Author Topic: Question about big bore revolvers??? (Read 3956 times)

KENTDEP · « **on:** November 25, 2004, 01:43:41 AM »

I am intrested in getting a big bore revolver. I am thinking about the 454Casull and the .475Linbaugh (not sure of the spelling). Which would you chose and why?

My other question is how are the cylinders bored on the BFRs? I ask this because I am curious if the accuracy and quality of the BFR is on par with the Freedom Arms revolver. Wondering if they are line bored or not.

Thanks in advance and Happy Thanksgiving!

Jay

44 Man · « **Reply #1 on:** November 25, 2004, 02:38:37 AM »

I am not 100% sure, but I do not believe that the BFR are line bored. I do know the frames are made by Ruger for BFR. If you have ANY question as to which to buy, just read the Freedom Arms posts in this forum. The are the finest revolvers in the world. Period! 44 Man

Bill T · « **Reply #2 on:** November 25, 2004, 03:05:06 AM »

I have several Rugers and 2 Magnum Research BFR's. One in .45-70 and the other I just bought in .500 S&W Magnum. I would have to give the BFR's the edge in overall quality. They should be because they cost almost double. I don't own a Freedom Arms, but I've handled several, and shot a few. They are good guns, and again should be because of their extremly high cost. If they are worth it is up to the purchaser. Bill T.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #3 on:** November 25, 2004, 03:25:14 AM »

Yes Freedom Arms are fine guns, but my 500MAG BFR will do anything the F/A will do. I could of bought a F/A but chose the BFR over it. I have over 1000 rounds of heavy loaded 500MAG's and not one problem, the gun is very accurate and functions flawless. Plus I have a lot more money in my pocket to boot.

Bill T · « **Reply #4 on:** November 25, 2004, 04:28:19 AM »

Redhawk,

I share your feelings on the BFR over the Freedom Arms. Yes, the Freedom Arms guns are of high quality, no question about it. They damn well should be for what they charge. My BFR in .500 Mag. is still new but my other BFR in .45-70 has seen several hundred rounds and digested every one without a problem. The BFR's from Magnum Research rate #1 in my book! Bill T.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #5 on:** November 25, 2004, 05:08:43 AM »

Bill T, I sent my BFR to Mag-na-port and had them cut the barrel down to 6 inches and invert the muzzle crown. I also had them put 4 port porting on it to tame the 575 gr. monsters I am shooting. The gun has the same great accuracy it had with the longer barrel. I am looking forward to using it on my Maine fall bear hunt I have booked for next October.

Catfish · « **Reply #6 on:** November 25, 2004, 11:05:38 AM »

I bought my first .44 mag. in 1966, I now have 3 of them. I have 2 .454`s, a Ruger and a Taurus. I also recently picked up a .500 Smith. Noe my thoghts on big bores. I would forget the .475, not because it a bad round, but if I waanted something that big I would go wirh the .500 Smith as it is a factory round. As for the .454, it`s a great round but in the Ruger the recoil is pretty stiff. The Rageing Bull I have is a great shooter and has far less recoil, but I have heard about some people haveing problems with the Taurus`s and from what I hear their customer service stinks. So far I`ve only fired 1 full cylinder through my .500 Smith, and it is a Smith, but I was fireing at a rock about 12 in. in dia. at about 135 yrds. I hit the rock 3 out of the 5 shots and the other 2 were right there, all would have taken a deer. The recoil, with 350 grn. bullets at about 1,875 fps, was far less than my Rugher Red Hawk in .454 pushing 300 grn. bullets at 1,500 fps. I love my Taurus, but from what I`ve been hearing about their service I`m not going to buy another one for a while at least. There for my advice would be to go with the .500 Smith. I hear they get brutal with the 440 grn. bukkets and up, but they are still pushing a 350 grn. bullet faster than than the old .45-70`s will push a 300 grn. bullet and they used them on bufflow.

