Author Topic: Crazy hunter story already getting slanted  (Read 2469 times)

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Offline willysjeep134

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« on: November 23, 2004, 03:33:46 AM »
I was watching my ABC news ticker right when the story about that crazy minnesota hunter going berserk broke. The original article said he had a "7.62 mm SKS, a common hunting rifle in Wisconsin". Now that the story has had some time to ferment it has become, according to ABC "A high powered assult rifle with a 20 round clip".

FIrst of all, they are beginning to villify the rifle, not the whacko shooter.

Second of all, they don't know their ear from their arse apparently when talking about firearms. A 20 round clip wouldn't fit in the average 10 round SKS magazine. It is a common mistake, to use the terms interchangeably, but they are diferent things. I don't say "I got a flat rim on my car last week", because it isn't the correct term.

I can only see this story sparking more hatred against hunters, and more laws banning this and that "for our own good"

After all, I'm sure if this guy had a single shot .410 it would still be an assult weapon to some. It makes me sick when slanted news sources twist tragic storys into their own political agenda.

I think I might go out and buy an SKS before they too are banned.
If God wanted plastic stocks he would have made plastic trees.

Offline magooch

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #1 on: November 23, 2004, 04:20:49 AM »
This is SOP for the media.  I'm glad I've got all the SKSes I want, because I'm sure the "gungrabbers" will put them at the top of their list now.
Swingem

Offline Robert

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I agree about the media but not about the mag..
« Reply #2 on: November 23, 2004, 04:59:44 AM »
The mags are easily interchangeable. I switched mine back to a factory 10 rnd fixed mag.  It came to me with a detachable 30 rnd, and I can change it back to the 30 rnd in about 5 minutes.
....make it count

Offline Jack Crevalle

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #3 on: November 23, 2004, 08:17:05 AM »
My favorite is an ABC spin that the shooter is a Hmoung and that the Hmoung don't have the concept of private hunting property. I guess just trying to imply that this is some kind of cultural misunderstanding.

Fine, I say he gets assimulated starting with an American tradition: Old Sparky.

Offline Shorty

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #4 on: November 23, 2004, 09:06:02 AM »
"Cultural misunderstanding".  That' might work. :roll:
How about "flash-back"?  Ya know; "all those VC (dressed in orange) were onto me, but I got most of them".
This'll make the DC snipers look small-time.  It'll be a feeding frenzy for lawyers seeking fame.

Offline williamlayton

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #5 on: November 24, 2004, 01:30:38 AM »
I say lets let it rest til the boys do their work---Then we can speculate on the facts they present. Seems like a lot of things going on here that need explanation.
News seems to get wilder as it goes on--Worse than Big Momma and the bridge club.
Blessings
TEXAS, by GOD

Offline myronman3

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #6 on: November 24, 2004, 01:57:34 PM »
for more info check out "a good day not to be hunting" in handgun hunting forum, and deer hunting forum, i forget the name of the post but you will know it when you see it.

Offline Loader 3009

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #7 on: November 25, 2004, 12:33:11 PM »
http://www.kaaltv.com/article/view/83330

Authorities also look at 2001 hunter slaying

Updated: 11-24-2004 02:03:10 PM


 
Jim Southworth
 
(AP) - Clark County's sheriff says his detectives "jumped on it right away" when trying to determine any possible link between the fatal Sawyer County shootings and the 2001 death of a hunter near Neillsville, Wisconsin.
Sheriff Louis Rosandich says the homicide of Jim Southworth in November of 2001 has not been forgotten by area citizens or anyone else. Southworth was hunting alone on family land when he was shot twice in the back.

Witnesses reported a late 1980s-model Nissan or Chevy truck near the scene of the shooting. Three occupants in the truck were described as Asian. The Milwaukee Journal Sentinel reports the Sawyer County shooting suspect, Chai Vang, owned a 1987 Nissan pickup.

Authorities have said Vang was hunting with two other people on Sunday before he wandered onto private property west of Exeland. The other two people have not been found.

Vang is accused of fatally shooting six hunters and wounding two others.
Don't believe everything you think.

Offline HipShot

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #8 on: November 27, 2004, 05:53:44 AM »
That wasn't an SKS, it was a Saiga in 7.62x39.

Offline Patriot_1776

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #9 on: November 28, 2004, 06:25:12 PM »
With a story like this in the hands of ABC, CNN, and NBC, you can bet it will become a bundle of dynamite against the hunting tradition, and an explosive plus for the recently expired AWB.  Just my  :money:  Patriot
-Patriot

Offline lgm270

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #10 on: December 02, 2004, 01:02:29 AM »
Message: It's open season on white people.  

If the victim was a "minority" and the perp a White male, the hate crimes crowd would be on the air every five minutes about the evil white man. This is as much an immigration issue as a crime issue.  It's time to stop immigration to this country of these people.

