357 mag vs. 45 colt

[kysingleshot]

Now I am sure that many of you were shocked by the title of this post, but here is the story.
I was looking for a sidearm for carrying in the woods here in Ky, and felt that a 44 mag was a little too brutal for me for general carry.  I planned on buying a 45 colt and got to looking at muzzle energy.  Apparently I made a mistake from what I have read.  Anyway, I wound up buying a 357 mag due to muzzle energy alone.  The main reason was I saw many hunting rounds for 357, but not 45.  Now I have thought of selling the 357 and buying the 45 I wanted to begin with.  
Now the question.
Is the 45 colt head and shoulders above the 357 mag?

Thanks,
Michael

[oso45-70]

KYsingleshot,
One word answer,  ( YES )

[Robert357]

Love 'em both!

As to your statement about a mistake.......As with most things in life it depends.  

First I am a really big fan of the 357 Mag.  If you read the history on this round it has been used (at slightly more powerful loads than factory loads today) to shoot just about anything and so should be fine for deer, if you know how to shoot it and keep your range reasonable and carefully select your ammo.  That means if you just get the first box of factory ammo from the store shelf and don't practice, it probably isn't the firearm for you, but then again, hardly anything would be.

Personally, I like Ruger single action blackhawks for the deep dard woods.  I have a couple in 357 Mag (along with Tarus 357 Mag) and a 45 (Long) Colt Blackhawk.

I hand load, and use 180 grain and 200 grain bullets with a "Blackhawk" magnum load of Alliant 2400 powder for my serious 357 Mag rounds.  The 180 and 200 grain rounds are so long they will only fit my Ruger Blackhawk cylinders.  

Elmer Keith preferred 173 to 180 grain bullets at pretty impressive power levels.  If you have a Blackhawk or other "solid" 357 magnum revolver, I suggest you either work up some stout handloads for you 357 to put the "magnum" back in 357 Magnum.  If you don't have one of the brands that is solid, then I would suggest either selling it like you think.  

If you are not a handloader then there is an outfit that sells ammo called Buffalo Bore.  They have special high performance hunting ammo for handguns.  They include both 357 Mag and 45 (Long) Colt in thier factory offerings.  They sell over the internet and have a verying interesting website.

Now the the Colt 45.  It is really great to shoot a Ruger Blackhawk in Colt 45.  My handloading books have special sections on loads for the Ruger Blackhawks and Thompson Contenders as the actions are much stronger than other brands.  A Colt 45 can be hand loaded to approximately standard 44 Mag levels.  However, that level of power is not generally needed for deer hunting.  I have some handloads with 250 grain Hornady bullets and Alliant 2400 powder that are near 44 Mag level and very accurate in my Ruger 45 Colt.

In short you probably didn't make a mistake if your 357 revolver can handle the Buffalo Bore hunting grade ammo or it is a Ruger Blackhawk and you handload.  

Personally, I prefer the 357 Mag in the woods as a side arm, multipurpose tool.  I usually take 6 high performance rounds in the Blackhawk (with transfer bar safety), and a ten round pocket ammo carrier with 2 38 special shot shells, 4 38 Special rounds, and 4 standard 357 rounds.  That provides me with lots and lots of options for putting something in the camp dinner pot to providing lots of protection.  I view a 357 Mag handgun with various 357 Mag and 38 special ammo as a real general purpose wilderness tool.

Good luck!

[kysingleshot]

just for clarification,  I was looking at a ruger blackhawk 45 colt, 4 5/8 barrel, and bought a blackhawk 357 mag 6 1/2 barrel.

[Lone Star]

The .45LC is the superior hunting round - IF you handload or can find the few available high performance specialty rounds.  The factory ammo is very mild and while it kills it is no better IMO than a .357 cartridge.  Only when you can heat up the .45LC to a true 1000+ fps and use bullets of 250 gr and up does the .45LC overtake the .357 - again IMO.  The revolver you have is a fine hunting/general purose tool.  Personally I prefer my five .45LCs to any .357, but I don't disrespect the .357 - with premium, suitable loads.

