Author Topic: Fred M is a genius (Read 1234 times)

Broken-arrow · « **on:** November 24, 2004, 02:07:06 PM »

Thanks Quick, just found the page you posted with Fred Ms little NEF tweaks. The man is a frigging Genius. Now I understand why these guns are how they are. Give the man a cigar. I'm a pretty good shade-tree gun-smith & it might take me a while, but by golly I am goin to make a shooter out that jack-handle that NEF calls a .308 Win. barrel. My son wanted it because I,ve always told him, NOTHING shoots like a .308. :lol:

quickdtoo · « **Reply #1 on:** November 24, 2004, 02:21:04 PM »

I'm a bit partial to the .308 myself, I've hunted with a .308 BLR since 1983 cept for a few yrs with a muzzleloader. It's been my only centerfire rifle until I became a Handiholic. That's why I jumped on the .308 barrel, couldn't control myself, it being a .308 AND a Handi-rifle!

Fred is a real wiz kid at his best and since he's only worked on one Handi, he's put a LOT of time in on it and still only achieved mediocre success, so your .308 isn't the only one out there that has had problems. Longcruise has a .223 that has caused him some major heartache, also. :cry: I have a .25-06 barrel for my Ultra frame, but it shoots good, 1" or better at 100yds with the first 2 of 3 rounds touching or real close and that is with factory ammo. Maybe ya just haven't tried the right ammo yet for the .308. One trend that I've noted out of most all Handi calibers is they like the lighter for caliber bullets, with a few exceptions like the .45-70, anyway. Tim

Broken-arrow · « **Reply #2 on:** November 24, 2004, 02:53:09 PM »

I dont know Quick, I,ve tried bullets from 110 gr. up to 180 gr.. I,ve tried IMR4895, 4064, & Varget. All really good powders in the .308 in my experience, light loads to max loads(they get sticky) No matter what you feed it, like someone else said, it shoots like the scope is bad.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #3 on:** November 24, 2004, 03:00:44 PM »

Maybe it just needs a trip to NEF! Wouldn't be the first... :cry:

Mac11700 · « **Reply #4 on:** November 24, 2004, 06:53:53 PM »

Broken Arrow:

I have a questions for you...have you varied the seating depth of the various bullets...I've found that on my 308...the best accuracy came with the bullet seated well off the lands...and I've tried it as far out as a 190 grain Sierra Matchking bullet will sit in the case...move it back to the recommended O.A.L. and accuracy improves greatly...also...give close attention to your dies...if your full lenght relloading...switch over to neck sizing only and set the die up just kiss the shoulder without setting it back any...on your primers...I tried them all...the best todate...is the Remington 9-1/2...and BL-C2 powder or RL-15...try loading from the starting point and don't try for the velocity loadings till you find an accurate lower/medium velocity one...also...doulble check that your barrel isn't touching after it warms up...I take a buisness card with me to the range...and after 5 shots...I keep an eye on it...same for the forearm screw...make sure it isn't loosing up after it warms up...

Mac

Broken-arrow · « **Reply #5 on:** November 25, 2004, 01:37:04 AM »

Mac, I've tried all that. I've been messing with this thing since February.
I got the .223 to shoot really good but it was'nt any easy process.
You know, it would seem that a gun with the scope mounted right to the barrel would shoot good with the right load , bullet, & seating depth combination. Thats why I think Fred M is onto something. After I read his article I checked and the .308 barrel does not stay locked up as tight as the .223 does. It does'nt move much, but I guess it does'nt take much,according to Fred M. ( He's my Hero ) A .308 that shoots groups that look like 00Buck patterns has a problem. But it's a whole new challege now. And I love a good challenge. So until further notice, Handi NOT for sale. Keep you posted.

Mac11700 · « **Reply #6 on:** November 25, 2004, 04:56:32 AM »

Broken Arrow:

Happy Thanksgiving....

If your Handi isn't locking up tight...you don't really have a need to go thru all that Fred did to his 25-06...you can call NEF and send it back to have it repaired as needed,they are pretty good at taking care of our problems...if all of the different factory ammo groups as you say...you have a serious problem...one that NEF should be made aware of...most of the 308's that I've seen and owned(2) gave more than acceptable accuracy .....I'm not telling you not to try...but we have the option of sending it back,Fred didn't......

