Author Topic: Federal Marshalls-Game Wardens  (Read 2634 times)

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Offline HeltonPrecision

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« on: July 22, 2004, 09:13:34 PM »
Just wondering if any of you guys ever run across a federal warden while camping? I live in NC ,and very close to the mountains! So I try to go camping as much as I can It's always been a LOVE of mine but while camping in the Pisgah national forest we get totally searched every time in the evening ! I mean empty your pockets is that your vehicle kinda thing and they totally search It also which truly SUCKS we have never gave them a reason too think were doing illegal activities Just makes you feel totally violated Just be sitting there and all of a sudden a Jeep Cherokee pulls up and out comes a real total jerk wearing a bullet proof vest saying OK I need all of you guys to empty your pockets NOW! If I had a family up there with small children I know id turn into a real S.O.B if they were to act like that around them! What do you guys think? And were do you think a fella could find out about the laws on national forest in NC ? I mean, so id know my rights ! :roll: After they leave me and my buddies always make fun of there actions , as In the way there just totally rude I think next time I go up, I might just put on my bullet proof vest and wait for them to pull up see what kinda reaction I get LoL  :lol:

Offline dukkillr

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« Reply #1 on: July 22, 2004, 10:53:24 PM »
did you have a firearm with you?  did you have a hunting license... most states have a disclaimer that essentially says you allow them to search you when you're in the field... if you a)had no guns (or bows obviously) and b)weren't doing anything that could be deemed "questionable" (like building a greenhouse) and they still did that i'd say you've got a reasonable complaint...

Offline HeltonPrecision

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« Reply #2 on: July 23, 2004, 09:29:34 AM »
No firearms or anything It happens every time we go up on the weekends I dont know if there trying to keep people from not coming up there or what ! I still go ,but not as much as we used too Just to much harasment when I go camping I like to relax and not worry about the whole serching thing  :wink:

Offline dla

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« Reply #3 on: August 07, 2004, 09:55:05 AM »
Quote from: HeltonPrecision
No firearms or anything It happens every time we go up on the weekends I dont know if there trying to keep people from not coming up there or what ! I still go ,but not as much as we used too Just to much harasment when I go camping I like to relax and not worry about the whole serching thing  :wink:


File a complaint with the Feds. This dork Fed-CopWannabe is screwing up.

Offline mikemayberry

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« Reply #4 on: September 12, 2004, 04:16:20 PM »
HeltonPrecision,

Why not just ask for his business card or which office he is located out of and then call and ask for a supervisor upon your return.  Be polite and ask what their policy is on that type of search without cause.

Bet  his boss doesn't know he's doing it and will straighten him out if you ask the right questions without being accusatory.  Especially if it has happened more than once.

If it still sounds fishy, call your Congressman and ask him what he thinks of this policy.

Mike
In the absence of factual information, the voids will be filled with the worst possible scenario!

Offline jgalar

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« Reply #5 on: September 12, 2004, 05:31:52 PM »
Is there a water supply in the area that you could be poisoning? I don't know anything about your area, but its sounds like they are concerned about terrorist activity. Things have changed since the attack on the twin towers. Unfortunately we have to live with some of the security inconveniences.

Offline DanielWGriggs

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« Reply #6 on: September 29, 2004, 12:59:24 PM »
Sounds like crap to me. All the agents/Conservation Officers state and federal have always been polite. I hunt in the Illinois Shawnee national forest seldom see others where I go. The two that stopped by this year asked to see licence after 30 minutes of conversation before identifing themselves. kinda sneaky but we were all leagel so we offered a cup of coffee or a meal which they refused and  off they went. did see em spying on us later in the evening.  

Maybe your guy is on the take trying to protect a still or other illicit activity i would sure ask for a card and talk witha supervisor. gotta keep them honest too.

Offline HeltonPrecision

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« Reply #7 on: November 20, 2004, 07:30:12 PM »
I wish it was C**P But It isn't I the cold hard truth and it scares the he** out of me that no one knows more of the FEDERAL law :)

Offline FWiedner

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« Reply #8 on: January 08, 2005, 06:44:55 PM »
Quote from: U.S. Constitution
Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.


 :wink:
They may talk of a "New Order" in the  world, but what they have in mind is only a revival of the oldest and worst tyranny.   No liberty, no religion, no hope.   It is an unholy alliance of power and pelf to dominate and to enslave the human race.

Offline MGMorden

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« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2005, 05:14:57 PM »
Quote from: jgalar
Is there a water supply in the area that you could be poisoning? I don't know anything about your area, but its sounds like they are concerned about terrorist activity. Things have changed since the attack on the twin towers. Unfortunately we have to live with some of the security inconveniences.


Totally messing with our lives is what the terrorists had in mind in the first place.  To a large degree they've had a lot of sucess.  I personally think that this fear of terrorism is spawning a whole new era of "McCarthy-ism" all over again.  Believe me, one way that the government has found to take away freedoms is to proclaim it's to protect us from all the terrorists.

Offline DanielWGriggs

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« Reply #10 on: April 02, 2005, 10:12:02 AM »
HP I ment that I think getting searched is a load of C  P not what you had happen to you. I would report this behavior there may be an underlying reason but it doesn't justify how you were treated.

an armed society is a polite society.

