14 Grade Schoolers & 1 Teacher Killed In Uvalde Texas! A "Speculation" Thread!

[Dee]

Well the local news, along with investigating DPS supervisors seem to be backing way off on responding officers not storming room upon arrival.
It seems the door was VERY DIFFICULT to breech as the shooter locked them, and they were designed to be almost breech proof.
A janitor was eventually located that had keys, and that is how Border Patrol got in. In the meantime, officers in the school had set up a fire zone should the shooter attempt to expand the assault on students while other officers were evacuating students.

Also learned is, the teacher that proped the door open DID NOT die in the shooting, and has layered up.

Also, the chief of police has lawyered up, as so much misinformation has been put out before the investigation is complete, and is causing chaotic reactions from uninformed radical zealots.

I personally regret entering into a pissing contest in my attempted defense of police officers that were put into a horrible situation due to Uvalde Indepenent School Districts' complete failure to provide security for school children.

I fully realize that to point out actual police protocol, and to encourage patients, compassion, and respect for those first responders, while giving them the benefit of the doubt UNTIL the investigation is complete, is beyond
some folks comprehension.

Bill, if you would lock this thread down, I would appreciate it. There is nuthin positive here.

[Lloyd Smale]

your not going to get anywhere. Obviously he has a hard on for ALL police and a hard on for you.

[Dee]

your not going to get anywhere. Obviously he has a hard on for ALL police and a hard on for you.

Agreed, and while we're here, I hope that you have realized after all our differences concerning Catholicism, I do not hate the catholic. Your apology was accepted, and much appreciated. You have also seen my condemnation of the Southern Baptist Convention. They're all falling apart.
For the most part, we're on the same page.

[BUGEYE]

Let me get this straight, those 19 cops decided to sacrifice those CHILDREN and keep the shooter confined so he couldn't get to other CHILDREN. 
Classroom doors open out, and, every custodian and every staff member had a key, and most likely all the doors were keyed alike and every teacher would have a key.

There is no way on earth that you can justify allowing 19 CHILDREN and 2 teachers to be murdered while you try to think up excuses for your cowardice.

Lloyd, I don't hate cops in general, only those who will allow 19 CHILDREN to be murdered and those who make up excuses for them.

Everything we do on this earth will be paraded before us someday and we'll have to explain our actions to someone who holds CHILDREN most dear.
And you can't lie to him.

BTW, I know most of the cops here in Morrow Ga. and they are a great group.
Most have degrees and they don't spend any time preying on the citizens, they root out drugs and other crimes that have victims.   They are constantly getting awards for their professionalism.

[Graybeard]

Fact: We do not know if any children died as a result of not going into that class room sooner.

I am not saying they didn't cuz I don't know that either. But we don't know if any did die as a result. They have not yet released any data from known sources to say one way or another. I'm sure it will come out at some point in the investigation but it might not be presented to the public until the trials.

Meantime, arm chair pundits who with no first hand knowledge continue to postulate on what happened as if they were there. People ascribe things like so afraid they were quaking in their boots and pissed in their pants to these cops.

Perhaps they did those things, but since no one has come out and said that they did who actually has knowledge rather than just making stuff up we sure don't know that.

Yes I'm firmly in the column of those who think the waiting was a bad, really bad decision, I'm admitting that is a decision I'm making without first hand knowledge and that I am Monday morning, armchair quarterbacking to think that.

What seems to be known for sure is some teacher as yet unnamed did prop that door open and that door was used by the shooter to gain access. If the door had been closed and properly secured the entire incident MIGHT NOT have happened. That too is speculation cuz we can't know that he'd not have still gotten inside.

We do know that the school had an opportunity to join the state sponsored program to have armed teachers so no one inside the school was armed who might have tried to stop him. Of course we don't know that if there had been would they have tried to stop him and if they had tried would they have been successful or just another dead person from the school.

We do know their grandiose AI program to identify locals who might become school shooters failed to ID him.

We do know there were all kinds of warning signs seen by lots of folks yet none of them stepped forward and said anything that might have prevented the incident.

We do know that no amount of AR15 rifles or handguns by themselves alone could have killed anyone or have they ever done so. It takes a person to pick them up and pull that trigger to make them fire. So blaming the gun rather than the gunman is just plain wrong and is intended only to take away freedom and our ability to defend against folks like the crazy gunman.


