kevin .303 i have a ?

[TrapperZach]

we have a british .303 enfield  it has been sporterized and is very accurate the best i can figure its made in1942 but dont understand. if you can give me any info or tell me how to read the hall marks.

[kevin.303]

For quick ID on what model it is, you can tell by looking at the rear sight. If it is a ladder type sight placed half way down the barrel you have a No.1 MK 3*. The * means it was made after changes to the design where made in 1916 to streamline production. If your rear sight is a peep sight on the rear of the receiver, you have No.4 MK 1 or MK 2. These rifles are also referred to as a SMLE or Short Magazine Lee Enfield. This doesn't mean that the magazine is short, but that the barrel is shorter than the No.1 MK 1 Long Lee. If your rifle has a conical flash suppressor than you have a No. 5, more commonly known as a "Jungle Carbine". Flip up the bolt handle and take a look at the collar band above the trigger guard this should tell you the country, arsenal, model, and year of manufacture. For example on my No.1 MK 3 we see;

MA
LITHGOW
SMLE
III*
1941

here’s what that all means

MA- Made in Australia
LITHGOW- the government arsenal in Lithgow assembled this rifle
SMLE- Short Magazine Lee Enfield
III*- a SMLE incorporating the modifications of 1916
1941- year of manufacture

I believe a No.4 would look something like this;

CANADA
LONGBRANCH
NO4MK2(T)
1945


I’m not to sure about that, someone else here can verify it. Note the “T” after the model number. This does not appear on all No.4’s, but ones that where set aside for their accuracy and mounted with a Mk. 82 telescopic sight. Sometimes it won’t always note what country it is made in so here’s a fairly accurate list of arsenals and where they’re located (I think)

No.1 MK 3

Enfield- Enfield Small Arms Factory, England. Birthplace of the Lee-Enfield.

BSA- Birmingham Small Arms Factory, England. fairly accurate, well built.

Maltby- Maltby Arsenal, England.

Ishapore- Ishapore Small Arms Factory, India. General opinion of these rifles is that they’re junk. Some are good, I owned a Parker-Hale sporting conversion that was a tack driver at 200 yards.

Lithgow- Lithgow arsenal, Australia. Thought to be the most accurate of the Lee-Enfield family. My personal favorite. Very well built rifles. Some heavy barrel models built in the 1920’s are still popular for long range shooting to this day.

No.4 MK1/MK2

Enfield- Enfield Small Arms Factory, England.

BSA- Birmingham Small Arms Factory, England.

Longbranch- Longbranch Arsenal, Canada. My national heritage.

Savage- Savage Arms Company, USA. Some dealers will charge more for these rifles because people think that because they are made in the US they’re worth more. Not true.

I know there’s one or two more but forgot them at this moment. The No.5 Jungle Carbine was only made at the Fazackerly Arsenal, so if someone tries to sell you one and it’s not stamped “FAZ”, they’re lying.

I’ll have more info later on. Hope this helps.

Kevin
 

[kevin.303]

hers part of a magazine article i wrote on hunting with milsurps. if anyones interested i can post he rest of the article in a day or two.

The Lee-Enfield

            First accepted into the commonwealth armies in 1888, the cock-on-closing turn bolt action designed by James Paris Lee has stood the test of time. First introduced as the Lee-Metford and later redesigned in 1902 as the Lee-Enfield, it proved it self in the trenches of the first world war and went on to serve in WW2 and Korea, being retired as a sniper rifle in the mid ninetie's. Chambered in .303 British these fast cycling rifles are considered to be adequate for almost all North American big game, with the exception of grizzly and polar bears. Also known as the Short Magazine Lee-Enfield or SMLE (or smelly by its detractors), they first appeared on the market in the early sixties and sold for as little as $20, and they are some of the most common and popular military rifles around. The No.1 MK3 is the most common model and where manufactured through out the commonwealth, with the best rifles coming from the Australian Lithgow arsenal and the Enfield small arms factory. Some think that the Indian manufactured Lee’s are inaccurate and poorly made, but this is more a case of individual rifles and they should not be considered as all bad. The No.4 MK2 is similar in appearance to the No.1 MK3, the most noticeable difference being the receiver-mounted micrometer adjustable rear sight on the No.4 compared to the barrel mounted range adjustable only sight on the No.1 MK3. In most cases the rifles will already have had the forestock cutdown, which lightens it by a few pounds.