Offline williamlayton

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #11 on: December 02, 2004, 02:01:21 AM »
IGM
I am not picking an arguement or saying I dsagree but please define "these people".
It would seem to me better to stop or at least put immigration on hold for awhile than to try and define "these people". There are a number of all "these people" who are active and good citizens. Until we can get a perfect handle on defining those that will be good citizens we are at a loss to do much elese. Kinda like saying children who will not be good citizens should not be born.
Well, if'n that were the case, there might be a few object to me.
Blessings
TEXAS, by GOD

Offline lostone1413

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #12 on: December 02, 2004, 05:59:56 AM »
I'm with you on that a 100% Igm270!!! Your right if the race was turned around it would be a hate crime. If it went that way wonder how much of are country would have been burned down by now?

Offline MGMorden

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #13 on: January 03, 2005, 01:13:45 PM »
Quote from: lgm270
Message: It's open season on white people.  

If the victim was a "minority" and the perp a White male, the hate crimes crowd would be on the air every five minutes about the evil white man. This is as much an immigration issue as a crime issue.  It's time to stop immigration to this country of these people.


That's not a good attitude to have.  Anyone here who isn't Native American has their roots somewhere else in the world.  Our own race commited some of the most atrocious crimes in history when we "immigrated" here.  Now I'm not going to apoligize for the actions of my ancestors, nor do I think that we should pack up and return to Europe, but lets not justify the world's image of "the evil white male" by broadly painting an entire race of people as undesirable because of the actions of a single person.  This man did wrong; he should be rightly punished.  It's as wrong for us to want new immigration laws over this as it is for the lefties to want new gun laws over it.

Offline williamlayton

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2005, 09:55:00 PM »
MG-
That was well stated.
Blessings
TEXAS, by GOD

Offline Loader 3009

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #15 on: January 04, 2005, 12:50:48 AM »
Well stated.....but erroneous.  First of all, the "native Americans" are no more native than you or I.  They came here (to America) in the first millenium.  They were the Picts, driven out of the British Isles by the westward migrating peoples of Israelite descent.

Secondly, I live among and know well the Hmongs.  They were brought to America by our federal government and settled in three states.  They are very clannish and have yet, after three generations, to adapt the American ways.  They remain a law unto themselves.  Some of "these people", and that's what they are....a people, I consider friends.  We often discuss our likenesses and differences.  I wish some of you fellows could hear some of these conversations.  Talk about culture clash! :grin:  

Some of you may call them Americans, but they remain Laotian to the bone.
Don't believe everything you think.

Offline lostone1413

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #16 on: January 04, 2005, 05:07:40 AM »
The late 1800s up until maybe 50 years ago you had Immigrants. They wanted to live like we live in America. It isn't that way anymore. Now you have Colonist coming over. They think America should be like the country they left. They are like the ones coming to America in the 1500s 1600s and in the 1700s. That is what is pulling America down the tubes. The thing is the Colonist that came over in the early years were from Europe They shared are values. Not like that now!

Offline williamlayton

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #17 on: January 05, 2005, 12:25:32 AM »
Loader-
Please expand on your thoughts about The pics. I think I have serious disagreements with your theory but would like further clarification.
Blessings
TEXAS, by GOD

Offline fe352v8

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #18 on: January 05, 2005, 01:52:47 PM »
Every group of immigrants to this country: Germans, Italians, Mexicans, Chinese, Catholics, Jews, Poles, Slavs, or who ever have been vilified the current residents.  Funny thing about America, not only is it the home of the brave and the land of the free, its also the land of the xenophobic.  Your kidding about native Americans, sometimes called American indians, being first millennium Picts forced to flee here by Israelites.  The archeological, anthropological, and genetic evidence seem to indicate that the Native Americans were of asiatic extraction.  Excavation of paleolithic sites in both North and South America indicate there having been here some 20,000 years, which is not only earlier than the first millennium but pre-dates judah by about 9000 years.  Now if you really believe the Pict Israelite nosense, I would guess that you believe that Nazi extermination camps were a myth created by the same group of Israelites as part of their plot for world domination. ARE YOU NUTS?  KU Klux sounds a lot like cookoo.  By the way when reading your bible, remember the story of Jesus, the israelite kid who grew up to be the Christ, and ask your self who would Jesus hate.

jon
life is no joke but funny things happen

jon

Offline Loader 3009

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Crazy hunter story already getting slanted
« Reply #19 on: January 05, 2005, 02:59:04 PM »
EARLIEST HISTORY OF SCOTLAND
 
     The complete king list -- and an accurate chronology of all the
kings of the Cruithne -- has come down to us in the "Pictish
Chronicle." The record begins with the first settlement of the
Agathyrsi in 1040. That is the year they were planted in Northwest
Europe by Odin of Denmark, who led them out of their ancient homeland
in Thrace.
     The "Pictish Chronicle" begins with the name of Cruithne and seven
sons, who divided the Scottish realm between them. The entire period
from the first migration in 1040 to the death of Cruithne and his sons
was 100 years. Thereafter the royal line was inherited from the
mother's side, not the father's, in accordance with the original
agreement with the Milesians.
     The following chart is taken from the "Pictish Chronicle."
 