Each of us do have the right to jump to any conclusions we want to jump to minus hard evidence to back up our fictional accounts we make up in our heads. Just admit that is what you are doing and that your fictional account isn't factual but just what you think happened. At least be that honest with yourself and us.

No matter your personal thoughts about cops or of their fairness to investigate other cops in this matter, please don't ascribe your feelings as if it were fact.

Clearly that head of DPS wasn't pulling any punches, he seemed to be shooting straight with us about the facts as he knew them at that time. He wasn't trying to cover for anyone. He just flat came out and said that local chief of the school cops made a rotten and wrong decision.

I'm of the opinion, NO I do not know this as fact, that he likely wasn't qualified to be making such decisions. He was the head of a 6-8 man force so likely had a small budget and not all that much experience. He almost surely wasn't someone who would or could get hired to be chief of a large or even small city police force. He was a school cop and so far I've heard nothing of his qualifications.

I'm of the opinion that when more qualified police leaders arrived on scene he should have stepped down from incident commander to let a more highly qualified person take over.

I won't speculate on whether the 19 cops in the hallway could or should have broken down that door and stormed in. I'll leave that to folks with first hand knowledge to decide and report to us. I won't speculate about whether they should have known or learned that a janitor had the key and whether they could or couldn't have found him and gotten that key. I'm sure the investigators will determine it and it will be in their report. I don't know when or if that info will be made available to us arm chair quarterbacks at some point.

I do know without a doubt that demanding anyone of us to tell you what Jesus would have done is fruitless. Truth is we don't know. I'm sure he wouldn't have needed a key to get in and would have the ability to calm the situation by his mere presence at the scene. No mere mortal human could do what Jesus could do so what possible difference does it make what Jesus would have done, none of those on scene were him nor had his abilities.

Just asking us what would we have done is again fruitless. None of us know for sure what we'd have done. We might have an idea of what we've have tried but we can't know with no real facts of the situation what we'd have done. Folks w ho have never faced an armed assailant have the experience in our back ground to say what we'd have done. I don't pretend to know what I'd do or will do should I ever have to face an armed shooter like that, more especially one with armor on when I don't have armor.

To try and tell us you know what you'd do when you've never been in an equal or even remotely similar situation is folly and bravado with no meaning.

To say what you'd want to do, sure we can do that. But just looking at me personally, I'm not physically capable of doing what I'd want to have done if I were there. So admitted to myself and you that I'd have been pretty useless once he was inside that locked classroom is just being truthful even if perhaps embarrassing. Hell I can barely walk and for sure can't break down a reinforced door and I sure wouldn't be shooting thru that door hoping to get it open or to hit the gunman and not the innocents inside.

So I ask why is this incident such a provocateur of high emotion for some here, not against the gunman but against the cops who were trying to resolve it and of other members who weren't even near the scene.

[BUGEYE]

Thanks for the post Bill.
I do know this, 19 cops did nothing, 3 border patrol agents told the cops to kick rocks and went in and killed the shooter.
There were survivors so the BP saved CHILDREN.

[Graybeard]

There were survivors so the BP saved CHILDREN.

I certainly can't disagree with that.

BUT, BIG BUT, would there have been more saved children if the entry had been made an hour or whatever was possible earlier? That we do not know.

The gunman was in there alone with those saved children for a long time and didn't kill them when certainly he had time to do so and ammo to do so.

I don't know if we'll ever know why he killed the number he did and left the rest alive. We should eventually be told something about any who were wounded and maybe died due to the delay in entry. That is something I want to know but may or may not ever hear.

I'm sure no cop fanboy, in fact I guess it would be fair to say I'm slightly on the anti cop side of the neutral point. They never get there in time to save you, perhaps sometimes in mass shooter incidents but even then most times not. I kinda think we'd be better off if there were no cops and no laws in place regarding how citizens could deal with such outlaws. I guess I'm thinking of the really old wild west before law came to a town.

I don't know if that would be a good or a bad thing and it's sure not a thing that is likely to ever happen.

