Author Topic: Base gun? (Read 682 times)

litman252 · « **on:** June 27, 2004, 04:03:06 PM »

Well some of you guys might not like this but I'm looking for a bolt action to turn into a "Scout rifle."
I don't want a nice collector, just a decent shooting gun. Something that is somewhat popular would be good, I'd like to use a synthetic stock in the future. Peep with post sights are a plus, original or available aftermarket. I would'nt mind a previous bubbized version as long as they kept the grinder off of it.
I don't like the straight bolts, unless bent ones are avail.
I'd love a 1903/A3 but am guessing they would be to much $$$ for my project.
Any ideas/thoughts???
Thanks much, don't be to harsh on me :wink:
Tony

Castaway · « **Reply #1 on:** June 28, 2004, 12:38:44 AM »

What's a "Scout" rifle? I know Cooper was working on one and seems he changed his definition a time or two when tweeking it down. If I remember right, he finally decided a production rifle from either Austria or Germany fit his final definition.

Jack Crevalle · « **Reply #2 on:** June 28, 2004, 01:13:15 AM »

Quote from: litman252

Well some of you guys might not like this but I'm looking for a bolt action to turn into a "Scout rifle."
I don't want a nice collector, just a decent shooting gun. Something that is somewhat popular would be good, I'd like to use a synthetic stock in the future. Peep with post sights are a plus, original or available aftermarket. I would'nt mind a previous bubbized version as long as they kept the grinder off of it.
I don't like the straight bolts, unless bent ones are avail.
I'd love a 1903/A3 but am guessing they would be to much $$$ for my project.
Any ideas/thoughts???
Thanks much, don't be to harsh on me :wink:
Tony

If you are interested in an 03a3 you might want to look on auction sites for one that has already been bubba'd, er, sporterized. They are considerably cheaper than 03a3's in good condition plus you aren't reducing a potential collectors piece's value. When I say cheaper, keep in mind that the market for US milsurps is nuts now. A good condition 03a3 runs $500-$700. Sporterized ones run about $250.

You might also want to look at 03's ( a1 etc ) since you want to make a scout rifle ( When you say scout rifle I think long eye-relief barrel mounted scope. This might not be what you mean. ) you won't need the peep sights of the a3.

Sources for other potential bases are to look on big surplus websites such as AIM, SOG, SAMCO for barreled actions or junkers that they are trying to rid themselves of cheap because of cosmetic damage.

1911crazy · « **Reply #3 on:** June 28, 2004, 02:49:21 AM »

I collect but I have some sporters too like something to take in the woods with no worries of hurting it too. My choice for two project guns were a German 98k 8MM and a M1895 Chilean 7MM mauser. The best gun for the buck to me is a Yugo "Mod.98" Preducecci 44 8mm mauser they can be found still affordable. There actually a German 98k with the german markings ground off and the yugo crest put on them. You can pick them out by the shorter upper handguard that runs from the front of the rear site to the front barrel band. Its a very short upper handguard and a dead give away to finding this unique quality rifle. Its very similair to a sino soviet sks while it says its a chinese sks its russian manufactured parts and chinese assembled gun at the chinese price so while the 8MM mauser has yugo markings its a german made quality german mauser at the yugo price too. Most can be had for around and under $100 sometimes too. It has the smooth german 98 bolt. Now to stay in the affordable range you can get weaver scope mounts at a local shop and get a three post military style scope w/rings from CDNN for $29. I'm going to estimate the whole gun will run about $200 depending the price of the stock you pick out. BigBill

Shorty · « **Reply #4 on:** June 28, 2004, 02:17:22 PM »

Litman252,
No. 4 Enfield.
Peep sights, large magazine, charger bridge, inexpensive, reasonable power... :roll: :wink:

RaySendero · « **Reply #5 on:** June 28, 2004, 02:58:53 PM »

litman252,

I'm building a scout form a 1939 Mauser in 8mm. It was made in Czechoslovakia by Brno company - Model VZ-24. It's a "carbine" with a 23.5" barrel (most barrels lenghts were 29.5"!!!) Found it in a local Pawn shop. It's a large ring Mauser capable of being rebarreled to any 30/06 head cartridge w/o changing the bolt!

My intentions were to rechamber the rifle to 8mm/06 or rebarrel to 35 Whelen but more and more got to like the 8x57! I've polished and cleaned the chamber and bore. Glass bed the action. Refinished the stock (there was some pretty wood under all that grim!). I have a Weaver pistol scope on order and am planning on mounting it forward of the reciever where the rear leaf sight is now.

This project may just turn out to be my favorite hog rifle! My reloads have ranged from 185 grain Remington CoreLokts to 200 grain Sierra MatchKing to 220 grain Sierra GameKings. Planning on using the 185s for deer and 220s for Hogs. Who knows at 2,550 FPS the 220s (some power there!) may be all I shoot.

OK, back to the point - Would recommend you look at old Mausers. Big Bill has given you some good leads. As you can tell I like the 8x57 but a 7x57 or the 6.5 x55 Swede could suit your plans as well.

litman252 · « **Reply #6 on:** June 28, 2004, 04:09:28 PM »

Castaway, take a look here-http://home.netcom.com/~chingesh/scoutrifle.html

Shorty, can you give me a place to do some learning on the No. 4???
Bigbill, are those calibers close to 308??? How pricey in bulk??
Thanks for the info guys, I have some sorting to do.