King's Names               Lengths of Reign     Dates
 
Cruidne (or Cruithne),           100           1040- 940
son of Cinge (or Kinne),
father of the Agathyrsi
dwelling in Scotland.
 
The seven sons of Cruithne:
 
Circui                            60
 
Fidaich                           40
 
Forteim                           70
 
Floclaid                          30
 
Got                               12
 
Ce, that is, Cecircum             15
 
Fibaid                            24
 
     The entire period of Cruithne and his seven sons is contained in
the 100 years assigned to Cruithne. None of the sons' reigns can be
dated. The kingship after 940 was passed on to the following:
 
Gedeolgudach                      80            940-860
 
Denbacan                         100            860-760
 
Finnechta (Olfinecta)             60            760-700
 
Guididgaedbrecach                 50            700-650
 
Gestgurtich                       40            650-610
 
Wurgest                           30            610-580
 
Brudebout                         48            580-532
 
     "From Brudebout descended 30 kings of the name of Brude, who
reigned during 150 years in Ireland and in Albany," records the
Chronicle. Albany was the seat of authority in Scotland. The following
names indicate that the realm was divided into numerous principalities
-- probably 15 -- over each of which two generations of kinglets
reigned.
 
Thirty kings by name of Brude    150            532-382
 
               Brude Gest                   Brude Uleo
 
               Brude Urgest                 Brude Gant
 
               Brude Point                  Brude Urgant
 
               Brude Urpoint                Brude Gnith
 
               Brude Leo                    Brude Urgnith
 
               Brude Feth                   Brude Gart
 
               Brude Urfeichir              Brude Urgart
 
               Brude Cal                    Brude Clnd
 
               Brude Urcal                  Brude Urclnd
 
               Brude Cint                   Brude Uip
 
               Brude Urcint                 Brude Uruip
 
               Brude Feth                   Brude Grith
 
               Brude Urfeth                 Brude Urgrith
 
               Brude Ru                     Brude Muin
 
               Brude Ero                    Brude Urmuin
 
Gilgidi                           101           382-281
 
Tharan                            100           281-181
 
Morleo                             15           181-166
 
Deocilunan                         40           166-126
 
Cimoiod, son of Arcois              7           126-119
 
Deord                              50           119- 69
 
Bliciblitherth                      5            69- 64
 
Dectoteric, brother of Diu         40            64- 24
 
Usconbuts                          30       24 B.C.-  7 A.D.
 
Carvorst                           40             7- 47
 
Deoartavois                        20            47- 67
 
Uist                               50            67-117
 
Ru                                100           117-217
 
Gartnaithboc                        4           217-221
 
Vere                                9           221-230
 
Breth, son of Buthut                7           230-237
 
Vipoignamet                        30           237-267
 
Canutulachma                        4           267-271
 
Wradech Vechla                      2           271-273
 
Garnaichdi Uber                    60           273-333
 
Talore, son of Achivir --          75           333-408
(Nectanus, a contemporary
Pictish king was slain in
361)
 
Drust, son of Erp or Irb           45           408-453
 
     Though the "Pictish Chronicle" continues the history of the
Cruithne without interruption, it is important that the list be stopped
here to discover who Drust, the son of Erp, was.
 
 
                     EARLY LINE OF SCOTTISH KINGS
 
     Erp is the Pictish name for the Scottish Erc. Who was this Erc?
     Late Scottish historians confused this Erp or Erc with Erc the
father of Fearghus. Fearghus mac Erc reigned 513-529. This was about a
century after Drust mac Erp (or Erc). The two Ercs are not the same
person. This is clearly proved by all early Scottish historians. "In
two particulars at least, none of the early writers have disagreed:
that in the year 503 an invasion of Caledonia took place under the
leadership of Fergus mac Erc, and that he and his followers had come to
stay" ("Controversial Issues in Scottish History", Gregg, page 35).
     Then who was the other Erc whose son, a century earlier, returned
to rule over the Picts? The answer is found in the early history of the
Scots who migrated from Scythia in the year 331-330.
     In 331 Alexander the Great overthrew the Persian realm. Many
nations who had been held in virtual slavery gained their freedom. One
of these people was the House of Israel. Israel was invaded in 721 by
Shalmaneser of Assyria. After a three-year siege her people were taken
into captivity. Ezekiel, over a century later was given a vision in
which he saw that the House of Israel would not be released from their
enslavement until 390 years had elapsed from the time of the siege of
Samaria (Ezekiel 4:3-5). It was precisely 390 years from 721, when the
siege against Samaria began, to 331, the date of the final overthrow of
Persia and the deliverance out of captivity of the Hebrews. Some of
them immediately commenced a migration to the land settled long before
by their brethren. In the year 331-330 they journeyed out of Scythia to
Scotland -- the word Scotland originally meant the land of the Scyths.
In Scotland they sent to Ireland for a Scythian-Mileslan prince, of the
line of Mileadh, to rule over them. A prince was dispatched, together
with a small army. His name was Fergus, the son of Ferquhard. It was
his family from which Erp or Erc, the father of Drust, king of the
"Picts,'' sprang. Before returning to complete the line of "Pictish"
kings, we shall present a summary of the earliest kings to rule over
the Scots in Scotland. (It should be remembered that Scotland and
Pictland were but two of several early divisions of that land now known
as Scotland.)
     This material is taken from Boethus and Buchanan. The correct
outline is that preserved in Anderson's "Royal Genealogies". Buchanan
mistakenly shortens the total of the dynasty 16 years. But Roman
history confirms the longer form preserved by Anderson on page 753.
 