DEANO · « **Reply #7 on:** December 03, 2004, 09:12:56 AM »

These are my opinions. Get a Freedom Arms in .454. Don't get something that you think will be as good as one, and later wish you had gotten the FA. I will make some folks mad, but the BFRs are just UGLY!!! And the name is pretty silly too. Judging from the Freedom Arms owners I know and what I have read on these posts, you can't go wrong with a FA. You can load it as hot and as low as you want to go. Big bores are not for everybody, and you may not like them. Also, you can always get your money back out of a Freedom Arms if you don't like it. Hope this helps.

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #8 on:** December 03, 2004, 09:47:34 AM »

sorry boys but im with Denno on this one! Ive shot and handled alot of them and even owned a bfr and to me a fa is as much of a step above a bfr as a bfr is above a ruger. In all actuallity id take an accusport ruger have it freewheeled and get an action job done and in my opionion have just as good of a gun for substaintialy less then a bfr and it would be a much better packin gun. Alot more compact and alot lighter. So if its saving money your looking at why even buy a bfr get a ruger and if its a custom your looking for get a fa or a true custom. One thing ive learned in the gun buying ive done is you get what payed for. Sorry if I stepped on any bfr fans toes. But ive got a sour taste in my mouth after the pos they tried passing off to me as an $800 gun. and a sore but from the way the service dept treated me.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #9 on:** December 03, 2004, 10:08:54 AM »

Quote from: DEANO

These are my opinions. Get a Freedom Arms in .454. Don't get something that you think will be as good as one, and later wish you had gotten the FA. I will make some folks mad, but the BFRs are just UGLY!!! And the name is pretty silly too. Judging from the Freedom Arms owners I know and what I have read on these posts, you can't go wrong with a FA. You can load it as hot and as low as you want to go. Big bores are not for everybody, and you may not like them. Also, you can always get your money back out of a Freedom Arms if you don't like it. Hope this helps.

Just your opinion. :roll:

Dusty Miller · « **Reply #10 on:** December 03, 2004, 10:33:22 AM »

That's right, Redhawk, its just his opinion. Isen't' that what we ALL do here, express our opinions? There's nothing wrong with that.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #11 on:** December 03, 2004, 10:50:09 AM »

Quote from: Dusty Miller

That's right, Redhawk, its just his opinion. Isen't' that what we ALL do here, express our opinions? There's nothing wrong with that.

Your absolutely right. I am glad I can make an informed decision on my own.

KENTDEP · « **Reply #12 on:** December 03, 2004, 04:12:31 PM »

Thanks for the opinions guys! I appreciate your advise. I'll have to save up my allowance and my paper route money and get a FA. I like the idea of the .454 and buying the other cylinders too.

Thanks again,

Jay

SaguaroKid · « **Reply #13 on:** December 03, 2004, 10:16:02 PM »

I bought a new BRF in .454, took it out for the first time and the base pin broke on the third shot. Factory ammo too. I couldn't get it apart. Had to take it back to where I bought it with live rounds in it. They send it back for me. I told them I'd rather have a Super Red Hawk, so they said ok. The Red hawks rear sight was milled off center about .010, looked funny, I didn't notice it when I bought it. Trigger pull kept getting increasingly worse for some reason. Got rid of it and got a F.A. and love it. It's a work of art. Everthing is just done right, linebored, great sight system, locks up tight, cylinder doesn't flop around. I had a Raging Bull to I feel it was better than the SRH or BFR just didn't feel right, I like to buy USA. Get a F.A. you won't be sorry.

EdK · « **Reply #14 on:** December 04, 2004, 03:03:00 AM »

Quote from: KENTDEP

I like the idea of the .454 and buying the other cylinders too.

I too like the FA 454 but I can't say I'm keen on buying 45 Colt and 45 ACP cylinders for it. That's a a lot of dough! Why not handload 454 brass to whatever level you want? The price of just one cylinder is enough to get you into reloading if you aren't already.

