Author Topic: A Blackpowder confession... (Read 1758 times)

Stoots · « **on:** October 02, 2004, 07:59:27 PM »

Gentlemen, I have found the need to tell a small story, to see if it's just me or others have felt this way...

I am 33 and just started hunting about 10 years ago. In the beginning, I had tried just about every weapon there is. I started with compound bows. Then, I went to rifles. Having owned just about every "big" caliber rifle there was, I switched to using handguns. Never really found my 'niche', so to speak.

Several years ago, an old man I worked with invited me to hunt with him on his land. It was the first week of blackpowder season. I didn't own any muzzleloaders, but he was kind enough to let me use his TC Renegade 54. I went to his home the weekend before our hunt to get used to firing this primitive weapon. The first shot seemed to awaken something inside me. Perhaps it was the smell of blackpowder, or the feel of a primitive connection to a past heritage, or maybe because it was a new experience. Whatever it was, I think I was hooked.

The hunt came and went. I sat in that tree stand all that day, in the cold November rain, holding that Renegade. Her classic lines and no-nonsense mechanics appealing to my meticulous nature. Neither of us got a deer that day, but we shared a few laughs and stories on the way to and from the property. It's amazing what you can learn from an old man if you simply shut up and listen...

Today, that Renegade sits proudly in my gun cabinet, a reminder of the day that changed me as an outdoors lover. It sits next to a Hawken in .50 and a Lyman GPR in .50.

I'm still not sure what it was that changed that day. But for me, ever since that first "click-BOOM" sound, I have discovered a new way to hunt. The importance of shot placement, the concentration on aiming, or maybe just knowing our ancestors survived this very same way.

I have since moved to muzzleloaders only. Has anyone else felt this way, or is it just me?

Thanks for letting me ramble,
Jason Stoots

fffffg · « **Reply #1 on:** October 02, 2004, 08:41:54 PM »

i have some comments,, "if God ment us to shoot caplocks you would find them all over the ground."

so in the natural progression of things the next thing is a flintlock.. go to jim chambers websight http://www.flintlocks.com/ and look at some smoothbores and youl find the next logical proceedings.. i shoot a 16 gauge chambers swamped barreled 16 guage smoothbore. the sixteen was used by the french for many years in the charlievill..well after the caplock ws invented.. i will awaken many to arms here, but the 10 guage is too big for general all around use, the ball is absolutly huge.. the 12 is great shotgun but 540 grain ball still is alot to pack around.. the 20 is the most popular and favorite of many for ball but too light for shotgun.. the 16 in a well built gun has enough energy for elk, bear, deer etc. and shotgun will tackle ducks, pheasant, etc.. too small for geese in my book and black powder.. the single shot idea is also tough propositioin for waterfoul and pheasant if you knock them down and they take off.. i think i have the mark silver with an upgraded walnut high grade stock. smooth bore ball is good to 50 yards, smoothbore shotgun is good to 30-35 yards depending on how good you load it.. a little further with advanced loading.. i shot a green wing teal yesterday with my flintlock and i wouldn trade it for the limit with a modern 10 gauge. unexpereinced will say you only shot one duck??? knowlegable hunters who have hunted ducks or shot clays with a flintlock realize what an acomplishment this really is.. so keep collecting bp guns for sure but dont leave out a real quality large lock flint gun.. the large lock and long barrel is really rnessesary for dependable shotgunning and hunting/practice for best results.. you can field dress the flint on half cock in the field with the large locks and get up to 50 rounds on some flints, and they dont need to be changed during the hunt.. have fun and keep up the good work. dave..

quickdtoo · « **Reply #2 on:** October 03, 2004, 04:40:24 AM »

Quote

.... the 20 is the most popular and favorite of many for ball but too light for shotgun..

