Author Topic: Loading Pressure  (Read 629 times)

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Offline fairchase

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Loading Pressure
« on: April 25, 2004, 08:37:50 AM »
With consistent loading pressure being one of the factors that contributes to good accuracy, what method do you use to get the same amount of force while loading your rifle?
I have my own method, but it is far from exact and I think that I may be using too much pressure while seating my bullets. I like the sound of dropping the powder, compacting it and then seating the projectile on top of the compacted powder with less force.
I have used the 'press til it hurts' method with a handle-less range rod with some success.
I would like to hear how you go about seating your bullets and how much pressure you use.
 
Any of you guys ever use a floor scale for consistent loading or perfecting a particular method

 Thanks.
Dream big,
Greg


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Offline RandyWakeman

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Re: Loading Pressure
« Reply #1 on: April 25, 2004, 09:48:13 AM »
Quote from: fairchase
With consistent loading pressure being one of the factors that contributes to good accuracy, what method do you use to get the same amount of force while loading your rifle?


Fairchase, I know you've already had a good "run" with this one, over on another board, and the KaDooty pressure regulator has already been mentioned:

"The KaDooty is a ramrod to increase accuracy when shooting black powder muzzleloading firearms. It can also be used to withdraw either a stuck projectile or pull a patched ball free that has been loaded without powder to test for patch cutting. When using the optional archery attachments, the KaDOOTYz will convert into a archery stabilizer and broadhead puller."

If you care to, you can make your own "pressure regulator ramrod"-- I've never been compelled to.

Personally, I've not seen that loading pressure actually is of great accuracy significance at all. Certainly, consistent compaction and moisture content is a good thing-- and is one of the touted benefits of using pellets. I do try to be consistent with 40 lbs. or so of seating pressure with T 7 or Pyrodex, something that can't happen with selecting a sabot combination you practically have to pound down.

PR Bullet's new rotating head swivel jag is a very good idea, as the part of the jag that contacts the bullet rotates with the bullet-- no way can the bullet be scuffed or scored on its way down the muzzle. When is comes to accuracy, it seems that just one component gets a lot of attention-- when it is a combinatorial issue, and nothing is going to help you with a gun that has a rough barrel-- or in the case where neither gun or shooter are capable of excellent groups. If you don't already have a steady rest, an accurate gun, a load your gun likes, etc., etc., already out of the way-- it isn't likely that seating pressure alone is going to change your world.

I've got consistent 3/4 MOA guns, and have had several consistent 3-4 MOA guns-- yet, the "nut behind the butt" has remained a constant for all of them. "Preacher's" shooting regiment, based heavily on weighing everything and cited elsewhere on this board, is as good as anything I'm aware of.  See also: http://www.graybeardoutdoors.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=28394

If hunting is the issue, then once you have a 1" MOA day in, day out gun, there really isn't more more to be sought. If this is strictly an accuracy issue, then looking at the non-hunting loads (60 gr. Swiss BP FFFg) that have been favored by the good folks winning the matches at Friendship seems a good path to consider.

T 7, Pyrodex, and other synthetic pyrotechnic compounds burn at very much the same rate when unconfined as when confined. They also are still so horrifically inefficient propellants, that still close to 50% of the powder charge remains a solid. I've yet to hear of anybody dramatically shrinking group size by pressure regulator use alone, or use of a "drop tube" when loading. I'm not suggesting it is not a factor at all, just that I've not heard of it or experienced it. Also, I don't know of anyone intentionally trying to seat their projectiles with uneven pressure from shot-to-shot.

Offline fairchase

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Loading Pressure
« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2004, 11:20:16 AM »
Randy,
I got some interesting info from my other post but I got tired of weeding through the  B.S. and bickering,:roll:  that it turned into, so I thought I'd give it a fresh try here. Thanks for the time you took to respond, you have been most helpful.
Dream big,
Greg


Heritage Gun Books
The world's best gunsmithing manuals from Jerry Kuhnhausen

Offline RandyWakeman

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Loading Pressure
« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2004, 12:48:39 PM »
Hi Fairchase,

Here's Preacher's "weighing / sorting" missive : http://www.graybeardoutdoors.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=27086


That approach has been commented on as giving noticeable, positive results for more than a few contributors here, especially the weighing of T 7 charges and sabot petal alignment.

I'm not sure exactly what credence Wolfhound gives to this regarding his 1/2" @ 100 yds. Omega, for example-- perhaps he will comment. I think he just got an exceptionally good Omega for starters, but Pat obviously is doing a lot of other things right as well.  :wink:

Offline Batchief909

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Loading Pressure
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2004, 02:35:27 PM »
Fairchase, sorry about your post on the other forum. I don't know who's been crapping in his Wheaties lately. Glad you finally got your answer.

Offline Wolfhound

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Loading Pressure
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2004, 02:40:41 PM »
Quote from: RandyWakeman
I'm not sure exactly what credence Wolfhound gives to this regarding his 1/2" @ 100 yds. Omega, for example-- perhaps he will comment. I think he just got an exceptionally good Omega for starters, but Pat obviously is doing a lot of other things right as well.  :wink:

Well, I'm pretty confident weighing powder charges to within a 1/10th of a grain helps some, as does having a good sabot/bore fit. I'm not really sure I buy into the weighing primers like Preacher does since it doesn't really seem like it can make a huge difference. After all how much fire from a 209 actually makes it into the powder charge? I do follow the petal alignment bit. Not really sure it can make a huge difference, but what's a 1/2 second to do it anyway? As for seating the bullet, I prefer to make sure my tip is the right one for the bullet. I think that one of the biggest mistakes people make when seating a snug fitting bullet is deforming the tip. With seating pressure though, I don't really do anything special. A simple press and hold works for me. Since my powerrod has witness marks already on the rod, I do look to see where it is. I've never had a problem though, but it's always nice to doublecheck. Other than that, nothing extremely out of the ordinary.

Offline Flyrod444

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PR"s rotating head jag
« Reply #6 on: April 26, 2004, 02:57:05 AM »
I have seen this rotating jag mentioned a couple of times and would like to obtain one. Are these jags available at this time? I have checked their web site and they aren't listed yet.
It is better to have it and not need it than it is to need it and not have it!!

Offline RandyWakeman

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Re: PR"s rotating head jag
« Reply #7 on: April 26, 2004, 03:13:07 AM »
Quote from: Flyrod444
I have seen this rotating jag mentioned a couple of times and would like to obtain one. Are these jags available at this time?


Yes, they are. Just give Cecil @ PR bullet a call-- they are in stock in both .45 and .50 caliber, I have a set here.

Offline Wolfhound

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Loading Pressure
« Reply #8 on: April 26, 2004, 03:37:49 AM »
It'd be nice if they came out with a swivel unit that you could add your own loading tip/jag to. Preferably made of something stronger than brass. :wink: I tend to bend brass jags. I buy a whole bunch of them on clearance and then bend em all during the year. :eek: