Author Topic: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..  (Read 993 times)

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Offline ironglow

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Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« on: March 16, 2023, 03:16:06 AM »
  A Russian fighter jet downed one of our nearly $30 million drone over international waters of the Black Sea.  First
  the Russian pilot dumps fuel on the drone..then apparently clips the propellor, bringing it down..

   Russians are at the moment, doing their best to recover the drone for their own uses..  We cannot even try to recover the craft, since Biden pulled our Navy out of the Black sea, when Putin decided to invade Ukraine.

  https://www.foxnews.com/politics/russia-try-recovering-downed-us-drone-us-vows-protect-our-equities

       
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline Dee

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #1 on: March 16, 2023, 03:21:09 AM »
Another display of an inept Russian pilots' flying ability caught on camera. He got lucky and survived.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline ironglow

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #2 on: March 16, 2023, 03:47:00 AM »
Another display of an inept Russian pilots' flying ability caught on camera. He got lucky and survived.

   Yes, I accept the fuel dump..but I suspect the clipping of the drone prop..was just ineptness..the pilot blew it!

  ..I suppose Putin had misgivings for a moment, but then realizing he was dealing with sleepy Joe...he figures he may as well try recovering OUR drone..since nothing will be done by the US about it !
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline mcbammer

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #3 on: March 16, 2023, 05:29:29 AM »
      Well the Russian brought the drone down  ,  without firing a 30 million dollar missle  like at a   ballon .Looks like pretty good flying to me .
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Offline guzzijohn

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #4 on: March 16, 2023, 08:45:51 AM »
From mcbammer:
Quote
Well the Russian brought the drone down  ,  without firing a 30 million dollar missle  like at a   ballon .Looks like pretty good flying to me

Where did you get that cost figure? I see it at about $440,000. The Russian plane could easily have that much cost in damage form hitting the drone. I seriously doubt the Russians were concerned about a cost of a missile. What was the cost of the dumped fuel?
GuzziJohn
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Offline ironglow

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #5 on: March 16, 2023, 10:41:11 AM »
  It would seem that in bringing the baloon down..a skilful pilot would puncture the balloon with just enough MG fire, to allow the gas to escape slowly..and make a soft landing.  ..But he was probably engaging under strict orders..

   So far as the Russians dumping fuel..probably the one it upset the most was "how dare you" Greta..  She probably
    threw a stark, raving, tantrum...
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline mcbammer

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #6 on: March 16, 2023, 11:44:48 AM »
From mcbammer:
Quote
Well the Russian brought the drone down  ,  without firing a 30 million dollar missle  like at a   ballon .Looks like pretty good flying to me

Where did you get that cost figure? I see it at about $440,000. The Russian plane could easily have that much cost in damage form hitting the drone. I seriously doubt the Russians were concerned about a cost of a missile. What was the cost of the dumped fuel?
GuzziJohn
      Correction the drone cost 30 million , some say 15 million ,who knows what things cost the military ,they'll buy a 600 dollar hammer .

Offline ironglow

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #7 on: March 16, 2023, 11:52:48 AM »
From mcbammer:
Quote
Well the Russian brought the drone down  ,  without firing a 30 million dollar missle  like at a   ballon .Looks like pretty good flying to me

Where did you get that cost figure? I see it at about $440,000. The Russian plane could easily have that much cost in damage form hitting the drone. I seriously doubt the Russians were concerned about a cost of a missile. What was the cost of the dumped fuel?
GuzziJohn

  ..About $32,000,000...  https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidhambling/2020/06/10/why-the-air-force-needs-a-cheaper-reaper/?sh=3852333a946f
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline JBinMN

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #8 on: March 16, 2023, 04:03:55 PM »
Ya'll haven't figured out about the legalization of "PROPAGANDA" being legally able to be given to the US citizens yet?

I feel sad for ya for not being able to recognize BS being shoved in your faces, and worse yet, eating it like it was a candy bar.

Doggone folks...
Wise the hell up...

