Gold Gold Gold

[Ranger99]

I've been getting more junk mail and emails
lately about how important it is to buy gold
since things are getting warmer in the M.E.

I've probably posted something similar before,
but I'm gonna throw it out there again.

If you have a stash of gold ingots and coins,
and things actually have gone to poop, and
paper money is worthless for buying necessities,
exactly how do you buy a loaf of bread or
something similar with a piece of gold that
you paid over a thousand dollars for?
I've asked the same question of many people
in person and online, and nobody can give a
satisfactory answer. They either quote somebody's
"wealth building " book or seminar, or get red
faced and indignant and angry as if I asked
permission to have relations with their wife.

Anybody on GBOR have a logical feasible
knowledgeable sensible answer  ?

[Casull]

I've been getting more junk mail and emails
lately about how important it is to buy gold
since things are getting warmer in the M.E.

I've probably posted something similar before,
but I'm gonna throw it out there again.

If you have a stash of gold ingots and coins,
and things actually have gone to poop, and
paper money is worthless for buying necessities,
exactly how do you buy a loaf of bread or
something similar with a piece of gold that
you paid over a thousand dollars for?
I've asked the same question of many people
in person and online, and nobody can give a
satisfactory answer. They either quote somebody's
"wealth building " book or seminar, or get red
faced and indignant and angry as if I asked
permission to have relations with their wife.

Anybody on GBOR have a logical feasible
knowledgeable sensible answer  ?

Pretty simple.  Gold is soft.  Cut off a piece and use that.  Wasn't that long ago that people paid for things with dust and nuggets.

[Ranger99]

Yeah
What if the vendor doesn't have an accurate
way to weigh and grade the gold?
Most likely somebody will get the short stick

[Lloyd Smale]

i think of it like this. if its so dam good why is the tv full of comercials wanting to trade me their gold for my money? its a good long term investment but food guns and ammo what will be worth the most if shtf. cant see much use for shiny rocks or rings and Neckleses when you family is hungry. like most here were getting up in age. long term saving doesnt matter to me anymore. id rather use my money to enjoy life today then get buried with a pile of it in the bank.

[Casull]

Yeah
What if the vendor doesn't have an accurate
way to weigh and grade the gold?
Most likely somebody will get the short stick

Didn't really effect trade when this country was growing up.  Or any other civilization for the past several millenium.

[gene_225]

What do you think pieces of eight were?

[Ranger99]

What do you think pieces of eight were?

That was a silver coin from
Spain worth eight reales.
Most everybody could nearly
accurately cut one into 4 equal
parts, and divide those in two.
That's stuff they no longer teach
in school

[Ranger99]

Yeah
What if the vendor doesn't have an accurate
way to weigh and grade the gold?
Most likely somebody will get the short stick

Didn't really effect trade when this country was growing up.  Or any other civilization for the past several millenium.

Remembering the period literature ( like mark twain)
most all the larger stores traded in things like animal
hides and had scales on site to weigh gold dust and
nuggets and such.
That'll never happen again in any of our lifetimes.
And a gold piece was 5 dollars worth of gold.
Not so in 2023. I can hold 5 dollars worth of groceries
in one hand. You'd need a wagon or pack animals
to haul 5 dollars worth of grub in those days.
Really good jobs back then paid a dollar a day
if you were lucky enough to find a deal like that

[Ranger99]

Semi related
A box of plain store brand saltine crackers
like I've bought for years now costs $1.74
as of 30 October this last month.
Not too long ago the identical product was 88 cents

[Ranger99]

Well I was sorta thinking wrongly

According to this brochure, a 1 ounce 99%
gold ingot is a bit over $2000.00

I was still stuck on $1000.00 

[Casull]

Most of us here have grain scales that will weigh down to 1/70,000 of a pound (1 tenth of 1 grain).  They are quite common.  You're envisioning problems that would not exist.

[Ranger99]

. . .  You're envisioning problems that would not exist.

No, not really.
Of course I can't speak for everybody, but I
don't know of any stores near me that would
accept precious metals or stones as payment
for any food or merchandise.
The local grocery and hardware stores don't
have precision scales, or cashiers qualified
to judge the quality and purity of precious
metals. Every scale that I know of used for
business purposes must be certified by an
inspector of the government, so bringing
your own with you would definitely not be
an option. Bureau of Weights and Measures IIRC.
Maybe 4 or 5 decades from now if the world
still exists.

