Author Topic: Question for the "math guys"..  (Read 760 times)

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Offline ironglow

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Question for the "math guys"..
« on: June 25, 2022, 01:00:57 AM »
  I was not a stellar math student..and I know i could muddle through this, but instead I will check with the "math guys" on here, knoiwing they enjoy such a challenge.

  I want to know what kind of mileage I am getting with my scooter..here's the figures...

    I filled my tank to the brim, then I rode a total of 82  miles and topped my tank.  That required .922 gallons of
     gas.

    How many mpg did I get with my scooter?
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline oldandslow

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #1 on: June 25, 2022, 02:49:17 AM »
My calculator tells me 88.937093. If using paper and pencil I would have quit at one decimal point.  ;D
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Offline gene_225

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #2 on: June 25, 2022, 03:22:21 AM »
Divide miles by gallons equals miles per gallon.
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Offline billy_56081

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #3 on: June 25, 2022, 04:36:03 AM »
82 divided by .992 equals 82.66129
99% of all Lawyers give the other 1% a bad name. What I find hilarious about this is they are such an arrogant bunch, that they all think they are in the 1%.

Offline gene_225

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #4 on: June 25, 2022, 05:01:35 AM »
Yes, but check again the numbers the OP posted.
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Offline phalanx

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #5 on: June 25, 2022, 05:52:24 AM »
Gene is right i use that formula on my tucks.

Get the miles traveled from the trip odometer, or subtract the original odometer reading from the new one.
Divide the miles traveled by the amount of gallons it took to refill the tank. The result will be your car's average miles per gallon yield for that driving period.

I copied this from my Rand McNally road Atlas. I bought at a truck stop.

In this time i Command ,That you take the Secular to Jerusalem .
There you rid the Holy City of the Scourge of Islam , Make the streets run red with the Blood of those who wish to wash Israel and Christianity from the face of the Earth.
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Offline ironglow

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #6 on: June 25, 2022, 06:04:05 AM »
  Thanks guys...i knew you would come through...
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline ironglow

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #7 on: June 25, 2022, 06:06:15 AM »
  Thanks guys...i knew you would come through... I stumbled at knowing the formula...
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline Land_Owner

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #8 on: June 25, 2022, 09:52:07 PM »
It's a "word problem" IG and that pesky acronym "mpg" is the key.

mpg = miles per gallon

"per" (as used) means "divided by"

Offline Land_Owner

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #9 on: June 25, 2022, 10:22:29 PM »
All kidding aside, it is disingenuous to you, and over-estimating mpg to count "every drop of fuel" on a single fill-up (to the 'thousandths of a gallon' - really?).  You can do "instantaneous math" like that - but it will be inconsistent.

Some fill-ups, those in which the hand "lingers" in pulling the gas pump lever, you spill a tiny bit, your "attention to detail" wanders, hot tank-cold fuel, cold tank-warm fuel, expansion and contraction, will equate to instantaneous results that are skewed from previous individual fill-ups.

The lack of consistency may find you asking, "Is there something wrong with my scooter?  One day it's 90 mpg.  Another day, 82 mpg."  I will say, "Nothing is wrong!"

To reduce or eliminate instantaneous error, keep a log at each fill up of
1.)  the odometer reading and
2.)  fuel added to the tank to one one-hundredth (0.01) of a gallon.

Cumulative mileage is current mileage at fill up minus Log Day 1 mileage
Cumulative fuel is EVERY gallon, to 0.01 of a gallon, through the scooter since Log Day 1
AVERAGE miles per gallon is cumulative miles ridden divided by cumulative fuel. 

Today ==> 89 mpg instantaneous
In a year ==> (say) 78 mpg AVERAGE, and only then ask, "Is there something wrong?"


Offline ironglow

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #10 on: June 26, 2022, 01:57:47 AM »
Thank you Land Owner, I like the way you extrapolated the explanation with many facets to consider.

  I was well aware of the cumulative effect, but I'm not so concerned as to keep a log.

  Now how about this shortcut "country math"?

   I round off the gallonage to an even 92 or 92% of a gallon..so there would be a lingering 8% of a gallon to account for.

  So I take that 82 miles and add 8%..   or 6.56 miles   ergo..88.56 mpg. Not exact, but good enough for "govt work"... ;)

  OK Mr Engineer..now shame me and my country logic.. :D  ;D
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline oldandslow

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #11 on: June 26, 2022, 04:17:07 AM »
Close enough for country hicks of which I am also one.

Offline billy_56081

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #12 on: June 26, 2022, 05:06:32 AM »
Yes, but check again the numbers the OP posted.

Oops!  ;D
99% of all Lawyers give the other 1% a bad name. What I find hilarious about this is they are such an arrogant bunch, that they all think they are in the 1%.