But take that into consideration when reading my comments on this incident. I'm not quick to jump on the bandwagon of condemning the cops for their actions. I'm willing to wait for the report of the investigation and then if they need condemnation I'll be right there with you doing it. I think this is yet another incident when there is no shortage of blame to go around and so many things done wrong that could have totally prevented it rather than just mitigated the aftereffects.

[ironglow]

  Lloyd;   You weren't talking about this door were you?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhnwfq_IfmI

  If you are..take another look..  That is a STEEL door, with steel gratework!

  With your years of big game hunting in the UP...you MUST know how powerful a 12 ga with slugs is.

   Many game wardens and  big game guides in AK, use a 12 ga with slugs for a final "stopper"..

 ....And Brenneke recommends their 12 ga slugs for African big game.

  BTW...  Notice that shotgun had several rounds on hand...with 00, they are often used inside the house aas well.

[BUGEYE]

I almost cried tonight as I watched a news person interview a little girl and her parents.
The little girl was trying to hide with her best friend and the punk shot her friend, but she was only wounded, then the punk came back and shot her again and killed her.

The only bright spot in this fiasco is that all those CHILDREN are in the arms of JESUS.

[Lloyd Smale]

yes i was and its a glorified storm door not a solid core steel door with inside hinges like at that school and even in the case of that door in the video they sure didnt stand there for five minutes pumping 556 round into it. I dont know what the door in that school actually was so ill not say that a 12 guage couldnt have blown the hinges but i do know swat and soliders carry shape charges for breaching reinforced doors. Yup ive played ALOt with 12 gauge slugs. Not Brennekes though because there EXPENSIVE. Shotguns with slugs are devestating at close ranges on thin skinned animals but weve penetration tested lots of them and they actually do real poorly at that. Big glob of solf lead that about flattens on something hard. Personaly if i was faced with a charging bear id much rather my 458 mag or even a 300 mag. But they are very effective at taking out hinges on wooden doors and crappy doors like that. I was at a linebauh seminar one year and the discussion that was on the table was pentration. Penetration to the vitles or central nervous system to STOP a large animal. there was a guide from alaska there and he had a buddy killed by a bear that took 3 shots of OO at very close range that failed to penetrate into the vitals. Lots of guides in alaska carry 12 guages with buck too. Doesnt make it the best choice. I know buck and slugs are two totaly different things but it shows you that just because a guide uses one doesnt make him a ballistics expert or a gun expert. Most of them are not. I beleive the most popular rounds for guides in there back up guns in alaska are the 375 and 338 mags.

  Lloyd;   You weren't talking about this door were you?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhnwfq_IfmI

  If you are..take another look..  That is a STEEL door, with steel gratework!

  With your years of big game hunting in the UP...you MUST know how powerful a 12 ga with slugs is.

   Many game wardens and  big game guides in AK, use a 12 ga with slugs for a final "stopper"..

 ....And Brenneke recommends their 12 ga slugs for African big game.

  BTW...  Notice that shotgun had several rounds on hand...with 00, they are often used inside the house aas well.

[Lloyd Smale]

Bill it would cost the tax payers billions in this country to have police forces that could respond to ANYBODY in minutes. Its why most of us here depend on ourselves to take care of buisness.

There were survivors so the BP saved CHILDREN.

I certainly can't disagree with that.

BUT, BIG BUT, would there have been more saved children if the entry had been made an hour or whatever was possible earlier? That we do not know.

The gunman was in there alone with those saved children for a long time and didn't kill them when certainly he had time to do so and ammo to do so.

I don't know if we'll ever know why he killed the number he did and left the rest alive. We should eventually be told something about any who were wounded and maybe died due to the delay in entry. That is something I want to know but may or may not ever hear.

I'm sure no cop fanboy, in fact I guess it would be fair to say I'm slightly on the anti cop side of the neutral point. They never get there in time to save you, perhaps sometimes in mass shooter incidents but even then most times not. I kinda think we'd be better off if there were no cops and no laws in place regarding how citizens could deal with such outlaws. I guess I'm thinking of the really old wild west before law came to a town.

I don't know if that would be a good or a bad thing and it's sure not a thing that is likely to ever happen.

