Why the 30/30 is all you need...

[ironglow]

OK...so how about Lakewood?  Is it something we should all be familiar with, or is it a parochialism ?

[Land_Owner]

^^^ interested here too ^^^

1.)  It is a neighborhood on the southside of Jacksonville, FL.
.....1.a.)  Where University Blvd meets San Jose Blvd.
.....1.b.)  I doubt that this is the reference though.
.....1.c.)  Nothing "dubious", "infamous", or particularly "note-worthy" in Jacksonville.
2.)  "Narrowing the field", there is a "Lakewood" in:
.....2.a.)  California
.....2.b.)  Colorado
.....2.c.)  Illinois
.....2.d.)  New Jersey
.....2.e.)  New Mexico
.....2.f.)   New York
.....2.g.)  Ohio
.....2.h.)  Wisconsin
.....2.i.)   Washington
3.)  University(ies)
4.)  Hospital(s)
5.)  Church(es)
6.)  Campground(s)
7.)  Exhausted from searching for Net references...

[neckisred]

The suspense is kiiling me.....................and I know the answer!!!!!!! 

[ironglow]

..And I suspect  nothing to do with Elm wood, apple wood, Basswood, rosewood or cocobola either..

[Buckskin]

  The energy of a 30/30 at 100 yards, is about the same as a 30/06 at 200 yards..

 

Actually over 300 would be a lot more like it.


Yeah, you could make it work if 30-30 is all you had, many did it for a long, long time.  But not too many would or do now for good reason.  Love my 94, shot last years buck with it, but more of a nostalgia thing when I hunt with it now.

[Mule 11]

For a wooded lot within its range it kills very well in a 375 win, no experience with the 30 30 but it is my parent case without the shoulder. I’m impressed with it.

[darkgael]

Just found this video. Thought you would find this interesting. 30-30 at 1160 yards.
https://youtu.be/bvTiuMmNoCU

[Graybeard]

I've never shot a deer with the .30-30, never hunted deer with it. I did kill a prairie dog with it once and found it entirely adequate for that job.

[Ranger99]

I'd guess that the biggest problem is that
so many today use the internet and magazine
articles and such for their information.
You really can't honestly tell what a particular
firearm with a particular load will do unless
you go out and personally fire that firearm
and load at that distance.
I know a couple of people that tell me that
they've sighted in and zeroed their firearms
in preparation for the season, but they do
it very close in, and not at the distance they
intend to shoot. I had a discussion with a
man about larger bore rifles, and he was
telling me how this or that would drop
way too much past 100 yards and so on.
He never actually shot the firearm in question,
he was just quoting some ballistic table or
website or something

[Casull]

Well, ballistics is a science.  You don't have to shoot any particular firearm to determine how much drop you'll get.  Now, what they'll do on an animal is another story.

[Dee]

Animals, wild or tame, are no harder to kill than they were 200 years ago. People either.

I shot a big 6 point muley this year with a 55 grain soft point. He staggered about 20 feet and fell over dead.

So yeah, a 3030 is big enough for anything on the north American continent. Or it used to be until they invented gun writers.

[Lloyd Smale]

me? make my only rifle an 06. It can be loaded down to 3030 ballistics and even use 3030 bullets if you want. But when  you break out of the woods into a large field and 300 yards away stands the buck of a lifetime your going to regret your choice. It all has to do with wear you hunt. If you hunted at my camp every year a 44 mag would get it done. Really rare to have a shot over a 100 yards unless you intentioally set up your stand and put bait way out there. I htink the longest shot i made at camp was like 80 yards. Its why for over 30 years i used nothing but open sighted sixguns to hunt there. But go down state to the farm country or even the farms up here when they hunt open fields and the 3030 is silly to take out of the cabinet. The 06 can be a 3030 but the 3030 can never be an 06. Even at full power levels the deer ive shot with 3030s at short range had at least as much of a wound channel if not more then a 150 06. Its the only rifle round i know of other then the .35 rem and the 300 blackout barnes, that has bullets made specificaly for it. They are very thin skinned and open up extremely fast. Hit bone with one and you can tear up a font end of a deer fast. But at 80 yards if you can place your shot precisely you shouldnt be hunting.