Under the Obamination regime, the ability to propagandize the US people was legalized.
Here is a link to the Act that became LAW under the US Congress back in 2011-2012 into 2013:
https://www.congress.gov/bill/112th/house-bill/5736

. another one:
https://www.rferl.org/a/obama-signs-law-restructuring-us-international-media-voa-rferl-board-governors/28194511.html

After close to 60+ years and a removing/undermining a law that prohibited the use of Propaganda by US sources to be read/heard/etc. by the US citizens by US media from back in around 1948, that oler law was changed & now it is legal to BS(Propagandize) ya any time they want...

Hey, I have said it before & I will say it again..

Believe what ya like.

But remember  that I, or others do not have to believe what YOU believe.

remember... NO matter what,

"CONSIDER THE SOURCE.".

 ;)

( Including "me", do your own research. Show me how I am mistaken.   ;) )


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Offline guzzijohn

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #9 on: March 17, 2023, 03:18:31 AM »
The fighters were approaching from behind dumping fuel while VERY closely overflying it to soak it in fuel. What I don't get from the video is how the fighter made contact with what appears to be only the propeller and not contact any other part of the drone and what part of the fighter made contact with it? Other thought is that the fuel dump was heavy and dense enough to damage the prop. Your all guesses are probably as good or better than mine.
GuzziJohn
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Offline Goldie

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #10 on: March 17, 2023, 03:24:21 AM »
I really think most on this forum website believe the government to be full of human excrement and take heed with whatever they put out whether it be democrat 0r rhino rheterick.
Ya'll haven't figured out about the legalization of "PROPAGANDA" being legally able to be given to the US citizens yet?

I feel sad for ya for not being able to recognize BS being shoved in your faces, and worse yet, eating it like it was a candy bar.

Doggone folks...
Wise the hell up...

Under the Obamination regime, the ability to propagandize the US people was legalized.
Here is a link to the Act that became LAW under the US Congress back in 2011-2012 into 2013:
https://www.congress.gov/bill/112th/house-bill/5736

. another one:
https://www.rferl.org/a/obama-signs-law-restructuring-us-international-media-voa-rferl-board-governors/28194511.html

After close to 60+ years and a removing/undermining a law that prohibited the use of Propaganda by US sources to be read/heard/etc. by the US citizens by US media from back in around 1948, that oler law was changed & now it is legal to BS(Propagandize) ya any time they want...

Hey, I have said it before & I will say it again..

Believe what ya like.

But remember  that I, or others do not have to believe what YOU believe.

remember... NO matter what,

"CONSIDER THE SOURCE.".

 ;)

( Including "me", do your own research. Show me how I am mistaken.   ;) )



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Offline JBinMN

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #11 on: March 17, 2023, 04:02:00 AM »
The fighters were approaching from behind dumping fuel while VERY closely overflying it to soak it in fuel. What I don't get from the video is how the fighter made contact with what appears to be only the propeller and not contact any other part of the drone and what part of the fighter made contact with it? Other thought is that the fuel dump was heavy and dense enough to damage the prop. Your all guesses are probably as good or better than mine.
GuzziJohn

Not necessarily directed at "you" GuzziJohn, but to others as well. I just used your quote to separate from a comment I make that follows this one.
;)

It would be my somewhat educated WAG that the fuel was dumped to create a "flooding" condition to the Reapers turboprop engine.

The engine requires a fuel air mix, just like a internal combustion engine, or even for a gas turbine or jet engine & if that mix is forced to take on too much air, or too much fuel it overwhelms the engine(s) ability to correctly mix the air/fuel and makes the engine(s) shut off.

When the fuel was dumped and got sucked into the air intake for the engine it simply shut the engine down & thus the prop shut down.

Not so sure about any possible highjinks of "hitting the prop" as the so called, "News" says. I doubt it.

It seems that using such a tactic like fuel dumping to overwhelm the ACs ability to keep its' engine(s) running to take down a aircraft would be a good one if one wanted to make sure that the AC was undamaged, or lightly damaged for recovery by whoever gets there to it first.

Even if it had been an on-board piloted AC, the effect of the fuel dumping & engine(s) shutting down would make the pilot whether on board or not aboard the AC likely have to do some emergency measures to recover , IF recovery was possible.

I don''t know much about the drones capability to glide if there is some sort of engine failure, but I think that many AC can be put on a glide path to recover after a engine shutdown IF the engine might be restarted.

