Author Topic: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..  (Read 3303 times)

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Offline Dee

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #30 on: August 04, 2022, 01:29:04 AM »
We know he was rose again...and that is what counts.

So why not talk about that, instead of pictures of feet, and angles of imaginary nails?

Locust has been pushing your buttons with goofy questions, and odd surmisings, ever since he logged onto GBO, and you "bite" time after time.

His inability to resist settin you up, is equally matched by your inability to ignore him.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline ironglow

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #31 on: August 04, 2022, 01:37:01 AM »
We know he was rose again...and that is what counts.

So why not talk about that, instead of pictures of feet, and angles of imaginary nails?

Locust has been pushing your buttons with goofy questions, and odd surmisings, ever since he logged onto GBO, and you "bite" time after time.

His inability to resist settin you up, is equally matched by your inability to ignore him.

  Nope..I only provided Locust with a retort ! 

   Check back, iit was DG to whom I replied, concerning the endless misleading dialog..

  So far as pictures of feet, angles of nails(which I didn't discuss) etc..  if you don't want to red or see that
   information..just pass on by..  There is no requirement that you either read or reply.
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline Dee

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #32 on: August 04, 2022, 01:49:05 AM »
We know he was rose again...and that is what counts.

So why not talk about that, instead of pictures of feet, and angles of imaginary nails?

Locust has been pushing your buttons with goofy questions, and odd surmisings, ever since he logged onto GBO, and you "bite" time after time.

His inability to resist settin you up, is equally matched by your inability to ignore him.

  Nope..I only provided Locust with a retort ! 

   Check back, iit was DG to whom I replied, concerning the endless misleading dialog..

  So far as pictures of feet, angles of nails(which I didn't discuss) etc..  if you don't want to red or see that
   information..just pass on by.. There is no requirement to read it !

Of course. What was I thinking.  DG is far more receptive to Christian views.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline Casull

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #33 on: August 04, 2022, 11:05:30 AM »
any way you's still have it wrong . at best the cross you picture is upside down .the short part of the cross in placed in a hole in the ground . it would be easier to stand up and easier to take down. and require less people to do so.


If the short part was put in the ground, what would be the purpose for the long part?   :o
Aim small, miss small!!!

Offline ironglow

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #34 on: August 04, 2022, 12:04:45 PM »
any way you's still have it wrong . at best the cross you picture is upside down .the short part of the cross in placed in a hole in the ground . it would be easier to stand up and easier to take down. and require less people to do so.


If the short part was put in the ground, what would be the purpose for the long part?   :o

  Some of the earliest depictions we have of Roman crucifixions..  Graffiti on barracks walls, mocking Christian believers from the 2nd and 3rd centuries.

 Roman soldiers of that era may have had a better sense of what crucifixion is..compared to what we know..
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline darkgael

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #35 on: August 05, 2022, 01:48:16 AM »
any way you's still have it wrong . at best the cross you picture is upside down .the short part of the cross in placed in a hole in the ground . it would be easier to stand up and easier to take down. and require less people to do so.


If the short part was put in the ground, what would be the purpose for the long part?   :o
Could be that is a reference to Crucifying a person in an upside down position. Wasn’t that how St. Peter was martyred?

Offline ironglow

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #36 on: August 05, 2022, 02:14:26 AM »
any way you's still have it wrong . at best the cross you picture is upside down .the short part of the cross in placed in a hole in the ground . it would be easier to stand up and easier to take down. and require less people to do so.


If the short part was put in the ground, what would be the purpose for the long part?   :o
Could be that is a reference to Crucifying a person in an upside down position. Wasn’t that how St. Peter was martyred?

  The upended crucifixion of Peter is held by tradition..even though the normal method was as depicted in the grafitti.  Tradition holds that Peter did not feel worthy to be crucified in the same way his savior was.

  Folklore can be powerful evidence, but not necessarily definitive, although I have no quarrel with the tradition.
 
   I am however, not entirely convinced that Peter finished his years in Rome.
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)
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Offline locust

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #37 on: August 22, 2022, 03:43:22 PM »
any way you's still have it wrong . at best the cross you picture is upside down .the short part of the cross in placed in a hole in the ground . it would be easier to stand up and easier to take down. and require less people to do so.
up

If the short part was put in the ground, what would be the purpose for the long part?   :o
the man would be huge  hands nailed to the post . being hung in that  manner puts a great deal of stress on the upper body restricting the breathing . even to the point of suffocation. to then get a breath of air the person would push up with the legs .to keep a person from doing that the legs would be broken