Mac

Broken-arrow · « **Reply #7 on:** November 25, 2004, 08:12:23 PM »

Yes, I thought about sending it back , but I,m actually afraid they will do something to the receiver, and ruin the .223s accuracy. And besides that, they did sloppy work the first time and it took almost 4 months to get it back. Anyway it's a cheap gun and I've got tinkeritis. I'm almost positive I can make it shoot better . I finally understand what causes the vertical and horizontal stringing.( Thanks again Fred ) Poor quality control is obviously the problem with NEF and I'll never buy another one.
It's like rolling the dice, maybe it will shoot, and maybe it won't. I've got about 30 guns , and the most consistently accurate, no matter what you feed them, are both Savages. A 110.270 and 10FP.308. They're not expensive rifles. I know i'm comparing a bolt gun to a break action single shot, but my point is,quality control is poor and they know it. Until they make it better they are just digging theirselves a hole.
MADE IN USA is supposed to mean a quality product.

Mac11700 · « **Reply #8 on:** November 25, 2004, 09:23:40 PM »

Well....if you would rather do it yourself...then go for it...me...I've never had the problems that a few folks here have had...and as far as them doing anything to the reciever...I sincerly doubt they would...since the fitting of a new barrel is done on the barrel...unless you specify to do a trigger job on it...still in all...if your that dissatisfied with the results...and"friendly" call to the CS department is in order...and I would much rather have them make it right...just on the principle of the whole thing...

Mac

thecowboyace · « **Reply #9 on:** November 28, 2004, 06:50:09 PM »

There are so many great suggestions that Fred has but as clumsy fingered as what I am I can't do them. I figure that I might try theat produrct tthat uses bullets that have abrasives on them and then send it off for a trigger job if I can find someone who will do the trigger job for me. Wouldn't mind them doing a video of them doing it at the same time and then I could try it on my on on the other NEF that I have.

Fred M · « **Reply #10 on:** November 29, 2004, 05:18:38 AM »

thecowboyace
I would not advise to do a fire lapping job (bullets with grit) in a micro goove Handi barrel with its already too long a throat. Just polish the barrel with either Flitz or J-B bore cleaning compound and then follow with J-B Bore Bright. The two J-B products come as a kit. That is all you need to do. 50 strokes with e first and a 100 strokes with the second and you are ready to shoot bullets. Perklo or the factory will do your trigger.

thecowboyace · « **Reply #11 on:** November 30, 2004, 06:14:49 PM »

Thanks a lot. Will try the swab job and see where that gets me!

ScatterGunner · « **Reply #12 on:** December 01, 2004, 05:33:54 PM »

Fred M is a valuable contributor to this forum.

maybe we can get him to do a cliffnotes type of thing on handi's !??!!

my hat is off to fred for his patience and willingness to share his experience with us.

sg

Fred M · « **Reply #13 on:** December 01, 2004, 06:55:17 PM »

ScatterGunner.
Thankyou for the compliment. I am not really a genius. Since I had so much enjoyment out of the hunting and shooting sports and so many friends to share this sport with and fortunate to hunt in so many different places. that I feel obligated to pass on as much of what I learnt and experienced to the younger generation of hunters and shooters. They need all the help they can get.

I have put my web page together with the same thoughts in mind and I am very pleased with the visitors of this page from all over the world who have expressed their gratitude. The reception and popularity my page received was beyond my wildest expectations. Not to mention al the e-mail I received and answered. It nearly turned into a full time job, but my typing skills made big improvements :grin:

ScatterGuner I don't understand the below sentence.

Quote

maybe we can get him to do a cliffnotes type of thing on handi's

I really don't need another job, scatter gunning in the fall is a big enough job. I sure like to cut down on goose decoys at four in the morning.

ScatterGunner · « **Reply #14 on:** December 02, 2004, 01:24:12 AM »

hi fred -

cliff notes are a set of condensed study books with a lot of stuff packed into a few pages. they must be unique to the states.

sg

quickdtoo · « **Reply #15 on:** December 02, 2004, 05:05:33 AM »

I think they should be called Frednotes, then! :wink:

Fred M · « **Reply #16 on:** December 02, 2004, 06:29:17 AM »

Quick.
Fred's Notes, eh. Well I been working on on a book called "Adventures of a Hunter." I have stacks of hand written pages in sort of Fred's steno that people have a hard time to read. These notes need to be typed and edited.

I ask my daughter a very literary expert if she would take on the job, she said after she looked at some of my writings, quote: " Dad, you know that I don't speak German". She thought I had written it in German since I speak and write it. That's how bad my notes are. What a big laugh it was.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #17 on:** December 02, 2004, 07:07:33 AM »

Ah...your own version of cryptograhy! :wink: