Author Topic: 1712 Trigger questions (Read 1137 times)

jimny · « **on:** May 31, 2004, 09:03:17 AM »

The rifle is a new silhouette model 1712 FWT with 2 stage trigger.
Using an RCBS trigger pull gauge, the trigger breaks at 1.75 #.
Using an actual 2# NRA weight, the trigger will pick the weight and hold it until it is forced to release by jerking it sharply upwards.
I have also noticed that I sometimes go through the second stage before I intend to. The owners manual that came with the rifle is for a 1710D, and does not give any detail on the trigger I have.
I read a thread on 1710 trigger problems on this forum and it made me think that this trigger needs some attention. Also, the thread mentions weighing the stages in grams-where do you obtain that type of trigger gauge? Nomad, can you help?
I need some basics on setting this trigger up correctly. I went to an Anschutz web sight but I am not fluent in German, so it was not much help. I also don't want to be disqualified because the trigger won't pick the weight using an RCBS gauge. Thanks in advance, Jim

nomad · « **Reply #1 on:** May 31, 2004, 09:17:22 AM »

Email me offlist at e27122002@yahoo.com and we'll go over it.
It's not all that hard to improve but IMO you need a different cam. They're about $15 from ISS in Fort Worth, TX.
You should be able to do the fix easily yourself.

bob259 · « **Reply #2 on:** June 02, 2004, 05:06:10 AM »

Quote from: jimny

I also don't want to be disqualified because the trigger won't pick the weight using an RCBS gauge. Thanks in advance, Jim

Any NRA sanctioned match must use the official NRA weights and not a pull gauge which can give a different reading at any given time. If someone is disqualifying you and using a pull gauge you didn't want to shoot there anyway.... my 2 cents.

CB · « **Reply #3 on:** June 02, 2004, 06:53:35 AM »

http://jga.anschuetz-sport.com/english.php?topicID=94&articleID=203
http://jga.anschuetz-sport.com/index.php?topicID=94&articleID=184

try these two links for Anshutz adj and descriptions, they're sweet triggers

bob259 · « **Reply #4 on:** June 02, 2004, 07:10:27 AM »

Quote from: CB

http://jga.anschuetz-sport.com/english.php?topicID=94&articleID=203
http://jga.anschuetz-sport.com/index.php?topicID=94&articleID=184

try these two links for Anshutz adj and descriptions, they're sweet triggers

CB, The links you sent are great, but they do not show the triggers that are in the 1712's. It's almost the same trigger as the single stage only difference is they have an adjustable LOP with the trigger shoe and cam'ed to make them 'feel' like a two stage Vs the adjustments available on the true match triggers.

I had the same question and didn't get a clear answer back from Anschutz on how to adjust, other then the same as a single stage trigger.

nomad · « **Reply #5 on:** June 02, 2004, 07:42:07 AM »

Bob,
They ARE two-stage triggers. (AFAIK they are, in fact, the older 64 target trigger with a few minor changes.)
The small triangular 'tit' on the upper rear of the staff begins to move the sear lever as you take up the slack (1st stage) until the 'cam' nose egages the sear lever (2nd stage) and effects release.
When correctly adjusted, the first stage moves the sear to minimum engagement and the change in pull as the second stage takes over for the break is due to the change in mechanical advantage.
If there's another definition of a 'true' two-stage trigger, I'm unaware of it.
I had also thought that they were 'false' two-stage units -- wherein the first stage was no more than a take-up that allowed a light release -- but once I started pulling them apart and redoing them, I discovered that I'd been wrong.

bob259 · « **Reply #6 on:** June 02, 2004, 08:30:58 AM »

Quote from: nomad

Bob,
They ARE two-stage triggers. (AFAIK they are, in fact, the older 64 target trigger with a few minor changes.)
The small triangular 'tit' on the upper rear of the staff begins to move the sear lever as you take up the slack (1st stage) until the 'cam' nose egages the sear lever (2nd stage) and effects release.
When correctly adjusted, the first stage moves the sear to minimum engagement and the change in pull as the second stage takes over for the break is due to the change in mechanical advantage.
If there's another definition of a 'true' two-stage trigger, I'm unaware of it.
I had also thought that they were 'false' two-stage units -- wherein the first stage was no more than a take-up that allowed a light release -- but once I started pulling them apart and redoing them, I discovered that I'd been wrong.

Nomad.. it appears you have done your homework and looked at and understand them real well... Question is there a way to shorten the total over all travel? I'd like the entire travel to be shorter, but was unsure of and unable to get a clear answer on that.

nomad · « **Reply #7 on:** June 02, 2004, 03:55:18 PM »

Bob,

Yes and no.
The screw in the side of the trigger is the engagement screw. All it is is a tapered cone on the end of the screw that inserts itself between the staff and the cam and changes their relative positions. (Actually it changes the 'time' that the cam nose picks up the sear lever.)
Sometimes you can adjust more or less travel with that.
Problem is that the relative tolerances (first stage to second stage to engagement) are critical but because of the manufacturing process used, dimensions vary slightly and changing anything changes everything else also.
IOW, they all work...but some work better than others.
If you can't adjust the travel to your satisfaction with the engagement screw -- without creating a sloppy break -- you can stone the first stage tit and change the relationship. Problem is that it's cut and try and if you overdo it you buy another staff...at about $70 each!