I could take my 6.5x300wby to camp. It shoots a 140 grain hornady at 3500 fps. I could kill a 100 deer with it and only loose the ribs and i dont fart with ribs anyway. Now if the 307 would have taken a good foot hold id have a much harder time arguing versatility because it tacks on another 100 yards to the 3030s 150. Ive had many 3030s over the years and dont have a single one today. Dads and grandpas went to nephews and the rest go sold. But if you look in my safe you will find 3 3006s and two of my favorite deer round the 280. If you want light and handy theres a stainless model 7 308 there thats a light as a marlin with a scope and it too can be loaded identically to a 3030 if you want but why would you even want to! I will agree that the 3030 is capable of killing anything in north america. But i sure wouldnt want to stand 40 yards from a grizzly with a 3030. I wouldnt want to take a chance on a 5000 dollar once in a lifetime elk hunt out west with a 3030. Heck if we go that way theres not an animal in the US that hasnt been killed with a 22lr.

 Me? ill use the right tool for the job im facing. I aint driving nails with a rock. Im using a hammer. The 3030 IS NOT all i need. Yup dee i can kill a deer with a 223 ar. Heck ive done it a half dozen times. But since then ive build 300bo 300hmr and my favorite my 6.5 grendel. What sense would it make to head out hunting with a 556 when i can take a hamr or grendel. Ive shot enough deer that i dont feel the need to prove i can get away with the least powerful gun in my safe. Now id about bet your deer was an opportunity that presented itself and thats what you had with you. I can understand that. But what i dont understand is why someone would grab a 556 to intentionally hunt deer when he owns better guns for the job. Ive killed hundreds of deer and take pride not in the fact i can do it with a pop gun but in the fact that i do everything in my power to insure the deer i kill dont suffer.

[Dee]

 LOL,  Lloyd, years ago, i gave all my guns to my two boys, and kept 1 22 rifle, 1 23 pistol, 1 shotgun 2 defense pistol, and 1 centerfire rifle. Im not  a collector, if i want a different pistol, the one I'm in possession of is "replaced" not "safed".

Jeff Cooper once said: Beware of the man with only one rifle. He hits what he shoots at.

Alaskan Inuits use AR15S for everything from seals to polar bear. I find entertaining that folks seldom criticize archers runnin a stick through a big buck, but say "a 223 just ain't enough" for the same e deer.

I NEVER do shoulder shots. EVER! A rib behind the front leg ain't much to get through on a deer, elk, or moose for that matter.

Where I live, you seldom get a shot closer than 75 yards. Most are 100 yards plus.

Like I said, a deer is no harder to kill now, than it was 200 years ago.

Everybody's free to hunt with what they "believe" they need, whether its necessarily true or not.

[ironglow]

From Dee;

   "So yeah, a 3030 is big enough for anything on the north American continent. Or it used to be until they invented gun writers"   LOL..I like that..
   
  Keeping in mind, the largest caliber doesn't replace "shot placement"..  A .22 shot to the head will kill some big game..

[Dee]

From Dee;

   "So yeah, a 3030 is big enough for anything on the north American continent. Or it used to be until they invented gun writers"   LOL..I like that..
   
  Keeping in mind, the largest caliber doesn't replace "shot placement"..  A .22 shot to the head will kill some big game..

Exactly. Some people hunt, and some people shoot, and call it hunting.  And no, I'm not pointing any fingers, or making any accusations.

Gun magazine writers have pumped so much BS out, and convoluted reality to the point, it isn't even worth discussing many times.

[neckisred]

  I find entertaining that folks seldom criticize archers runnin a stick through a big buck, but say "a 223 just ain't enough" for the same e deer.
Like I said, a deer is no harder to kill now, than it was 200 years ago.

Everybody's free to hunt with what they "believe" they need, whether its necessarily true or not.

I could not agree more. I often wonder if the archery guys have such "discussions" over the "right" equipment to use?

[Lloyd Smale]

ya those inuits use a 22lr to kill polar bear too. Most of there game they catch swimming in the water and drive up to it and shoot it in the head. They dont mostly use ars either they use any old rifle they can get there hands on. The one show i watched said they dont like wasting expensive centerfire rifle ammo unless they have to. As to beware of the man with one gun ill laugh my ass of at that. ANY gun that only has one gun ISNT INTO GUNS and chances are he couldnt hit a deer at 5o yards. Look at your fellow law inforcment officers. Many of them have there service weapon. Maybe a second carry gun. They have to qualify once a year and most dont shoot anymore then that. I know im friends with the police here. They havent had access to practice ammo for years unless they bought it or bumed it from me. I dont know of one single man ive ever met in my life that has even two guns that id call a competant shooter. Shooting is muscle memory just like shooting basketball or anything else. If you dont shoot you dont become good. You might find an natural AVERAGE shooter but good shooters SHOOT. What do your think you would have got for an answer if you asked jeff cooper how many guns he had.

