Author Topic: Kit guns (Read 797 times)

Hoyt · « **on:** May 05, 2004, 10:06:45 AM »

Is it necessary to have a drill press and know how to solder to build a flintlock from kit? I'm thinking about trying one of the kits..Track of Wolf, Chambers, Pecatonica, North West, TVM, Cabin Creek..still trying to decide which of these will be easiest for first time and best quality and deal.
So many options I wanted to start narrowing down my possiblities..if drill press and soldering are required..it will narrow down a whole bunch.
Thanks for any advice on this.

filmokentucky · « **Reply #1 on:** May 05, 2004, 12:00:36 PM »

I've built them without a drill press but a good vise is nice to have. It isn't always necessary to solder---depends on the kit---but soldering is easy to learn. And building your own firearm from quality parts is easily one of the most satisfying things you can do. Track's kits are first rate and so are the guns from Jim Chambers.

lostid · « **Reply #2 on:** May 05, 2004, 04:24:54 PM »

Not with the names you listed.. I guess what you need to look for in KEY words are terms like 90% complete or 95% in-let,,both are about the same and simply mean all the metal parts are very close to where they need to be,,drilled,tapped and pre-fit for the wood stock.(basically drop-in)
Then all that is required is shaping/sanding the stock with your preferd stain and finish,,,,
AND;
File-ing,sanding,polishing brass furniture (easy), and/or doing the same with iron parts like, barrel,butts, nosecaps,thimbles,locks for brown or blueing,,,,,

Tell me Hoyt,,

Do ya know bp guns or have one?? Or ya just shoppin for a kit?,,I ask because it's important. There are good value kit's out there for alot less than the $450-700 kit suppliers you listed.
I for one am darn glad I butcherd a 200$ kit as my first attempt,(years back and ya,,it shoots!!),instead of the $500 one I've been working on for the past 6 months,,,,
Know what I mean??

Hoyt · « **Reply #3 on:** May 05, 2004, 08:55:36 PM »

filmokentucky

I'm sure building one yourself must be very satisfying and have got the bug to try it. I was looking at one of the kits in Track of Wolf and they recommended having drill press..they also offer to do soldering on lugs and sites for an extra cost and just wondered if it was a necessity to building good gun.

Lostid..

I know what you mean about not wanting to chop up a good kit..I can't afford to practice too much on $700 or $200 kits. I would really like to be able to build one myself (put it together and shape stock a little) but don't want to get in over my head. In the white would probably be the best way for me to go. However if I could find a kit I felt fairly comfortable with I would take the chance for the savings. Right now I'm looking at a smooth bore for gobblers...62cal. Culpeper Virginia Rifle at Narragansett Armes. 38" octagon to round Colerain barrel, Chambers Colonial Virginia lock, premium grade curly maple, front and rear sites....I've emailed them about a kit or in the white and they said they would work with me..however next time I look I will probably change my mind...just so many choices and options. Will be asking lots more questions I'm sure.

I hunt now with all types of guns and bows..killed my spring gobbler with T/C side lock percussion shotgun..but knew it would be my last because I have the urge to go all flintlock with my future hunting. Hope to get a smooth bore for gobblers and rifle for deer and hogs.

gewehrfreund · « **Reply #4 on:** May 06, 2004, 02:21:04 AM »

Whether you choose a "kit" or assemble your own unique parts, a drill press will ensure that you do the best job you can (i.e. get the holes straight and in the right places). I agree with everyone who has said that building your own muzzleloader is one of the more satisfying things that a gun enthusiast can do. But be careful, it can be addictive, not to mention expensive and, at times, damn frustrating!
If you can get ahold of back issues of Muzzle Blasts, there is no better advice on building, etc. than that given by Fred Stutzenberger, IMO.

Naphtali · « **Reply #5 on:** May 06, 2004, 04:24:41 AM »

Some kits are advertised as having had their metal parts "tried" in wood. This translates to the kit being 100 percent inletted by machine. All metal finish machined and heat treated.