Even if the engine(s) cannot be re-started, even helos can be "auto rotated" if there is engine failure(s) and if done right usually a successful but "iffy' landing can be made. ( <this I know for a fact as I have participated in training & actually doing auto-rotation landings on more than one occasion. ;) )

I don't have pilot training but I do/did have accredited AC Airframe & Powerplant schooling, as well as a lot of schooling,training & flying in CH46 helos while I was in the Corps., so I know a bit more about how they work, instead of flying them. I am pretty sure though that many AC can be glided into landing and don't just drop like a rock if there is an engine failure. ;)

Anyway, The fuel dumping in this case was , IMO, likely a tactic/method of taking down the drone without firing on it or even making any direct contact with it by the Ruskies, and whether or not it was done to aid in recovery by any party, or just to keep the "engagement" to a minimum of a demonstration of aggression by either party, I do not know.

I liken it to "Use of Force" levels & whether or not one has to move up the levels depending on the threat perceived. If folks here understand what I am talking about. ( I think may would anyway.)

OK, I will stop there with this conjecture, & only say that the cost of the fuel to accomplish the mission of downing a perceived threat likely has less cost both in $$$ and in aggravating the situation by shooting a cannon, MG, or a missile, much like the use of pepper spray instead of shooting someone perceived as an attacker might be considered a lesser "use of force".

Offline JBinMN

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #12 on: March 17, 2023, 04:12:46 AM »
I really think most on this forum website believe the government to be full of human excrement and take heed with whatever they put out whether it be democrat 0r rhino rheterick.

I agree with ya for the most part.
I also note that the faith that some here , as well as elsewhere, have in what I call the, "MSM" ( Main Stream Media), that is run by something like 4-6 corporations who basically run the whole "news" system, at least as far as TV goes; is not necessarily a good idea if those folks are/were not aware that laws were changed to allow for the propagandizing of the US citizens by those same MSM outlets by the US Gubment under the Obaminations watch.

I do not plan to go on further in that issue here in this topic, so as to not further hijack any discussion about the drone incident.

I will stop with that. :)

Offline Dee

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #13 on: March 17, 2023, 04:44:38 AM »
There is no way for anyone here, or anywhere else, to know if this "incident" even happened, or if it did, how it happened.
For every positive report, there is a negative one, and for every "reliable source" there is another claiming to be just as reliable, saying the opposite.

We live in an age of computer assessability that has become nuthin more than "propaganda", and it's a choose your brand of poison on what you accept or reject.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline ironglow

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #14 on: March 18, 2023, 01:39:05 AM »
Yeah well, the Russians claim they warned the Americans 19 times to get their snooper drone out of the area or they would take it down.
.

  Reports say the drone was over international waters..  Should that have made a difference?

  It is becoming more clear that both Obama and Biden (Obama's puppet?) are considered very weak by the Russian
  leaders.  Note; during the Obama admin, Putin invades Crimea, now during the Biden administration, Putin invades
  Ukraine.

    There were no adventures by Putin, trying to take back the old USSR client states, while Trump was in office.

    Self explanatory...
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)
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Offline Dee

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #15 on: March 18, 2023, 02:10:38 AM »
Yeah well, the Russians claim they warned the Americans 19 times to get their snooper drone out of the area or they would take it down.
.

  Reports say the drone was over international waters..  Should that have made a difference?

  It is becoming more clear that both Obama and Biden (Obama's puppet?) are considered very weak by the Russian
  leaders.  Note; during the Obama admin, Putin invades Crimea, now during the Biden administration, Putin invades
  Ukraine.

    There were no adventures by Putin, trying to take back the old USSR client states, while Trump was in office.

    Self explanatory...

Agreed.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline ironglow

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #16 on: March 18, 2023, 08:29:57 AM »
The drone was in international air space with transponders off. That air space is a designated war zone. That particular drone can also carry weapons, and the USA is and active participant in the war. The drone operators would not retract the drone. Russians were within legal rights to down it.   If it was a balloon floating around the USA slow Joe would have order a shoot down.

This drone caper will probably be used to further deepen Washington's involvement with it's proxy war against Russia.  Most likely to send offensive jet aircraft to Ukro President Nuland and her court jester, Zelenskyy. Meanwhile, how many banks failed in Russia last week?
.