Offline Ranger99

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #13 on: June 26, 2022, 12:39:00 PM »
Another factor is the mixture of
the fuel used.
Some will yield slightly higher
mileage, some significantly higher.
About all you can do is get an
approximation
18 MINUTES.  . . . . . .

Offline ironglow

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #14 on: June 26, 2022, 03:28:16 PM »
My scooter is a 2-cycle machine, with auto oil injector.  Manufacturer recommends no-ethanol gasoline,  of which only 90 octane is all I can get around here...although I don't need 90 octane..but I don't mind that.

  Stock photo of my bike...  Not much, but still better than Joe's...     :D   ;D
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline Drilling Man

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #15 on: June 26, 2022, 04:44:07 PM »
  I want to know what kind of mileage I am getting with my scooter..here's the figures...
  Are you the Polish guy that went to a bar and saw a girl he liked?  He went up to her and started a conversation and bought her drinks.  After a time, he said to her, would you like to go to my place and spend the night?

  She said, well I can't, I'm on my menstrual cycle.  The Polish guy answered, oh that's OK, I'll follow you on my scooter!!

  DM

Offline Land_Owner

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #16 on: June 26, 2022, 10:16:14 PM »
Mr Engineer

I like that. 

"Shame you"?  No way! 

Give you a ride from the side of the road or a gallon of fuel I will if you run her out trying to get that "0.56th" mile after 88, or more realistically pushing her past 80 miles on a single tank.

Approaching 88 miles on a single gallon assumes yours is a fuel tank and pickup tube "from heaven", every fuel droplet that coats the inside walls of the tank, hoses, and carburetor's bowl, jets, and walls leaves no trace on its way to the cylinders, and the volatile gas fumes are completely consumed, it is within the realm of possibilities.  The probability of nearly 89 miles on a single gallon is pretty small, but I won't discount it, except to caution that your distance to the filling station had better be perfect when the scooter runs out so you can coast to the dispenser.

How's that?

Offline Lloyd Smale

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #17 on: June 27, 2022, 12:12:45 AM »
alot comes into play with something like a scooter. Your taking (im guessing) a carbureted motor. So its going to run a bit leaner and put out a bit more power in colder air and even humidity can effect mpg. Then being underpowered wind resistance is going to mean alot. Drive into a head wind and your going to get less. A change in terrain like hills is going to effect it. Traffic will effect it. Ever fell the wind off a semi in the other lane going by you. Then your driving habbits. Do you run it the exact same way every day. If your in a hurry one day you might not even realize your getting on it a bit more. What ive seen through the years is that things like your scooter that get exceptional gas milage percentage wise suffer from these things that effect it more then something like a pickup. I can drive my ram trying to get the absolute best gas mileage and it might get 20. Drive it not trying and you might looses 3 mpg. Being fuel injected and computer controled things like air temp really dont matter much. But with a scooter like yours its easy to see a 20 percent reduction in mileage between tanks. I laughed at my dad years ago when he had a dodge dakota with a 318 in it. I told him i was getting about 20mpg highway in my silverado and he laughed and said he can get 35 in his dakota. i asked him how he came to that realization he said the mpg readout on his dash said that going down the highway. It only read instant mpg not average. To get a real world number you need to fill it and drive it for at least 5 tanks of gas under various conditions you encounter and not trying to drive to get the best but drive it the way you do day to day and then average those 5 tanks and get a  REAL world number to slap on it. Even if that works out to 50mpg your saving serious money driving it instead of your car. Ever notics that when talk of fuel mileage comes up mostly what you get quoted is the best reading someone ever got with there vehicle. I dont bother checking it by doing math anymore. It doesnt much matter because i have to put fuel in it anyway. What i do is leave my average gas mileage alone. I never reset it. That way i can look at my average fuel economy over a year or two instead of one tank of gas. No need to brag because both of my main vehicles are gas hogs. My ram averages in the mid 17s and my wrangler in the high 16s. It doesnt do me any good to drive it down the highway for 300 miles at 55 on a straight flat road and claim thats my gas mileage. Id be just lying to myself
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Offline oldandslow

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #18 on: June 27, 2022, 02:29:38 AM »
The wind off a semi reminded me of my experience with a fairing on my Harley. I rode it 22 miles to and from work from March to November. I had a wind shield crack and replaced it. That one eventually cracked so I went to the glass and mirror shop and bought a piece of lexan big enough to make a new windshield and stop the crack. Meeting a semi the wind blast would blow it over but it would just straighten up and be good. Lexan will eventually fail with enough abuse I found but it lasts a lot longer that the plexiglass or whatever the factory shield are made from.

