Author Topic: What do you eat? What about coffee? (Read 1935 times)

Feez · « **on:** July 14, 2004, 05:24:49 AM »

It's my first year in HP rifle silhouette. My scores have been 6's and a 9 so far.
Thought you needed to know that to answer appropriately.

Some days I have a nice slow left to right swing that passes a pig by about 1/2 pig length on each side. On the best days the vertical movement is less than a pig.
Now today I went out to practice and it wasn't worth wasting a bullet!
The "swing" was 3 pigs high and 3 long. It wasn't a swing at all, it was jerky like the camera guy running behind a cop on "Cops". :wink:

Question is, do you guys keep a special diet of any kind? Is there any issue like eating too recently or too long ago? Too much or too little? If you have food recommendations, is that a day or so before the shoot or all the time?

Coffee is a different story. If I can't quit it completely, should I have just a little bit the day of the shoot? If I have none at all I get shaky from withdraw.

I am average weight, had all the blood work and all that stuff a year ago and everything's ok. I don't exercise at all except for a good bit of hunting.

Any input would be appreciated.

genphideaux · « **Reply #1 on:** July 14, 2004, 05:39:03 AM »

Feez,

I'll be the first to say it "PRACTICE,PRACTICE and did I say PRACTICE"
we all have gone through this, is it what we eat, drink, amount of sleep, etc.....who knows? But I do know if I practice and stick with followthru, all the rest seems less adverse.

The only differance between b class and master class is number of hits on the berms. Practice up, confidence up, cowboy up and watch them fall.

Dawg

ajj · « **Reply #2 on:** July 14, 2004, 08:36:00 AM »

Eat moderately on match day, just enough to keep from having hunger pangs. A full stomach will do nothing good for your hold. Stay hydrated by drinking small amounts of water or gatorade many times during the day, even if you're not thirsty. The first sign of mild dehydration is usually fatigue and general loss of enthusiasm for what you're doing and you won't connect those feelings with dehydration. I drink coffee and have not found any tremors resulting from one cup in the morning. I fooled around and had two small cups at the motel in Winnsboro (hey, it was free) and then had about half of another when I got to the range, just because it was morning and that's when I drink coffee and I wasn't thinking. When I first put the rifle to my shoulder I knew I'd made a mistake. Certainly, you are wise to avoid excessive caffine on match day. Stay away from carbonated/caffinated soft drinks, too. Tobacco use will substantially increase your wobble area.
Just make it an "All things in moderation" deal and you'll be fine.

GeoNLR · « **Reply #3 on:** July 14, 2004, 10:15:45 AM »

Ask genphideaux and the PA boys about the strict diets they observe the night before big matches, Like in FL this year... Ha-ha...

Seriously, I'm not expert shooter, but I agree with ajj. Moderation before the match, well nurished, but moderate. I would also say to stay away from the caffine.

Don't believe me? Download the 10 Meter air rifle target and practice dry-firing in your house. Same scale, same sight picture, etc. Drink 2 or 3 cokes and then try and hold on an animal... I made the switch to all cafine free drinks, all the time, not just on match day, this seems to help me.

Oh yeah, what that ugly guy said about practice and watching them fall off the rail...

Good luck and good shooting

Geo

Steel killer · « **Reply #4 on:** July 14, 2004, 04:39:17 PM »

Since you are having good days and bad days you just may be at the break over stage in learning how to shoot. You need to dry fire, and dry fire ,and dry fire ect. Work on developing a good off hand position. In high power you have to learn conditions and how the effect sight setting. get Tubbs book and a book on sniper tec, they explain conditions well.

In high power fitness is very inportant, My first match was a month after my daughters wedding, I had lost 20lbs and was fairly hard due to some weight training. Recoil did not bother me , I shot my average score in rimfire a 23, I got lazy and stoped training my scores dropped.

I can't shoot with out my morning coffee, that stuff they serve at Winnsborrow is not even close to coffee. George don't give james to hard a time, I dit notice you being a tea tootler. He just may tell every one what a boy from Ark. said about people fro Minn-e-sota.
JD

GeoNLR · « **Reply #5 on:** July 15, 2004, 03:32:11 AM »

Quote from: GeoNLR

I made the switch to all cafine free drinks, all the time, not just on match day, this seems to help me.

Geo

There was no cafine in what I was drinking....