Not trying to instigate any arguments.
Just looking for a non-emotional answer
to a sincere question.
And there's still no answer

[Casull]

. . .  You're envisioning problems that would not exist.

No, not really.
Of course I can't speak for everybody, but I
don't know of any stores near me that would
accept precious metals or stones as payment
for any food or merchandise.
The local grocery and hardware stores don't
have precision scales, or cashiers qualified
to judge the quality and purity of precious
metals. Every scale that I know of used for
business purposes must be certified by an
inspector of the government, so bringing
your own with you would definitely not be
an option. Bureau of Weights and Measures IIRC.
Maybe 4 or 5 decades from now if the world
still exists.

Not trying to instigate any arguments.
Just looking for a non-emotional answer
to a sincere question.
And there's still no answer

Well, the problem is that you were NOT talking about today, but in a SHTF scenario.  If THAT were to happen, those stores (if they were even open) would make whatever changes were needed to accept ANY form of acceptable payment.  Nobody wanting to sell something is going to turn down gold, especially if money becomes worthless.

[Ranger99]

Well you can buy all the gold you want to
I never said that anybody couldn't.

If things fell apart,  stores as we know them now
won't exist. They have to pay employee salaries,
pay commercial-rate utilities,  pay wholesalers
and vendors,  etc.
There won't be any walmart, no bass amateur shop,
No fast food places like McSalty's or Booger Queen,
no automotive industries such as dealerships, or
aftermarket parts supply places. None for agricultural
parts and equipment.

Modern businesses are totally geared towards currencies.

The reason people usually give me is to be able to
buy things with their precious metals and stones if
currency becomes unusable,  but that's not feasible

[GTS225]

i think of it like this. if its so dam good why is the tv full of comercials wanting to trade me their gold for my money? its a good long term investment but food guns and ammo what will be worth the most if shtf. cant see much use for shiny rocks or rings and Neckleses when you family is hungry. like most here were getting up in age. long term saving doesnt matter to me anymore. id rather use my money to enjoy life today then get buried with a pile of it in the bank.

YUP!  I'm in Lloyd's corner.  Gold, silver, and gems ain't gonna be worth she-ite in an appocolyptic situation.  It'll be lead, smokeless and black powder, food, ammo, guns, and maybe alcohol, not necessarily in that order.  Further down the list might be seeds, fuels, etc.
I suggest one remembers New Orlean's hurricane Katrina, and what law enforcement was confiscating......it wasn't gold and silver.

Just my opine.....Roger

[Casull]

i think of it like this. if its so dam good why is the tv full of comercials wanting to trade me their gold for my money? its a good long term investment but food guns and ammo what will be worth the most if shtf. cant see much use for shiny rocks or rings and Neckleses when you family is hungry. like most here were getting up in age. long term saving doesnt matter to me anymore. id rather use my money to enjoy life today then get buried with a pile of it in the bank.

YUP!  I'm in Lloyd's corner.  Gold, silver, and gems ain't gonna be worth she-ite in an appocolyptic situation.  It'll be lead, smokeless and black powder, food, ammo, guns, and maybe alcohol, not necessarily in that order.  Further down the list might be seeds, fuels, etc.
I suggest one remembers New Orlean's hurricane Katrina, and what law enforcement was confiscating......it wasn't gold and silver.

Just my opine.....Roger

Yep, because when this country was young and gold and silver were the only currency, everybody traded goods and nobody "bought" anything or would accept raw gold for trade.   

[wtxbadger]

Always figured if everything collapsed financially then trade goods and bartering would be it. Basic durable goods and dry goods would seem to me to be the way to survive. Beans, flour, corn meal, ammo and other basic needs. On the other hand there are lots of people dependent on prescription meds and it makes me wonder how they would survive a complete meltdown of society if it happened.

[gypsyman]

 Never was much on the buy gold just in case. I figured silver was a better option. Coins minted before 1964 I believe, are solid silver. A lot easier to barter with a 1955 silver quarter worth whatever value they are, than chip off a piece of gold.

[mcbammer]

     
        Precious metal will always be worth something ,  Keep a little on hand ,you may need to swap it for a loaf of bread someday .