My company built a new water injection station, the last of three they build during my working years. This one was a small one pump affair and the engineer that designed it put a metal building over it with a large picture window on the west side tolet in light. It also made it hotter than Hades inside on a summer afternoon. That is the side our thunder storms and high winds usually come from. After replacing the glass for the second time after hail broke it the farmboss told me to get a piece of  plexaglass and replace it. Strange job for a welder but I got to do strange jobs pretty regularly. The next seriously high windstorm blew it out in chunks. He showed up asking if I could think of a way to put something in it that would stay. Off to the G&M place I went and bought a sheet of lexan and cut it to fit. It was still there when I retired, flexing but not breaking, when a storm passed through.

Offline ironglow

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #19 on: June 27, 2022, 02:45:03 AM »
Mr Engineer

I like that. 

"Shame you"?  No way! 

Give you a ride from the side of the road or a gallon of fuel I will if you run her out trying to get that "0.56th" mile after 88, or more realistically pushing her past 80 miles on a single tank.

Approaching 88 miles on a single gallon assumes yours is a fuel tank and pickup tube "from heaven", every fuel droplet that coats the inside walls of the tank, hoses, and carburetor's bowl, jets, and walls leaves no trace on its way to the cylinders, and the volatile gas fumes are completely consumed, it is within the realm of possibilities.  The probability of nearly 89 miles on a single gallon is pretty small, but I won't discount it, except to caution that your distance to the filling station had better be perfect when the scooter runs out so you can coast to the dispenser.

How's that?
  Actually, my tank is 1.3 gallons, but I usually fill near the 1 gallon mark, when I can.  That is how I got to the .922 figure. No, I don't sweat the details..

  The machine is supposed to get 100 mpg, but that is likely computed for a 150 lb rider on straight, level roads.
  ..But I am 200 lbs and we have plenty of hills around here, especially on the less-than-main roads which I prefer to travel.  You can be sure though, with Biden gas @ $5..I am running more errands with old "Ruffy" than with my car.
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline Land_Owner

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #20 on: June 27, 2022, 03:49:12 AM »
Actually, my tank is 1.3 gallons

Dooph!  Facts not in evidence, but I should have asked.

Hills?  Humidity?  Headwinds?  Speed sensitivity?  Dooph! 

Florida here. Straight roads (+/-).  Flat roads and the occasional dead armadillo.  Following wind when riding West.  Facing wind when riding East.  99% humidity always.  Hair on fire, pedal to the medal always!  Tongue in cheek, follow a semi close and get 150 mpg!

Offline phalanx

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #21 on: June 27, 2022, 04:39:17 AM »
Mr Engineer

I like that. 

"Shame you"?  No way! 

Give you a ride from the side of the road or a gallon of fuel I will if you run her out trying to get that "0.56th" mile after 88, or more realistically pushing her past 80 miles on a single tank.

Approaching 88 miles on a single gallon assumes yours is a fuel tank and pickup tube "from heaven", every fuel droplet that coats the inside walls of the tank, hoses, and carburetor's bowl, jets, and walls leaves no trace on its way to the cylinders, and the volatile gas fumes are completely consumed, it is within the realm of possibilities.  The probability of nearly 89 miles on a single gallon is pretty small, but I won't discount it, except to caution that your distance to the filling station had better be perfect when the scooter runs out so you can coast to the dispenser.

How's that?

Only in a hybrid, maybe.
In this time i Command ,That you take the Secular to Jerusalem .
There you rid the Holy City of the Scourge of Islam , Make the streets run red with the Blood of those who wish to wash Israel and Christianity from the face of the Earth.
Constantine III

Offline Lloyd Smale

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #22 on: June 27, 2022, 06:48:24 AM »
cant argue that other then i dont go somewhere just to go there and dont need to go to the grocery store because the wife shops once a month up town and drives by a grocery store every time she comes home from work. So theres very few times i would get any use out of a moped. I hate going to town and if i do its to get something thats usualy to big to haul on a bike rack. So instead of making 4 small trips i keep a list and go to town (5 miles) MAYBE once a week for stuff I dont trust the wife to get at the hardware store or tractor supply. Might have made sense back when my buddy had the gun shop and I was there about every day but hes retired and moved. Then add half the year up here you dont want to be in anything without heat. I figured maybe id use the polaris general to go fishing (again about 5 miles) but the jeep gets as good of gas milage as it does and it takes about 3 times longer to get there on the trails as it does on the road in the jeep. Because of that id about guess it would be cheaper to take the jeep too.I do have one of those fat tired mini bikes. Its fun for putting in the woods but im sure not taking it to town. we actually thought about a moped for the wife to go to work on. But at least one day a week its to cold or raining and she leaves to work at 630am so its never really warm except coming home and the season so short that wed never recoup the 2k one costs. Same with a little car. First i detest them and you could put A LOT of gas in her pickup for what one costs. So we drive the gas hogs.
Mr Engineer

I like that. 

"Shame you"?  No way! 