[crawfish]

The .45LC is one of many calibers that suffer from age. It has been around a long time. That does indicate that it has passed the tests of time, but it also means that there are still many old guns in that caliber that cannot safely shoot ammunition loaded to the levels of the new Rugers, FA, BFR to name a few. Because of the two very different classes of revolvers still in use you have the major commercial ammunition companies loading to the limits of the lowest safe level in any gun. When you compare those .45LC loadings against the .357Mag the .45LC comes up wanting. Then you have the custom ammo companies like Garrett, Cor-Bon, and BuffaloBore to name a few that have .45LC loadings that exploit the full potential of the very strong modern 6 and 5 shooters in .45LC. When you compare these loadings against the .357Mag you can readily see that the .45LC stands right up there with our most powerful handgun calibers and that the .357Mag pales by comparison.

[C A Plater]

First you did not make a mistake.  Perhaps a diversion on the path to true enlightenment but not a mistake.  As to your question, yes but not always in the case of available factory ammo.  Performance .45 Colt ammo is scarce and not available at every gun emporium.   Most of it is design to work in old SAA Colts or is the light cowboy loads.  On the other hand, good stout .357 is available at most Walmarts and the like.  Now if you handload, then like the motorheads say, there is no substitute for cubic inches and that goes for pistols too.  I load my .45 Ruger Bisley with 270 grain Keith at about 1100 fps and that is way better than just about any factory .357.  Keep the .357 and shoot the heck out of it and have a blast.  Later,  get yourself a .45 and have some more fun.  Two guns are better than one.

[Lone Star]

Ol' C.A. is right on.  Since the original poster is talking about the .45LC Blackhawk, the "strength" issue is moot.  Oddly, Garrett does not list .45LC loads on their site - I too thought they did.  But not everyone wants - or needs - the moose-class loads from Cor-Bon or Buffalo Bore - a deer hunter certainly doesn't need a 300 grain bullet at 1300+ fps.  A load like that becomes a challenge to shoot well in a short-barreled BH like the poster considered, expecially for the "average" handgun hunter.  In this instance the .357 may well be the better hunting round because the average handgun hunter can hit the animal with it.  Handloading is what makes the .45LC really shine as a hunting round for the masses....but then the masses don't buy it.  

Yes, the case has excessive capacity, most brass is thin, factory loads suck and you have to pay attention to the handgun you fire it in.  But for those who like the old round, who like a loading challenge, and who can't stomach the thought of shooting the ubiquitous .44 Magnum, the .45 LC fills a real need.

[Bullseye]

You did not make a mistake in my opinion.  I would take the 357 Mag over the 45 LC any day.  The 45 LC is not very impressive at factory velocities and my experience with hot rodding it has never been very good.  My hot rod loads never had good accuracy and I always had premature case failures.  I know I lot of people like it and get them shooting good, but I was not one of them.  My 45 LC went bye bye.

[Glanceblamm]

One of our greats, I think it was Skeeter, said that the .45 colt sure does belie it's preformance in the field as compared to it's published ballistics!
I do believe that he was talking about the lighter factory stuff at that time.

This sure does seem to be true. Especially with a hard cast. The accuracy? Yes it is there!

[Smokem]

I have both calibers. My 357 is S&W 66 and the 45colt is a 454 casull. I enjoy shooting both. I prefer to hunt with the 45colt cartridge. I use it to hunt whitetails in the Maine woods which is both very thick in places (under 25yds) and very open (over 50yds). I choose to hunt with the 45colt because I load it for those potential shot out to 100yds. I have taken deer as close as 25FEET and as far away as 120yds with my rifle. So when I wanted to switch to a handgun I chose a SRH in 454 casull. I have shot plenty of rounds through the big gun and enjoy the 45 colts the best.
JMO

[Redhawk1]

I think the 45 Colt is a better choice. It can be load to shoot mild loads and loaded to compare to the 44MAG.  If I had to choose one, it would be the 45 Colt. JMHO  

[John R.]

I have both, 357 & 45 colt. When I go hunting I always grab the 45 Colt. (Bigger bullet, hits harder than any 357 on game). When it comes to hunting handguns bigger is better. It has been my experience that if you want to shoot a 357 for deer or especially hogs you better brush up on your tracking skills.

[Robert357]

just for clarification,  I was looking at a ruger blackhawk 45 colt, 4 5/8 barrel, and bought a blackhawk 357 mag 6 1/2 barrel.

As you can see from the posts, there is a lot of differing opinion on the subject.

I think you made the best choice.  If I were in your shoes, I would have opted to for the longer barrel as it has a better sight radius and will be much more accurate.  

