Author Topic: .458 and MMP orange sabots  (Read 1166 times)

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Offline sduve

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.458 and MMP orange sabots
« on: April 05, 2004, 03:09:44 PM »
Finally made it out to do some shooting today and had a blast. Time was short but I cleaned all the borebutter out of my 209x50 to set it up for sabots shooting. Fired several groups of Rem 405 gr. SP's with 75 and 90 gr of Pyrodex RS. Got great results and it looks like I finally found MY recipe for one hole groups. Am looking forward to my next date at my range for more distant shooting. Can anyone tell me what velocity range I may be running with these .458 pills and 90-100 gr of Pyro RS? My guess would be in the 1400-1600 fps, I didn't have a battery for my chrono :oops: .

Offline sabotloader

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.458 and MMP orange sabots
« Reply #1 on: April 06, 2004, 04:29:53 PM »
sduve,

Well, I just ordered some of those Orange MMP .458 and plan to fire some Hornady 350 grain RN bullets across a chrono as soon as they show up.  I am just not sure which rifle I will be able to use.  I have not been to successful at getting MMP sabots down any of my guns.  I would really like to shoot them out of one of the A&H's.
Keep shooting muzzleloaders - they are a blast....

Offline RandyWakeman

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.458 and MMP orange sabots
« Reply #2 on: April 06, 2004, 05:21:22 PM »
Quote
 I have not been to successful at getting MMP sabots down any of my guns.  I would really like to shoot them out of one of the A&H's.


Good luck here with the .45 / 50 300 gr. Dead Centers and also the Buffalo SSB 285 grainers in three different A & H's.

Offline sabotloader

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Randy?
« Reply #3 on: April 07, 2004, 04:25:57 AM »
Randy, I can't tell from your post for sure, but I think you are saying that you have had some problem with the tight A&H barrel.  Did these go down or didn't they (.45 / 50 300 gr. Dead Centers and also the Buffalo SSB 285 )

If the MMP's do not go down the A&H's, I thought I would also try the Remington, it seems to have a slightly larger barrel... I am just going to have to break down and get a mic....

Do you see any advantage to shooting the .458 over a .429/.452?  My line of thought was I would be shooting a bullet designed for a rifle and still have the cutting edge provided by copper - I am still hooked up on copper working inside the tissue much like a sharp arrowhead.
Keep shooting muzzleloaders - they are a blast....

Offline RandyWakeman

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Re: Randy?
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2004, 04:38:52 AM »
Quote
Randy, I can't tell from your post for sure, but I think you are saying that you have had some problem with the tight A&H barrel.  Did these go down or didn't they


Yes, they load just fine. It may seem unreal, but MMP makes some 15 different sabots in .45 / 50 alone!


Quote
Do you see any advantage to shooting the .458 over a .429/.452?  


Not really, actually a few slight negatives for longer ranges. A bit lower BC, a bit shorter bullet, all things being equal. The main thing is if they shoot accurately or not. I need to try some Shockwave 250's in the A & H's, with a smaller sabot than the SST's-- the SST's do not load well.

Your 350 gr. bullet should be more than adequate for most anything, though. The 285 gr. SSB's have a relatively small bearing surface, and that can help in ease of loading as well.

Offline sabotloader

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.458 and MMP orange sabots
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2004, 05:14:00 AM »
Yesterday when I called MMP, I point blank asked "Connie" about the same thing and she said they they only have the one size - period.  So at that point what does the general public do?  Any suggestions on how to get the right information?  It certainly would help if we were givien the right information....

Another question, do you know who is currently making the new TC Mag Sabots?  I think they have switched vendors possible from Harvester to MMP.  These new green 44/50's TC's while a little tighter than old black TC's work just fine in the A&H, but they reall look like MMP's especially in the base.
Keep shooting muzzleloaders - they are a blast....

Offline RandyWakeman

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.458 and MMP orange sabots
« Reply #6 on: April 07, 2004, 06:02:28 AM »
Quote from: sabotloader
So at that point what does the general public do?  Any suggestions on how to get the right information?  It certainly would help if we were givien the right information....

Another question, do you know who is currently making the new TC Mag Sabots?  I think they have switched vendors possible from Harvester to MMP.  These new green 44/50's TC's while a little tighter than old black TC's work just fine in the A&H, but they reall look like MMP's especially in the base.


The green sabots are MMP, as are 90% + of all muzzleloading sabots sold.

The "problem" is that for the sabot to fit the bore, the natural question that follows is "what is your bore land to land dimension?" Most cannot answer that, so it is hard to find a proper combination based on no data to start with. Most try a few packs of different bullets to see what works best, just like trying different brands of ammo in a CF to see what your gun likes. Hard to recommend a "shoe" when you don't know your shoe size.

Del Ramsey of MMP will personally make suggestions based on bore diameter, so will Cecil Epp of Precision. Both, ironically, give far data with far more exactitude than the muzzleloading manufacturers themselves-- and they really are the ones that should have at least a general idea of what shoots well in their own rifles, don't you agree?

Offline sabotloader

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.458 and MMP orange sabots
« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2004, 09:00:36 AM »
Randy, just talked to Del, gained a ton of information, certainly understand a lot more now than I did before - and it is now it is a must that I get a mic if they know or you know specifically what you have they can help you out...  With the number of barrels I am dealing with it certainly would be an advantage to know their true diameters....
Keep shooting muzzleloaders - they are a blast....