Give you a ride from the side of the road or a gallon of fuel I will if you run her out trying to get that "0.56th" mile after 88, or more realistically pushing her past 80 miles on a single tank.

Approaching 88 miles on a single gallon assumes yours is a fuel tank and pickup tube "from heaven", every fuel droplet that coats the inside walls of the tank, hoses, and carburetor's bowl, jets, and walls leaves no trace on its way to the cylinders, and the volatile gas fumes are completely consumed, it is within the realm of possibilities.  The probability of nearly 89 miles on a single gallon is pretty small, but I won't discount it, except to caution that your distance to the filling station had better be perfect when the scooter runs out so you can coast to the dispenser.

How's that?
  Actually, my tank is 1.3 gallons, but I usually fill near the 1 gallon mark, when I can.  That is how I got to the .922 figure. No, I don't sweat the details..

  The machine is supposed to get 100 mpg, but that is likely computed for a 150 lb rider on straight, level roads.
  ..But I am 200 lbs and we have plenty of hills around here, especially on the less-than-main roads which I prefer to travel.  You can be sure though, with Biden gas @ $5..I am running more errends with ols "Ruffy" than with my car.
blue lives matter

Offline ironglow

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #23 on: June 27, 2022, 08:34:55 AM »
Actually, the unmentioned part is that a scooter can be fun, when the weather is good...and "an adventure' when it turns rainy while you're out riding... :D  ;D

  It gas been said by the 'biker' types.... "Riding a scooter is like dating a fat girl.. It sure looks like it could be fun, but you just don't want your friends to catch you riding one"!

  ..But I am not deterred by what others think..that is concerning the scooter..not the fat girl.. ;D

  Mine is a more rare model, because it is a 2 stroke engine, so I have done a couple simple tricks with it and on level going, can read 50 mph..which with GPS, works out to an honest 45.
  It will go much slower on long, drawn out, and steep hills,

  Some advice...stay away from those made by the Chi-coms.  My scooter is made in Taiwan, by a very reputable company.  The engine is a Minarelli, and Italian make often used in the Lambrettas and Vespas.

  An added cost to mileage is the synthetic 2 stroke oil, that runs from $9 to $12 per bottle which more than fills the tank, and lasts for between 700 & 800 miles.

If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline ironglow

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #24 on: June 27, 2022, 08:39:19 AM »
  I want to know what kind of mileage I am getting with my scooter..here's the figures...
  Are you the Polish guy that went to a bar and saw a girl he liked?  He went up to her and started a conversation and bought her drinks.  After a time, he said to her, would you like to go to my place and spend the night?

  She said, well I can't, I'm on my menstrual cycle.  The Polish guy answered, oh that's OK, I'll follow you on my scooter!!

  DM

  Nah!  That wouldn't work with me.....I wouldn't be patronizing a bar, nor buying alcohol... ;)  ;D
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline oldandslow

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #25 on: June 27, 2022, 10:05:47 AM »
Like IG, I am at the age where I just don't give a---um, two whoops about what people think about me. All anyone sees anymore is an old geezer.

Offline ulav8r

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #26 on: June 27, 2022, 03:55:52 PM »
Dashboard mpg can lie.  Many are based on manifold vacuum readings.  My first exposure to that was in an "89 Plymouth Acclaim V6.  It often displayed up to 35 mpg but usually got 28 to 30 based on fuel used.  Once, on a trip to Southern Colorado, we climbed the side of a plateau, where it was showing 60 mpg on a relatively steep grade.  Once we topped out, there was a very long straight stretch that was near level,  At65 mph it was indicating that we were getting 80-82 mpg.  We "might" have been getting 35 but certainly no more.  I think I read at one time there were some vehicles that based their mpg readings on actual fuel flow but did not have a flow reading for excess fuel being fed back to the tank.

Offline Land_Owner

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #27 on: June 28, 2022, 01:23:07 AM »
It is 'just an estimate', and one can "slice the baloney" in any manner of ways.  Cumulative average remains a decent gauge of use, which, when it falls below some threshold, can also be an indicator that maintenance is required: 

[LATE NOTE] DOOPH!
I reversed that to ==>

Total miles driven
..........divided by..........
Every gallon through the tank



THAT [former formula] was a BLUNDER.  I apologize...


Offline oldandslow

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #28 on: June 28, 2022, 02:25:15 AM »
And now I find I have been doing it wrong all these years. I have been dividing miles driven by gallons thru the tank. I just tried my method using a town 112 miles away and it usually takes just a little over 4 gallons to get there. For simplicity's sake I divided 112 by 4 and had a result of 28 mpg. Then I divided 4 by 112 and found I was really only getting .0357 mpg.

Offline gene_225

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Re: Question for the "math guys"..
« Reply #29 on: June 28, 2022, 04:58:13 AM »
You had it right in the first place.