First Kings of the             Lengths of Reign      Dates
Scots
 
  1. Fergus                           25            330-305
      He died in shipwreck off
      the coast of Ireland,
      where he went to quell
      some commotions.
 
  2. Feritharis                       15            305-290
      Brother of Fergus succeeds,
      since Fergus' sons are too
      young.
 
    3. Mainus                         29            290-261
      Fergus' younger son chosen
      king, the older, Ferlegus,
      being condemned for
      conspiring in his uncle's
      death.
 
  4. Dornadilla                       28            261-233
      A son of Mainus
 
  5. Nothatus                         20            233-213
      Dornadilla's brother; his
      own son too young to succeed
      to the throne. A very
      cruel and despotic ruler,
      he was slain.
 
  6. Reuther                          26            213-187
      Dornadilla's son. Dowal,
      the murderer of Nothatus,
      exercised great influence
      over the still young Reuther.
 
  7. Reutha                           17            187-170
      Son of Nothatus, cousin
      of Reuther. Reuther's
      brother rules for his
      nephew, who is only ten
      years old. Reutha
      resigned the government
      in favour of Thereus his
      nephew.
 
  8. Thereus                          12            170-158
      Reuther's son. A cruel
      and unwise tyrant, driven
      into exile in his twelfth
      year, Conan elected viceroy.
 
  9. Josina                           24            158-134
      Thereus' brother. He
      greatly honored physicians,
      as he had been educated
      among them.
 
10. Finnan                            30            134-104
      Josina's son. Established
      that kings should not
      decide on great matters
      without authority of the
      great council. Ne was
      devoted to Druidical
      superstitions.
 
11. Durstus                            9            104- 95
      Finnan's son. A vile and
      debauched ruler. Pretending
      to reform his life, he
      invited the nobles and had
      them slain. He was slain
      in the ensuing battle.
 
12. Evenus                            19              95- 76
      Paternal cousin to Durstus.
      Exacted oath of
      allegiance from his subjects.
 
13. Gillus                             3              76- 73
      A crafty tyrant, slain by
      Cadwal, his viceroy, in
      battle.
 
14. Evenus II                         17              73- 56
      Son of Doval; grandson
      of Josina.
 
15. Ederus                            48              56-  8
      Son of Dochamus, Durstus'
      son.
 
16. Evenus III                         7               8-  1
      A wicked and licentious
      king; the son of Ederus.
      He was put in prison by
      the nobles and there
      murdered by a fellow
      prisoner.
 
17. Metellanus                        29       "1 B.C."- 29 "A.D."
      Son of Ederus' brother.
 
18. Caractacus                        20              29- 49
      Son of Cadallanus and of
      Eropeia, Metellanus' sister.
 
19. Corbred I                         18              49- 67
      Caractacus' brother.
 
20. Dardanus                           4              67- 71
      Metellanus' nephew. A
      cruel and licentious ruler,
      he was captured in battle
      and beheaded.
 
21. Corbred II.                       35              71-106
      Corbred's son. After many
      battles with the Romans,
      he died at peace.
 
22. Luctacus                           3             106-109
      A licentious prince, son
      of Corbred II. He was
      slain by his nobles.
 
23. Mogaldus (Mogallus)               36             109-145
      Grandson of Galdus and
      maternal nephew of
      Lactacus, son of the
      sister of Corbred II.
      Started his reign well
      but ended it in the ways
      of his predecessor. Was
      slain by the nobles.
 
24. Conarus                           14             145-159
      Mogaldus' son. He was a
      partner in the conspiracy
      against his father. He
      himself was a lecherous
      tyrant, was put in
      prison after only 2 years.
      Argadus became governor;
      Conarus was finally slain
      in prison in 159.
 
25. Ethodius                          33             159-192
      Mogaldus' sister's son.
      He was murdered for
      personal reasons by an
      Irish harper.
 
26. Satrael                            4             192-196
      Ethodlus' brother, the son
      was not yet mature enough.
      This man murdered the
      nobles and friends of
      Ethodius, so he could do
      away with the sons, in
      order to keep the reign
      in his family. Was finally
      strangled by his own
      servants.
 
27. Donald I.                         21             196-217
      Another brother of
      Ethodius. The first
      "Christian king" of
      Scotland. First to coin
      gold and silver money in
      the land.
 
28. Ethodius II.                      21             217-238
      Son of Ethodius, an
      intellectually weak and
      base-minded man. Directed
      by his nobles, slain by own
      officers.
 
29. Athirco                           12             238-250
      Son of Ethodius. Began
      his reign decently, but
      degenerated and committed
      suicide when pursued by
      his nobles. Athirco's
      brother, Dorus, flees
      from the noble Nathalocus
      with the three sons of
      Athirco.
 
30. Nathalocau                        12             250-262
      A son of Athirco's brother,
      he usurped the kingdom; was
      a cruel tyrant and was slain
      by the nobles.
 
31. Findochus                         11             262-273
      A son of Athirco. A
      good ruler, he was slain
      by his own brother at the
      instigation of Donald the
      Islander.
 
32. Donald II.                         1             273-274
      Findochus' brother. In
      battle Donald is wounded
      and dies shortly after.
 
33. Donald III                        12             274-286
      Donald the Islander
      usurped the kingship
      without any right to it,
      and ruled very cruelly.
      He was finally slain by
      Crathilinthus.
 
34. Crathilinthus                     24             286-310
      The son of Findochus, who
      was hidden for years.
      After a long series of
      battles with the wild
      Picts, and after
      purging the land of
      the idolatrous superstition
      of the Druids and
      enforcing Christianity, he died.
 
35. Fincormach                        47             310-357
      Crathilinthus' cousin.
      A just ruler.
 
36. Romachus                           3             357-360
      Son of oldest brother of
      Crathilinthus. Obtained
      the kingdom by force from
      the two sons of two other
      brothers of Crathilinthus.
      Defeated incursions of the
      wild Picts. His murder
      ended his evil reign.
 
37. Angusianus                         1             360-361
      Son of a brother of
      Crathilinthus. Angusianus
      was slain in battle with the
      Picts' king Nectanus.
 
38. Fethelmachus                       3             361-364
      Son of the third brother
      of Crathilinthus, Devastating
      the forces of the Picts in
      battle, they sent assassins
      who murdered the king.
 
39. Eugenius I (Evenus)               12             364-376
 
     Fincormach's son. He was killed in battle against the Romans and
their Pictish allies. The Scottish kingdom was obliterated. The dead
king's brother, with his son Erc, and his grandson, fled to Denmark
where he was received by Sivaldus III. The Scottish population
scattered throughout Scandanavia.
     The Romans soon turned on the Cruithne -- who were still dwelling
in Pictland along with the wild Picts. The Cruithne were miserably
oppressed. After three decades they came to an agreement with the Scots
and promised to restore the Scots to the throne if they would deliver
them from oppression. The son of Erc or Erp returned in 408 at the head
of a Scottish army, delivered the Cruithne and restored the throne.
This son of Erc or Erp was not Ferghus, as later traditions assumed,
but Drust, who became the new king of the Cruithne or Picts. Drust was
famous in poetry for having fought 100 battles and lived 100 years. As
he ended his reign in 453, he was born 353. He was therefore only 23
years old at the time of the flight of his grandfather and father.
     Before continuing the remarkable history of the wild Picts which
culminated in 503 in Scotland, we should continue with the line of
Scottish kings who now sat on the throne over the Cruithne (or the
Agathyrsi Picts).
 
 
                      KINGS OF CRUITHNE CONTINUED
 
Kings of the Cruithne          Lengths of Reign       Dates
 
(Drust, son of Erp or Erc             45             408-453)
 
Talore, son of Aniel                   4             453-457
 
Necton Morbet, son of Erp             25             457-482
 
Drest Gurthinmoth                     30             482-512
 
Galanau Etelich                       12             512-524
 
Dadrest                                1             524-525
 
Drest, son of Gyrom                    1             525-526
 
Drest, son of Udrost, reigned          5             526-531
jointly with Drest, son of Gyrom
 
Drest, son of Gyrom,                   5             531-536
continues to reign alone
 
Gartnach, son of Gyrom                 7             536-543
 
Cealtraim, son of Gyrom                1             543-544
 
Talorg, son of Muircholaich           11             544-555
 
Drest, son of Munait                   1             555-556
 
Galam, with Aleth                      1             556-557
 
Galam, with Brideo                     1             557-558
 
Bride, son of Mailcon                 30             558-588
 
Gartnaich, son of Domelch             11             588-599
 
Nectan                                20             599-619
 
Cineoch, son of Luthrn                19             619-638
 
Garnard, son of Wid                    4             638-642
 
Bridei, son of Wid                     5             642-647
 
Talore, brother of the two            12             647-659
former kings
 
Talorcan, son of Enfret                4             659-663
 
Gartnait, son of Donnel                6             663-669
 
Drest, brother of Gartnait             7             669-676
 
Bridei, son of Bill                   21             676-697
 
Taran, son of Entisidich               4             697-701
 
Bredei, son of Derili                 11             701-712
 
Necton, or Naitan, son of Derili      15             712-727
 
Drest and Alpin reigned together       5             727-732
 
Onnust, or Oengus, son of Urgust,     31             732-763
or Fergus
 
Bredei, son of Uiurgust                2             763-765
 
Kinoid, or Kinoth son of Wirdech      12             765-777
 
Elpin, or Alpin son of Wroid           3             777-780
 
Drest, or Durst son of Talorgan        4             780-784
 
Talargan, son of Onnust                2             784-786
 
Canaul, son of Tarla                   5             786-791
 
Castantin, or Constantine, son        30             791-821
of Urguist, or Fergus
 
Unnust, or Hungus, son of Urguist     12             821-833
 
Drest, son of Constantine, and         3             833-836
Taloran, son of Utholl, reigned
together.
 