I have LOTS of guns. Am i a collector? Hell no. Not even close. My guns are shot. picked up that psa dagger the other day and just got home and i put over 500 rounds out of it in 3 days. How many of the "one gun" experts or even the average guy here put that many rounds down range in a year. Shooting is my passion. Ive got toys that some call hobbys but to me there just something to play with once in a while. I live to shoot.

If it could be proved id compare round counts with jeff cooper any day. Am I as good as him? Dont know. No doubt hes been proven under stress more times then me. but i sure wouldnt get nervous standing alongside of him at a range. Now if you were talking Jordan i might get a bit nervous. A GOOD shot can pick up any gun and shoot it well. Just look at special service operators. There trained to be able to pick up any gun in the field and fire it better then the guy that dropped it. A good shot is like a good carpenter or mechanic. He has and knows how to use the PROPER tool for the job. He isnt framing with a chain saw or a little hole saw. Or cranking down head bolts with a crescent wrench I can guarntee you one thing. Find anyone thats shot 50 deer with a 223. Heck even 20 and if he was honest (most that brag on it arent) hes lost at least one deer because there was no blood trail. Kind of reminds me of dad. When he was young he was a violator. He shot LOTs OF ILLEGAL DEER. I still remember him telling the guys at camp about his buddys deer rifle that killed like lightning. What was it? A 22 hornet!!! Probably did work riding the roads shining and your only shot at eyeballs when the deer was past a 100 yards and when the deer isnt laying where you shot you just claimed you missed because you sure as crap werent going to hang around and try to track it.  I wonder how many deer ran off and suffered horrible deaths at there hands with that pop gun

Like I said, a deer is no harder to kill now, than it was 200 years ago.

you and your just as apt to wound one today as 200 years ago when by the way they used 50 cal and 45 cal muzzle loaders no 223s. Ill say this and then let you guys say what you want. Ive killed some deer. Probably more then anyone on this forum and i DO have a grasp on what works and what doesnt. Didnt get tha knowlege from a magazine or someone else that shot a half a dozen deer. I got it by killing deer. LOTS OF THEM.

Everybody's free to hunt with what they "believe" they need, whether its necessarily true or not.

  Now that right there is a fact. We live in a free country and good advice can be given but nobody has to listen. if it wasnt true we wouldnt have liberals, abortion or an open border.

LOL,  Lloyd, years ago, i gave all my guns to my two boys, and kept 1 22 rifle, 1 23 pistol, 1 shotgun 2 defense pistol, and 1 centerfire rifle. Im not  a collector, if i want a different pistol, the one I'm in possession of is "replaced" not "safed".

Jeff Cooper once said: Beware of the man with only one rifle. He hits what he shoots at.

Alaskan Inuits use AR15S for everything from seals to polar bear. I find entertaining that folks seldom criticize archers runnin a stick through a big buck, but say "a 223 just ain't enough" for the same e deer.

I NEVER do shoulder shots. EVER! A rib behind the front leg ain't much to get through on a deer, elk, or moose for that matter.

Where I live, you seldom get a shot closer than 75 yards. Most are 100 yards plus.

Like I said, a deer is no harder to kill now, than it was 200 years ago.

Everybody's free to hunt with what they "believe" they need, whether its necessarily true or not.

[Dee]

ya those inuits use a 22lr to kill polar bear too. Most of there game they catch swimming in the water and drive up to it and shoot it in the head. They dont mostly use ars either they use any old rifle they can get there hands on. The one show i watched said they dont like wasting expensive centerfire rifle ammo unless they have to. As to beware of the man with one gun ill laugh my ass of at that. ANY gun that only has one gun ISNT INTO GUNS and chances are he couldnt hit a deer at 5o yards. Look at your fellow law inforcment officers. Many of them have there service weapon. Maybe a second carry gun. They have to qualify once a year and most dont shoot anymore then that. I know im friends with the police here. They havent had access to practice ammo for years unless they bought it or bumed it from me. I dont know of one single man ive ever met in my life that has even two guns that id call a competant shooter. Shooting is muscle memory just like shooting basketball or anything else. If you dont shoot you dont become good. You might find an natural AVERAGE shooter but good shooters SHOOT. What do your think you would have got for an answer if you asked jeff cooper how many guns he had.

