Win brass/lee loader problems .308 Win

[JBKERNS]

I have some Winchester Brass that loaded fine the first time around in my Savage 10 action.

My load:
50 gr Win 760
Win LR Primer
150 gr Hornady RN

After the first loading, I cleaned the brass with detergent and checked the case length with one of those Lee hand case trimmers.  I followed normal procedures and when I seated the bullets they were very loose!  I am going back to Rem brass as I have no problems with it.

Has anyone had this problem?  Thank you in advance, Jeff

[Wrong Way]

You used your Lee Loader to size your brass and to crimp the bullet and it was still loose? Wow, I've loaded hundreds of 30-30's and .45's with the Lee Loader and never had that problem. I'm having a problem trying to picture how that can be. Could you go into a little more detail?

[JBKERNS]

Thank you Wrong Way for the reply.

The loader is a Lee Classic Loader, the "hammer one" if I was not clear.

I do the neck resize with the tool and the bullet is only finger tight when it is seated.   It can be easily pushed INTO the case (to the charge).  

The first loading with this brass was fine.

Can you crimp with the Lee Classic tool?

Thanks again, Jeff

[ButlerFord45]

I'm gonna guess you didn't get the case deep enough into the die to get proper sizing.  Give it another try before you dump the brass.  Personally, I wouldn't crimp a 308, but if I recall correctly, you can crimp with the Lee classic

[jd45]

I've been using one of these now for about 3 years for .308. I've gotten a good "grab" of the case on the shank of the bullet with different brands of cases from mil-surp to Norma, which I'm using now, & fantastic accuracy, even at 200yds with Federal 210m primers & minimun charges of Hodgdon's Varget in my Rem. Varmint Synthetic. But I just bought another one for .303 British & some new Win. cases as well as some mil-surp ammo & when I neck-size the Win cases it doesn't size them down as much as the Sellior & Bellot mil-surp cases. Am still testing for accuracy, but, again, with min chgs of Varget & Fed 210m's accuracy is surprising from a "worn-out" jungle carbine. Might want to contact Lee in Hartford, Ws., to get their take on this. I might, myself. Good luck. jd45.

[Wrong Way]

Yeah, you can crimp with this tool. It is in the instructions. When I first loaded with it I forgot to crimp and when I loaded it into a lever action the bullet pushed way back into the case. I'm glad I was paying attention when that happened. Could of had a big problem. Crimping is easy. Just take it easy. I like to load with the Lee Classic Loader. It kind of gives me the feeling that each round is "special". And they are. I loaded for years with a press and if I were reloading in large amounts again I would still. But I don't now so it really fits the bill. And it's really fun. For people on a budget it can't be beat. I load shells right at the kitchen table. I load a bit on the light side for my 30-30's. Deer don't seem to know the difference.
 I enjoy reading how others reload. Quite an interesting group. Even after all the years of reloading I still find there are a lot of people out there that know a lot more about it than I ever will.  :grin: But I do know the Lee Loader. I know it works. Have fun.
 If you don't have the instructions I can copy mine and send them to you.

[jd45]

I second Wrong Way's mentioning of the fact that you should take it easy when crimping with the tool. I've buckeled more than a few cases cause I tried to put too much crimp on the cart. By the way, the crimp-end of the die is the opposite  of the neck-sizing end ot it. Lee reccomends crimping, as they say the resistance of the crimp gets a more controlled burn going, which enhances accuracy, & I've always crimped with this tool. So far, so good. jd45.

[Larry Gibson]

JBKERNS

"I have some Winchester Brass that loaded fine the first time around in my Savage 10 action.......After the first loading, I cleaned the brass with detergent and checked the case length with one of those Lee hand case trimmers.  I followed normal procedures and when I seated the bullets they were very loose!  I am going back to Rem brass as I have no problems with it.

Has anyone had this problem?  Thank you in advance, Jeff[/quote]"

Good news and bad news...the Lee loaders normally should size the necks of W-W brass to sufficiently hold the bullets.  However, Winchester brass is quite a bit thinner than other .308 brass particularly in the necks.  Since Lee loaders do not have an expander to size the inside of the necks uniformily they walk a thin line betwenn sizing thin necked brass enough and the thick military brass too much.  Your loader may work very well with another lot of Winchester brass.  The good news is you are minimally neck sizing the Remington brass.  The reason the brass loaded fine the first time was that the necks were factory sized under what your Lee loader sizes them to, even if you ran them into the Lee loader.  

If you have a micrometer mike the thickness of the brass in the necks and I'm sure you will see the difference between the Win and Rem brass.  Knowing the thickness of the Rem necks you can readily measure other brass to determine its suitability for your Lee loader.  Some will criticise the Lee loader for as "slow", "cumbersome" etc. but some very, very accurate loads can be loaded with Lee loaders.  I started out years ago with a Lee loader for my 30-30.  Though I have two single stage presses, two progressive presses, a hand press and three Lyman Tong tools I still have several Lee Loaders that I use to load with also.  My accurate long range .308 target loads are loaded with a Lee Target loader (just a more sophisticated loader that allows inside neck reaming).  

Larry Gibson

[Leftoverdj]

If you think you will ever get bitten by the cast bullet bug, you might mark those cases and set them aside for that. Cast bullets should be a bit bigger than jacketed and don't like being forced into real tight necks. I shoot cast bullets sized .309 and .311 in .30 cal rifles. Your cases and die should be just right for that.