Hornetx60 · « **Reply #6 on:** July 16, 2004, 01:30:20 PM »

Hey George why you gotta drag the Pa boys into this. We weren't drinkin nothing with caffeine in it...LOL Besides them Southern Louisiana boys was doin all the drinkin at least that would give them an excuse for all that crap they were talkin :roll: That was medicinal use so I could sleep well before the match. Can't wait to do it again!!!!
.......... I also switched to all non caffeine drinks. Honestly the soda can't do any good with all of the sugar. Ajj is giving you good advice........ I won't eat any later than 2 hours before I start shooting and you need to keep yourself hydrated. you have to force yourself to drink more water than you think you need. I ruined a match for myself in cold weather this spring for that very reason. It is just as important in cool weather as it is in hot weather. Practice and don't be afraid to try new things in your shooting style. The only way to get better is to change and improve.

Bald Barry · « **Reply #7 on:** July 19, 2004, 05:30:59 PM »

All the advice above is good except for the stuff about alcohol. I just hope they were doing it after the match. Even then they have to deal with the hangover and dehydration the next morning. Back in the 70's when some bullseye pistol shooters were still shooting "wet", an old shooter told me "Booze doesn't help your shooting, but it sure makes losing easier to take." He was only half kidding.

I recommend you get a copy of of the book "Competitive Shooting" by A.A. Yur'yev. He was a coach for the Soviets. It's available on the NRA's website in their book store. Besides detailed recommendations on shooting positions, trigger techniques, breathing control, etc., he also talks about general physical conditioning. He advises against alcohol, tobacco, and caffeine.

Another pistol shooter I know told me recently he quit chewing tobacco. He said the decrease in arm movement was dramatic. "It's like putting my arm on a bench now."

And then years ago I watched a national championship category shooter drink a cup of coffee and smoke a cigarette before the .22 pistol match. He shot a 892 out of 900 that morning. Only 8 shots leaked out into the nine ring out of 90 shots. That's 30 shots slow fire at 50 yards, 30 timed fire at 25, and 30 rapid fire at 25. All one-handed. But for us mere humans I wouldn't recommend that.

Bottom line, the cleaner your system and the better shape you are in, the better you will shoot, whether it's rifle or pistol. Then dry fire, dry fire, dry fire, practice, practice, practice.

Oh, and then do what I say, not I do. Unfortunately I don't take a lot of my own advice. But then I'm stuck in AA. It all depends on how much you want something and how much time and effort you are willing to spend on it.

Good luck with your shooting career.

dawg_doc · « **Reply #8 on:** July 20, 2004, 03:46:28 AM »

I'm not sure I'm qualified to answer, since I don't shoot rifle silhouette, but am hoping to start soon. I do shoot IHMSA quite a bit. Normally, I call the line for the first few hours in the morning of the matches, during which time I'm busy pounding the coffee while running the microphone.

Last match, I shot first; nicely hydrated, no coffee and it seemed like the sight picture was rock steady. Hmmm....

In my actual job, I do a lot of what requires very fine motor control. I find something with lots of carbs helps. I usually have a couple of bagels before surgery and think it helps. Atkins would disagree, but it works for me.

On the other hand, one of the finest shooters I know drinks like a fish, downs coffee like it was going out of style, and smokes lots of cigars.

I'd start with lots of practice and limit the coffee.

Green3845 · « **Reply #9 on:** July 25, 2004, 10:08:15 AM »

I'm not a silhouette shooter, but rather a NRA high power shooter. My opinion is that one should do what is normal for you just prior to a match. I certainly advocate clean living, but it's probably not a good idea, to embark on something the night before or morning of a match. If you smoke, I wouldn't quit the night before or the morning of a match. The nicotine withdrawal would most certainly cause tremors. Same thing for caffeine intake, do what is normal.

It's interesting to go to a big match like Perry and watch all of the military shooters clustered around the Igloo's of hot coffee, half with cigarettes, first thing in the morning. They have a couple of cups of coffee and a cigarette or two, and then go and shoot an outstanding offhand.

shootingpaul · « **Reply #10 on:** July 25, 2004, 03:44:08 PM »

I do drink a cup or 2 of coffee in the morning- I do it every day so not doing it on the match day might be a disaster, I also like few beers after a match (I call them sighting fluids) - sometimes whiskey shot is very welcomed, my bottom line is that if I will get so seriously into the game that I can not have fun, then i will quit and concentrate on fishing instead.