I have LOTS of guns. Am i a collector? Hell no. Not even close. My guns are shot. picked up that psa dagger the other day and just got home and i put over 500 rounds out of it in 3 days. How many of the "one gun" experts or even the average guy here put that many rounds down range in a year. Shooting is my passion. Ive got toys that some call hobbys but to me there just something to play with once in a while. I live to shoot.

If it could be proved id compare round counts with jeff cooper any day. Am I as good as him? Dont know. No doubt hes been proven under stress more times then me. but i sure wouldnt get nervous standing alongside of him at a range. Now if you were talking Jordan i might get a bit nervous. A GOOD shot can pick up any gun and shoot it well. Just look at special service operators. There trained to be able to pick up any gun in the field and fire it better then the guy that dropped it. A good shot is like a good carpenter or mechanic. He has and knows how to use the PROPER tool for the job. He isnt framing with a chain saw or a little hole saw. Or cranking down head bolts with a crescent wrench I can guarntee you one thing. Find anyone thats shot 50 deer with a 223. Heck even 20 and if he was honest (most that brag on it arent) hes lost at least one deer because there was no blood trail. Kind of reminds me of dad. When he was young he was a violator. He shot LOTs OF ILLEGAL DEER. I still remember him telling the guys at camp about his buddys deer rifle that killed like lightning. What was it? A 22 hornet!!! Probably did work riding the roads shining and your only shot at eyeballs when the deer was past a 100 yards and when the deer isnt laying where you shot you just claimed you missed because you sure as crap werent going to hang around and try to track it.  I wonder how many deer ran off and suffered horrible deaths at there hands with that pop gun

Like I said, a deer is no harder to kill now, than it was 200 years ago.

you and your just as apt to wound one today as 200 years ago when by the way they used 50 cal and 45 cal muzzle loaders no 223s. Ill say this and then let you guys say what you want. Ive killed some deer. Probably more then anyone on this forum and i DO have a grasp on what works and what doesnt. Didnt get tha knowlege from a magazine or someone else that shot a half a dozen deer. I got it by killing deer. LOTS OF THEM.

Everybody's free to hunt with what they "believe" they need, whether its necessarily true or not.

  Now that right there is a fact. We live in a free country and good advice can be given but nobody has to listen. if it wasnt true we wouldnt have liberals, abortion or an open border.

LOL,  Lloyd, years ago, i gave all my guns to my two boys, and kept 1 22 rifle, 1 23 pistol, 1 shotgun 2 defense pistol, and 1 centerfire rifle. Im not  a collector, if i want a different pistol, the one I'm in possession of is "replaced" not "safed".

Jeff Cooper once said: Beware of the man with only one rifle. He hits what he shoots at.

Alaskan Inuits use AR15S for everything from seals to polar bear. I find entertaining that folks seldom criticize archers runnin a stick through a big buck, but say "a 223 just ain't enough" for the same e deer.

I NEVER do shoulder shots. EVER! A rib behind the front leg ain't much to get through on a deer, elk, or moose for that matter.

Where I live, you seldom get a shot closer than 75 yards. Most are 100 yards plus.

Like I said, a deer is no harder to kill now, than it was 200 years ago.

Everybody's free to hunt with what they "believe" they need, whether its necessarily true or not.

Lloyd, I'm not gonna get into a pissin contest with you on this issue. There's  nuthin you can teach me about "muscle memory". You'll never in your lifetime reach the round count I've sent down range in training myself, and other officers, both street, and tactical, regardless of how many deer you've shot, or rounds you've expelled. Day in, and day out, thats what I did for living.

My quote of Jeff Cooper was one of the few things he ever said, hat I kinda agree with. In truth, jumping from gun to gun does not make for excellence in marksmanship.
But the quote really isn't about anything, but personal beliefs.