I must disagree with that part of your statement, I've killed several pheasant with my 20ga NW trade gun using #6 shot 2ff goex, it's a great field gun for it's intented range of less than 25yds. :grin:

Alboy · « **Reply #3 on:** October 03, 2004, 05:24:05 AM »

i CURRENTLY OWN BOTH A 12 & 10 GUGE SXS BP shotguns and am looking forward to my custom 20 gauge fowler this year or next. Have been hunting the 12 since about 81 or 82.

No you are not the only one. It just fits so to speak.

The only time I use modern guns any more is if I am going to have to do a lot of quick shooting such as pest control and herd reduction work, then it is usually a Rem 223 and 40 to 50 shots a day.

For water fowl, the only thing you will concede to modern is speed of reloading. Shot patterns and pellet speed are not a problem. In fact all the cartridge guns still gauge their shell performance to dram equivalent of a black powder charge.

On rifles, in general, any thing over 100 yards probably should be passed on. This is true for the majority of modern shooters also and does not reflect the weapons capabilities as much as the operators. That said, with practice and confidence there are those that can hit it if they can see it.

1000 yard matches were a great past time and hard competition a few years back. You have to know the weapon and what she does.

swecology · « **Reply #4 on:** October 03, 2004, 05:26:15 AM »

Yes, I do understand.

I built my first muzzleloader last winter, and shot it once. It re-ignited what I felt as a 14 year old boy when I tried a freind's muzzleloader.

This spring and summer have been spent dealing with a herniated disc in my back and recovery from the resulting surgery. Every day is different, usually improving but not quite up to full speed. I will occasionally take out that Lyman 50 cal. GPR and look at it. I want to shoot it so badly, but I'm biding my time until I'm healed enough to feel comfortable doing it. I don't want to re-injure the disc. Every day, though, it tugs at me a little more, in a different way than my centerfires do.

I put in for my first BP hunt this month, and I'm waiting to see if I get drawn (I'm in Az.) for the Spring. If I do, it will be the completion of the healing, and the start of a new cycle. If not, I'll have to find another "marker".

That click-boom hooked me when I was a kid, and I fullfilled a dream just by getting the firearm built and working this year. There is something simplistic and primal about it, that cannot be found by looking through a scope and feeding metallic cartridges.

crow_feather · « **Reply #5 on:** October 03, 2004, 12:44:40 PM »

Stoots,
Quite a few people feel as you, they just can't put it quite as elegantly. There is more to shooting black powder than just shooting a rifle. It is the reliving of history, the self-imposed handicap of only one shot, and the feeling that you will never be closer to your ancesters than when seeking game with a black powder weapon at your side.

The sound of a black powder rifle firing is the one sound that makes me think there may be something to reincarnation.

C F

lostid · « **Reply #6 on:** October 03, 2004, 12:49:36 PM »

Well writen Jason Stoots.

yup, I know the feeling too. The entire aspect of traditional bp shooting, brings you so much closer to a sence of personal accomplishment.
It's fun. I think the only thing that compares is "long bow". nun of the gadgets,,nun of the crap,,just you the weapon and the hunt. it brings back that basic challenge.
I don't mean ta "dog" anything, but Savage 10 ml,,plastic tipped pistol bullets in sabots,and "special" seasons. Have kinda taken that away haven't they?

But, Then again, they haven't really have they?? It's up to you,,
Welcome to "sport",,,,and a knowing welcome to the feeling,,,,,,

zrifleman · « **Reply #7 on:** October 03, 2004, 05:00:39 PM »

I second all of the feelings you guys expressed. My first traditional muzzleloader was purchased about 33 yrs ago and I still get the same excitement today as then. At the range or in the woods the BP rifle just feels "right". I have 3 deer tags in NY that I am going to try to fill with my half stock,percussion rifle loaded with blackpowder. You "in-liners ought to give it a try, you don't know what you are missing!

Birddog6 · « **Reply #8 on:** October 03, 2004, 10:51:01 PM »

Jason, very well spoken. I started shooting traditional ML's in the 70's mainly because I was always impressed by the mountain men & the mere fact they survived & how they did so. About 20 years ago I shot my first flintlock, and since that day it is practically all I have shot & it is all I build.