But take that into consideration when reading my comments on this incident. I'm not quick to jump on the bandwagon of condemning the cops for their actions. I'm willing to wait for the report of the investigation and then if they need condemnation I'll be right there with you doing it. I think this is yet another incident when there is no shortage of blame to go around and so many things done wrong that could have totally prevented it rather than just mitigated the aftereffects.

[Lloyd Smale]

So I ask why is this incident such a provocateur of high emotion for some here, not against the gunman but against the cops who were trying to resolve it and of other members who weren't even near the scene.

because we get the liberal agenda forced down our throats in the news. Everyone wants to blame the cops and nobody wants to blame the people really at fault like the school system. One armed teacher might have stopped all of this. One teacher smart enough to relock the door after sneaking out for a cigarette. A school system that would allow armed guards in every school and pay for it with our tax money instead of wasting it teaching men can become pregnant or its cool to be a homo. Wheres the outcry by the press over that. Why hasnt that school superintendent been fired already?

[Lloyd Smale]

dont you realize hes disagreeing with most of what youve been posting. Or are you just sucking up? What hes saying is just like you hes no expert and is keeping his opinions to himself until all the facts are in and giving the cops the benifit of the doubt till then.

Thanks for the post Bill.
I do know this, 19 cops did nothing, 3 border patrol agents told the cops to kick rocks and went in and killed the shooter.
There were survivors so the BP saved CHILDREN.

[Lloyd Smale]

Dont lie bugeye. You already admitted you dont like cops. ANY of them.

Let me get this straight, those 19 cops decided to sacrifice those CHILDREN and keep the shooter confined so he couldn't get to other CHILDREN. 
Classroom doors open out, and, every custodian and every staff member had a key, and most likely all the doors were keyed alike and every teacher would have a key.

There is no way on earth that you can justify allowing 19 CHILDREN and 2 teachers to be murdered while you try to think up excuses for your cowardice.

Lloyd, I don't hate cops in general, only those who will allow 19 CHILDREN to be murdered and those who make up excuses for them.

Everything we do on this earth will be paraded before us someday and we'll have to explain our actions to someone who holds CHILDREN most dear.
And you can't lie to him.

BTW, I know most of the cops here in Morrow Ga. and they are a great group.
Most have degrees and they don't spend any time preying on the citizens, they root out drugs and other crimes that have victims.   They are constantly getting awards for their professionalism.

[Lloyd Smale]

It seems the door was VERY DIFFICULT to breech as the shooter locked them, and they were designed to be almost breech proof.

as i would have expected. Sure wasnt going to be breached by 556 rounds or probably not even by slugs

  Lloyd;   You weren't talking about this door were you?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhnwfq_IfmI

  If you are..take another look..  That is a STEEL door, with steel gratework!

  With your years of big game hunting in the UP...you MUST know how powerful a 12 ga with slugs is.

   Many game wardens and  big game guides in AK, use a 12 ga with slugs for a final "stopper"..

 ....And Brenneke recommends their 12 ga slugs for African big game.

  BTW...  Notice that shotgun had several rounds on hand...with 00, they are often used inside the house aas well.

[ironglow]

It seems the door was VERY DIFFICULT to breech as the shooter locked them, and they were designed to be almost breech proof.

as i would have expected. Sure wasnt going to be breached by 556 rounds or probably not even by slugs

  Lloyd;   You weren't talking about this door were you?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhnwfq_IfmI

  If you are..take another look..  That is a STEEL door, with steel gratework!

  With your years of big game hunting in the UP...you MUST know how powerful a 12 ga with slugs is.

   Many game wardens and  big game guides in AK, use a 12 ga with slugs for a final "stopper"..

 ....And Brenneke recommends their 12 ga slugs for African big game.

  BTW...  Notice that shotgun had several rounds on hand...with 00, they are often used inside the house aas well.

   Sure, and those scholhouse doors are much more well fortified than the doors of the insurgent , "safe houses", our guys ran into in Iraq..

     https://americancop.com/ballistic-breaching-with-a-shotgun/

[ironglow]

   Soldier #1...  "I'm going in..are youbguys ready?"

   Soldier #2....    "Got your back, I'm right behind you!"

   Soldier #3...       " NOPE!   I'm staying here.... there is a bad guy in there, and we could get hurt!"