I'm sure you believe everything you've said, but I don't. I believe what I personally know, and put i put the rest where it belongs. . Happy new year. 

[Lloyd Smale]

now dee if your referring to me i will ask you to show where i ever called crop damage shooting hunting. its killing deer plain and simple. But then how many here actually HUNT anymore. Im to old and wore out to craw through swamps or climb mountains. I set up a heated blind and shoot deer coming into eat just like 3/4s of the "hunters out there and on here do" Why is it called shooting in September and hunting in November. Its all just shooting. Out west? Most of them drive around in a truck till they find some mule deer or antelope and get out and shoot one. Been there done that. Heck i got so bored with regular deer season that i put my rifles away for 22 years and used open sighted handguns. 

From Dee;

   "So yeah, a 3030 is big enough for anything on the north American continent. Or it used to be until they invented gun writers"   LOL..I like that..
   
  Keeping in mind, the largest caliber doesn't replace "shot placement"..  A .22 shot to the head will kill some big game..

Exactly. Some people hunt, and some people shoot, and call it hunting.  And no, I'm not pointing any fingers, or making any accusations.

Gun magazine writers have pumped so much BS out, and convoluted reality to the point, it isn't even worth discussing many times.

[Lloyd Smale]

well i sure dont want a pissing match either but rounds down range. Ill stack mine up against yours any day. If you did more then me you couldnt have spent to much time out on the street. As to doing it for a living i kind of chuckle at that one. I shot comp for about 20 years. If it was shot with a handgun i shot it. Some of the worse shots ive seen in matches were police officers. Some of the best ive seen are police officers. But those that were some of the best sure didnt learn it at work. They shot every day just like i did. Hundreds of rounds every week. They all reloaded and most of them casted too to be able to shoot enough to get that good. NO police dept up here can afford unlimited ammo to train with. Not even the state police do that. Im sure not arguing that you havent been in more crap then me. But rounds down range? if there was a way to prove it id bet my house. SHOOT? ive got more into my loading room then some do into there homes.

Lloyd, I'm not gonna get into a pissin contest with you on this issue. There's  nuthin you can teach me about "muscle memory". You'll never in your lifetime reach the round count I've sent down range in training myself, and other officers, both street, and tactical, regardless of how many deer you've shot, or rounds you've expelled. Day in, and day out, thats what I did for living.

My quote of Jeff Cooper was one of the few things he ever said, hat I kinda agree with. In truth, jumping from gun to gun does not make for excellence in marksmanship.
But the quote really isn't about anything, but personal beliefs.

I'm sure you believe everything you've said, but I don't. I believe what I personally know, and put i put the rest where it belongs. . Happy new year. 

[Dee]

well i sure dont want a pissing match either but rounds down range. Ill stack mine up against yours any day. If you did more then me you couldnt have spent to much time out on the street. As to doing it for a living i kind of chuckle at that one. I shot comp for about 20 years. If it was shot with a handgun i shot it. Some of the worse shots ive seen in matches were police officers. Some of the best ive seen are police officers. But those that were some of the best sure didnt learn it at work. They shot every day just like i did. Hundreds of rounds every week. They all reloaded and most of them casted too to be able to shoot enough to get that good. NO police dept up here can afford unlimited ammo to train with. Not even the state police do that. Im sure not arguing that you havent been in more crap then me. But rounds down range? if there was a way to prove it id bet my house. SHOOT? ive got more into my loading room then some do into there homes.

Lloyd, I'm not gonna get into a pissin contest with you on this issue. There's  nuthin you can teach me about "muscle memory". You'll never in your lifetime reach the round count I've sent down range in training myself, and other officers, both street, and tactical, regardless of how many deer you've shot, or rounds you've expelled. Day in, and day out, thats what I did for living.

My quote of Jeff Cooper was one of the few things he ever said, hat I kinda agree with. In truth, jumping from gun to gun does not make for excellence in marksmanship.
But the quote really isn't about anything, but personal beliefs.

I'm sure you believe everything you've said, but I don't. I believe what I personally know, and put i put the rest where it belongs. . Happy new year. 

Ok, Happy New Year

[Casull]

  I find entertaining that folks seldom criticize archers runnin a stick through a big buck, but say "a 223 just ain't enough" for the same e deer.
Like I said, a deer is no harder to kill now, than it was 200 years ago.

Everybody's free to hunt with what they "believe" they need, whether its necessarily true or not.

I could not agree more. I often wonder if the archery guys have such "discussions" over the "right" equipment to use?

Except they aren't running a "stick" through a deer.  More like a knife, or better yet a sword.  You take a 2" mechanical broadhead and it's going to make a wider wound channel than a .223 any day.

[Lloyd Smale]

thats a fact and they actually leave a blood trail .

  I find entertaining that folks seldom criticize archers runnin a stick through a big buck, but say "a 223 just ain't enough" for the same e deer.
Like I said, a deer is no harder to kill now, than it was 200 years ago.

Everybody's free to hunt with what they "believe" they need, whether its necessarily true or not.

I could not agree more. I often wonder if the archery guys have such "discussions" over the "right" equipment to use?

Except they aren't running a "stick" through a deer.  More like a knife, or better yet a sword.  You take a 2" mechanical broadhead and it's going to make a wider wound channel than a .223 any day.

[billy_56081]

you aint a pimple on his a$$

well i sure dont want a pissing match either but rounds down range. Ill stack mine up against yours any day. If you did more then me you couldnt have spent to much time out on the street. As to doing it for a living i kind of chuckle at that one. I shot comp for about 20 years. If it was shot with a handgun i shot it. Some of the worse shots ive seen in matches were police officers. Some of the best ive seen are police officers. But those that were some of the best sure didnt learn it at work. They shot every day just like i did. Hundreds of rounds every week. They all reloaded and most of them casted too to be able to shoot enough to get that good. NO police dept up here can afford unlimited ammo to train with. Not even the state police do that. Im sure not arguing that you havent been in more crap then me. But rounds down range? if there was a way to prove it id bet my house. SHOOT? ive got more into my loading room then some do into there homes.

Lloyd, I'm not gonna get into a pissin contest with you on this issue. There's  nuthin you can teach me about "muscle memory". You'll never in your lifetime reach the round count I've sent down range in training myself, and other officers, both street, and tactical, regardless of how many deer you've shot, or rounds you've expelled. Day in, and day out, thats what I did for living.

My quote of Jeff Cooper was one of the few things he ever said, hat I kinda agree with. In truth, jumping from gun to gun does not make for excellence in marksmanship.
But the quote really isn't about anything, but personal beliefs.

I'm sure you believe everything you've said, but I don't. I believe what I personally know, and put i put the rest where it belongs. . Happy new year. 

I kinda doubt he was even what he claims. Maybe he was a rent a cop or sheriffs reserve.

I'll say I'm glad for that, I just don't believe all the stories I hear on the interwebs. I still find it funny the at his advanced age he is forced to still work in a bottom end job.

[Mule 11]

There in lies the problem. When you make fun Of or accuse others without any fact whatsoever. You. And I mean You, leave yourself deserving of the same. You expect respect yet have none for others. Turn about is FairPlay...

[Dee]

you aint a pimple on his a$$

well i sure dont want a pissing match either but rounds down range. Ill stack mine up against yours any day. If you did more then me you couldnt have spent to much time out on the street. As to doing it for a living i kind of chuckle at that one. I shot comp for about 20 years. If it was shot with a handgun i shot it. Some of the worse shots ive seen in matches were police officers. Some of the best ive seen are police officers. But those that were some of the best sure didnt learn it at work. They shot every day just like i did. Hundreds of rounds every week. They all reloaded and most of them casted too to be able to shoot enough to get that good. NO police dept up here can afford unlimited ammo to train with. Not even the state police do that. Im sure not arguing that you havent been in more crap then me. But rounds down range? if there was a way to prove it id bet my house. SHOOT? ive got more into my loading room then some do into there homes.

Lloyd, I'm not gonna get into a pissin contest with you on this issue. There's  nuthin you can teach me about "muscle memory". You'll never in your lifetime reach the round count I've sent down range in training myself, and other officers, both street, and tactical, regardless of how many deer you've shot, or rounds you've expelled. Day in, and day out, thats what I did for living.

My quote of Jeff Cooper was one of the few things he ever said, hat I kinda agree with. In truth, jumping from gun to gun does not make for excellence in marksmanship.
But the quote really isn't about anything, but personal beliefs.

I'm sure you believe everything you've said, but I don't. I believe what I personally know, and put i put the rest where it belongs. . Happy new year. 