[Lloyd Smale]

without electricity i doubt those stores could stay open. stores in the old days were mostly dry goods. today alot of what we buy is Refridgerated. grandpa told me about when he was i high school working weekends to cut ice for the ice house at the grocery store. shtf first thing that will happen is the stores will be ransacked. probably empty in a week and no way to replenish them. want to buy a t bone with your gold? my guess is the same thief's will have them gone in short order too and youd better eat it fast because you have no refrigeration either. you will be buying canned food and rice and beans of of armed scalpers. they will want ammo alot more than your gold. because they realize they are going to be in your spot very soon because without electricity EVERYTHING STOPS no production of new food no fuel to transfer even what they have in storage. which buy the way the government will confiscate to feed there selves. grow your own? youd best already have seeds and lots of guns to protect it. bottom line all it takes to put us in all on Armagedon mode is a couple emps to take out our electrical grid. just that would send us back to the 1700s and without the skills our forefathers had to live the very hard life they did. not one of us could survive without it because it would shut down everything.  how much do you really think shiny rocks will buy you. i wouldnt swap you a can of tomato soup for a pound of it and i hate tomato soup.

. . .  You're envisioning problems that would not exist.

No, not really.
Of course I can't speak for everybody, but I
don't know of any stores near me that would
accept precious metals or stones as payment
for any food or merchandise.
The local grocery and hardware stores don't
have precision scales, or cashiers qualified
to judge the quality and purity of precious
metals. Every scale that I know of used for
business purposes must be certified by an
inspector of the government, so bringing
your own with you would definitely not be
an option. Bureau of Weights and Measures IIRC.
Maybe 4 or 5 decades from now if the world
still exists.

Not trying to instigate any arguments.
Just looking for a non-emotional answer
to a sincere question.
And there's still no answer

Well, the problem is that you were NOT talking about today, but in a SHTF scenario.  If THAT were to happen, those stores (if they were even open) would make whatever changes were needed to accept ANY form of acceptable payment.  Nobody wanting to sell something is going to turn down gold, especially if money becomes worthless.

[guzzijohn]

Do people ever ask themselves why all these adds to sell gold? If it is such a great investment why are they trying to sell it? People do not realize that you will NOT get anywhere close to spot prices when they try to sell. When I was trustee of an estate the estate had a silver bar. After much searching I found a place that paid 90% of spot. Most would pay 50-60%. Terrible investment IMHO.
GuzziJohn

[GTS225]

Do people ever ask themselves why all these adds to sell gold? If it is such a great investment why are they trying to sell it? People do not realize that you will NOT get anywhere close to spot prices when they try to sell. When I was trustee of an estate the estate had a silver bar. After much searching I found a place that paid 90% of spot. Most would pay 50-60%. Terrible investment IMHO.
GuzziJohn

This, and the thought that if they're spending such a large amount of money for television advertisement, just how much profit are they making selling, and buying gold?
The value of "precious" metals and gems is a HUMAN concept.  From a very practical viewpoint, they're good for nothing but decoration. (Well, gold is good for electrical contacts in space, being as it doesn't tarnish.)

Buy (dismally) LOW, sell (astronomically) HIGH.....Roger

[ironglow]

  That ius a terrible narkup..., but I can recall when we as investors were robbed of much of our investments, primarily by government actions.

  Carter's years when inflation went to 20%... Then 1987..a "reset"..  Then 2000..the high tech bubble broke, and robbed our investments.

    Then about 2007-2008 Barney Frank and Chris Dodd managed the "housing crisis" that endangered the  the big banks, so Obama bailed the big
   banks out with OUR money...and the banks have paid virtually NO INTEREST on savings since then.

     So it doesn't look like anything the government gets its grubbny hands on,does very well. Especially now, that we know we cannot trust the
     federal government.

   Real estate may be a decent investment.  I hav ehad more calls in the last 6 months or so...asking to buy somne wooded acreage I own.
   Strange thing, the offers seem tobe coming from unnamed sources..buyers for some  kind of a "shadow purchasers".  ....Not selling !

[Dixie-Dude]

Best gold to buy is Israeli Sheckel.  It is about the size of a dime and worth maybe $200 about 1/10 of an ounce.  It is probably better to buy silver as it is cheaper and right now it is about $30 an ounce.  You can get it in smaller amounts and then there is old silver coins if you can find them. 

Probably best to buy beans, bullets, and bandaids.  Canned goods keep their vitamins about 2 years thus the expiration is about 2 years out.  However, keeping vitamins on hand with older foods is what the military did in Vietnam.  I know guys who were in Vietnam and ate WWII C and K rations with dates of 1943 and 1944 stamped on them.  They did hand out vitamins to take when eating them.  Dry goods can last far longer except flour.  Ammo for hunting and self defence.  Then medical supplies for almost every possible problem.  Then store losts of garden seeds as long term some may not germinate.  Fishing tackle, snare wire and traps is also a must for long term survival. 