I am out of AA and AAA as well, I am M in all rifles and can shoot really nice and decent score in the match (providing I had enough sighting fluids the night before :lol: )
good luck to you and all the best!

Sixgun · « **Reply #11 on:** July 26, 2004, 03:30:05 AM »

caffeine and a rock steady hold are a really interesting subject.

I do not drink coffee and very little coke. I am a insulin dependent diabetic also. If I drink a few cokes the week before a match I know it at the match. I am wiggling all over the place. If I stay off the coke I am rock steady. I think that the caffeine has a very lingering effect. It may be that I do have a small tolerance for it and maybe my system is shaky cause it wants more, I don't know why but I do know it has a very definite effect.

caffeine also lowers blood sugar. That can make me shaky too. I try to stay off caffeine all week before a match.

Blood sugar also plays a big roll. If I am shaky during a match, and I have not had any coke during the week, I check my blood sugar and it is usually low. I carry some really sweet stuff with me all of the time and will take it during a match but my blood sugar usually does not catch up fast enough. Sugar in liquid form will bring up blood sugar quicker than candy. Drinks with fruitose and corn syrup will not bring blood sugar up real fast but will bring it up. It has to be sugar to do a fast job. Blood sugar can drop really fast. If you are shooting good at the first of a match and then get shaky and missing, eat some candy or drink a pop that has no caffeine.

More about caffeine. If you drink coffee regularly and stop for a match it won't do any good. If you are shaky because you drink coffee and want to fix it, I believe you need to quit drinking it all together and stay off it. If you find that hard, caffeine is one drug that you can taper off of. Meaning you can drink less and less and quit all together. A can of coke has much less caffeine than a cup of coffee so it is a good substitute for coffee when you are tapering off.

If coffee does not bother your shooting, drink it like you normally do.

I hope this will help. It all works for me.

Sixgun

hh4064 · « **Reply #12 on:** November 22, 2004, 01:08:08 PM »

I am a RN and a paramedic certified in trauma. I have been in medicine for over 20 yrs. (ONLY TO QUALIFY MY COMMENTS)Everyone is different. Comfort is EVERYTHING. For me I cant consume any caffeine 48 hrs before shooting. The shooters breakfast has been is oatmeal and orange juice. BUT don't over eat. When we eat to much too fast a larger amount of blood diverts to the intestinal tract to add in digestion. When this happens it causes us to feel tired. Remember what it feels like after a big thanksgiving meal whewwwwwwwwwwww. The recliner looks pretty darn good. Eat small portions before you shoot. Stay comfortable at all times. Then throughout out the match ESPECIALLY if it is hot, sip on a sports drink of some kind (replaces fluids). Munch on a few tater chips. (replaces sodium). This will help fight the shakes, keep you from getting too tired. Everyones metabolism is different. Pay very close attention to what you eat and how you feel after you eat. It also not good if you are hungry. This will cause the adrenaline to flow. I believe it is better to eat something. I am sure there will be shooters out there that will say I am full of crap. Remember we are all different and different in many ways. This works for me I hope it works for you.
mbj
lapeer mi

SteelEye · « **Reply #13 on:** November 23, 2004, 05:36:40 AM »

Before any type of shooting where I want to shoot well, I will dry fire at home for 15-30 minutes. If I really want to shoot well, I do yoga-like stretching for 30 minutes and if its an important match I may even meditate (close my eyes and focus on breathing until my mind, hopefully, goes blank...)

I work-out regularly to strengthen my arms and shoulders. Find it helps a lot and gives me a longer hold period. One dry fire exercise that helps is to hold until my arms ache. I do this for a 5 minute period. After a while, my hold gets steadier and I can hold longer.

Prior to a match I will ensure that I don't eat something to give me any type of indigestion. Nothing like standing on the line with a gut full of poison gas.

dave imas · « **Reply #14 on:** November 26, 2004, 06:28:24 AM »

Feez,
it has been said here already but let me add emphasis and be, perhaps, a bit more direct. Diet is the least of your challenges at the moment. Your position, hold, and technique are the foundation that you may be missing to allow you to shoot higher scores. You do need to practice. But you need to practice good skills. Practice doesn't make perfect. Perfect practice makes perfect. Perfect practice of the correct skills and methodology make perfect. Anything else and you are just practicing bad habits and making improvement all the more difficult.

Also... the vast majority of your practice for highpower should be with your smallbore or air rifle. It is cheaper, less painful, and far more effective in improving your skills. Also, practice on paper. This is extremely important. Paper doesn't lie. Swingers work for hits but don't tell you anything about your misses.

