Author Topic: 45/70 or 405 Win? (Read 5053 times)

samson · « **on:** November 24, 2002, 07:02:01 AM »

:? I am interested in getting a big bore, I have my eye on bouth a Win1886 in 45/70, and a Win 95 in 405. They are expensive rifles, about 1000.00 dollars,Any suggestions as to what would be the better gun, wish I could afford bouth! Tough decision.

Graybeard · « **Reply #1 on:** November 24, 2002, 12:37:40 PM »

Both are quality guns and both will do for most anything you are likely to want them to do. The .405 sorta tops out at 300 grains which almost seems light to me but has been used on some pretty big game over the years. The .45-70 can use bullets up to at least 540 grains if you really want penetration.

I'd decide based on which gun feels best to you and appeals to you the most.

GB

samson · « **Reply #2 on:** November 24, 2002, 02:21:44 PM »

Thanks for the reply ogreat gray one, I have deffently decided on the Browning {winchester} model 1886, the action locks up like a bank volt, and will digest all kinds of loads, 405W ammo is quite expensive, and its return could be just a flash in the pan ; not easy to find either.

dclark · « **Reply #3 on:** November 25, 2002, 01:58:55 PM »

I have a couple of .45-70s, including the Brownchester 1886 ELR. Fine rifle! You will enjoy it! BUT! A .405! WOW! Ya, not as popular. Harder to find ammo. Bullets are less common. BUT! A .405! Teddy in Africa! Tough choice! (Me? I;m still lookin'.)

dclark

86er · « **Reply #4 on:** November 26, 2002, 03:55:24 PM »

Don't be too hasty in buying your 1886 Brownchester. By all means grab one, just shop around. There are a number of these guns available for far less than the $1100 retail price. I've seen 'em for as little as $675 in recent months.The 45-70 is as versatile a cartridge that you could ask for.
So far, I've not seen any downpricing of the '95 .405. Given time you'll probably find some breaks on this one, too. Good luck and good shootin'.
Mike

samson · « **Reply #5 on:** November 27, 2002, 04:06:42 PM »

86er, will your chesterbrown chamber Buffalo Bore, and Garrett ammo?

86er · « **Reply #6 on:** November 30, 2002, 04:44:43 PM »

Samson, I don't have a clue, 'cause I've never tried their ammo. The "Chesterbrowns" are cartridge length sensitive, though. I discovered that the Hornady .350 FN is too long when loaded to the crimping groove. I found out too late that this bullet is designed for the .458 mag. I regularly use the 350 RN without a hitch. By the way, the old .45-90 likes those .350 FNs so they ain't goin' to waste.

coug2wolfs · « **Reply #7 on:** December 01, 2002, 11:02:36 AM »

For my two cents worth, I'd pass on the 405 for the reasons stated. I have no doubt it will knock critters 8 ways from loose, but why go the road of hard knox :roll:

Coug

samson · « **Reply #8 on:** December 02, 2002, 02:42:46 PM »

I just visited your site, most beautiful and informative, I hope others will enjoy it also, I know I will return to it agin.Oh I got the 1886 in 45/70,also a Marlin 1895 , same caliber, hey did you use a 45/70 on that bear and buffalo?

45LC-Man · « **Reply #9 on:** January 26, 2003, 05:43:41 PM »

How did you come across your name for the forum?

Edwin Samson

Yukon Jack · « **Reply #10 on:** January 30, 2003, 02:47:23 PM »

I kinda like the idea of the 405. Not that any animal is really going to be able to tell the difference. Don't worry about finding quality bullets for it, Barnes, Woodleigh, Swift, Hawk and others all make high quality 411 diameter bullets that will work in the 405. Shoot Woodleigh and Barnes makes 400 grainers that have a greater sectional density (better penetration if comparing jacketed bullets) than the 405 grain offerings in the 45/70. Plus, if you get the Winchester 1895, you can shoot spitzer shaped bullets. Swift makes their A-Frame in a 350 grain .411 and should be a dynamite combination.

If you are going to use factory ammo, the 45/70 might be a better bet, though with Ruger introducing the 405 in the No.1 this year, more manufacturers may consider offering that load. Also, with H&H introducing their new 400 H&H (using the .411 bore), yet more bullets may be available. If you want to shoot hardcast slugs, the 45/70 is definitely the way to go. But if you want to use jacketed bullets and are a handloader, the Winchester 1895 and 405 Winchester is something that really deserves looking at.

Personally, I'd go with the 405.