All that remains for you to do, depending upon the kit, is to touch up inletting, finish wood (you can leave profiling as is, or more carefully define its shape), and on some finish metals' exteriors, on some just put the gun together.
*******
Track of the Wolf's kits are not really kits. They are a collection of all parts needed to complete a rifle. This is not denigrating what they offer. They also offer detailed inspection drawings for most of their "kits," so you will be able to complete your work numerically rather than by "feel."

The place where you need to be careful when buying any rifle or kit is grain direction of the wood. Nearly all prefabricated stocks are routed by machine. Any cast-on or cast-off is also done by machine. These machines do not follow grain; they follow a duplicator pattern. This "problem" really becomes a problem only when making a dinosaur stopper, or heavily using a bayonet.

Black Jaque Janaviac · « **Reply #6 on:** May 06, 2004, 08:47:20 AM »

Part of the reason Track sells the parts as they do I think has to do with taxes. I think if it's a "kit" then you pay 11% Pittman Robertson tax.

You can buy the parts from them. Then hire Track to do gunsmithing services. It's really not a bad way to go because you can have them do certain things you aren't comfortable doing, and leave the rest to you.

Naphtali · « **Reply #7 on:** May 06, 2004, 09:52:11 AM »

Black Jaque Janaviac: We have to quit meeting like this. She Who Must Be Obeyed is getting suspicious.

Hoyt · « **Reply #8 on:** May 06, 2004, 02:34:47 PM »

Black Jaque Janaviac....I have looked long at Track of Wolf and when running up prices on their many different flintlocks always included the soldering of sights and lugs...that would be a very big help to me. The only problem I have with them is out of all the many options they have I can't manage to pc. together the smooth bore or rifle I want. Either they don't offer the Chamber's lock I want with the gun I like or the barrel length or type I prefer is not offered or they don't have the gun I like period.
I'm only interested in the gun for hunting purposes and I want to put together or have built the one that fits my needs best. I want it to be period correct but with all the features a woodsman of that era would have also wanted.
Looks, good sparking lock, best lock for wet conditions, lightweight gun, barrel not over 38" for the smoothbore...Could be if I called Track of Wolf they would work with me on different options other than what they list on their site..just not quite that far along on decision making yet.
I'm still trying to educate myself through this forum and other flintlock sites so I can at least know enough to ask the right questions and understand all the different options before laying out cash.

lostid · « **Reply #9 on:** May 06, 2004, 04:40:29 PM »

ty for the retun,,correct me if I'm wrong,,but dosen't chambers offer just Siler locks,,I understand they got contract to build siler because Jim thought they were best, and got tired he of waiting for parts,,
Internal parts of Siler locks are pretty much the same,,(paten) the design of different style Siler is simply the lock plate it's self. A Siler this or a Siler that,,,
Here's another hint,,high grade curly is really hard to work with! That purtty twisty grain is just that,,twisty..it takes tyme!!

Lugs, don't need to be soldered. (.) Thimbles can be blue or brown, pinned or in a rail,,how can ya put that in a "kit"?

From just yer further discription of what yer looking for,,i'd guess 9 months to 1 yr after putting up "front" money before you recieve the raw stock and in the white',,from any trader. Nobody will build "your" gun without cash,,why would they? So you can back out? Don't get me wrong it ain't you,,it's just the way,,,,
Try looking at and research, "Indian trade gun" styles,,then check with that feller in montana,,northwest??

Do a little more research and you'll find most woodsmen bought their gun at the begining of season, and sold it back come fall,, Ahh heck,,I wish I could sit an yak with ya over coffee,,we could learn alot,,,

good luck to ya,,but i'd highly recomend that feller in montana,,,

Naphtali · « **Reply #10 on:** May 07, 2004, 04:10:46 AM »

Hoyt:

Have you called Track and asked them human being-to-human being if they would be willing to fill your non-standard order? I believe you will be pleasantly surprised.

Were they unable to meet your needs, ask if you can have the [non-standard] parts drop shipped to Track, for their gunsmiths to do whatever you need them to do.

If all else fails, contact Dennis McCandless in Las Cruces, NM. He has a web site. Dunno what is URL. When he lived in NW Washington state, he was first-class custom gun builder whose prices and delivery schedules were reasonable. Make that extremely reasonable.