Offline flamenblaster

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« Reply #11 on: April 04, 2005, 04:12:24 AM »
Up here in washington state we go out camping and shooting alot..not always clear who "administers" the land..blm, national forest, state forest, etc...its like a checkerboard on a map and out in the woods its not so easy to tell what "rules" are in effect right where we are all the time. Only got bothered once by a county sheriff in a jeep while shooting..advised us not to break any glass and that our firepit, while technicaly illegal due to dry august conditions and burn ban, didnt concern him but said be careful about it...id say that some local enforcement people are just overstepping their authority.
Good friends will come, and good friends will go...but jerks will just accumulate.

Offline JohnClif

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« Reply #12 on: April 07, 2005, 09:18:44 PM »
You know, there is nothing that prohibits a law enforcement officer from asking you to do anything... like submit to a search. They have every right to ask. There is also nothing that prohibits you from saying NO! A police officer has to have reasonable suspicion of criminal activity or that you pose a threat to him (probable cause) in order to search you without your permission. Just being out in the woods isn't enough. However, do not physically resist a search of your person or your vehicle.

I watch "Cops" occasionally and am constantly amazed to see people meekly acquiesce when a police officer says, "Can I search your vehicle?" Of course, the police officer finds drugs or a gun or whatever, and the driver is arrested. There's no doubt that if the people said "No, you can't search my vehicle" they'd go free after a few minutes of hassles and empty threats ("Do you want us to get a search warrant?" I'd say, "Yes, if you feel you have probable cause, then please get a warrant. In the meantime, am I under arrest? If not, I'm leaving, in my vehicle, and you can follow me and bring the search warrant when you get it.")

You don't have to let them search your car, however everything in plain sight is fair game, and if they see something that looks suspicious (like a handgun butt sticking out from under a seat, or a baggie full of drugs) then they can search the car because they now have probable cause. If you are in the car, they can order you out of the car and then search the passenger compartment for weapons. If you are not in the car and the doors are shut then I think searching would be a lot more problematic. The important thing to remember is, tell the officer that you do not consent to a search of your vehicle. That way, if they do search it and find something that they arrest you for, you can challenge the search as illegal. Of course, the real secret here is don't have anything illegal in your car (drugs, illegal weapons, etc.).

The police know (they are taught this) that most people don't know their rights and that most people will submit to authority. They also know that, if you do not object, the courts have ruled that you agree to the search and therefore anything they find can be used against you.

As someone who has a healthy respect for law enforcement, an understanding of the level of risk in their job, and a deep appreciation of the risks they take and the crap they put up with, let me tell you what many of my law enforcement acquaintances have told me: the police are not your enemy, but they are also not your friends.

The police deal with human scum every day, and after a while many of them begin to view anyone who is not in law enforcement as "them"... criminals. This is a sad byproduct of having to deal with wife-beaters, murderers, thiefs, robbers, pimps, rapists, muggers, child molesters, etc., continually, and some of the nicest-appearing folks are actually the most horrible criminals. It's only human nature that a cop with any experience is going to become somewhat jaundiced. Hence, the tendency to treat everyone like a criminal until proven otherwise.

If you don't want to be searched, then don't give permission to search. You have a Fourth Amendment right to be free from unreasonable searches, but you have to stand up for your rights in a respectful and nonconfrontational manner. Like, "Officer, I understand you have a difficult job to do, and I know you understand that I have my rights, too. I do not give you permission to search me, my vehicle, or my possessions." If an officer asks you questions, you generally are only obligated to tell them your name and your date of birth. If you decide to answer more questions, either answer them truthfully "My name is John Smith. Would you like to see my driver's license?" or politely refuse to answer them "Officer, with all due respect, the contents of my vehicle are none of your business." Generally, be polite and brief because the less you say the better off you are. Remember that more people talk themselves into jail than talk themselves out.

Here's another tip: if you are bothered by this official's regular confrontation of you and your group, why not tell him? And why not ask him why he is doing this? Do you match the description of someone wanted in the area? Is a manhunt underway (maybe something you don't know about)? I know that, in North Carolina, the Atlanta Olympic Bomber was on the run in the mountains for several years (he was recently caught). If you know of some suspicious activity or run across some, e.g. marijuana plot or still, then report it.

Here's a good link for more information:

http://criminal-law.freeadvice.com/arrests_and_searches/

Offline HeltonPrecision

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« Reply #13 on: May 08, 2005, 10:24:07 AM »
I understand that I have the right to refuse but I wasn't sure on Federal Land  :? I know that's different that privately owned :)

Offline outdoorman

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« Reply #14 on: September 02, 2005, 03:04:34 PM »
I'd comply politely with the officer then afterwards ask why he searched you. Perhaps there's been particular illegal activity there you are unaware of.  As someone else said you can always ask for his buisness card if you feel you need to speak to his supervisor.
Being a game warden or forest law enforcement officer is dangerous isolated work so I'd understand them taking some precaution especially if illegal stuff has occurred in that area.

Offline HeltonPrecision

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« Reply #15 on: October 24, 2005, 05:18:15 PM »
Just a recap fellas ! We haven't been searched in the last 10 or so times we've been camping :) All has been really good ,this camping season :D