Seeking a chambering....

[JPH45]

I've decided to deepsix my 45-70 barrel, so I can take the underlug and weld it to another barrel. Question is where do I want to go?

I fired some Winchester USA brand 44 Mag 240 grain soft points today. Reminded me why I don't like heavy recoilers. A nice thump, my 30-30 aint as bad. Those loads pushing 1730 fps let you know you pulled the trigger.

Kinda leaves me in limited territory. I know that if what I build recoils heavy, I won't use it. I've been thinking about something on the level of a 35 Remington, but I got a 357 Max, so whats the point? A 7.62x39 could be interesting, but I have a 30-30....

For a long time, I had designs on a 375 of some sort, a 375 JDJ, or 375 Winchester, a wildcat 375-08, but I know that in the end the rifle will beat the crap out of me, and I just ain't interested today. I was thinking most recently about rechambering my 44 to 445 Super Mag, same problem. Besides, I like my nice quite low recoil 265 grain cast at a sedate 1275 fps.

I begin to lean toward something like a 257 Roberts, perhaps even a 7-30 Waters, but I have a strong love affair with casting my own. I ain't no expert on that subject, but I enjoy casting and shooing my own, So I begin to wonder about something on the order of a 308x1.5, perhaps even a 308/35x1.5

I'm open to suggestions. I've beenshooting for a number of years and at one time or another have shot most everthing at least once. The only 3 cartridges I can say I have been in love with are the 45 ACP, 30-06 and the 45-70.

A 16 or 18" 45 ACP Handi could be interesting, but it would be limited to target shooting only. Yeah, it could be used to deer hunt, perfect shots at 30 yards or less and very illegal. Not I. But I won't right that chambering off yet.

I am not a fan big fan of high pressure bottle neck cases.

Maybe the best way to get there is this......

I want readily available or easily made brass.  A 200 grain bullet at 2000 fps or so is about all the juice I want or need.

I sit looking at this and think over and again "Sounds like a 35 Remington JP"   I'm gonna post this and ask for you guys suggestions. I'm getting nowhere on my own.

[jeff223]

how about a 41mag or a 44-40

[handirifle]

JPH
You mentioned a good one and passed right over it.  The 375 Winchester.  I have a model 94 Big Bore in 375 and can tell you factory 200gr loads don't kick much more than my handi 30-30.  Very close.  

The recoil is about the same as my Marlin 35 Rem was with 200gr loads.

If you can get a barrel in 375 Win go for it.

My second choice would be the 35 Rem.  Recoil is only slightly more than 30-30.

[JPH45]

Thanks Handi, I was concerned that even the 375 may recoil more than I want, but adding in 38-55 level loads it may be a LOT more versatile than it would on first glance appear. I'll give it another, closer look.

[handirifle]

The upside is NEF makes a 38-55 barrel.  Uses different bullets but you said you wanted to cast your own and that is just the ticket for the 38-55.  Don't know about the Handi's rifling type or twist rate in the 38-55.

[Fred M]

Deleted

[Mac11700]

That's funny....same thing David White says he does..........

Mac

[Fred M]

Eh Mac
Who is David White? If he does jobs like that he could turn out some nice 6PPC, 6BR, 7BR, 30BR  8MMBR 250 Sav, 257 Roberts. 6x47, 22Fireball,
25Fireballl there is no end to the goodies.

[jbtazgrabber]

plese dont 6 the 4570 barrel ill trade you a lug and some cash for the barrel or     ill give you a lug and loan you my 44 reamer to make your 44 a 445 super and throw in some brass with a load for 2100 fps 200 gr xtp that wont thump your sholder.....

[Badnews Bob]

Give a look at a .357/44 Bain and Davis or maybe a.41GNR both would be easy to make out of a .357 barrel. :roll:

[fish280]

hmmm ... 200-grain bullet at 2,000 fps.
how about bagging another .30-30 barrel and rechambering to 30-40 krag? or go .30-30 AI.
the krag case easily would give you 200-220 grainers at 2,000. that's what it was designed for.
i'm thinking the 30-30 ai could do the same with easy pressures, and be a much easier re-chamber.
either one would handle factory ammo to boot.