Tony

1911crazy · « **Reply #7 on:** June 29, 2004, 12:12:53 AM »

The 8mm ammo is the cheapest around you can buy surplus 8mm in turk ammo that is 70rds for $4 its FMJ great for varmits. There is hunting 8mm soft point that is affordable too in Sellier & bellot or Hotshot brands are under $10 a box. No matter which caliber you choose reloading for it is the way to go and is the most accurate in some cases too. BigBill

Now for a scout rifle there are mosins that are cheap rifles too (under $100)you can get a M91/59 or M38 still in wrapper rearsenaled and add a scout mount scope too. There in 7.62x54 caliber and its inbetween a 308 and 30-06 in power. And you can use the russian made hunting ammo from Barnaul its 204gr. SP and costs $5 a bx. The wolf brand ammo in 7.62x54 costs a little more about $7 a box. You could also look at the M44 mosin too there around $49 right now and a scout type scope can be mounted on these too.

On calibers the 6,5x55 swede is good from varmit up to deer sized animals. The 7mm mauser will kill anything from varmit to thin skinned game in africa. With the 308, 30-06, 8MM and 7.62x54 with the same performance too so there are no really slackers here they all can do the job. Someone posted on another forum he hunted with the 8mm mauser and the larger 8MM diameter bullet sure seemed a good brush buster too so that is a plus to me for the 8x57. He made a shot thru heavy brush with no bullet deflection. The only drawback with the 8mm is the american made ammo its loaded on the wimpy side but the imported ammo like sellier & bellot, igman, hotshot loads the 8mm where it should be.

BIGBOREFAN · « **Reply #8 on:** June 29, 2004, 10:24:11 AM »

I have seen Mosin Nagant M38 that were already sporterized for sale at Dunhams sporting goods for 169.00 They had a synthetic stock and the scout mount already installed. Just add a scope. The 7.62x54R is about the same as a 308 Win ballistic wise. You may look into one of them.

BBF

Big Paulie · « **Reply #9 on:** June 30, 2004, 05:18:35 AM »

Dear Tony,

Just a warning, in case you don't already know, that after you do thorough research on this project, and you have priced all parts, gunsmithing and other things you need for your project, the cost of your project is going to be very high compared to buying a new medium grade commercial rifle.

This is probably OK, so long as you know it in advance and are just happy with the hobby.

For my money, I would just by a brand new or used Savage Scout Rifle, in .308 Winchester or 7mm-08. It is a very nice rendition of the scout concept for a reasonable price, in modern ammo, and very accurate.

Aside from that, I believe that the suggestions of the Enfield No. 4 Rifle (mark 4?) with its integral peep sight, or a Springfield 03-A3 that has already been sporterized (and still has its integral peep sight) is definitely the way to go.

The absolute cheapest way to go would be to buy an old Mauser 98 in good condition in 8mm, and then buy one of the pre-fab "scout rifle" kits that are sold for it, that provide a scope mounting sleeve that slides over the barrel and down to about two inches in front of the receiver, and is held in place with accra-glass and a locking screw. The problem is, even after you shorten and recrown the barrel, you still have a pretty heavy rifle, which is contrary to the scout concept.

My advice? Take a deep breath and think about all of this, and think about whether you are going to be happy with the end result after spending alot of money. And then, . . . go buy the Savage Scout in .308 Winchester. You will be able to use the relatively cheap 7.62 Nato ammo in it.

Just my opinion.

Big Paulie

S.S. · « **Reply #10 on:** June 30, 2004, 05:18:36 AM »

I am not really sure what Mr. Cooper was attempting
to accomplish with his Scout rifle concept, So I don't
know what all Criteria a rifle must meet to be called a
Scout. I would assume that it should be Light, Moderately
powerful, accurate enough for Sniping should the need
or opportunity arise and have both Iron and Glass sights
in case one became damaged and unusable.
Out of the military surplus available today, I would have to
choose one of Straight pull bolt actions. I liked the Steyr m95
myself but ammo is a pain to aquire (and Costly). So one of those
nice SWISS straight-pulls would be my choice.
(Swede 6.5 would be best, but I could not bring myself
to "CHOP" one up)

kevin.303 · « **Reply #11 on:** June 30, 2004, 08:45:34 AM »

i thinking of something along the same line but with a No.5 jungle carbine. check out www.303british.com some nice pics of a sporting rifle built from a burnt out No.5

only use one that's been sportered or is mismatching. if you used a collectors grade i hunt you down and beat you.(just kidding)

hillbill · « **Reply #12 on:** June 30, 2004, 03:03:52 PM »

not sure where i have seen it on here but last winter i checked out some pics of a absolutely cool mosin nagant rifle a guy built from a stocker. he cut off the bolt and welded on a bent one, added a synthetic stock and a bunch of homemade goodies he built with basic shop tools and a lot of elbow grease and ended up with a really nice cheap rifle. nagants been goin for around 100 bucks here lately, the ammo is cheap and powerfull and they are tuff as nails. might be a place to start.

Snowshoe · « **Reply #13 on:** July 01, 2004, 04:30:49 AM »

I picked up a Turkish Mauser in 8x57, with a synthetic stock and scope mounts already installed. The price was $200, and with a scope I picked up for a $125. I have a nice outfit for not much money, considering this is Canadian dollars. I went the standard sporter route, not the scout, but my point is if you look around deals can be found. The 8x57 is a fine cartridge to build your rife around, I reload for mine and am very impressed with it. Good luck.