Author Topic: whats a good bullet for the .30/30 (Read 3143 times)

thelaw · « **on:** July 10, 2004, 04:24:33 PM »

i've always shot federal 170gr. factory ammo in my .30/30. wondering what anyone who handloads, likes to load in their .30/30. barnes x, hornady, or the nosler partition. i don't hunt with the rifle much any more, but i still like hunting with it on occasion.

John Y Cannuck · « **Reply #1 on:** July 11, 2004, 01:07:37 AM »

I hunt the 30-30 a lot, the Hordady interlock has been good to me, as have cast bullets.
R15 seems to be the most accurate powder for me, but I've found the 30-30 isn't that picky.
34 grains under the 170 Hornady gives me 2150 fps (chronoed) out of my 20" bbl rifle.

Snowshoe · « **Reply #2 on:** July 11, 2004, 04:44:43 AM »

I like the 150g bullets better than the 170's, and the Hornady is my bullet of choice. I have heard good things about the Speer bullet, and I may give it a try. My wife uses 125g pointed soft point in her bolt action .30-30, and has taken quite a few nice whitetails, all one shot kills. Speer makes a good 130g flat point, that some like too.

oso45-70 · « **Reply #3 on:** July 11, 2004, 10:10:37 AM »

Thelaw
I don't think the make or kind of bullets you use in a 30-30 makes a lot of difference since the velocity is not that great, when this comes into effect is when your velocity is greater than lets say 2800 fpc. As for the type or manufactur of your hunting loads, I think they all fill the bill, There is nothing in the wourld wrong with the 30-30 as long as you don't try to stretch it to far. I carry one in my pickup all the time. Its one that i had my Smith put a ballard barrel on, And cut back to trapper lenth with Peep sights and a hi vizz front sight. I would not hesitate for a second shooting any game animal or varmint,, Four legged of course, LOL. Good luck.
.........Joe..................

Kragman71 · « **Reply #4 on:** July 14, 2004, 03:51:35 PM »

I am happy with the 170 grain Hornaday and IMR 3031 powder for hunting Whitetails.
Frank

snowdog · « **Reply #5 on:** July 19, 2004, 09:40:05 PM »

I'm working on that load right now Kragman, 170 grn Hornady
and IMR 3031 , last measure was I think ....28.5 grns

fired off 10 rounds earlier today.......accurate, hard hitting,
I think I will work with this for a while,

nightstalker · « **Reply #6 on:** August 11, 2004, 03:57:32 PM »

I like Sierra 150 gr. and Allante RE-7 powder. for plinking I use Magnus 150 and 170 gr lead bullets I get from Midsouth Shooters Supply. I load them with the same charge of Bulseye that I load my .357's with and are very accurate. They also make a goon small game round.

Kragman71 · « **Reply #7 on:** August 15, 2004, 04:22:39 PM »

Snowdog,
Sorry for my tardyness.
I get best results with 31.0 grains of IMR 3031. 31.3 grs gives me 2100 FPS,but with a drop in accuracy.
Frank

leverfan · « **Reply #8 on:** August 16, 2004, 09:39:02 PM »

I think that the 30-30 is at its all-around best when loaded with 170 grain flat nosed bullets, and the brand on the box isn't too important. Most bullet makers have been cranking out 30-30 bullets long enough to get them right, and the velocity isn't too stressful on the bullet, anyway. My grandfather's house had some mighty impressive trophies, including bull elk, all taken with the same 30-30, originally purchased by my great-grandfather. As far as I know, it's never shot a bullet that weighed less than 170 grains, and three generations of hunters have been satisfied with its performance.

If deer are the only animals you hunt, the 150 grain bullets may be a slightly better choice, but the main difference may be in what your particular rifle "prefers", or simply what gives you the most confidence when you take the shot.

snowdog · « **Reply #9 on:** August 19, 2004, 11:29:51 AM »

Hi Kragman

I bumbed up the load for the 170 grn hornady. In my 30-30
the best most accurate load I came up with was 29.5 3031.

It puts 3/3 rounds in a business card at 100 yds away.
consistantly.