Guys we watch on financial news say hyperinflation will begin late next year and into 2025.  Prepare for it.  Buy now while prices are lower. 

[Lloyd Smale]

dammit i hate to agree with you but in this your SPOT on

Do people ever ask themselves why all these adds to sell gold? If it is such a great investment why are they trying to sell it? People do not realize that you will NOT get anywhere close to spot prices when they try to sell. When I was trustee of an estate the estate had a silver bar. After much searching I found a place that paid 90% of spot. Most would pay 50-60%. Terrible investment IMHO.
GuzziJohn

[Casull]

Don't know why you guys think it's an either/or situation.  Buy beans, ammo, etc. AND gold.  I bought some in the early 2000's when it was $400 an ounce and sold it ten years later at $2000 an ounce.  Worked pretty well.  Also, if inflation does run up EVEN more next year, that gold will get you more paper funny money, if that's what you really want.

[Lloyd Smale]

bought my camp and 80 acres in 99 for 37k. last year was offered 180k for it. i didnt have to go and see what i could get for it. they came to me. then like was posted when you bought that gold for 400 bucks unless you paid way under spot price you got taken for the same ride youd be on trying to get someone to actually give you 2k an once. then factor in inflation. you could buy a well equipped 4x4 pickup in 2000 for 15k. i know I bought one that year. today the same truck would set you back 55-60k or 4 times as much.

so well you might have made a bit of profit its nothing like what gold buyers and sellers like to claim. i made the same gains with my camp and our whole family has enjoyed it and hunted their for 20 years. how much fun and memories did you make with those rocks. my take on it in a shtf scenario is the value of something that cant be used for what its good for and when staying alive is the major concern, not gaining wealth the price of frivolous things tank. no im no expert and dont claim to be and we havent seen a real shtf scenario to test it. keep in mind our government uses gold to back up the dollar. what happens to the value of your gold if there is no government? what happens when it fails and fort knox is ransacked and all that gold hits the streets? you wont be able to buy a bag of beans for 10lbs of it. i doubt you bought your gold as a shtf currency. i know your an intelligent man and im sure you bought it as a long term investment for your older retired years. it worked well for that.

i would have been better off buying gold then i did with my 401k. but shtf is a totaly different thing and unless you can find a way to tenderize it ill take beans rice and ammo. long term is over for me. ive got a little money in the bank for unforeseen non shtf stuff. i no longer save money. today im 67 and am going to spend as many years as i can enjoying myself. if i want something i buy it. im not going to spend my last years driving rusty vehicles or sitting home to save more money that my kids will blow. actually this whole discussion is silly. there's probably no 5% of us here that are young enough and or are in good enough shape to survive a shtf thing anyway no matter what you have stashed. hell, do you even want to live in a world like that?

[ironglow]

  From WTXbadger;

      " On the other hand there are lots of people dependent on prescription meds and it makes me wonder how they would survive a complete
    meltdown of society if it happened.'
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

   They probably won't survive, that's the hard truth of it !  I have meds, but Iwouldn't die right off.. How long does it take for  high blood pressure
    or cholestrol to get a fellow?

  Those who need meds, just to survive daily, will have a tough go of it !  I guess if it were me, I would stock up a bit if possible, and if the SHTF
     happens, just deal with it..

[Lloyd Smale]

remember that just a short time ago if you lived to mid 60s it was exceptional. there were very few real meds and people wore there bodys out doing actual work. just think how many times in your life you had to take antibiotics for something a cut on the hand that got infected killed thousands before penicillin. if you sat a cord of cut wood in the yard and gave everyone an axe and said you had to split it all and no breaks half of them couldnt do it and it would probably kill many of them and im not just talking old guys like us. only thing in shape on most young people are their fingers from tapping on their phone. just a hundred years ago people didnt retire or get pensions or social security. the worked till they couldnt then if they were lucky their family took care of them. most just worked the same day they died

Always figured if everything collapsed financially then trade goods and bartering would be it. Basic durable goods and dry goods would seem to me to be the way to survive. Beans, flour, corn meal, ammo and other basic needs. On the other hand there are lots of people dependent on prescription meds and it makes me wonder how they would survive a complete meltdown of society if it happened.

[gene_225]

One thing that will be useful, post shtf, will be knowledge.  I have stocked up on books in my field of engineering, on medicine for everyday ailments and injuries, books from 100-150 years ago on chemistry and manufacturing processes, etc. As long as people can read, I figure they will have value. At least to the community.