         I will only briefly mention the No.5 MK1 “jungle carbine” because they aren’t as common as the other variants and are more sought after by collectors which in turn drives the price up. They appear vastly different with a sporter-style stock, flash suppressor and rear mounted sight. Another popular variant is the Parker & Hale sporting conversions. I bought one of these fine guns last year and was impressed with the parkerized finish and the Monte Carlo stock. It was already mounted with a weaver K4 and I only paid $100 Cdn. They all utilize a ten round detachable magazine and parts such as the buttstock and trigger guards are interchangeable between all three major variants. Care should be taken when loading the magazine as the .303 is a rimmed case and improper stacking can cause the bolt to jam when trying to close the action. Safety Note; the .303 British and the .303 Savage are two completely different cartridges and you should never attempt to substitute one for the other. Stripper clips help with fast loading and are very cheap at gun shows. Often you will find a bandoleer of 50 rounds of surplus ammo with strippers attached for under $25. Due to the fact that the rifling has a left-handed twist I recommend that a one-piece cleaning rod be used because the 3-piece screw together type is made with right-hand threads and will come apart in the barrel. Some Lee-Enfield’s have been rechambered to .308, .45-70 and .45 ACP, and there are also popular wildcats in Australia based on necking down the .303 case. All of the major ammo companies make loads in this caliber with 150 and 180 grain loads most common and reloading dies and components are easily available.

[TrapperZach]

k i took the bolt out and didint seen any writing in there. but it has a latter type site and there are some numbers and stuff on the barrel behing the site i can later list them if it would help.

[kevin.303]

odd, yes, list what ever markings you can find.

[Mikey]

TrapperZach:  if your SMLE has markings on the rearmost stock band, which you can see if you lift up the bolt handle as though cocking the rifle, it is a #1 Mk111.  If it has the rear sight mounted to the barrel, it is a #1 Mk111.  

If the markings are found on the left side of the action on a forward most flat spot, and if it has an adjustable rear peep sight with ladder elevations, it is a #4 Mk1.  If it has a 'T' marking anywhere near the Model, it was a sniper.  

If yours is marked 1942, it is most likely a #4 Mk1.  The other markings kevin .303 referenced should be near the date stamp.  

Anyhow, shoot the thing and enjoy it.  HTH.  Mikey.

[TrapperZach]

all the folowing marks and numbers ore on the back end of the barrel where it starts to get fat right befor the bolt the breach i think it would be.

this is all on the left side of the barrel.
MA
V11

A
V1

l
arow pointing up
4
another arrow


3    55


A  up arow   F

left arow
backwards b 2 #


left ways MA
             V11         V1  


butterfly with two crosed flags underneath it with a p under it

R
X
L
with 3 holes driled together crossed over


now on right side of barrel

F.T.R
   E
     
      1
853

  E
8531

1 beside 7 point start

roman number 2 beside 7 point star

roman numiral 3 beside 7 point star

and on the bolt theres a large M



on the orear site they stamped a MA54



now on the very back of the gun behing the bolt holder infront of the shoulder stock the last pice of metal twards the end of the gun.

theres
51266

then a
o

6
  3

M

and on left side of it  M.A.55
 
right side

MA
ITHGOW
S.M.L.E
roman numer 3 *
1942

and

on thrigger thes a 7 point star wit a in it on right side of trigger
aand on left side theres a BA

on clip theres a
OA
and
4


and on the but plate it has a cleaning rod holder with flip door.

[kevin.303]

so you have the same thing i do, just one year newer. BA and OA refer to Bathurst and Orange Arsenals, they where smaller factories that made parts for Lithgow. are you goin to hunt with this rifle anytime soon?

[TrapperZach]

come nov 20 how much is it worth

[kevin.303]

up here a cut down SMLE is worth $80, $40 if the mag is missing. numrich is selling sets of full wood for $65 US, so after christmas i might order one and restore my 1917 BSA

[TrapperZach]

whyd you ask if i would be huntin with it soon?

[kevin.303]

just curious, you said you where having trouble finding ammo. is that PMC stuff soft point? cabela's has Sellier & Belliot as well as PMP, but i've heard very few good things said about PMP.

[kevin.303]

FTR means it was rearsenaled after the war. here's a site that should tell you everything about the little benchmarks and cartouches.

http://www.skennerton.com/index.html

[kevin.303]

a little late to ask, but did you have any luck last season? i crapped out, hope to do better this year with my .30-40 Krag

[S.B.]

we have a british .303 enfield  it has been sporterized and is very accurate the best i can figure its made in1942 but dont understand. if you can give me any info or tell me how to read the hall marks.

Don't know that this will help but, check out this website under Enfield Articles for some info on sporterized Enfields:  http://www.webpages.uidaho.edu/~stratton/en-page.html