Offline locust

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #38 on: November 04, 2022, 04:48:32 PM »
there is another issue . we know Jesus was nailed on and it was stood up for all to see , how was he removed?? it was stood up  it would have to be laid down to remove him . a inverted cross like structure would be soooo much easier to lift up out of the hole it was set in . 4-5 man could do it easily 

Offline ironglow

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #39 on: November 05, 2022, 03:24:17 AM »
  Jesus was crucified on a cross, and not on any form of a natural tree.
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline Lloyd Smale

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #40 on: November 05, 2022, 05:51:24 AM »
a cross set only so deep that it would temporarily hold a man could easily be rocked back and forth and lowered by two people with pike poles. Same with setting them. A basic pole jinny and two guys can set a 30 foot treated power pole that weights much more then a 15 foot untreated cross with a man on it. Ive set a number of them like that and even a couple 35 footers that probably weight north of 400 lbs. Would have been even simpler to lower one with a horse to pull it and two men with pike poles to help lower it. Heck they could have pulled it over with just a horse if they didnt care about saving the cross. Im sure respect for the bodies of those crucified wasnt a real high priority.
blue lives matter

Offline locust

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #41 on: November 05, 2022, 10:55:28 AM »
  Jesus was crucified on a cross, and not on any form of a natural tree.
is  inverted cross still a cross? if some one was to carry it would it be  carried as a cross would be carried. until you have tried to stand any stick with a offset load thats on one side you will find that you are in for a surprise. 

Offline locust

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #42 on: November 05, 2022, 10:59:18 AM »
a cross set only so deep that it would temporarily hold a man could easily be rocked back and forth and lowered by two people with pike poles. Same with setting them. A basic pole jinny and two guys can set a 30 foot treated power pole that weights much more then a 15 foot untreated cross with a man on it. Ive set a number of them like that and even a couple 35 footers that probably weight north of 400 lbs. Would have been even simpler to lower one with a horse to pull it and two men with pike poles to help lower it. Heck they could have pulled it over with just a horse if they didnt care about saving the cross. Im sure respect for the bodies of those crucified wasnt a real high priority.
ah but a cross bar does make it sooo much easier to lift a pole or even a cross up out of the hole its planted/set in .that is something i
 know as fact

Offline ironglow

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #43 on: November 17, 2022, 02:06:29 AM »
  Not for Locust, since his descriptions are trying to reinforce his cult's insistence that Jesus died on a tree...you know, like the trunk of an apple or elm tree..
  Crucifixion was a very common manner of execution with the Romans, and was done regularly, often many at one time.

   For other, truly inquiring minds..the words of Tacitus, a first century Roman historian.  Who actually was an anti Christian..
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    "… fastened the guilt and inflicted the most exquisite tortures on a class hated for their abominations, called Christians by the populace. Christus, from whom the name had its origin, suffered the extreme penalty during the reign of Tiberius at the hands of one of our procurators, Pontius Pilatus, and a most mischievous superstition, thus checked for the moment, again broke out not only in Judæa, the first source of the evil, but even in Rome, where all things hideous and shameful from every part of the world find their centre and become popular. Accordingly, an arrest was first made of all who pleaded guilty; then, upon their information, an immense multitude was convicted, not so much of the crime of firing the city, as of hatred against mankind."
 
He then describes the torture of Christians:

"Mockery of every sort was added to their deaths. Covered with the skins of beasts, they were torn by dogs and perished, or were nailed to crosses, or were doomed to the flames and burnt, to serve as a nightly illumination, when daylight had expired. Nero offered his gardens for the spectacle, and was exhibiting a show in the circus, while he mingled with the people in the dress of a charioteer or stood aloft on a car. Hence, even for criminals who deserved extreme and exemplary punishment, there arose a feeling of compassion; for it was not, as it seemed, for the public good, but to glut one man’s cruelty, that they were being destroyed"
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline locust

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #44 on: November 17, 2022, 04:08:13 PM »
i am not going to tell  you no one has ever died on a cross . its a death that can take days. Jesus and the other men had to die in a few hours not days. thats why the legs would be broken if the person was not already dead

Offline phalanx

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #45 on: November 18, 2022, 07:04:12 AM »
Jesus prayed to his father near the end to take his life.  ( "And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost." )
In this time i Command ,That you take the Secular to Jerusalem .
There you rid the Holy City of the Scourge of Islam , Make the streets run red with the Blood of those who wish to wash Israel and Christianity from the face of the Earth.
Constantine III

Offline ironglow

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #46 on: November 18, 2022, 08:16:02 AM »
  I only went deeper into the subject of the crucifixion, not for Locust's sake, because he won't "get it" anyway. 

   The information I offered is for Christians and others who may be interested in learning more about the subject.

   Sorry, but I enjoy delving into whatever I can uncover, to add to my knowledge of history and my faith.