Kragman71 · « **Reply #10 on:** August 22, 2004, 01:58:25 PM »

Snowdog,
You are probably getting the same velocity that I get with more powder.
You're at the peak of efficiency with that cartridge and that componant combination.
Just opinion,
Frank

snowdog · « **Reply #11 on:** August 22, 2004, 06:25:09 PM »

Hey Kragman, The 29.5 grns works great in my M94 but
shoots about 3 inches to the left in the marlin 336. go figure.

odd but with 150 grn sierra, I can get the same accuracy
from both guns... but with the 170 grn bullets, the marlin
is off to the left. I wonder if my marlin barrel is partial
to 150 grain bullets. I wonder if the differences in barrells
is that great to do this. the "standard" I use is win 170
grn power points. the win is 2 inch high at 100 yds, windage is
right on. putting in my reloads with the same sights I am 1 inch
high at 100 yds. the Marlin with the win fact loads is 2 inches high
windage right on. then with my reloads (29.5 grn loads) its about 1.5 high
and 3 - 3.5 inches to the left.

Buffalogun · « **Reply #12 on:** August 23, 2004, 03:03:00 PM »

thelaw,

I took a doe last year with my 1965 Win. 94 carbine at about 75 yds, using the std. open sights. My rifle likes the plain old Winchester 150g. Silvertip(30-30 bullet) over 33g Varget and is zeroed for 100 yds. Penetration was complete through the rib-cage/vitals.

If your thinking of going to handloads for the 30-30, just remember that some bullets are designed for higher velocities than the 30-30 can provide. These bullets, at 30-30 velocities, will more than likely act like full-metal-jacketed bullets and probably won't mushroom. Most manufacturers make bullets designed for 30-30 velocities and I'd stay with these!

Buffalogun

Kragman71 · « **Reply #13 on:** August 23, 2004, 04:33:04 PM »

Snowdog,
You mention 170 Gr Hornadays in your first post,but mention Winchester bullets as the ones that confound you. How does your Marlin handle the 170 Gr Hornadays?
I can't give you a reason for the different POI's
I cant even understand my own different POI's.
I have a GI Carbine Sporter that shoots 100 Gr Hornadays very well.
It also shoots 110 Gr Various Make bullets pretty well,but 2 inches to the right at 100 yards.
It shoots my cast bullet,Lyman#311359,3 inches to the left,and lower.
I have this noted in my reloading log,and don't worry about it.
Frank

snowdog · « **Reply #14 on:** August 24, 2004, 03:58:23 AM »

sorry bout that. I was saying that, I use the winchester 170 grn
as a standard or base. The 170 grn hornady's work great in my
winnie. If I shoot the winchester 170's and then my reloads...
they shoot about the same, I don't have to readjust my sights.
(winchester's are are about 1/2 inch higher.) With the Marlin....
the hornady's are about 3-4 inches to the left and about 1-2
inches higher. while the winchester ammo is dead on. in my marlin.

Lee · « **Reply #15 on:** August 24, 2004, 07:43:17 AM »

A 150 gr will give a flatter trajectory if you want to shoot at longer distances, and will retain more velocity at longer distances.

Just got a 30 30 and have not hunted with it yet, but I have used both 150 and 180 gr bullets in both 308 and 30 06 and thought that the 150 weight was the best. The velocity of 308 and 30 06 would drive the 180
right through a deer without bullet expansion at distances up to 100 yards.

On deer at very close range the same might be true on deer when using the 170 gr bullets, I would hesitate to use 170 gr on small deer at short distances, 170 was made for elk and bear, not that it cant kill a deer, just more than what you need.

leverfan · « **Reply #16 on:** August 24, 2004, 10:46:30 AM »

Quote from: Lee

(snip)On deer at very close range the same might be true on deer when using the 170 gr bullets, I would hesitate to use 170 gr on small deer at short distances, 170 was made for elk and bear, not that it cant kill a deer, just more than what you need.

The 170 grain bullets are more than you need for deer, but 170 grain flatpoint bullets made by most manufacturers are designed to expand very well at 30-30 velocities. The last deer I saw shot with a 30-30 was shot with 170 grain Federal factory loads, and it was a spike blacktail. It was so small, I was able to carry it out on my back a distance of 6 miles without help, and without putting it down. The 170 grain flatpoint broke a rib at the rear of the left chest going in, made a royal green mess of the deer's last few meals on the way through, exited just behind the right foreleg, entered the right foreleg, and was found under the skin at the "elbow" joint. It was expanded to .56", and it weighed 138 grains. That's the only 170 grain bullet I've seen recovered from a deer, but all wound tracks showed signs of bullet expansion.