    ..Does that sound logical?

[Lloyd Smale]

differnce is there trained to fight and to fight well. Police are not. There trained to write traffic tickets and deal with crack heads on the street. Something like this might happen to one cop in a 100k. Id bet unless is swat theres very little training in this country for police breaching doors or going into a full on firefight. Im good friends with the entire sherrifs dept here but theres only one of them that id want on my side in that situation. He had 4 combat tours. The rest of them either came to the dept out of high school or college. Up here there more likely to deal with a car wreck or a speeder and the worse they might get is called to a domestic dispute or bar fight. Nearest swatt team is 75 miles away. Our dept has very little money for training. There budget allows for enough ammo to carry and for each officer to shoot qualifications once a money. Practice ammo? They either buy it or get it from me. Were are they suppose to get the money to train to be full on combat soldiers like bugeye expects them to be. Its about like saying you were a tank driver so in an emergency you should be able to fly a helicopter.

[BUGEYE]

Below is copied from a post by Bill.
*********************************************************************

I'm sure no cop fanboy, in fact I guess it would be fair to say I'm slightly on the anti cop side of the neutral point.
******************************************************************************************

I don't see any of you getting on Bill's case. 

Fact, classroom doors OPEN OUT so it couldn't have been barricaded.
Fact, it did not change from active shooter to hostage negotiations as the chief said.
Fact, the school had plenty of people with a key to that door.
Fact, the cops who stood in the hallway for 40 minutes had a shield.
Fact, https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/please-send-police-now-uvalde-student-called-911-multiple-shooting-rcna30898
Fact, police arrived two minutes after the punk shooter so we can safely say that that they were there during the murder of 19 CHILDREN.
Fact, the border patrol agents (with the same kind of shield that the cops had) couldn't stand by as ordered while CHILDREN were being murdered and went in and killed the punk shooter.
Fact, CHILDREN are GOD's most precious.
Fact, with the fact that CHILDREN were begging for the cops to come save them, those cops should hand in their badges and then get on their knees and beg GOD to forgive them for not doing their duty.
Fact, people are not angry enough about this fiasco.

[BUGEYE]

Copied from Lloyd.
********************************************************
differnce is there trained to fight and to fight well. Police are not. There trained to write traffic tickets and deal with crack heads.
********************************************************
The Uvalde police had trained for an active shooter.
Of course going through a building that they know is empty and yelling clear once in a while is a farce.

But, when it's all said and done, the police should have handed their ARs to the parents and let them handle it, they sure couldn't have done any worse.

[BUGEYE]

differnce is there trained to fight and to fight well. Police are not. There trained to write traffic tickets and deal with crack heads on the street. Something like this might happen to one cop in a 100k. Id bet unless is swat theres very little training in this country for police breaching doors or going into a full on firefight. Im good friends with the entire sherrifs dept here but theres only one of them that id want on my side in that situation. He had 4 combat tours. The rest of them either came to the dept out of high school or college. Up here there more likely to deal with a car wreck or a speeder and the worse they might get is called to a domestic dispute or bar fight. Nearest swatt team is 75 miles away. Our dept has very little money for training. There budget allows for enough ammo to carry and for each officer to shoot qualifications once a money. Practice ammo? They either buy it or get it from me. Were are they suppose to get the money to train to be full on combat soldiers like bugeye expects them to be. Its about like saying you were a tank driver so in an emergency you should be able to fly a helicopter.
They had trained (so called) for an active shooter situation so that made them responsible for dead CHILDREN.
If they didn't want to act in a real active shooter situation, they should have refused the training and handed in their badges.
Men who, for whatever reason, don't want to fight, don't join the military.
I trained as a loadmaster and that was my job at Delta Airlines, and if Delta had told me to do something that would jeopardize a flight for cost savings, I would have quit and called as many news outlets I could think of.

[Graybeard]

Sorry Bug but your stated facts are NOT facts and are not established in evidence. Where is your link to all those facts that to my knowledge have not yet been established except in your mind.

Where did you get the info that the cops in the hallway had the shield?

Where did you get the info that keys were so easily available?

I've heard no one say the door was barricaded but regardless of how it opened the shooter could have put stuff in front of it to "barricade" it in that the stuff helped stop bullets that might come thru otherwise.

