Error sweeping through the church..

[ironglow]

Today, there is a grave error sweeping through much of the church, and perhaps it is part of the great falling away...

   It replaces clear thinking and Biblical scholarship..with raw emotion and being carried away with music and "different"
   stage effects.

      It claims that there are prophets being called today...along with apostles..  Sorry, no go..
   
  There are no more prophets or apostles being appointed by God these days.  John the Baptist was the last of his kind...the last true prophet..

  No new apostles have been approved since the first century....it just can't happen..

[geosmin]

    John the Baptist was the last of his kind...the last true prophet..

 

When did John the Baptist die?
When was the book of Revelation written?

Paul wrote I Corinthians 12-14.

[ironglow]

    John the Baptist was the last of his kind...the last true prophet..

 

When did John the Baptist die?  Don't you know?  John was murdered by Herod, just as Jesus was
  starting his ministry. In essence, John was the last of the Old Testament prophets..which he reinforced when he said,"I am the voice of one crying in the wilderness".   Then he doubled down, when he told his followers that he was not worthy to tie the sandals of the one who was to follow him.

  When was the book of Revelation written?  Most scholars tend to agree, that John (another John)wrote under inspiration on the island of Patmos..most likely during the last decade of the 1st century. Why do you ask?

Paul wrote I Corinthians 12-14.  So?  Nobody is taking issue with that

   Now perhaps, you can explain why you asked those two questions and made that statement concerning
  (1 Cor 12,14)., please extrapolate..

[Dee]

Today, there is a grave error sweeping through much of the church, and perhaps it is part of the great falling away...

   It replaces clear thinking and Biblical scholarship..with raw emotion and being carried away with music and "different"
   stage effects.

      It claims that there are prophets being called today...along with apostles..  Sorry, no go..
   
  There are no more prophets or apostles being appointed by God these days.  John the Baptist was the last of his kind...the last true prophet..

  No new apostles have been approved since the first century....it just can't happen..

Agreed, and TV evangelism has done much to corrupt the church, along with folks like Hal Lindsey and others making millions on prophecy books pretending to be prophets.

Todays 7/11 so called "Christian music" is more of a repeated chant carrying no Biblical message whatsoever, but more of an "emotional pump-up".

Cowboy churches sometimes make me nervous, as many have adopted a "cowboy dress up" come as you are, with a "cowboy bible"Bible. Huh?

Give it to me, but don't make me "uncomfortable".

In my hometown I was told that the Methodist Church has voted to leave the "United Methodist Church" organization, and go independent. I'd say, its about time.

"Error in the church"? An understatement.

[ironglow]

  Dee;
  What the OP was about..
   There is a current error that is spreading through the church like covid through a girl scouts camp. Probably one of the foremost error makers is something called the "New Apostolic Reformation" movement, or NAR..

  They are making big use of highly emotional people...getting them all wrapped up in wild music, then pushing all kinds of errors upon them.
   They claim that their "leaders" are prophets and apostles..  Sorry folks, those days are over..

  As I see it..when you see people get all tore up by music, talking gibberish, then rolling down the aisle and "jumping over the pews stiff-legged'"...that is a problem..

  Probably never has so much error been brought into the churches with a single movement.

   Here is a look at their game...  https://bereanresearch.org/dominionism-nar/

[geosmin]

IG:

As you, I believe the book of Revelation was written after the death of John the Baptist.

You state John the Baptist was the last "true prophet".

Was the book of Revelation written by a "true prophet"?

[ironglow]

IG:

As you, I believe the book of Revelation was written after the death of John the Baptist.

You state John the Baptist was the last "true prophet".

Was the book of Revelation written by a "true prophet"?

  Not really, not in the OT sense..First  John wrote the gospel of John, then 1,2&3 John while he was relatively free..
 When John was exiled to the isle of Patmos, he knew his words would not likely be heard or even read, within his lifetime..but God told him to record what he was told.
  Much the same as Luke, Peter, Mark and others wrote epistles under inspiration, but were not called prophets..forecasting future happenings as a warning.
 
    Note; Prophets, such a Ezekiel and Daniel, once they received the word from God..went about preaching to all, who would listen.

   The reason we have no prophets now...is because they are not needed. We have the full  word of God, so we don't need further revelations.

  Some confusion is experienced because upon occasion the term prophesy is used interchangeably with preaching, or message.

[geosmin]

IG:

As you, I believe the book of Revelation was written after the death of John the Baptist.

You state John the Baptist was the last "true prophet".

Was the book of Revelation written by a "true prophet"?