As for not using the 170 at short range, well, short range is where all bullets are most likely to expand the most, so I'm not sure if I'm understanding you here. The same goes for 180 grain 30-06/308 loads not expanding "at distances up to 100 yards." Perhaps you've seen some bullets fragmenting at close range, and tiny exit holes left by a single fragment are giving you the impression that the bullet didn't expand. You must have recovered all of the game, in order to determine that the bullet exited, so I was wondering what sort of internal damage you saw.

The 30-30 should have ample velocity to expand any bullet made for it out to at least 200 yards, except for hard-cast lead. Likewise, if you're using a .308" bullet that's designed to expand at all, the .308 Winchester and the .30-06 Springfield produce plenty of velocity to do the job, even out to 400 yards and more, depending on the specific bullet used. There is some chance that you simply got hold of some defective bullets or loads, if there was really no expansion at all.

Deer don't open up a bullet as far, or stop it as often, as really big game tends to, but the bullet does almost always expand some. I started hunting with a .308 caliber model 88, and my dad always stoked it with 180 grain bullets, and he always used 170 grain bullets in his 30-30, and I don't remember any problems with either (other than the recoil of that 88 against my tender young shoulder).

Lee · « **Reply #17 on:** August 24, 2004, 05:29:41 PM »

leverfan

I read your story of the 170 gr with interest because I have never used
the 170 weight bullet.

Sorry if I failed to explain my point clearly. What I tried to say was the
heavier bullets sometimes pass through without expanding while the 150
is more reliable to expand.

If you hit right on a rib of course that helps expansion.

I dont know if there are griz where you hunt, but that would sure be a
reason to use 170.

leverfan · « **Reply #18 on:** August 24, 2004, 07:58:07 PM »

Quote from: Lee

leverfan(snip)
I dont know if there are griz where you hunt, but that would sure be a
reason to use 170.

If any griz are sauntering around Washington, they'd be in the northeast corner of the state. Washington state law pretty much requires you to just let the bear eat you, if it's a griz that's coming at you. You'd probably face less jail time and fines if you just shoot your hunting partner, and let the bear eat them, rather than shoot the bear.

At any rate, you'd have a hard time convincing authorities that you shot in self defense.

Black bear are fairly common all over the state, and we have some big ones, and a 30-30 with a full tube of 170 grain bullets would feel better than the single shot I held the last time I faced a bear.

You're right, 150 grain bullets tend to expand more, and penetrate less. Still, there are plenty of 180 grain bullets that open up very well, and they give lots of penetration. I often split the difference and load 165 grain Nosler Partitions in .308 Winchester, 30-06 Springfields, and the various 30 caliber magnums.

To get back to the 30-30, I'm afraid I'll always be a fan of cheap, cup-and-core flat nosed 170 grain bullets at around 2100 fps. I've never seen or heard of them failing to get the job done, with proper shot placement.

Riflemen10x · « **Reply #19 on:** August 27, 2004, 03:40:40 PM »

Hi Guy`s

I like the Winchester 170 and 150 Power point bullets made for the 30-30.

They are cheap,around 10.95 for 100 count bag and have worked realy well for me on deer sized game.

I like the 150gr ones.I like to get a little more zip from the 150 than the 170 but thats just me.

The 150gr do 2,360 fps with H4895 and 2,380 with reloader 15 out of my 20 inch rifles with Max Loads and good groups.

Riflemen10x

snowdog · « **Reply #20 on:** August 31, 2004, 04:41:11 AM »

either bullet will do its job. I happen to like the 170's because
here in W Wash. younever know when you'll run into a bear.
Not for protection mind you.... I just prefer the 170 or 150
if I should put a bead on a bear.

During my previous post on this subject, I mentioned I
thought my marlin had a preference for 150 grn. well turns
out after 6 different reload outtings, the Winchester shoots
great with my 29.5 grn 3031 recipe.
the Marlin works great with a bit hotter load.. 30.3 grns
of 3031. with the same Hornady 170 grn. I could use them
in the winchester... but bench shooting, the best I could do with the
hotter load in the winnie was a 3 inch group of 5 shots.

OLEVERN · « **Reply #21 on:** September 16, 2004, 03:33:23 AM »

I have had great results with a max charge of IMR 3031 behind the Sierra 170 grain FP.
Works wonders on S. Texas Hogs and quite accurate.