      I guess In would be boring to most, since I just love to  learn.  That is the reason I read or view very little fiction.

   if I can't learn at least something from it, I believe I am wasting my time..

 
25 For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion... (Romans 11:25a)

If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline phalanx

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #47 on: November 18, 2022, 12:13:40 PM »
  I only went deeper into the subject of the crucifixion, not for Locust's sake, because he won't "get it" anyway. 

   The information I offered is for Christians and others who may be interested in learning more about the subject.

   Sorry, but I enjoy delving into whatever I can uncover, to add to my knowledge of history and my faith.

      I guess In would be boring to most, since I just love to  learn.  That is the reason I read or view very little fiction.

   if I can't learn at least something from it, I believe I am wasting my time..

Watching The Passion of the Christ tonight. Risen is another good one.

 
25 For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion... (Romans 11:25a)

In this time i Command ,That you take the Secular to Jerusalem .
There you rid the Holy City of the Scourge of Islam , Make the streets run red with the Blood of those who wish to wash Israel and Christianity from the face of the Earth.
Constantine III

Offline locust

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #48 on: November 19, 2022, 07:39:28 AM »
  I only went deeper into the subject of the crucifixion, not for Locust's sake, because he won't "get it" anyway. 

   The information I offered is for Christians and others who may be interested in learning more about the subject.

   Sorry, but I enjoy delving into whatever I can uncover, to add to my knowledge of history and my faith.

      I guess In would be boring to most, since I just love to  learn.  That is the reason I read or view very little fiction.

   if I can't learn at least something from it, I believe I am wasting my time..

 
25 For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion... (Romans 11:25a)

lets go deeper. stanning a cross, inverted  cross or even a pole with no cross bar comes with many of the same problems . a straight pole with a man attached is going to twist when its picked up , a cross would be  easier  to get started up as the twist could be controlled, at least till grown men could reach no farther up, perhaps with a series of pushup sticks could be used. works on paper not so much in reality   . a inverted cross /a pole with a cross bar nearer the bottom. would not twist as the cross bar would have 2 maybe even 4 men pushing /lifting it up.they would not have to let go till the end drops into the hole.
the next problem ,how do you get it all down so that the dead man can be disposed of  ? the inverted cross would be the easiest .its just a matter of 2 to 4 men taking ahold of the crossbar and lifting it up. the cross or the pole has no hand holds       

Offline phalanx

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #49 on: November 19, 2022, 10:27:34 AM »
The passion of the Christ was bloody and cruel. And it went along more with what IG has said. I didn't like using the English subtitles to understand what was being said in Hebrew and Latin. Mel Gibson said he did that to be more realistic.
In this time i Command ,That you take the Secular to Jerusalem .
There you rid the Holy City of the Scourge of Islam , Make the streets run red with the Blood of those who wish to wash Israel and Christianity from the face of the Earth.
Constantine III

Offline locust

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #50 on: November 19, 2022, 03:16:38 PM »
The passion of the Christ was bloody and cruel. And it went along more with what IG has said. I didn't like using the English subtitles to understand what was being said in Hebrew and Latin. Mel Gibson said he did that to be more realistic.
you should know the passion of the christ was a movie. it kindof gave a glimpse into the life of jesus but hardly historical fact
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Offline phalanx

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #51 on: November 21, 2022, 05:17:51 AM »
Son of God was better than The Passion. Jesus wasn't Crucified on a tree. He didn't carry a tree through the streets of Jerusalem.

Why did you choose the name ( locust)? Basically a pest.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Locust
Locusts have formed plagues since prehistory. The ancient Egyptians carved them on their tombs and the insects are mentioned in the Iliad, the Mahabharata, and the Bible.[3] Swarms have devastated crops and have caused famines and human migrations. More recently, changes in agricultural practices and better surveillance of locust breeding grounds have allowed control measures at an early stage. Traditional locust control uses insecticides from the ground or air, but newer biological control methods are proving effective.
In this time i Command ,That you take the Secular to Jerusalem .
There you rid the Holy City of the Scourge of Islam , Make the streets run red with the Blood of those who wish to wash Israel and Christianity from the face of the Earth.
Constantine III

Offline ironglow

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #52 on: November 21, 2022, 06:37:29 AM »
Son of God was better than The Passion. Jesus wasn't Crucified on a tree. He didn't carry a tree through the streets of Jerusalem.

Why did you choose the name ( locust)? Basically a pest.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Locust
Locusts have formed plagues since prehistory. The ancient Egyptians carved them on their tombs and the insects are mentioned in the Iliad, the Mahabharata, and the Bible.[3] Swarms have devastated crops and have caused famines and human migrations. More recently, changes in agricultural practices and better surveillance of locust breeding grounds have allowed control measures at an early stage. Traditional locust control uses insecticides from the ground or air, but newer biological control methods are proving effective.