  Not really, not in the OT sense..First  John wrote the gospel of John, then 1,2&3 John while he was relatively free..
 When John was exiled to the isle of Patmos, he knew his words would not likely be heard or even read, within his lifetime..but God told him to record what he was told.
  Much the same as Luke, Peter, Mark and others wrote epistles under inspiration, but were not called prophets..forecasting future happenings as a warning.
 
    Note; Prophets, such a Ezekiel and Daniel, once they received the word from God..went about preaching to all, who would listen.

   The reason we have no prophets now...is because they are not needed. We have the full  word of God, so we don't need further revelations.

  Some confusion is experienced because upon occasion the term prophesy is used interchangeably with preaching, or message.

Thank you for your reply.

I reject your nuanced view, which seems contrived to allow your first statement of John the Baptist to stand.

If you deny John as a prophet, how then can you accept Revelation as prophecy? Or do you? Even preterists - those who
believe John wrote of near-future events that have already occurred - would call John a prophet.

Yet, John did prophesy, which makes him a prophet after John the Baptist. That his prophecy, given by God, would not be
read within his lifetime, does not negate his prophecy. Were it otherwise, then what of the Old Testament prophecies
which foretold the future coming of the Messiah? That they were unknown to the gentiles and, likely, many Jews, makes
them no less prophetic.

John knew the old prophecies, and in obedience, faith and trust in his God, wrote Revelation.


Isaiah 55:8-11
8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord.
9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.
10 For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater:
11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

[Dee]

The Apostle John was most certainly a "New Testament" prophet, and was taken up to view what was to come, and commanded by God to record his "Revelation" a prophecy.

[ironglow]

  Not at all deceptive.. As I said, not comparable to the OT prophets.  You quote Isaiah who said, 11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

   Excellent reference, at that point we did not have the complete Bible, it was still being written, and the OT prophets were to be included.  ..But now we have the entire Bible, and so we can refer to it for whatever we need.

The term prophet, underwent a change along with the new covenant.  Once we have in our hands the entire Word
  of God, we don't need more prophesy.

  With the OT prophets, such as Ezekiel, and Daniel..they were involved in everyday life, when the voice of the Lord came to them, told them what to preach and to whom they were to preach it. Straight away they went to the appointed people..and preached the message.
   With John he was given a vision which he was told to write down.  Even then he tells us that he did not write down all he saw..because we couldn't handle it..and naturally, he did not immediately start preaching to a target audience, as the OT prophets did. He didn't have an audience on Patmos..and surely God knew that well.  Did God expect him to preach to a crowd of nobodies..or did He just want the vision recorded in the NT..
 
  Smith's Bible dictionary explains it like this;
  Prophet. [E]The ordinary Hebrew word for prophet is nabi , derived from a verb signifying "to bubble forth" like a fountain; hence the word means one who announces or pours forth the declarations of God."

  So by the time of the new covenant, prophet was also a term for preacher.  Besides, Jesus sends "the comforter" to guide us with  His complete word.
     "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;"    (John 14:16)

  To wrap it up..let's hear what Jesus said on the subject;

  "  The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it."  (Luke 1616)

  "12 And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.
13 For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.
14 And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come. (Matt 11:12,-14)

 

[ironglow]

If we disagree on the details above..we will just have to disagree..

   ..But let's move on to the real subject of the OP..    That is the errors sweeping through the church these days.
  Specifically, the NAR  (New Apostolic Reformation) as I outlined in post # 4.  Check up on it.

[locust]

the great river Euphrates is drying up

[ironglow]

My concern for this entrance of error entering the church is not without a personal challenge.  There are signs that
  some of these manifestations are showing up in my local church.

  just about the last thing I want to deal with in these last years of my life, is theological error, however that is often
   the case of rapid growth in a local churc.  New people bring in odd ideas..

  I hear people quietly babbling so-called 'tongues', and once in a while, somebody "has a word" or speaks a prophesy..

  I am going on 87 and much rather would let my final curtain be drawn quietly, but we are commanded by
    God to resist error... so what choice have I ?

[Bob Riebe]

  just about the last thing I want to deal with in these last years of my life, is theological error,

I understand what you are saying and I feel your pain (sorry that just popped into my head    )
But such things started within months after Jesus went home.

It has gotten only worse.

[ironglow]

  just about the last thing I want to deal with in these last years of my life, is theological error,

I understand what you are saying and I feel your pain (sorry that just popped into my head    )
But such things started within months after Jesus went home.

It has gotten only worse.

 Yes, Jesus himself warned us..
  "15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves." (Mathew 7:15)

  ..But we must be on guard, likely because time is drawing closer.   Some times I wonder but what old Beelzebub is trying to grab what he can..while he can.