86er · « **Reply #11 on:** January 31, 2003, 03:38:13 PM »

http://www.graybeardoutdoors.com/phpbb2/images/smiles/gb-blue-smile2.gif Samson, the Miroku chester wouldn't hardly chamber those Garrett 425 Hammerhead+P 45-70s.My 1915 vintage 45-70 lt wt handles 'em with ease, though. They are a little on the pricey side to waste shootin' at targets, so I only fired 5 of 'em. The remaining rounds will be saved for huntin' somethin' real BIG.

Barnacle Bill · « **Reply #12 on:** January 31, 2003, 06:18:26 PM »

I painstakingly saved my pennies and bought a high-grade Win '95 in .405. This is now my family heirloom and legacy.

Already have a Win '71 in .348 to hunt small stuff.
Just read Teddy's African Game Trails, and smell the campfire smoke.
When I hit 'em, I like them to go "ouch".

:-)

mickey · « **Reply #13 on:** February 22, 2003, 05:50:53 PM »

On the question of 405 or 45-70 get the rifle you like best and dont worry about cartridge. The other guys summed it up. 45-70 shoots heavier bullets, ammo more available. For what its worth, the 405 is much more accurate with smokeless because of its smaller capacity. The 45-70 case is just too big to fill up with smokeless. Also, Hornady has high quality ammo. You can buy that, or you can make very passable cases by necking up 30-40 Krag, they work with no other adjustments. There are high quality expensive bullets for serious hunting and cheap ones. They are called bullets for 41 magnum pistol, jacketed and cast, 210 to 260 grains. No one writes about them because the industry wants you to buy their high cost ammo. How do I know this. Some of us have loved the 405 for years, decades in fact. We bout real winchester 405's when they were cheap or converted 30-40 Krags to same along with Ruger No. 1's.

Buckeye · « **Reply #14 on:** February 28, 2003, 12:46:13 PM »

45/70 , 405gr. 1900fps. 18.5 in. barrel, fast lever action, 4 shots. 7lbs.
$ 425.00 . who could ask for anything more? :lol:

Enforcer · « **Reply #15 on:** March 01, 2003, 01:23:28 AM »

Quote from: Buckeye

45/70 , 405gr. 1900fps. 18.5 in. barrel, fast lever action, 4 shots. 7lbs.
$ 425.00 . who could ask for anything more? :lol:

405Win 300gr SP:2450fps-4000fpe,58.5grs IMR 3031,out of 28in Win M1895,chronoed at 12ft.New releases for 405Win(.412) 325gr,350gr,400gr,can use spitzers too.Who could ask for more?Cost for my rifle $2100.00.So if price is an issue,45/70 is your baby.

Buckeye · « **Reply #16 on:** March 01, 2003, 01:43:55 AM »

300 gr. Nosler @ 2100 fps. ( 458 Dia.) 60 gr.s of IMR 3031 ina 18.5 in. barrel 7.5 lb.s HANDY CARBINE not in something a long as cold weather.
But I still like the ole Lion Tamer. Just not as much as the 45/70 GG.
In my hunting realm a carbine is much better. And if I need flatter shooting and more reach I reach out and get my Mod. 77 .270win.

Enforcer · « **Reply #17 on:** March 01, 2003, 02:05:15 AM »

Quote from: Buckeye

300 gr. Nosler @ 2100 fps. ( 458 Dia.) 60 gr.s of IMR 3031 ina 18.5 in. barrel 7.5 lb.s HANDY CARBINE not in something a long as cold weather.
But I still like the ole Lion Tamer. Just not as much as the 45/70 GG.
In my hunting realm a carbine is much better. And if I need flatter shooting and more reach I reach out and get my Mod. 77 .270win.

Point taken.To me longer is better.I have over 30 lever actions and if i can get one with a longer barrel.I will. I don't like giving up the velocity that you must with the shorter barrels.But i must admit they are handier. Enforcer

Buckeye · « **Reply #18 on:** March 01, 2003, 02:12:22 AM »

Enforcer , Have you seen the ( ?) I asked you concerning the .356 win.
In the Lever gun forum In the (.356 ) best post ?

Enforcer · « **Reply #19 on:** March 01, 2003, 05:30:06 AM »

Quote from: Buckeye

Enforcer , Have you seen the ( ?) I asked you concerning the .356 win.
In the Lever gun forum In the (.356 ) best post ?

No let me check it and I'll get you an answer.

R. Tillery · « **Reply #20 on:** March 05, 2003, 05:58:31 AM »

I just ordered a Grade 1 Winchester 1886 (.45-70) Lightweight from CDNN for $599.