I kinda doubt he was even what he claims. Maybe he was a rent a cop or sheriffs reserve.

I'll say I'm glad for that, I just don't believe all the stories I hear on the interwebs. I still find it funny the at his advanced age he is forced to still work in a bottom end job.

Well billie boy, while I normally ignore you, your constant unprovoked, stalking, and trolling of me, says that I've obviously got your goat at some point, and it bothers you.

"I choose to work", and have been debt free for decades. This morning I was sittin on a horse that likely is worth more than anything "you actually own" if you even own anything, (and no, makin payments isn't ownership). I was 15 miles from the nearest house, and saw deer, turkey, a couple of coyotes, and walked through a covey of quail.

All while you travel all over the country restocking vending machines, and your family (if you have one) is left to fend for themselves, and entertain themselves. 

That you "try and mock me" for working in my 80s because of poor planning and  "think" it's offensive to me, is actually laughable. Likly I could write a check for everything you actually own (if you actually own anything), and not miss the money. And I'm debt free because I will work.

So I'll keep lookin at some of the most spectacular scenery in Texas over the ears of a damn good cow pony, while you eat by yourself, and wonder whats going on at your house while you're gone.

Keep trollin troll. The joke is on you.

[ironglow]

From Dee;

   "So yeah, a 3030 is big enough for anything on the north American continent. Or it used to be until they invented gun writers"   LOL..I like that..
   
  Keeping in mind, the largest caliber doesn't replace "shot placement"..  A .22 shot to the head will kill some big game..

Exactly. Some people hunt, and some people shoot, and call it hunting.  And no, I'm not pointing any fingers, or making any accusations.

Gun magazine writers have pumped so much BS out, and convoluted reality to the point, it isn't even worth discussing many times.

   ...Those writers make us wonder how our fathers and grandfathers got along with the 'puny' old 30/30, and not only gathered game, but bragged about the killing power of the rifle..

[Dee]

There in lies the problem. When you make fun Of or accuse others without any fact whatsoever. You. And I mean You, leave yourself deserving of the same. You expect respect yet have none for others. Turn about is FairPlay...

Like I said, more accusations with zero proof. You deserve the same bias condemnation you spew... I believe I’ll do the same just because I can and you have it coming...

Well, I assume you're talking to me since I accidentally put your post in mine, which I've since removed when i noticed it. .

But your even easier to ignore than your buddy, and as anyone can see, I almost always ignore you. But Happy New Year anyway,  and Adios. 

[Mule 11]

There in lies the problem. When you make fun Of or accuse others without any fact whatsoever. You. And I mean You, leave yourself deserving of the same. You expect respect yet have none for others. Turn about is FairPlay...

Like I said, more accusations with zero proof. You deserve the same bias condemnation you spew... I believe I’ll do the same just because I can and you have it coming...

Well, I assume you're talking to me since I accidentally put your post in mine, which I've since removed when i noticed it. .

But your even easier to ignore than your buddy, and as anyone can see, I almost always ignore you. But Happy New Year anyway,  and Adios. 

Merry Christmas to you and yours. My post was directed at all posting uninformed statements, you and Lloyd at the top of the list, also including myself...

[Dee]

There in lies the problem. When you make fun Of or accuse others without any fact whatsoever. You. And I mean You, leave yourself deserving of the same. You expect respect yet have none for others. Turn about is FairPlay...

Like I said, more accusations with zero proof. You deserve the same bias condemnation you spew... I believe I’ll do the same just because I can and you have it coming...

Well, I assume you're talking to me since I accidentally put your post in mine, which I've since removed when i noticed it. .

But your even easier to ignore than your buddy, and as anyone can see, I almost always ignore you. But Happy New Year anyway,  and Adios. 

I would guess you think everything is about you! 

Nope, I don't mean anything to anybody except my family and friends. And of course you.

If you go all the way back to the beginning, you'll find that this all started with you not liking my emojis, none of which were directed at you, but you decided to take exception to sumthin that really didn't concern you. So you started sniping me.
That's pretty much how your buddy mulie got started. Being snarky to me for no good reason. One will only take so  much.

If you go even further back, you'll see that I was the first to welcome you back to GBO. You picked this fight over silly emojis, which were, and  are "supposed to be silly".

But none of that matters now, so Adios.