30-06 Whitetail and Mulie Bullet Selection?

[BowhunterNJ]

Anyone have any recommendations on a good whitetail/mulie bullet (off the shelf) for a Remington Model 700 Springfield 30-06?

I believe my father shot 165 gr Remington Core Lokts out of it with good success, just wondering if I might be better off going with a premium bullet considering I am mounting a new scope on it and will have to zero it again.

As far as ranges, I am not sure what to anticipate...I will be looking to stalk under 200 yards for mulies and whitetails will likely be well under that as well.  But, I'd like to have the ability to shoot a little farther without compromising bullet performance.

Which bullets perform well at close and long ranges, say 0-300 yards?

Lemme know what you all think!
Thanks!

[jackfish]

Probably couldn't do much better than the Hornady ammo in 30-06 with the 165 grain Interbond, $26.34 list price.

[jhm]

In the 30-06 my favorite is the 165 also you may want to try several brands to find the one brand your rifle likes the best.   JIM

[Bushnell Boy]

I used remington 150gr nosler partitions last year and they performed very well. They are consistanly accurate and very flat shooting. I had a 2 inch exit would on my buck last year. I also shot hogs with the same round and it otook care of them also. As for the core loct I wasn't happy with them at all. They didn't group well at all for me.

[RKBAHolsters]

Are you a hunter or a precision rifle shooter?


If you are a hunter, the Remington Core-loct work very well.  Myself and quite a few people I know have used them in 30-06 and .300 win mag, with total satisfaction.  

If you are a precision shooter, you may want to look into some of the higher dollar stuff.

Out to 300 yards you'll be fine with whatever you choose, as long as your gun shoots the load decently.  If it the core-locts worked for your dad they should still work for you.

Premium ammo/bullets don't kill a deer anymore than core-locts.


Now if you were going after Grizzly......

[Zachary]

My vote would also go to the 165.  As far as style, the interbond is a great choice, as well as the "conventional" Hornady interlock.

Other great choices include the Swift Scirocco and Nosler Accubond, although they are more expensive.

Zachary

[Rmouleart]

I also like 180gr Hornadys Interbonds/Interlocks/SST's...Speers Grandslams/Bearclaws...Rem coreloct...Nosler BT/Partitions/Accubonds...All good, the Hornadys are very affordable if you are reloading and working up a load. Good luck. Aim small hit small. RAMbo.

[SLAVAGE]

well numerus times i've heard an seen deer internals get liquidfide by winchester ballistic silver tips 168 grain
thats what i would shoot if i still used my 30-06 if i stoped reloading,
an if i did start shooting it again thats what i would use
dave

[BowhunterNJ]

Thanks for all the replies guys, I really appreciate it.

To answer a few questions posed, I do not plan on doing any precision (long range) shooting...although it is certainly within my interests, it is not an immediate goal or need for this hunt.

But, on the same token, I believe in being very prepared for anything that I do in life, and this hunt will be no different.  I spoke with the guide yesterday and he said most shots will indeed be under 200 yards but they like hunters to be prepared for out to 300 yards...ultimately whatever your comfort level is (some are comfortable out to 300 yards+).

I made it clear that I would be staying within my reasonable limits (which I currently do not know, since this will be my first high powered rifle hunt).  I do quite a bit of gun hunting here in NJ, but HP rifles are not permitted for deer, so I hunt with a shotgun and muzzleloader.

I am comfortable with my scoped T/C High Plains Sporter (rare side hammer ML model) out to 100-125 yards, placing near touching groups, so I don't think a HP rifle will be a problem out to 200 yards.  But, there are conditions over longer ranges that I need to be aware of, learn, practice, etc.  That's why I'm starting early now, plenty of time before November!

As far as bullets, it seems the most common answer is to shoot whatever shoots well out of your gun, afterall shot placement is the most important element of killing an animal quickly.

There is some confusion on my part regarding the softer, ballistic tip style bullets versus more middle grade/harder bullets (NPs, Bearclaws, Core-Lokts, etc)...and I'm not sure which is better.

From what I've researched, discussed, and read...ballistic tips expand rapidly and often don't leave much of an exit hole (if any) but do an incredible amount of damage internally.  The only problem I've heard about is when animals are BIG, these bullets expand TOO quickly and dont gain enough effective penetration.  

The question I have is, is that a moot point for mule deer and whitetails?

Apparently many hunters have had great success with ballistic tips, but others (whether out of preference, confidence, or otherwise) prefer the medium grade and harder bullets to ensure more than adequate penetration and a high percentage chance of an exit wound.

In the end, I just don't want to make a bad decision that will not result in a quick kill on an animal.  The shot placement is in my hands, but I need to be clear on a quality bullet (off the shelf loads, since I don't reload) suited for Wester Mulies and Western/Eastern Whitetails at both short and longer ranges (0-300 yards).

I hate to beat a dead horse here, but I think most of that has been answered and I can be confident in either a ballistic tip or a medium grade bullet.  Both will kill just as effectively.

If anyone has any additional thoughts, please let me know.  And thanks again for all the feedback!

[longwinters]

I would, personally, go with the Winchester Supreme cartridges or the Federal Premiums.  I used both out of my 06's for years (hunting whitetails) and always had an exit hole and a quickly downed deer.

long

[New Hampshire]

First off, I am working with 165 grainers too (specificalyy Nosler Partitions.)  I did a lot of heavy resarch and planning before I bought my Encore in .30-06.  What I found was that the 165, 168 and up to about 180 grains is the "optimum" weight in the 06.  What this means is that the weight/speed ratio is at the max for muzzel energy.  For Whitetail and mulies this really is kinda moot as 150 grainers at 500 yards will still "textbook" kill em (by that I mean they theoretically have more than enough energy, but that does not assume shot placement etc etc.)

As for bullet choice.  The Ballistic tips/ SSts/ Interbonds, etc will give you excellent long range accuracy (yes 2 or 3 inches at 100 yards is plenty to get into the kill zone of a deer,) but remember as the range increases so does group size.  So accuracy is VERY important in long range hunting.  Thankfully though most  quality hunting ammo will give you good enough accuracy to your desired 200 yards (testing needed of course.)  The polymer tipped bullets are known for quick expansion, and in the case of improper bullet weight choice to game animal weight will result in wounded animals.  but in the 06, 150 grainers wshould give you no problems.  I personally went with Partitioned bullets.  This was done only because this loading Im working on will give me multiple animal suitability.  I plan on using this mainly for deer, but with the awarness that I could get pulled for our moose lottery and a possible black bear hunt.  All my shooting, here in New England, is generally under 100 yards with the average being 25 yards and less.  So for me 3 to 4 inch groups at 200 yards mean nothing.
I hope this adds a little more extra.
Brian M.

[HuntingGuy]

Bow-

I shoot a Browning A-Bolt 30-06.  It shoots the Remington 180 grain Core-Lokt's just perfectly, under an inch at 100 yards.  I have yet to been able to shoot it at 2 and 300, but I am sure it would hold fine.

It is hard to predict what will shoot best in your gun, so all I can tell you is what shoots best in mine -- Different strokes for different folks.

I think you should give the Core-Lokts a good look at.  What I would reccommend is to choose 3 or 4 different brands and spend the day at the range and look at how each groups.  (3 or 4 shots to foul barrel, 3 shot groups, 5 mins in between each) Again, personal preference.

Best of luck to you!  

HuntingGuy

[Coyote Hunter]

BowhunterNJ -

I've used 160g Speer Grand Slams in my 7mm Rem Mag for 20+ years for mulies and elk.  With one exception, all bullets penetrated completely, whether at 100 yards or 350 yards.  The exception took out both shoulder joints on a 5x5 bull and dropped him in his tracks.  In fact, of the  6 elk my buddy and I have taken with this bullet in the last 5 years, 3 dropped in their tracks, 2 wandered 50 yards or less, and 1 that my buddy neck shot went 100 yards (not the bullets fault).  

One great thing about Grand Slams is that Federal loads the 180g for the .30-06 and they are very affordable -- $11.27 per box at Cheaper than dirt, item #68467 (Federal load 3006BG).  Normal price is around $25 per box, so this price may not last.

There are a number of other good bullets in factory loads (Interbond, Accubond, A-Frame, Trophy Bonded, Partiton, Core-Lokt Ultra, etc.), any of which would work equally well.

Good luck on your hunt, and I agree with your guide - be prepared for a 300 yard shot.  I've had mulies get close enough to touch, but the ones I have tags for always seem to be further away.

[Gregory]

I hunted for many years in NY state with a 30/06 and used 150 gr bullets with good success for deer.  Everything from Partitions to Nosler Solid base bullets did them in.  The Nosler solid base was the predecessor to the ballistic tip.

[James B]

All of the above suggestions are good ones. Its a matter of preference. For deer in my 308 and 30-06 I am using the 150 grain Nosler Partition with great success.

[goose7856]

I am in the same situation as the guy that posted this topic........but I have narrowed mine down to an exact bullet.  I only have one worry. the product is as follows: the Hornady Light Magnum, 150 grain, Interbond, for a 30-06, that travels 3100 fps (muzzle) with 3200 (muzzle energy).

