship...

  DM
.
Saw that, too, one time
But was it the large 360 foot ship he fired and hit?
Or was it just the guy firing, and then a cut to the smoking ship.
Btw, I'm not so sure a shoulder fired rocket can easily sink a larger ship.
.
  Don't you know, the whole war isn't real...  The democrats are just photoshopping all that footage to take your mind off the gas prices!

  NOW, go sit in a corner and repeat that to yourself over and over...

  DM

Offline ironglow

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #17 on: March 25, 2022, 03:06:28 AM »
  There are many mixed claims concerning that ship and the sinking thereof.  I try to stay uo to date on weapons systems, but I could have missed something.
  All that to preface my thought that I can't think of a shoulder fired that can sink a ship.  Ships are normally compartmented to prevent sinking from any single hole damage.  Even though this was a cargo ship, there must ha e been some compartmentalization.
  Hard to be sure of anything, between propaganda and the 'fog of war', almost any story can come out.
  Here is one that seems somewhat credible;

   https://www.standard.co.uk/news/world/cargo-ship-ukraine-coast-russia-b985842.html

  According to the article, it wasn't even a Russian ship, but rather an Estonian vessel.
 
 
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline Dee

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #18 on: March 25, 2022, 03:26:14 AM »
Russia is ruining a lot of innocent Ukrainian lives just because he can,  but seems in troop fighting to be getting their asses kicked.

While I hope we stay out of the fighting, I hope we keep giving the Ukrainian folks all the hardware they need, and kick them out of the Ukraine.

And I'm still hoping for that Putin/bus collision.

I'm still hopeful on this scenario.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline billy_56081

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #19 on: March 25, 2022, 03:41:56 AM »
https://youtu.be/6x0l6rSAtrM

This guy must be the ghost of Kiev! Only CNN watchers couldn't spot this as a fake!

More fake heroes in this war.
99% of all Lawyers give the other 1% a bad name. What I find hilarious about this is they are such an arrogant bunch, that they all think they are in the 1%.

Offline DDZ

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #20 on: March 26, 2022, 07:12:59 AM »
Anyone notice how the media is trying to make  Zelinsky out to be a hero? Despite being the leader of arguably the most corrupt country in the world. 
Those people who will not be governed by God will be ruled by tyrants.    Wm. Penn
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Offline Dee

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #21 on: March 26, 2022, 08:09:33 AM »
Anyone notice how the media is trying to make  Zelinsky out to be a hero? Despite being the leader of arguably the most corrupt country in the world.

No doubt the Ukrainian government is corrupt, but they aren't nearly on the scale of corruption our own government, or Russia, or China is.
Their not big enough to top us.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline Drilling Man

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #22 on: March 26, 2022, 09:18:12 AM »
  Latest news says, 6 confirmed now, and 99% a 7th was just killed.

  I hope they keep on, keeping on!

  DM

Offline Dee

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #23 on: March 26, 2022, 09:22:45 AM »
Wouldn't bother me if they wiped out the whole Russian army.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline phalanx

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #24 on: March 26, 2022, 10:17:56 AM »
Russia has lost a lot of tanks and trucks also.
In this time i Command ,That you take the Secular to Jerusalem .
There you rid the Holy City of the Scourge of Islam , Make the streets run red with the Blood of those who wish to wash Israel and Christianity from the face of the Earth.
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Offline Mule 11

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #25 on: March 26, 2022, 11:38:12 AM »
Ain’t war hell? Could have been avoided. My opinion... Many from both sides of the aisle on this argument will be proven both right and wrong. When and if this pans out, if it pans out we can argue about something else. I still care more about the destruction of the U.S.A.
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Offline Bob Riebe

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #26 on: March 26, 2022, 01:12:16 PM »
Lara Logan, who has numerous video interviews on-line, made a good point on one last week ; The Ukraine has one military division, that is was part of the German SS, and reformed after the Ukraine became independant.
They still use the Nazi symbols and are the reason 14,000 peole died in the Ukraine before this war started, she plainly stated They are the Nazies that Putin wants to eradicate.
Why he attacked Kiev makes no sense as he could have beaten or at least driven them out of the Donbas had he kept his assault limited to the Donbas but she also made it clear, Zelensky is not better than Putin.

Offline Dee

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #27 on: March 26, 2022, 04:50:46 PM »
Lara Logan, who has numerous video interviews on-line, made a good point on one last week ; The Ukraine has one military division, that is was part of the German SS, and reformed after the Ukraine became independant.
They still use the Nazi symbols and are the reason 14,000 peole died in the Ukraine before this war started, she plainly stated They are the Nazies that Putin wants to eradicate.
Why he attacked Kiev makes no sense as he could have beaten or at least driven them out of the Donbas had he kept his assault limited to the Donbas but she also made it clear, Zelensky is not better than Putin.

And all that may, or may not be true. Zalinsky may be as crooked as a barrel of snakes. But he ain't a coward, and he hasn't abandoned his country.
What is true, is innocent men, women, children, and the elderly ARE being killed over politics and Putin is the cause.
And what is also true, Putin is a POS, and should be euthanized asap.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline Drilling Man

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #28 on: March 26, 2022, 05:08:29 PM »
Lara Logan, who has numerous video interviews on-line, made a good point on one last week ; The Ukraine has one military division, that is was part of the German SS, and reformed after the Ukraine became independant.
They still use the Nazi symbols and are the reason 14,000 peole died in the Ukraine before this war started, she plainly stated They are the Nazies that Putin wants to eradicate.
Why he attacked Kiev makes no sense as he could have beaten or at least driven them out of the Donbas had he kept his assault limited to the Donbas but she also made it clear, Zelensky is not better than Putin.

And all that may, or may not be true. Zalinsky may be as crooked as a barrel of snakes. But he ai a coward, and he hasn't aba his country.
What is true is innocent men, women, children, and the elderly ARE being killed over politics and Putin is the cause.
And what is also true, Putin is a POS, and should be euthanized asap.
  A BIG + 1!!

  DM

Offline Lloyd Smale

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Re: Russia keeps losing generals
« Reply #29 on: March 26, 2022, 10:35:47 PM »
exactly. Its like the old saying about throwing stones in a glass house. What government isnt corrupt!! Ours? We have stolen elections, hunter biden and joe taking under the table money, far left idiots controlling the government and pushing global warming bs on us Zelenski's ass. If that war was here hed be hiding somewhere in a bunker like he did while he was campaigning with the only fear having him stick his foot in his mouth before the left really saw what they were voting for. Bottom line is PUTIN ATTACKED the Ukraine. The Ukraine have never even fired a shot across the border. Not one. They have killed NO Russians on Russia's soil. No innocent civilians, women or children. When are some of you going to stand up and say no more. When hes marching across Europe with china and korea at his side? When he lands troops or drops nukes in your neighborhood. Anyone with a lick of sense knows that if the ukraine people wouldnt have fought so bravely and  putin walked in and took it hed would never have stopped. History should show that the brave people of Ukraine might just have saved the world from becoming totally communist. Euthanized? the world would be a better place if both russia and us purged some leaders. 
Quote
And all that may, or may not be true. Zalinsky may be as crooked as a barrel of snakes. But he ain't a coward, and he hasn't abandoned his country.
What is true, is innocent men, women, children, and the elderly ARE being killed over politics and Putin is the cause.
And what is also true, Putin is a POS, and should be euthanized asap.
blue lives matter
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