Uwen, or Eogan, son of                 3             836-839
Unnust
 
Wrad, son of Bargoit                   3             839-842
 
Bred Brude                             3             842-845
 
Keneth MacAlpin, first king           16             843-859
of all Scotland, united line
of Cruithne (or "Picts")
with the Milesian Scottish
line of Ferghus mac Erc.
 
     This completes the history of the Picts who descended from the
intermarriage of the Cruithne and the Judaic Milesian royal house. From
the reign of Kenneth MacAlpin the history of the throne of David has
already been presented in volume I.
     But what befell those wild, tribal Picts who gave their name to
the Cruithne -- and who painted themselves? Remnants of them continued
to be referred to as late as the seventeenth century. Most of the
population, however, suddenly disappeared in 503 upon the coming of the
Milesian Scots out of Ireland under the leadership of Fearghus mac Erc.
     Those wild Picts were the people who left the many strange and
intriguing remains in the Northern Isles of Britain -- the mounds, the
flint knives, the stonehewn tombs, the carvings.
Don't believe everything you think.

Offline myronman3

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« Reply #20 on: January 05, 2005, 04:45:23 PM »
well that would certainly explain why irishmen and indians have one thing in common- notorious drinkers- cut from the same cloth :)  :-D  

now before any starts off, i am decended from both indians and irishmen (as well as many others); so by rights i can get away with it.   :)

i aint so brave as to say who is from where or what.  i just try to live right.  god bless you all.  :wink:

Offline myronman3

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« Reply #21 on: January 05, 2005, 04:57:25 PM »
oh- and vang is a rat  &%$$#!!  who will certainly answer for what he has done.  he took one friend and several of my nieghbors away from folks who loved them dearly; they were all wonderful people- truely some of the best people you could know.  
   i have things to answer for on judgement day, but i am glad i aint him.  

the rest of the hmoung should not be judged by this one person.   but they should address some of the problems this has highlighted, and i mean by being honest and fixing some of the problems with the way their community isolates itself and expects the rest of america to bend over backwards for them.  and truthfully, the hmoungs aint got the patent on that behaviour, either.  

the rest of us need to stop letting these groups get away with the small things, because in the end we aint doing anyone any favors; everyone loses.   call a spade a spade, and do the right thing.  it aint really all that hard to do.

Offline williamlayton

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« Reply #22 on: January 05, 2005, 08:41:54 PM »
Loader-
Good reading and an interesting thumbnail of Scottish history. I enjoyed the read.
I am still concerned about the thought of The journey from Great Britain to The North American continent and these being the native americans we are discussing. Are you suggesting these tribes or people  of the east coast are these descendants or the whole of the American indian being these descendants.
Blessings
TEXAS, by GOD

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« Reply #23 on: January 05, 2005, 11:05:21 PM »
Yes.  There is overwhelming evidence that the western tribes had the same origens, even though they migrated "up" through Mexico.  

My file on this branch is enormous.  Probably too large to post here.
Don't believe everything you think.

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« Reply #24 on: January 05, 2005, 11:24:32 PM »
Myronman, Ireland was settled by the descendants of both Simeon and Dan.  If you will study the beginnings of these people you will truly be amazed and astounded at the accuracy of their father's description of their fate in the "latter days".
Don't believe everything you think.

Offline williamlayton

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« Reply #25 on: January 06, 2005, 02:20:01 AM »
Unless I am reading your thoughts wrong, who do you maintain the Picts were and where did they originate?
I have no concerns with the dispersal of Israel, do have a concern and questions that are unanserable except by theory, by those who propose a race of pure israelites being the Anglo-Saxons who founded Great Britain.
I have no concerns with the origins of the Native Americans being of mixed origin from Asia, Africa, and the Islands. Had never considered the Picts to be part of the sceme.
How many Picts, according to your thoughts, were involved in this migration or how many Picts were in population when they disappeared?
What is the origin of the Picts? I see where I have asked this question so ignore the double question.
Could the Picts be from a westward migration rather than from the continent of Europe?
Blessings
TEXAS, by GOD

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« Reply #26 on: January 06, 2005, 05:47:13 AM »
Was watching a program the other day wherein they opined that the Picts, Celts, and Huns were the same people.  An eastward migration from the Asian steppe.
They may talk of a "New Order" in the  world, but what they have in mind is only a revival of the oldest and worst tyranny.   No liberty, no religion, no hope.   It is an unholy alliance of power and pelf to dominate and to enslave the human race.

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« Reply #27 on: January 06, 2005, 06:37:14 AM »
Do not confuse the "wild" Picts with the Cruithne Picts.  The Cruithne Picts, oppressed as they were, ruled over the wild Picts.  As they both lived in Pictland, they were both known as Picts.