[c_latrans]

Just a suggestion from a newbie here, but......  You might consider having a 357 barrel rechambered to 357 Herrett.  If you are not familiar with this round, it is a 30-30 case shortened to 1 1/2 inches, neck opened up to 358 and the shoulders blown out.  Dies are readily available and 30-30 brass is plentiful and cases are easy to form.  I just bought an old Lyman mold on ebay that will cast a 204 grain round nose bullet.  Using wheel weights like I do will probably drop a bullet that weighs between 210 and 215 grains.  Or you can use gas checked bullets for a little more velocity.  Being new to the world of Handi rifles I may be speaking out of turn, but I would thing that this would be a simple procedure to rechamber a barrel and the pressure should be well with int tolerances of the Handi rifle.  Dale

[JPH45]

plese dont 6 the 4570 barrel ill trade you a lug and some cash for the barrel or     ill give you a lug and loan you my 44 reamer to make your 44 a 445 super and throw in some brass with a load for 2100 fps 200 gr xtp that wont thump your sholder.....

We need to talk, my email is john_haxton@yahoo.com drop me line

[Fred M]

Thanks Handirifle.
What I have in mind is to get a light Handi of any sort, and have a 25cal barrel sleeved on it and chamber it for the 25 Hunter. I have a reamer for this caliber,dies and bullets and cases.

This particular cartridge in a tuned handy would really make a nice light deer and walking varmint rifle and could be subjected to being kicked around in a jeep. I would also be real happy with a Handi in 250 Sav Imp.

[De41mag]

JPH;

How about a 303 British AI. It's a rimmed cartridge also.
Just a suggestion.

Dennis  

[jbtazgrabber]

sorry the 303 is a 311 bullrt way to much prusser in a 308 bore   but the 30 40 krag is outstanding   almost as good as the 06 but no case problems   its rimmed        the 762    39 is semi rimmed but i didnt have any trouble in the h&r barrel i had  but i had to handload with 308 bullets.....you wouldnt want to shoot factory 311 out of it       h&r barrels are 308 barrels i have a 311 barrel 4 a h&r but its chamberd 4 the 762 25 round   and its octagon

[handirifle]

J-milner
I guess I'll have to make real sure I don't like the available calibers before I jump on that one.

Frem,
Welcome.  I think that might be your ticket.  Get the calibers you have experience with and a better quality barrel in a "kick around" gun.  kinda what handi's are made for.  Too bad they won't sell barrel blanks, or find someone that will make custom barrels.

Hmmmm, I wonder, if there is any truth to the rumor that rossi makes their barrels, would Rossi make custom calibers that the handi can handle?

Someone out there SHOULD be able to do this.  they do it for the TC and I cannot see how the Handi recievers can be that much different from each other, but then again, I am not a machinist either.

[jbtazgrabber]

We need to talk, my email is john_haxton@yahoo.com drop me line

pm sent

[Longcruise]

I've decided to deepsix my 45-70 barrel, so I can take the underlug and weld it to another barrel.

Well, if you do whack the lug off that barrel it could have a fine home with me! :grin:   It would be fun to convert it to a "45-70" muzzleloader with a sidelock8).  Would be a wonderful thick cover ml slug gun with 350 or 400 grain conicals.



Let me know if you intend to whack it!!

[MSP Ret]

Don't cut that barrel!!! JPH45 and jbtazgrabber please get together and work something out!!! There are many here that have something else less worthy to cut up, myself included. JPH45, If it does not work out with jbtazgrabber PLEASE get in touch with me by PM or e-mail. We should be able to work something out if things fall apart between you and  jbtazgrabber!!!  Thanks for listening....<><.... :grin:


If you looking for suggestions of what custom barrel to reweld that barrel lug on (after the trade with jbtazgrabber or me, but  only if he declines), Here are my suggestions. I have lusted after a .35 Remington Handi for a long time, but even more classic, a .348 Winchester would be a real winner, and it is a rimmed cartridge. I have dies and brass for my original Model 71 in .348 and that is one great gun and great classic caliber!!!

JPH45, please let me know the outcome if you would. If the deal with jbtazgrabber does not materialize and you decide to go with the .348 I have some brass that I could throw in with the deal....