Fitness is also important. Upper body strength will help your hold. You don't have to be Arnold but you do have to be able to pull back on your stock 40 to 60 times for a match without undue jitters. Less than fit muscles will fatique and begin to shake after awhile. Falling out of bed in the morning and doing 20 pushup with 20 more before you climb into bed is a great start. If you can't do 20, start with whatever you can. With that said, it would an interesting discussion about mental vs. physcial fatigue... which to do folks think costs them the most animals later in the match.
Cardiovascular fitness is, perhaps, more important than muscular fitness. Even though we are just standing still, if you are more fit you have a better chance of lower blood pressure and lower pulse rate. Both extremely important as your shooting skills improve. You don't have to be able to run a marathon but get off the couch and take a long walk after dinner.
dave imas

CB · « **Reply #15 on:** January 01, 2005, 04:58:44 AM »

Here's some stuff to chew on. Few months ago hold was 80% of the time settling and solid through shot release. (dry-firing). Reeses cups left over from Halloween built up with Thanksgiving+ peanut brittle and fudge at Christmas and I now have 3 chicken high and wide spasmy herky jerky mess. trip to Wally world revealed blood pressure had gone from 117/69 normal to 144/70 . heartbeat was evident during practice. Might add we had pretty day yesterday and rode 14miles on the bikes, mine is not a seditary lifestyle. I noticed coffee and cigars seem to fit in quite well with the chocolate diet as well. Also gym visits turned sluggy and dull. I'm at the half century mark so perhaps a younger person would show less effect. BUT I dare say an effect would be there. This is an athletic sport, stands to reason anything that disrupts the fine motor skills is going to see scores plummet.
CB

Graybeard · « **Reply #16 on:** January 01, 2005, 05:14:38 AM »

Been a LOT of years since I retired from competition. But back in my days of shooting it I found one thing that helped steady me down as much as anything. I developed a routine that consisted of lining up on the target and intentionally moving the barrel vertically above and below target slightly and then trying to reduce that movement to as near nothing as possible prior to making the shot.

This seemed to help greating in reducing side to side movement which was always my worse problem. I also tried to break the shot just as the cross hairs touched metal in my vertical movements.

What this did for me was to add consistency as well as reduce those wild gyrations. Seemed to put a lot of trophies in my truck at the end of matches.

drags · « **Reply #17 on:** January 01, 2005, 07:37:13 AM »

Hi Graybeard, when you move up above the animal and then back down below the animal then you bring the croswshairs back up to break the shot on the animal, am I understanding you correctly?
Drags

theunsv · « **Reply #18 on:** January 01, 2005, 08:56:00 AM »

I believe that what helps far more than drinking dull fizzy drinks, cutting down on beers, eating green stuff etc. is to simply get yourself a good air rifle and practice with that at home. The ammo is a lot cheaper. You learn not to flinch and you learn to follow through. Your HP scores will definitely improve.

Graybeard · « **Reply #19 on:** January 01, 2005, 02:24:02 PM »

Quote

Hi Graybeard, when you move up above the animal and then back down below the animal then you bring the croswshairs back up to break the shot on the animal, am I understanding you correctly?

Yes, Drags. What I did took maybe 2-3 seconds max per shot. As soon as I got the selected target in the scope and cross hairs roughly lined up I tried to center left to right and moved the rifle up and down a few times with movements getting less with each pass. And slowed the movement but kept it moving slowly. I tried to time the shot to make sure I fired just as the horizontal wire was about to touch metal on one of the very slow swings up or down. Give it a try while practicing. If it doesn't help don't use it in competition. It sure seemed to help me tho.

Feez · « **Reply #20 on:** January 06, 2005, 04:30:49 AM »

Thanks for all the input.
I thought this topic was dead but since it got brought up again ....

I see by the replies that everyone's body is different. The only thing everybody agrees on is practice - practice - practice. When it comes to diet etc it's what works for you.

I will say, since the first post my scores have improved. Coffee and lack of sleep is my enemy. I experimented a lot since then and found that I have to quit for three whole days. One and even two days after no coffee are actually worse than not quitting. I really should quit alltogether but working 3rd shift it's tempting all night.

But don't think I ignored all the other advice. Not at all! It's just that for me coffee destroys my hold to the point that nothing internal, mental, or mechanical will help. So it's cut the coffee and then do all the other stuff.