Where did you get the info cops arrived within two minutes? That is far less time than any report I have seen.

Where did you get the times of death of those 21 folks to be sure they died after cops were on scene and thus able to stop him? Not even the MSM has reported such.

[BUGEYE]

https://www.texastribune.org/2022/05/27/uvalde-school-shooting-police-errors/

Here’s just one of many news articles on the timeline.
When the punk started shooting at the funeral home someone called 911.
I’ll post more tomorrow, I’m in bed with my mini ipad and I have trouble copying links.
My laptop has a mouse so my shaky hands don’t push things up and down and sideways.
Anyhow the cops were there at the school two minutes after the shooter went in.

[Lloyd Smale]

Copied from Lloyd.
********************************************************
differnce is there trained to fight and to fight well. Police are not. There trained to write traffic tickets and deal with crack heads.
********************************************************
The Uvalde police had trained for an active shooter.
Of course going through a building that they know is empty and yelling clear once in a while is a farce.

But, when it's all said and done, the police should have handed their ARs to the parents and let them handle it, they sure couldn't have done any worse.

big difference in going to a class on it once and actually being trained and practicing regularly. Police depts do not actually train there every day cops. It would be like you taking a one day class in loading plane and calling yourself qualified. comical thing is you understand that and understand the police depts cant afford to spend the money tor a month long course and cant even afford to loose a cop for that long because there budgets are cut and there short staffed. Why you insist on making these claims and spending time digging up dirt agaisnt them is beyond me. Im starting to think you suffer the same mental issue as tm7. Your acting just like him. With one exception. His wacko opinions at least dont  side with the liberal trash that just like you hates the police and take every chance they can to tear them down. NOTHING they love more then when they can get a conservative to do there dirty work for them. Bottom line is like him your for the most part on your own here with this. All your arguments are doing is angering people and making you look bad. All of us here for the most part are on the side of the police and respect them. Its ok to acknowledge the fact that mistake may have been made. Thats a normal thing for humans. Hell ive made my share. But to stereotype them all as cowards is WAY out of line. Espeically from someone that doesnt have a clue what its like in a situation like that. You kind of remind me of the hippys that spit on and cursed soliders returning from viet nam. Hippys that didnt have the balls to do what they did. Because on in 10,000 did a few back things that it made them all bad. Like i said people should answer for this if REAL evidence comes out AFTER an investigation. But it isnt those police that may have been standing around. Its the people in power. there leadership. What will no doubt happen is they will throw a few patrol officers to the wolves to protect there carreers and the sad thing is you will cheer it. By now. You keep up your vendeta and ill let you have it. theres no cure for hate.  I wish they would have handed those guns (and to stop more disinformation that the liberals push they were probably not ar15s) to YOU. My guess is your tighty whities would have need a double dose of Tide.

[Graybeard]

Bug, that link backs up ONLY the two minute time frame, none of the other facts you list.

[Dee]

The Failures of The Uvalde Independent School District to protect their kids. CRICKETS from the warrior twins.

Oh well,  I'm getting bored anyway. Non combat critics really are a waste of time. They're either repeating what they read, or what someone told'em.

My wife has a 2nd cousin who is a school resource officer in Butts county Ga.
He was fired from the Griffin Ga. police dept. after wrecking two patrol cars.
He is a total doofus.

My wife is braver than the Uvalde cops, about 20 years ago her school had a bomb threat, the principal was out of town and the veep broke the rules and had went to walmart.
When the call came in she calmly got on the PA and announced a fire drill then pulled the fire alarm, and when the kids were out she walked each hallway to make sure they were empty, and only then did she exit the building.
She got it done before the cops showed up.
She had a duty and performed that duty which was to protect those kids AT ALL COST.

.

[Dee]

Bill, all of the news agencies are playing the news conferences over and over with the timeline of events.
At one point there was 19 cops in the hallway as the shooter killed CHILDREN and when two cops were wounded the rest of them chickened out.
This from the head lawman in Texas.
They detained a mother in handcuffs but she promised to behave so they uncuffed her and she jumped the fence and went in and got her kids. That woman had more gut than all the cops combined.