[M@$ter$h@ke]

I have a 7.62x39 rifle with a 30 round mag i barely feel the recoil when i fire it, Its a good gun.

[jbtazgrabber]

hey long cruse the only problem trying to mack a muzzy out of 4570 is finding a udersize bullet to drive down the bore  unless your making a brechloader... bulets are larger than bore on rifles but chambers are larger than bores ,,, bit muzzysuse smaller than bore size bullet s unless you order a mold it would me hard to make work

[Longcruise]

hey long cruse the only problem trying to mack a muzzy out of 4570 is finding a udersize bullet to drive down the bore unless your making a brechloader... bulets are larger than bore on rifles but chambers are larger than bores ,,, bit muzzysuse smaller than bore size bullet s unless you order a mold it would me hard to make work

All real problems but not insurmountable.  I guess in my mind surmounting the problems is part of the fun of such a project.

I have a mold on hand now that pops out a .456 385 grain bullet with wheel weights.  would probably come down to .455 or .4555 if cast out of pure lead.  No matter, a custom mold would be a simple thing and not that expensive from an outfit like Mountain Moulds.

A portion of the chamber would be cut off and the breech face trued up leaving about .6 or .5 inch of the chamber to thread for the breach plug.  Would probably have to drill the remaining chamber in order to get the correct breech plug size to fit.  Filing to round and cleaning up the area where the lug was cut off is no problem.  I've got a nice piece of walnut for the stock and several locks, one of which should do.

Need to purchase:  Butt plate, tirg guard, under lugs to pin the barrel, some bolts and screws, probably a breech plug with tang if can't make myself, an underrib.

Need to make:  Trigger and trigger plate, ramrod thimbles, ramrod and sights.

[jbtazgrabber]

im loven it somebody eles is unique like me...never say never...... but my lack of a bank accout does usally say NEVER for me..

[handirifle]

longcruise,
If that mold is a bit small put some automotive polishing compound on a bullet cast from that mold and turn it with a drill to "open" it up a bit.

[jbtazgrabber]

pm seht with a offer???did you get it???

[JPH45]

Sorry it took so long to figure this out Jb, I'm gonna hang on to the barrel for a time yet, at least through deer season, I appreciate your offer, it was certainly fair enough. Again, please excuse me for taking so long to make up my mind. Thanks, JP

[Longcruise]

If that mold is a bit small put some automotive polishing compound on a bullet cast from that mold and turn it with a drill to "open" it up a bit.

Hadn't thought of enlarging the mold.  Even though undersize it shoots nicely out of my Win '85 hi wall.  Go figger.

One reason that it may be a bit undersize is it has two layers of midway dropout on it :oops:   Never bothered to clean it off :eek:

Which brings up the use of Dropout to reduce the as cast size of a mold if needed or desired :shock:

[JPH45]

I too have noticed that if I allow my midway dropout to build out I will get undersize bullets. Usually I get sewveral casting sessions before bullets start to get sticky again, I just take spray carb cleaner and a rag to clean it out. Wonder if the opposite will work, can you take mold release and spray it on bullets and make 'em bigger :wink: I need to do something to bump up some 250 grain 45's I have so I can shoot 'em in the 45-70.

By the by, did anyone ever try sabots and either 40 cal or 375 cal bullets in their 45-70?

[Longcruise]

I need to do something to bump up some 250 grain 45's I have so I can shoot 'em in the 45-70.

Are you trying to take .452 or .454's up?  I did try some .454's in my 45-70 but did not size them up and they were not that great.  In my attempt I used a small amount of 231 and pushed the slugs all the way down into the case on top of the powder.  I used mild 45 LC data.  Results were not worth pursueing   The .454 is just too small without some help.  I have used teflon tape to up the diameter of some ML slugs and maybe that would work :shock:

By the by, did anyone ever try sabots and either 40 cal or 375 cal bullets in their 45-70?

Yup, the .375's would not fit the sabots I used (blue Hornady ML .45 cal sabots for .358 bullet).  I tried to load a .375 ML cap and ball bullet slug.  Too big.  Had some success with the .358 bullets.  You can read about it at http://willowlake.business.directnic.com/45-70_fun.htm  There is more to be done with this.  My efforts only scratched the surface.  Mainly need to try some different powders.