My question is that if I shoot a deer at say.......less than 100 yards as close as 25, is there a good possibility the bullet will "blow-up" because of the high fps (feet per second) the bullet is traveling at.  (I mean if it is at 25 yards I will just crank up the scope to 12x and shoot it in the head, but like a 50 yard shot where I don't feel comfortable shooting it in the head??  I just want to make sure before I buy the item.  One more thing to know is I just for the front shoulder, not behind it but on it, because the woods are to thick to track the deer, so I try to make sure they run three feet straight to the ground :lol: I dont know if that would have any effect on someones response.

Thanx ahead of time!!

[High Brass]

If those 165gr. Remington Core-Lokts should good for you, use them.  Cheap, accurate, very effective on game.  What's not to like?  In any event, good gouge here as usual.  There are many good choices out there in 150-180 gr. range.  Its just a matter on what your rifle likes, good luck.

[Graybeard]

You SURE don't need 12X to place a shot at 25 yards and FOV is so small you'll see little more. The head is a poor choice for a place to put a bullet really as the actual kill zone is small and moving. If you make a poor hit you might take out the jaw or throat area and the deer will get away to die a slow and lingering death.

Many prefer the neck shot and if you are 100% sure you KNOW where that spine is where you plan to place the bullet fine but me I use the heart lung area on all deer taken.


I prefer heavier bullets myself and generally use a 180 in the .30-06 or at the least a 165. BUt a 150 Hornady in the heart lung area means a dead deer every time at any range. The beauty of the '06 is that it isn't a real high velocity number and you really don't have to have premium bullets for it for that reason.

GB

[Cabin4]

I agree with GB on the Hornady 150's. Great results on deer and great accuracy out of my M77 MK2.

[New Hampshire]

Im working up a load using 165 gr Nosler Partitions.  What I like is that Ill have a dual purpose loading for deer to Moose.  But for deer 150gr is plenty fine.  And as was stated, any credible bullet manufacturer makes quality projectiles.  Evidence of this fact is that all kinds of Premium ammo loads them, From Hornadys to Noslers, Sierras and beyond.
Brian M.

[goose7856]

You SURE don't need 12X to place a shot at 25 yards and FOV is so small you'll see little more.

I understand, I was being sarcastic, but I would place it at about 6x or 7x.

Why do you have to hit the spine if you shoot them in the neck.  Couldn't you shoot them in the trachea (windpipe) and they would still die quick because there is no way for them to get O2.  Also, you could hit the jugular which would stop the blood flow to the brain (if I'm not mistaken).  So pretty much, anything that you hit in the center of the neck is going to kill the animal, and you wouldn't lose any meat.......right??

Correct me if I am wrong.......

Goose

[High Brass]

Neck shots can be tricky goose.  Yes, if you severe one or both carotid arteries the deer will die.  The spine shot that Graybeard was talking about meant that the deer will drop right there and would be fatal as well.  However, several members have posted on shooting deer in the neck and loosing them or having to track them down.  I haven't had that experience but enough people have posted it for me to believe it.  I've shot several deer in the neck and none have ran off but a few were still alive when I walked up to them.  This is just my limited experience.

[goose7856]

Thatnk you for the advice.  Woudln't ballistic tip bullets help if you like to shoot deer in the neck, as "sturdier bullets"  would be better for bone and behond the shoulder shots??  The Ballistic tip would enter the neck, blow up into a bunch of pieces, and each piece would hit an artery

[Lawdog]

goose7856,

I realize that you are young(we all were at one time or another.  I was in your boots 40 years ago) and don't have much experience but please don't put so much faith in ballistic charts and programs.  They are just tools to help you.  The only time I try a neck shot is when the deer is facing me or straight away from me.  From the side you have to great a chance of wounding the animal if it moves it’s head at the last moment(which happens a lot).  A 150 gr. .30 caliber Ballistic Tip bullet traveling at 3,100 fps. hitting bone(even a rib) has a better than average chance of fragmenting thus ending up with a wounded deer.  Why not use a Barnes TSX bullet that won’t fragment and then you will never have the problem because of bullet failure?  Lawdog
 

[goose7856]

Lawdog, I agree, and yes I am young, and will never shoot a deer in the neck, but I am interested in everyones opinions.  I will NEVER shoot a ballistic tip, that is why I am strongly thinking about buying two boxes of Hornady Light Magnum Interbond, 150 grain for a 30-06.  I am just still wondering if the "listed ballistics" (3100 fps), at that speed, if I hit bone at a hundred yards, if the bullet will fragment.  Thanx for all the helps guys and gals.

[BowhunterNJ]

Well I see this was hit not too long ago...so I'll piggy back.

I've been shooting at the range with pretty fair results.  Thus far I've shot the following:

1) Remington Premier Core-Lokt Ultra 150 grain (150 PSP Core-Lokt Ultra)
2) Remington Express Core-Lokt 165 grain (165 PSP Core-Lokt)
3) Winchester Power Point Plus High Velocity 150 grain

I've shot from 25 to 200 yards so far (max I can shoot at the range I go to is around 240).  I just shot all three of these today, and waited between rounds for the barrel to cool.

The 150 PSP CL Ultras seem fair, grouping OK at 100 yards at around 1.5-2" but spread out to around 4.0" at 200 yards.

The 165 PSPs are shooting better (but good enough?) at around 1-1.5" groups at 100 yards and 2.0-2.5" groups at 200 yards.

The Winchester 150 PPPs shot fair, grouping well but somewhat varying.  Groups at 100 were around 1.5-2.0" and around 3.5-4.0" at 200 yards.

Under these conditions the 165 PSPs shot best...which I figure is the best representation I can get now...as the bullets will shoot very different if I consecutively fire them and let the barrel get hot (as I found out before today when I was getting constantly varied results).

Towards the end of my day after the shoot/cool off sessions,  interestingly the Winchest 150 PPPs seem to get tighter as the barrel got hot.  Their 200 yard groups went from 4.0" to 2.0".  Strange?


Anyway those are my results so far.  Since this is my first time shooting a HP rifle, I have no clue what to expect.  I would think about 1" or better at 100 yards, 2" or better at 200 yards.  Is that about right?  Way off?  Let me know!

I think I am going to try some 180 grain Rem CL PSPs as my father has the best results with these out of this gun, having difficulty finding some ammo to try, seems like a lot of generic stock (good for me if I go with the Rem CL PSP 165s).  I see alot of the Winchester line and those Federal "Shock" lines on the shelves but not much else.

Even at Cabela's in PA, picking were slim and I had to even get the guy to go in the back room to get me some Remington CL PSP 165s!  I couldn't believe they didnt have them out.

Fill me in, so hard to find bullets to even try...either that or I'm just missing them...or they go by some other name when they are sold in manufacturer boxes.  (i.e. I have no clue what "bullet" the Winchester Power Point Plus is)

Well thats my report thus far, thanks for reading and please let me know if you have any additional comments.

Anyone have any additional recommendations

[sgtt]

I would go to the local -----mart and buy a box of the least expensive promotional stuff 150-180 grn.  None of the major mfg are loading junk.  Doesn't really take all that much to kill a deer.  People are still rolling 'em with lead.  If it shoots under 2" at 100 yrds you are probably good to go.  If it doesn't, try something else.  When you find one that shoots well, buy a bunch with the same lot numbers.  If you can't find it at Cabelas, what is the chance that you will find it at Trader Jack's in the great North somewhere, when your stash is still in the safe at home.   Deer were dying long before there were partitions.  Did he make a better bullet?  He made a lot of money!!!!!!!!!!!!

[rickt300]

Your getting good accuracy and if you can hold that tight under field conditions you are a heck of a shot.  The power Point plus is a coated Power point which is a good bullet for deer.  In my 30-06 I shoot 165 and 180 grain bullets and I don't take rear end shots.  I wouldn't be concerned at all about the bullets you are testing giving you trouble, just make good hits and you will get deer.  My "pet" load in my 308 is the 165 grain PSP corelokt over 42 grains of H4895 and I feel this bullet will do it all, very accurate and stays in one piece pushed to 2600 fps in my rifle.  Many swear this is the best deer bullet bar none.  Another thing, don't get carried away with the shoulder shot syndrome the best idea is to shoot at the offside shoulder through the deer or just behind the shoulder of a deer that is standing perfectly broadside to you. The best neck shot is just in front of and slightly below center of the shoulder blade.

[High Brass]

BowhunterNJ,

  That's good results, especially with factory ammo!.  If you are getting 2-2.5" groups at 200 yards, man you're in there!  The 165 gr. core-lokt is a great deer bullet.  I've taken three deer with them and I don't know how many my Dad has killed using this bullet.  If you got to where you handloaded and could tinker with things(powder, charges, seating depth, etc.) you would probably shrink those groups.  If not, don't worry.  Those groups are plenty good.

[TXSURVEYOR]

Here is the best bullet you can use, the one you practice with all year long.
Not just three practice shots the day before opening day. I do not use premium ammo for that reason. I like a afternoon of shooting to be fun and affordable. My old football coach said "you play like you practice",
So practice your shooting and whatever deer gun, caliber, and bullet
you choose will be the best choice. Also burn up the .22 rounds its cheap,
fun, affordable and does help you become a better shot. To answer your question I use 150 grain Winchester power points in my 30-06. Luckily
where I hunt is a five deer county and I usually take four or five a season. I can't wait until November.