Since it is a Ruger, you can really put the "magnum" back in 357 magnum.  Most factory 357 Magnum ammo has been downrated since when the cartridge first came out.  Look around and consider some specialty ammo that provides real magnum performance.  I also recommend "heavy" bullets of at least 170 grains, not the ultra-light 125 super fast bullets.

Check out the Buffalo Bore website and their product line...
http://www.buffalobore.com/ammunition/default.htm#357

If you handload, read up on Elmer Keith's thoughts on the 357 Magnum.
I really like the Hornady 180 grain XTP bullets and a lot of Alliant 2400 powder.

Another thing for you to consider is how do you like the single action grip.    Some folks have a real hard time with the traditional single action grip.  It is smooth and suppose to allow the revolver to ride up under recoil in the hand.  Some folks have a hard time consistently gripping it and don't get the accuracy they need.  If that is your problem it should become apparent real quick at the range when you practice.  If so there are target grips, which are much more like a double action grip in shape that help you better control where it is pointing, but don't help as much with recoil absorbtion.

CDNN has some inexpensive checkered grips that are an inexpensive alternative if you are not use to the standard Ruger Blackhawk single action grip.  They can be had for just a few dollars, but whatch out for the minimum charge.

http://www.cdnninvestments.com/woodblacchec.html

I would also suggest, especially with a 6 1/2 inch barrel that you spring for a good holster.  I would actually suggest a shoulder holster.  Of my three Blackhawks, I have installed on one of them a red-dot sight.  I actually prefer the open metal sights most of the time.

Good luck and enjoy your magnum!

[plstrns]

Sounds like a handload .41 mag is up your alley.  I like the .357, never owned a .45 colt but know of the potential.

[crawfish]

Sounds like a handload .41 mag is up your alley. I like the .357, never owned a .45 colt but know of the potential

 :grin:  :grin:  :grin:  Don’t get me started on my baby THE WONDERFUL DO ALL, IS THE FIX TO EVERY HANDGUN PROBLEM, THE MARVELOUS .41 REMINGTON MAGNUM. :wink:  :lol:  

[bigjeepman]

The .45 lc is my favorite caliber but I found out that it is awesome to have a few other calibers to enjoy too. I bought a .357 revolver about six weeks ago and it has been a blast shooting and looking for some good loads for it. I love 'em both but if I could only have one, it would have to be the .45 lc because it's history, size, and versatility as a package is hard to beat.

[crawfish]

ck98 have one just like that NIB. That will change on Saturday, granddaughter wants to take it out to shoot. Going to try to shoot all that have remained un used up to now this weekend, got to get to busting some caps.

[Bullseye]

Oh yes, the 41 Mag.  It is the only Contender caliber that I have two barrels of, a 10"er with a scope and a 10"er without a scope.  Then there is my Marlin 1894FG.  And the Old Model Blackhawk with 5.5" barrel, shucks I walked out of the store without it this summer and it was gone when I went back.

[m-g Willy]

The 357 is the right gun if you think the 44mag. is to brutal. The 45 is the better gun ONLY if you soup it up to 44mag levels. Then you also have the same recoil as the 44. My advise is to shoot the heck out of the 357. After awhile you will be use to the recoil and you can move up to the 44 and hot loaded 45's without to much trouble .Then you have a good excuse to buy( ANOTHER )gun :grin:--Willy

[Somerled]

I'd say get a .45 Colt if reloading is an option. A Ruger Bisley or a Redhawk chambered in .45 Colt can handle some loads far outstripping the factory fodder or any .357 Mag. Of course a 255 grain SWC at about 900 fps does all I want around here without the recoil and powder use.

The .357 does a good job on small game with low-velocity cast bullets. It can also be cranked up for whitetails. It does well on varmints one runs across on the farm and in the woods. I used to load a lot of 125 grain JHPs for that. But I settled on the Hornady 158 grain XTP after some of the 125 grain bullets didn't take down some bigger critters.