I don't have any idea of their numbers and nobody else probably does.  There were enough of them to pose problems for the civilized people.  Let's look at what some early historians have to say:

First, let us immediately banish a myth. White Europeans did not
become Indians by merely settling in the New World and becoming lost!
The American Indians are not the "Lost Tribes of Israel," or Egyptians.
The American Indian looks as he does because his ancestors appeared
that way before they traversed the waters of the Atlantic.

     It may come as a surprise to learn it, but Europe and the
Mediterranean world was early -- and comparatively late -- inhabited by
"Red Men." Everyone has heard of the famous Phoenician sailors of the
ancient Mediterranean world. They are known to have traveled far out
into the Atlantic and to Northwestern Europe. The Greeks called them
Phoenicians because that is what they were -- "Red Men." The word
"Phoenician" is derived from the Greek word for reddish dye. The
ancient Egyptians painted the Phoenicians on their walled tombs and on
papyri. Their skin color? Reddish. The Egyptians painted other peoples
of Palestine white and black. They recognized three races of men living
in Palestine in early ages.
 
     Julius Firmicus, an early writer, stated that "in Ethiopia all are
born black; in Germany, white; and in Thrace, red." Thrace was north of
Greece and originally populated by the children of Tiras, son of
Japheth (Gen. 10:2). It was from Thrace that Odin led the Agathyrsi and
other tribes to Northwestern Europe when he founded the Danish kingdom.
 
     Many of the warriors employed by the early princes of western
Europe were fierce, of swarthy skin, naked and often tatooed and
painted. Strabo, the Roman geographer, wrote that areas of Ireland and
Britain were inhabited "by men entirely wild." Jerome, writing in one
of his letters in the fifth century, characterizes some of them as
cannibals: "When they hunted the woods for prey, it is said they
attacked the shepherd, rather than his flock; and that they curiously
selected the most delicate and brawny parts, both of males and females,
for their horrid repast."
 
     In the eighteenth century, Martin, in his volume "Western Islands
of Scotland", remarked that the complexion of the natives of the isle
of Skye was "for the most part black;" and the natives of Jura were
"generally black of complexion," and of Arran, "generally brown, and
some of a black complexion." The inhabitants of the Isle Gigay were
"fair or brown in complexion." The American Indian -- commonly called
the Red Man -- varies from copper brown to almost black, and, of
course, almost white in some tribes.

     And the famous literary companions Johnson and Boswell several
times took notice of the swarthy color of some of the natives in the
north and west of Scotland (Croker's "Boswell", 1848, pp. 309-310, 316,
352). "There was great diversity in the faces of the circle around us,"
wrote Boswell; "some were as black and wild in their appearance as any
American savages whatever." "Our boatmen were rude singers, and seemed
so like wild Indians, that a very little imagination was necessary to
give one an impression of being upon an American river."

     A writer at the beginning of the nineteenth century characterized
the people of Harris: "In general the natives are of small stature ....
the cheek bones are rather prominent. The complexion is of all tints.
Many individuals are as dark as mulattoes, while others are nearly as
fair as Danes" ("Edinburgh New Philosophical Journal", No. vii, pp.
142, 143).
 
     In "Pennant's Second Tour", 1772, is a line drawing of the wigwams
of the half-breed natives of the Scottish Island of Jura. Here are
natives, like American Indians, living in the remote islands of Europe,
whose last remnants died out as late as the beginning of the nineteenth
century.

The Mongols, Picts and Celts were three unrelated peoples, unrelated in that they were not the same..... all having different origins.
Don't believe everything you think.

Offline williamlayton

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« Reply #28 on: January 06, 2005, 10:03:06 AM »
Very interesting read and I enjoyed. I have never been a student of European or history of that era.
Give a couple of refrence books that one could find, here I go on another journey, for a good reading. I do not think I want as much information as you have but would like to dip my finger into it.
Blessings
TEXAS, by GOD

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« Reply #29 on: January 06, 2005, 11:29:09 AM »
William, most of the books reliably dealing with the subject are long out of print.  The majority were printed from the late 1800's to the mid-1900's....in Great Britain.  I know of no recent publications.  I am fortunate to have a few on disc and a couple of originals left to me by family members.  

Just so you will know, here's a bibliography from which the compendium was compiled: (not all of the below deal with the Picts)

 
Akermana John Yonge, "Remains of Pagan Saxondom". London, 1860.
 
Alexander, William L., "The Ancient British Church". London, 1889
 
Anderson, Alan Orr, "Early Sources of Scottish History". Edinburgh,
     1922.
 
Angus, S., "The Mystery Religions and Christianity". London, 1928.
 
Arnold, Channing and F. J. T. Frost, "The American Egypt. A Record of
     Travel in Yucatan". London, 1909.
 
Avebury, Lord, "Pre-Historic Times". London, 1900.
 
Avery, Catherine B., Ed., "The New Century Classical Handbook". New
     York, 1962.
 