For me, hunting with a flintlock is an exceptional experience, and taking game with them is truely rewarding . I have hunted with allot of dif. firearms in 37 years of hunting, but nothing compares to the enjoyment of what I have with flintlocks. It is very challenging & very rewarding for me & I am always disappointed to see a hunting season end & always look forward to the new season..

Hope you continue to enjoy the sport.

Birddog6

www.custommuzzleloaders.com

remroller · « **Reply #9 on:** October 04, 2004, 02:59:42 AM »

Every year our local gun club plays host to the area Boy Scouts . They camp at the club . On Saturday they are broken up in to small groups ,and put through a safety course first. They are then taken to differnt parts of the club to shoot a variety of guns . I was working the muzzle loader range , and had both flint & caplock rifles for them to shoot. To make a long a story short They did not want to leave the flintlock to go to the next station. It was a .32 cal and I loaded almost 2 pounds of powder through it that day. There were fathers along with thier sons , and when all the scouts were through they kept coming back to shoot the Flinter one more time. At supper that evening most of the talk among the scouts was about shooting that cool old gun. Don't know how many converts we got that day,but I am sure we sparked interest it several.

Glanceblamm · « **Reply #10 on:** October 04, 2004, 03:31:25 AM »

Would like to "third" those feelings.
Got started in 1981. Will never forget that first hunt or talking to the wide eyed neighbooring hunters about it latter. What-cha shooting over there, they said. Sounded like the hillside went an detonated!

That very first Deer caught one of those .50 cal T/C Maxi-balls through the lungs at 65yds. Talk about perfect cookie cutter holes!. I decided that this was way too much power and have taken an additional 18 Deer since using 80gr dbl-f and the patched round ball.

I come from the old school that condemed putting a jacketed pistol bullet in the muzzle loader. At that time reports were of running, unrecovered deer. The good advice was to throw away those damn pistol bullets and utilize the full diameter of the bore. Still makes sense today.

I really appreciate seeing these post's (Thanks Graybeard) and appreciate any info that your clubs have on their public shoots.

Longcruise · « **Reply #11 on:** October 04, 2004, 07:33:24 AM »

I took up the ml gun in '75 just because it seemed like it would be interesting and different. Git the .50 TC Hawken that was so popular then and learned everything I needed to know about shooting bp from the little handbook that came with it.Up to then most of my hunting was with a bow. I still hunt a lot with the bow too but most of my game since .74 has been killed with ml guns.

But I still love to shoot modern firearms and especially love milsurp guns. Even thos that rap of multi rounds without shoving anything down the bore!

I also love to hunt with the milsurps and consider them a whole new challenge.

OTOH, when i enter a match it's almost always a ml match and when i look down the barrel of my ml on a hunt it's always loaded with a patched round ball

BTW, some might have seen my thread on the Deer Creek Rifle. Here are the results of a hunt several weeks ago with that same gun. Not sure why so many guys think they need 300 plus grain bullets for deer when a simple ball does the job so well. Maybe this will crank up you guys who have not been out yet this year :grin:

JPSaxMan · « **Reply #12 on:** October 04, 2004, 12:01:01 PM »

Wow...kinda weird how we went from muzzleloading to shotgun bores then back again. Anyway, I'm more or less brand new to muzzleloading (almost a year now I think), and I've gone through 2 muzzleloaders. My first muzzleloader was a CVA Silver Trophy Hunter bought for $160. The gun seemed alright at first but then other stuff started to happen. Every 5th or 6th shot a ball had to be pulled, accuracy sucked, and it just felt weak. It was a synthetic stocked gun and I'll admit; I loved that on that gun. But it just felt flimsy. One day I bought a kit by TC that will allow you to mount a sling on the gun by replacing one of the barrel couplings. Well, the screw that was used to tighten it fell out and I lost a major and microscopic part in the grass on the way to the range. At that moment, I decided not to go hunting with that gun this year. About a month later, I went down to the gunshop and ordered a Traditions Hawken; Flintlock and .50 cal. I got it a month later. It shoots great, and I only had one problem; the barrel wedge got bent (somehow :eek: ). But accuracy still is beautiful and the gun just shoots great. I'll be happy to go hunting with my new Hawken. And by the way, I've heard of guys killing ducks at 60 yds with a 20 gauge stoked in 3" HeviShot.