  The explanation is far simpler than that..Putin knows he is dealing with a "Patsy" !  It worked with Obama, and  has
  worked as well with his hand picked, dummkopf successor.
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline Bob Riebe

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #17 on: March 18, 2023, 09:49:49 AM »
There was NO fuel dump, I finally saw the video and all that was , was simply heat signature of the fighter planes engines.
A fuel dump will IGNITE, Aussies used to do it at air shows with the F-111 and there would be a huge flame.

At worst the pilots were seeing if their exhaust could do a number on the Drone.
I have read a goodly number of sites on Russian fighters and pilots, and they all seem to say the Russian pilots, from back when there waas East-West pilot exchanges were/are very, very poorly trained.

The very newest may be different but even twenty years ago Russia's fighter cockpits were labor intensive as the pilot had to be heads-down to use the electronic systems involved.

I was surprised to find out that Russia had the helmet controlled air to air missle over a decade before the U.S. had one BUT even then Russian pilot lost some of his advantage due to having to look at his cockpit controls  white in dog fight unless they were close enough to use the gun.

Poland has the most advanced export Mig-29 after decades of update mods. bith by the Russians and the West.
Even the early Mig-29s though were the absolute best visual range dog-fight aircraft bar none including the F-16 and F-22, its horrid electronics were its main failing the second being its short air combat range.

Offline Goldie

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #18 on: March 18, 2023, 12:42:05 PM »
No fuel dump? Heat signature ? Come on man you got to be kidding. Must be some pretty good stuff you have in the pipe.  ;D
There was NO fuel dump, I finally saw the video and all that was , was simply heat signature of the fighter planes engines.
A fuel dump will IGNITE, Aussies used to do it at air shows with the F-111 and there would be a huge flame.

At worst the pilots were seeing if their exhaust could do a number on the Drone.
I have read a goodly number of sites on Russian fighters and pilots, and they all seem to say the Russian pilots, from back when there waas East-West pilot exchanges were/are very, very poorly trained.


Offline nw_hunter

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #19 on: March 18, 2023, 12:57:34 PM »
Biden, still pokin the Bear, and the Bear is tired of it. Get the hell out of that region. We never should have been involved in the first place. If you want to try out some drones, then do it on our southern border where we should be using the billions sent to Ukraine down there to wipe out the cartel, and anyone associated with them. "Wait" That would mean wiping out half of DC and the equally corrupt Mexican Government as well. Can't have that! Can we?
Take a look at this map. https://www.welt-atlas.de/datenbank/karten/en/karte-1-1033-en.gif
We're not playing with Afghanistan, Iraq, or one of the other sheep herding rock piles. We are poking someone with big teeth.
Besides we have more important things happening close to home. They are coming after Trump again, and he is saying he could be arrested Tuesday, by the state of New Yawk.
Freedom Of Speech.....Once we lose it, every other freedom will follow.

Offline Bob Riebe

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fuel dump
« Reply #20 on: March 18, 2023, 01:39:53 PM »
I saw a different video, major channel actually, and they did show the fuel dump and how it worked.
Much better video than the first one.
It is amazing they did not get this or maybe they tried.

Que , sera, sera

Online Mule 11

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Re: Russian fighter plane downs our aircraft..
« Reply #21 on: March 18, 2023, 02:38:58 PM »
Biden, still pokin the Bear, and the Bear is tired of it. Get the hell out of that region. We never should have been involved in the first place. If you want to try out some drones, then do it on our southern border where we should be using the billions sent to Ukraine down there to wipe out the cartel, and anyone associated with them. "Wait" That would mean wiping out half of DC and the equally corrupt Mexican Government as well. Can't have that! Can we?
Take a look at this map. https://www.welt-atlas.de/datenbank/karten/en/karte-1-1033-en.gif
We're not playing with Afghanistan, Iraq, or one of the other sheep herding rock piles. We are poking someone with big teeth.
Besides we have more important things happening close to home. They are coming after Trump again, and he is saying he could be arrested Tuesday, by the state of New Yawk.

Mebbe he should go to Florida and fortify his arse? He has had plenty of time and tons of cash to do so...