  ..LOL...  touche'
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline locust

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #53 on: November 21, 2022, 03:52:11 PM »
Son of God was better than The Passion. Jesus wasn't Crucified on a tree. He didn't carry a tree through the streets of Jerusalem.

Why did you choose the name ( locust)? Basically a pest.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Locust
Locusts have formed plagues since prehistory. The ancient Egyptians carved them on their tombs and the insects are mentioned in the Iliad, the Mahabharata, and the Bible.[3] Swarms have devastated crops and have caused famines and human migrations. More recently, changes in agricultural practices and better surveillance of locust breeding grounds have allowed control measures at an early stage. Traditional locust control uses insecticides from the ground or air, but newer biological control methods are proving effective.
locust comes from Revelation 9
you say he was not hung on a tree and yet many different bibles do say he was hung on a tree   KJV acts 5:30
"The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree"
its the ones that want to manipulate scripture to make it say what they want to say and believe , they are the ones to look out for.
it being the trunk of a tree,a round shaped thing, not hand hewn to have flat sides.

Offline phalanx

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #54 on: November 23, 2022, 07:25:28 AM »
Son of God was better than The Passion. Jesus wasn't Crucified on a tree. He didn't carry a tree through the streets of Jerusalem.

Why did you choose the name ( locust)? Basically a pest.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Locust
Locusts have formed plagues since prehistory. The ancient Egyptians carved them on their tombs and the insects are mentioned in the Iliad, the Mahabharata, and the Bible.[3] Swarms have devastated crops and have caused famines and human migrations. More recently, changes in agricultural practices and better surveillance of locust breeding grounds have allowed control measures at an early stage. Traditional locust control uses insecticides from the ground or air, but newer biological control methods are proving effective.
locust comes from Revelation 9
you say he was not hung on a tree and yet many different bibles do say he was hung on a tree   KJV acts 5:30
"The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree"
its the ones that want to manipulate scripture to make it say what they want to say and believe , they are the ones to look out for.
it being the trunk of a tree,a round shaped thing, not hand hewn to have flat sides.

Maybe they meant that a cross was made from a tree.
In this time i Command ,That you take the Secular to Jerusalem .
There you rid the Holy City of the Scourge of Islam , Make the streets run red with the Blood of those who wish to wash Israel and Christianity from the face of the Earth.
Constantine III

Offline Buckskin

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #55 on: November 23, 2022, 10:25:39 AM »
The passion of the Christ was bloody and cruel. And it went along more with what IG has said. I didn't like using the English subtitles to understand what was being said in Hebrew and Latin. Mel Gibson said he did that to be more realistic.
you should know the passion of the christ was a movie. it kindof gave a glimpse into the life of jesus but hardly historical fact

Historical facts are difficult to find from thousands of years ago, especially when religion is the subject, it's all an interpretation of man.
Buckskin

"I have tried to live my life so that my family would love me and my friends respect me. The others can do whatever the hell they please.   --John Wayne

Offline ironglow

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #56 on: November 23, 2022, 11:12:20 AM »
Because of a tree's characteristics, the term "tree" is commonly employed as a descriptive term.  The term is commonly applied to certain construction methods when building a bar.  The mast and crosstrees of a sailing ship    is  self explanatory.

  Then I have heard mothers warn children that if they kept swallowing- their chewing gum, they would create a "gum tree" in their belly.

  Then, of course, there is the shoe tree.  And of course, no farm boy could forget a whiffle tree...
 
   The term "tree' is used and misused, in a myriad of ways..                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                           
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline locust

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #57 on: November 23, 2022, 01:09:58 PM »
one does not have to look at a wood power pole very long to realise that it was once a Tree . we dont call it a tree and even if it has a cross bar we would not call it a crucifix . thats really not the issue . Rome would of done an execution of this type the simplest way .nail the condemned to a pole for all to see. its both torturous and dead dealing. if the condemed was not dead in a few hours the legs would be broken . not only would that hurt it would also put a great deal of stress on the body .breathing would become extremely difficult .the person hung up would suffocate to death

Offline ironglow

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #58 on: November 23, 2022, 01:16:29 PM »
  Get ov99er it!  He died on a cross..but if you prefer, call it a tree and believe what you want..  He is the
  Son of God and God the Son, and rose again on the third day.
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline locust

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Re: Archeological evidence from crucifixion..
« Reply #59 on: November 23, 2022, 01:23:31 PM »
we know jesus died and was removed and placed in a tumb . just how do you get a dead man down ? pulling nails on a standing pole is harded than you may think