Jerry/PA · « **Reply #13 on:** October 05, 2004, 07:32:15 AM »

Hi Jason, thanks for rambling.

That sort of rambling does the soul good!

I've done much the same as you, working through various centerfires, various handgun hunting, and I even tried the Marlin Lever Actions. They do have "some" nostalgia that does take me a certain distance...

Now that I built my first "traditional" frontstuffer, I'm hopelessly into BP.

Lot's of my hunting buddies locally have gone over to the inlines. They kinda pity me for sticking to the flinter. I've tried to tell them what they're missing, but they just don't understand.

Anyway, it does me some good to realize that there are others, like you'all, who feel the mystique.

Regards to all,

Ironsights Jerry in Southwestern Pennsylvania.

indian*dave · « **Reply #14 on:** October 05, 2004, 04:05:26 PM »

Jason , I know exactly how you feel. I too have come full circle with the powder guns. I started shooting back in the early 70's with a old long rifle, even before NC had any BP seasons. So I was ahead of the game when we got a BP season. I hunted for a number of years with an old 45cal. long rifle with steel sights. Then I got a 45cal. Hawken and continued to hunt with open sight when practically everybody was putting scopes on their rifles. I just couldn't ugly up my Hawken by putting a scope on it. When the in-line crazy hit I too got bit and have hunted the last several years strickly with in-line 50 cal. Knight. Two years ago I lost my son and hunting partner to a car wreck. I haven't done any hunting since . Last March I bought a 32 cal. squirrel rifle and I have spent most of the summer shooting it. With it I have awakened that old feeling I use to have when I hunted with the Hawken. So I have sort of come full circle or seen the light. I don't know if I'll deer hunt this year but if I do it will be with my old Hawken. I for sure will sure scare a few squirrels with the long rifle. I discovered a long time ago it is not the kill that important but the joy of the hunt. My winter project is going to be building a flintlock and then I will have completed the journey. And yes it does do a body good to ramble once and awhile.

JPSaxMan · « **Reply #15 on:** October 05, 2004, 04:21:14 PM »

Dave, I'm sorry to hear about your loss :cry: . I hope I never have to bury my child (when that time comes). I just have my Hawken and nuttin else...for now :twisted:

Stoots · « **Reply #16 on:** October 06, 2004, 01:03:43 PM »

Thanks fellas for the replies and compliments, writing is just a side hobby...

Dave, I too am very sorry about your loss. I hope that you will return to the woods someday and find comfort there.

Jason

KING · « **Reply #17 on:** October 06, 2004, 03:52:04 PM »

:-D For what it is worth my friend I got bit by that bug when I was ten years old. It never seems to get old,and all I can think of is all the new old toys I can get.stay safe............King

m-g Willy · « **Reply #18 on:** October 08, 2004, 02:17:48 PM »

STAY AWAY FROM FLINTLOCKS!!!! After 40 some years of shooting everything and loving my handguns for hunting and plinking I made a mistake of watching the movie The Patriot. Sooooo, I picked up a Penn. FLINTLOCK! It's a drug !!!! I had to make a powder horn . then I needed to learn how to knapp a flint so it would fire EVERY TIME! Needed to learn how to hold the sight picture for a micro second longer with the flash in the pan going off. As much as I love handguns I find myself grabbing the flinter more often then not now when I head out to the woods. It's addictive, :shock: I can't get away from flintlocks, I noticed they are breeding in my gun safe now. (hope the wife dosn't notice the increse in guns in there :eek: ) Now I have to build a flintlock, I've got a few ideas I want on a new rifle,( RIFLE-S-?) :roll: :wink: I feel like a kid with his first BB gun or his first 22 :roll: --Willy

JPSaxMan · « **Reply #19 on:** October 08, 2004, 02:27:55 PM »

Them flintlocks purebred, Willy?