DPRinks · « **Reply #22 on:** October 05, 2004, 03:43:58 PM »

Lee;
Most bullet mfgs specify .30-30 bullets seperate from the other .30 's, this is to provide the correct jacket strength for the different class of velocity.
In the same way they seperately list bullets for the .30 carbine.
If the 150gr and the 170gr bullet are of the same profile, even though they leave at different velocities, the 170gr will eventually pass the 150g and have more retained energy down range.
Check any good exterior ballistics table, but compare oranges to oranges, not a fp with a btsp.
Don

willysjeep134 · « **Reply #23 on:** October 27, 2004, 06:11:27 PM »

I have used handloads with the Speer 110 grain hollowpoint Varminter bullet on whitetails before. Talk about expansion! At close to 2900FPS that little sucker left an enterance wound you could stick a fist through, liquefied any organs behind it, and no exit at all. I had to stop using them they damaged so much meat! Now I usually shoot 150 grainers, but I'm wondering if 170s might be a better all around load. Granted, I don't live in a state with much other large game, and a 150 is probably a better choice for deer and smaller animals, like coyotes this winter.

My dad reloaded some of those 130s last year. They performed all right, but were too much of a compromise. they didn't wallop a deer like a 150 nor scramble its innards like the 110s did. On smaller plains critters out west it might be a better choice.

S.S. · « **Reply #24 on:** October 28, 2004, 07:03:26 AM »

I have loaded every thing from 55 grain .223 sabot
bullets (fired in a single shot) to 220 grain bullets in
.30-30 Winchester and have finally settled on 180
grain jsp-rn bullets. There is really no other reason except
that they are very accurate in my mod. 94 trapper.
(my single shot load is a 150 gr. nosler ballistic tip at
max pressure. normally reserved for feral dogs)

willysjeep134 · « **Reply #25 on:** October 28, 2004, 07:05:51 PM »

I was just thinking about the 150 vs 170 debate. I have never shot 170s from my gun. I have always shot 150s or lighter. I'm thinking that if a higher velocity round like the 30-06 can take larger-than-deer game with a 150 grain bullet, the 150 will probably hold together just as well as the 170. Do I really want to cut my velocity even more for the sake of a little heavier 170grain bullet in a 30-30. I'm not attacking anybody elses choice, but I'm trying to figure out what really is best for me. I don't feel comfortable with the 130s, the 170s sacrifice energy for penetration that I don't think I can make use of, so i really think the 150 is my best choice.

I wonder if anybody has chosen the 150 for moose or elk. It seems like most people go for the 170s on bigger game. Does the 170 usually make its way all the way through the animal? Has anybody ever had a 150 not go all the way through?

These are just questions I'm asking myself as I contemplate buying another box of bullets to reload for this deer season. I think I will stick with the 150s.

sgtt · « **Reply #26 on:** October 28, 2004, 08:20:43 PM »

Shoot whatever your gun likes the best. The animal is not going to notice the difference.

147 Grain · « **Reply #27 on:** May 17, 2005, 11:31:21 AM »

Federal 30-30 rounds using the Grand Slam or newer Fusion bullet are the most aerodynamic out there (150-gr. or 170-gr.: taske your pick) and provide more energy on target than other factory ammo out there.

As far as BC and a bullet's energy are concerned, here are the following popular factory loads in order of ft. lbs. / BC:

* Federal's outgoing Grand Slam in 170-gr. = 1,115 ft. lbs at 200 yards. (renamed Fusion)
* Federal's new 2005 Fusion (similar to the Grand Slam) in 170-gr. = 1,115 ft. lbs at 200 yards. 150-gr. = 1,100 ft. lbs.
* Federal Nosler Partition in 170-gr. = 990 ft. lbs at 200 yards.
* Remington Core Lokt in 170-gr. = 989 ft. lbs at 200 yards.
* Winchester Power Point in 170-gr. = 955 ft. lbs at 200 yards.
* Hornady Interlock in 170-gr. = 793 ft. lbs at 200 yards.

While the energy of a round tells us NOTHING about the bullet's internal construction, it does, however, have a lot more to do with it's BC or how aerodynamic it is.

A good bullet will have a high BC and be well constructed; this is an ideal 30-30 round. Here is another list in order of how well the 30-30 bullets are constructed in order of toughness:

* Federal Nosler Partition in 170-gr. = 990 ft. lbs at 200 yards.
* Hornady Interlock in 170-gr. = 793 ft. lbs at 200 yards.
* Federal's new 2005 Fusion (similar to the Grand Slam) in 170-gr. = 1,115 ft. lbs at 200 yards.
* Remington Core Lokt in 170-gr. = 989 ft. lbs at 200 yards.
* Winchester Power Point in 170-gr. = 955 ft. lbs at 200 yards.