Every member here is a armchair quarterback, they give their opinion on every topic under the sun and say how things should have been done.
I’m no different, three retirement checks per month come here and we sit down and decide at each check which CHILDREN issue we’ll fund.
CHILDREN’S issues are the most important thing to us because it was also important to JESUS.

And I stand by every word I said about those cops, border patrol excepted.

Funny how facts start coming out when the dust starts settling.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/jun/02/uvalde-schools-police-chief-claims-cooperating-arredondo

[Lloyd Smale]

want an example of bs liberals defunding police and people with chips on there shoulder toward them that let this happen???  Seatle just announced that they cannot do any more sex crimes like rape of molestations this year because they have all they can handle and all they have funds for. One of the citys at the front of the liberal defund movement. Now you can rape little girls and boys there i guess and they wont even prosecute you. Wana bet that changes quick if the mayors grand kid gets raped!! They said one of the problems there blaming it on is so many police quit. I guess that shows right there that the cops are on our side. This is the kind of crap police have to deal with today. Take the risks of not comming home just to have fellons walking out laughing at you in a couple hours. Or people on the internet taking cheap shots at them

[BUGEYE]

Bug, that link backs up ONLY the two minute time frame, none of the other facts you list.

I mentioned that when I’m back on my laptop I’ll post some more.
I’m having to spend more time on my back than I want and trying to operate this iPad with fingers that jump and twitch is not easy so I’m not gonna try.

[BUGEYE]

Copied from Lloyd.
********************************************************
differnce is there trained to fight and to fight well. Police are not. There trained to write traffic tickets and deal with crack heads.
********************************************************
The Uvalde police had trained for an active shooter.
Of course going through a building that they know is empty and yelling clear once in a while is a farce.

But, when it's all said and done, the police should have handed their ARs to the parents and let them handle it, they sure couldn't have done any worse.

big difference in going to a class on it once and actually being trained and practicing regularly. Police depts do not actually train there every day cops. It would be like you taking a one day class in loading plane and calling yourself qualified. comical thing is you understand that and understand the police depts cant afford to spend the money tor a month long course and cant even afford to loose a cop for that long because there budgets are cut and there short staffed. Why you insist on making these claims and spending time digging up dirt agaisnt them is beyond me. Im starting to think you suffer the same mental issue as tm7. Your acting just like him. With one exception. His wacko opinions at least dont  side with the liberal trash that just like you hates the police and take every chance they can to tear them down. NOTHING they love more then when they can get a conservative to do there dirty work for them. Bottom line is like him your for the most part on your own here with this. All your arguments are doing is angering people and making you look bad. All of us here for the most part are on the side of the police and respect them. Its ok to acknowledge the fact that mistake may have been made. Thats a normal thing for humans. Hell ive made my share. But to stereotype them all as cowards is WAY out of line. Espeically from someone that doesnt have a clue what its like in a situation like that. You kind of remind me of the hippys that spit on and cursed soliders returning from viet nam. Hippys that didnt have the balls to do what they did. Because on in 10,000 did a few back things that it made them all bad. Like i said people should answer for this if REAL evidence comes out AFTER an investigation. But it isnt those police that may have been standing around. Its the people in power. there leadership. What will no doubt happen is they will throw a few patrol officers to the wolves to protect there carreers and the sad thing is you will cheer it. By now. You keep up your vendeta and ill let you have it. theres no cure for hate.  I wish they would have handed those guns (and to stop more disinformation that the liberals push they were probably not ar15s) to YOU. My guess is your tighty whities would have need a double dose of Tide.

Lloyd, I am not a cop and have never played one on the internet.
You can yell all you want about how I don’t know what I’d do in that situation.
But you’d be wrong.
Children’s issues are the most important things in the life of my wife and I.
And we both strongly believe that if we were in that situation and didn’t act, we would forfeit our souls.
You CANNOT stand by and let 19 CHILDREN and 2 adults be murdered and not expect consequences when you stand before GOD.
You might take that chance, but not me nor my wife.

Yeah my tighty whiteys might have been a mess , but, I would have done the RIGHT THING.

Ya know, nearly every person here believes that those cops were failures.
But, I can think of only two that would not have done the RIGHT THING.