And if they're given honest-to-goodness home cookin...I'll take one. Any price :roll: .

D.E.C · « **Reply #20 on:** October 08, 2004, 03:30:34 PM »

HEY, JUST HOW DO YOU KNAP A FLINT?

crow_feather · « **Reply #21 on:** October 08, 2004, 03:44:44 PM »

Simple, Take a flint and put it on the floor. Hollar "NAP FLINT" "NAP FLINT" and your flint should go to sleep. By the way, "nap" isn't spelled with a "K".

C F

D.E.C · « **Reply #22 on:** October 08, 2004, 03:51:30 PM »

YELLING "NAP" DONT WORK ON MY KIDS AND IT AINT GOING TO PUT AN EDGE ON A WORN FLINT EITHER. AS FOR THE SPELLING, I WENT TO PUBLIC SCHOOLS.

crow_feather · « **Reply #23 on:** October 08, 2004, 05:32:14 PM »

Oh! That knap. (never worked on my kids neither)

C F

m-g Willy · « **Reply #24 on:** October 10, 2004, 11:20:47 AM »

EXCUSSSEE ME!!! :oops: KNAP? KNAPP? NAP? duh? Don't chek ma spel'n I wen to pblick skols to :roll: --Willy

m-g Willy · « **Reply #25 on:** October 11, 2004, 05:47:31 PM »

[ quote="D.E.C"]HEY, JUST HOW DO YOU KNAP A FLINT?[/quote] Are you kidding me? :shock: Ya don't know how to knapp a flint? :roll: www.geocities.com/knappersanonymous/ :wink: --Willy

toecutter · « **Reply #26 on:** October 12, 2004, 03:13:33 AM »

Longcruise,
It's good to see that your nice piece of handiwork hunts as well as it shoots!! congrats

S.S. · « **Reply #27 on:** October 12, 2004, 07:04:35 AM »

My first experience with a Muzzle loader was actually my first experience with a Firearm. I was probably no more than ten years old and had seen a picture of a matchlock in a book at school. Two or three weeks later
I had a working handgun of about .32 caliber. I had no powder or shot so I had to improvise. The shot came from an old paper 12 ga. shell.
00 buck I think. The powder from the shell wouldn't burn so I opened a few fire crackers and "Eureaka"! The makings of one of the nicest
"SPANKINGS" I ever received as a child!
I have no Idea what kind of pressure that powder created, but when the
match cord touched it off in made quite a bit of racket! The little lead ball
punched through the piece of plywood I aimed at, bounced off a concrete block, dented our metal storage building and then departed up through
the limbs and leaves of our neighbors oak tree.
Well the owner of said Oak tree was in a swing on their back porch
and was really not as impressed with me as I was with Myself!
Out the back door comes my mother, neighbor snitched on me,
my prize handgun is removed from my now nervous hands and I was told to go inside! We all know what happened next, But I have been hooked
on muzzle loading every since !

D.E.C · « **Reply #28 on:** October 12, 2004, 04:30:01 PM »

M-G WILLY: I RECENTLY BUILT MY 1ST. FLINTER FROM A GPR KIT. LOOKS GOOD, SHOOTS GREAT BUT NO, I DON'T KNOW HOW TO KNAP A FLINT.

m-g Willy · « **Reply #29 on:** October 13, 2004, 02:34:11 PM »

Quote from: D.E.C

M-G WILLY: I RECENTLY BUILT MY 1ST. FLINTER FROM A GPR KIT. LOOKS GOOD, SHOOTS GREAT BUT NO, I DON'T KNOW HOW TO KNAP A FLINT.

Well,,, you really can't knapp a flint :cry: So what you should do is once they get dull you can send them to me and I will dispose of them for you :lol: Just kidding, :lol: check out the knappers site --Willy