Ayer, Joseph Cullen, Jr., "A Source Book for Ancient Church History".
     New York, 1941.
 
Baikie, James, "The Sea Kings of Crete". London, 1926.
 
Bancroft, Hubert Howe, "The Native Races of the Pacific States of North
     America". 5 vol. New York, 1875.
 
Berington, Joseph, "A Literary History of the Middle Ages". London,
     1814.
 
Bingham, Hiram, "Lost City of the Incas". London, 1951.
 
Bingham, Joseph, "The Antiquities of the Christian Church". 2 vol.
     London, 1920.
 
Bradley, Henry, "The Story of the Goths". London, 1891.
 
Bradley, R. N., "Malta and the Mediterranean Race". London, 1912.
 
Brion, Marcel, "The World of Archaeology India, China, and America".
     London, 1959.
 
Browne, G. F., "The Church In These Islands Before Augustine". New
     York, 1897.
 
Browne, James, "A History of the Highlands and of the Highland Clans".
     Edinburgh, 1852.
 
Browne, James, "The History of Scotland, its Highlands, Regiments, and
     Clans". 8 vol. London, 1909.
 
Buckle, Henry Thomas, "Introduction to the Civilization in England".
     New York, 1904.
 
Burton, John Hill, "The History of Scotland". 8 vol. Edinburgh, 1897.
 
Camden, William, "Remains Concerning Britain". London 1674.
 
Cameron, Mary Lovett, "Old Etruria and Modern Tuscany". London, 1909.
 
Cano, Benito, "Coronica General De Espana". Madrid, 1791.
 
Catrou and Rouille, "The Roman History". 6 vol. London 1728.
 
Cave, William, "Antiquitates Apostolicae -- The History of the
     Apostles". London, 1684.
 
Childe, V Gordon, "The Prehistory of Scotland". London 1935.
 
Churton, Edward, "The Early English Church". London.
 
Clark, Grahame, "Prehistoric England". London, 1962.
 
Cobern, Camden M., "The New Archaeological Discoveries and Their
     Bearing on the New Testament". London, 1918.
 
Coulton, G. G., "Medieval Panorama". Cambridge, 1949.
 
Crichton, Andrew, "Scandinavia, Ancient and Modern". 2 vol. New York,
     1841.
 
Cunnington, M. E., "An Introduction to the Archaeology of Wiltshire".
     1949.
 
de Bourbourg, LeAbbe Brasseur, "Histoire Des Nations Civilisees Du
     Mexique et de L'Amerique -- Centrale". Paris, 1857.
 
de Hirsch-Davies, J. E., "A Popular History of the Church in Wales".
     London, 1912.
 
de Laet, S. J., "The Low Countries". London, 1958.
 
de Leon, Pedro de Cieza, Trans. Victor W. von Hagen, "The Incas".
     Oklahoma, 1959.
 
de Nadaillac, "Prehistoric America". New York, 1884.
 
de Ocampo, Battasar, "History of the Incas". Cambridge, 1907.
 
de Paor, M. snd D., "Early Christian Ireland". London, 1959.
 
de Pufendorf, Baron Samuel, "Histoire de Suede". Amsterdam, 1730.
 
de Sahagun, Bernardino, "A History of Ancient Mexico". 1932.
 
Elton, Oliver, translator, "The Danish History of Saxo Grammaticus".
     London, 1894.
 
Evans, J. D., "Malta". London, 1959.
 
Evans, John, "The Ancient Stone Implements, Weapons and Ornaments of
     Great Britain". New York, 1872.
 
Ferrero, Guglielmo, "Characters and Events of Roman History". New York,
     1909.
 
Foster, J. W., "Pre-Historic Races of the United States of America".
     Chicago, 1878.
 
Gallenkamp, Charles, "Maya -- The Riddle and Rediscovery of a Lost
     Civilization". New York, 1959.
 
Geddes, Michael, "The Church History of Ethiopia". London, 1694.
 
Geoffrey of Monmouth, "History of the Kings of Britain". New York,
     1958.
 
Gilles, J. A., "Six Old English Chronicles", including Ethelwerd's
     chronlele, Asser's Life of Alfred, Geoffrey of Monmouth's British
     History, Gildas and Nennius. London, 1908.
 
Gjerset, Knut, "History of the Norwegian People". New York, 1932.
 
Gregg, William H., "Controversial Issues in Scottish History". London,
     1910.
 
Guest, Edwln, "Origines Celticae". 2 vol. London, 1883.
 
Harvey, G. E., "History of Burma". London, 1925.
 
Heyerdahl, Thor., "American Indians in the Pacific". Stockholm, 1952.
 
Holmes, T. Rice, "Ancient Britain and the Invasions of Julius Caesar".
     London, 1907.
 
Hubert, Henri, "The Rise of the Celts". London, 1934.
 
Johnson, Walter, "Byways in British Archaeology". Cambridge, 1912.
 
Jones, Inigo, "Stone-heng". London, 1655.
 
Kadar, Zoltan, "Die Kleinasiatisch -- Syrischen Kulte Zur Romerzeit in
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