[pastorp]

Kysingleshot, For about 25 years a SAA colt in 45 LC was my main carry gun. I loaded 8gr of unique behind a 260gr keith SWC cast bullet. My lyman loading manual claims 847fps for this load. I had no way to verify this during those years. I carried this for defense, used it as a house and truck gun, I also killed several head of big game animals with it as the opportunities presented themselves. I hunted with a rifle but if the shots were close the old colt was up to the job. What I am saying is the only advantage a magnum gives you is range. Within 100 yards the above load shoots completely through a big deer, and a 45 cal. hole bleeds them out real quick. You don't need to hot rod the 45 LC for it to be effective. The above load is comfortable to shoot, so you shoot it well and that is more important than more velocity. If you set up a modest reloading outfit the old girl is inexpensive to shoot, and fun. The high pressure loads do have a place, but 90% of our hunting in the US does not call for them. I would buy the 45 LC, learn to reload, and do all of your hunting before the shot(get close) and you will do fine. Regards, Byron

[Lone Star]

The 45 is the better gun ONLY if you soup it up to 44mag levels.

Wow, where did this pearl of wisdom come from?  Must be from extensive personal experience! :wink:  I guess that means that anything short of .44 Magnum power is less potent than a .357?  Hmmm, what do the 10mm and .41 Mag shooters think?

OTOH, IME mid-level .45LC loads work great for deer-sized game.  The original poster is new to handgun hunting so he most likely has no business shooting at 100 yards, or over 50 yards for that matter. (Apologies if he is an outstanding field/handgun shot.)   A 250-grain bullet - preferably an XTP but a cast SWC works too -  launched at 1000 fps is strong medicine on deer.   These are small big game animals and don't need the power of a .44 Magnum (not that the .44 isn't a great round for them).  The .357 is stretched on deer, but works with good bullets (hard to choose the best) and good shot placement.  The .45 still needs good shot placement of course, but is much less dependent on bullet quality.  

That all said, the .357 may be the best choice for the original poster considering recoil and available factory ammo.

[Old Griz]

Is the 45 colt head and shoulders above the 357 mag?

:cb2: Sure--if you're standing on a box.  

The .357 is probably the most versatile gun you can find. You can kill deer with it with heavy magnum loads, and you can shoot coons/rabbits with mild .38 loads. Then there is also the self protecting aspect with the 125-gr. JHPs.

At the range you can either rattle your fillings with the hot stuff, or teach your wife, girl friend, or daughter to shoot with the mild .38s.

Then if you really want to have some fun out in the woods, get a Marlin 1894 in .38/.357. You don't have to hunt with it (even though you can), but it's just a ton of fun to shoot—and you can use the same ammo in both guns.

Later, if ya still feel like you need more gun, I'd go with the .44 instead of the .45. The .45 is a great round if you reload, but there's more ammo available for the .44 and you can always shoot .44 Specials in it, too.

You made a good choice. There are a lot of deer hanging on folk's walls who died before they ever found out if they were killed by a .45, .44, or .357!  Enjoy your gun!

[WD45]

Dont put to much stock in energy numbers. A bunch of numbers on some paper never killed anything. Even though I like the 45 over all the others the 357 is about the best general woods loafin guns there is. Dont just run out and trade it in on something else ( especially if you're not a handloader ). Pack that thing around and kill some critters with it.
With any handgun you have to learn to match the bullet load combo to the game you are after. Most of the game you will encounter dont need T-REX loads.
By the way... You live anywhere close to the Ballard managent area ?

[Van/TX]

Guess I'm a little confused by the original post.  The gun is to be used as a side arm to carry in the woods of KY.  Carry for what purpose? :wink: The .44 Mag is too brutal.  Too brutal for what? Is the gun to be used for hunting?  You lost me     .....Van

[Lone Star]

The .44 Mag is too brutal.  Too brutal for what? Is the gun to be used for hunting?  You lost me

Try a GPS next time.....

44 mag was a little too brutal for me for general carry

Seems pretty clear to me - his primary use is general carry.  The responses above morphed into the usual hunting talk/debate, but the original question, as clearly stated above, was for general carry.  Hense the poster's decision that the .44 is too brutal for general carry.  Most here would agree with that - and the typical .44 is too large and heavy anyway.  

His choice of the .357 was the right one, IMO anyway.

[Van/TX]

His choice of the .357 was the right one, IMO anyway.

IMO is was also.  Just thought I had missed something with all the hunting debates and stuff about energy and all that :wink: ....Van

[pastorp]

Lonestar, I believe where we got the idea he was interested in hunting as well as general carry was because of his statement in the starting post saying " I found many hunting rounds for the 357 but not the 45". Regards, Byron

[Camel 23]

And, this is the Handgun Hunting forum.