Dusty Miller · « **Reply #15 on:** December 04, 2004, 11:05:55 AM »

That's what I do EdK.

Bill T · « **Reply #16 on:** December 05, 2004, 05:21:00 AM »

You could buy a Ruger Blackhawk Convertable in .45 Colt / .45 ACP, for what Freedom Arms will charge for 2 extra cylinders. Bill T.

Graybeard · « **Reply #17 on:** December 05, 2004, 07:04:29 AM »

Quote

You could buy a Ruger Blackhawk Convertable in .45 Colt / .45 ACP, for what Freedom Arms will charge for 2 extra cylinders. Bill T.

Yup so ya could. But you'll still have a Ruger then.

Bill T · « **Reply #18 on:** December 05, 2004, 08:34:34 AM »

2 complete guns instead of a bunch of fitted parts. Sounds good to me. Bill T.

Dusty Miller · « **Reply #19 on:** December 05, 2004, 09:13:36 AM »

Yep, so you could. But you'll still have a Ruger then. (Which, I guess, ain't really all that bad!)

Graybeard · « **Reply #20 on:** December 05, 2004, 10:25:26 AM »

Don't ya just love the way we can all agree on such matters? :-D

In truth an FA is not for everyone and not every one should own one anymore than everyone wants to own one. For sure a person just getting into handgunning shouldn't buy one. Far better to go thru a few other types and brands and learn what you like and whether you like handgunning at all. For some there is never the need or desire to move beyond those other guns.

But for some there is. For some the gun becomes the weak link in the system and more than factory class is no longer enough. Some chose to go the route of sending off the factory guns to custom gunsmiths to be turned into more. Some chose to buy quality right from the maker and for sure FA is that.

I think when the time is right for one to move to an FA or even to a customized factory gun you'll know it. Until then I agree staying with a gun such as a Ruger is all that's really called for. While it's taken me a long time to really decide the time has come I have decided it has and have moved to the FA. For some it comes early, for others never at all.

targetshootr · « **Reply #21 on:** December 05, 2004, 01:59:10 PM »

I've been looking for this topic. I have been debating sending my 454 to have a 45 colt cylinder fitted. I don't shoot it as much as I should and if it had another cylinder, that might make a difference. Otoh, a second hand BFR could be found for not much more than a new cylinder. That's if BFR makes one in 45 colt only. Otherwise, it's a no brainer.

TScottO · « **Reply #22 on:** December 05, 2004, 03:07:42 PM »

Truly fine SA revolvers start and end with Freedom Arms. Anything else for a big bore is just a substitute. The custom jobs are real nice and well built when you have a good Smith perform the work but the materials used in customized X-brand guns are not on par with FA. There are benefits to having a custom built Ruger as opposed to a FA but its not because the gun is stronger or made of better quality steel. The main reason is you can shoot longer bullets in customs because Rugers have a longer cylinder. Other than that, its simply cosmetics. Cosmetics can be added to FA guns if you wish to have them sent off to someone like Bowen.

People have guns they prefer and thats all well and good. No matter how strongly someone feels or how proud they are their gun will never be FA quality, BFR, custom built Ruger, it doesnt matter.

I have the 45 Colt cylinder for my 454 and to be honest, I never shoot it. I would have been better off spending that money on 454 loading components. The only difference in down loading the 454 as opposed to loading 45 Colt is that you spend a little more powder than you would in a 45 case to get the same velocity. You are also using up the life on 454 brass which is a little more expensive. All and all, the cost savings is probably offset by the price of the cylinder alone not to mention having to be set up to load 45 Colt cartridges. To me, the additional cylinder is a waste of money.

Be Safe,
Scott

knight0334 · « **Reply #23 on:** December 06, 2004, 02:49:49 AM »

I know this must be sort of a dumb question, but here goes:

Cant ya shoot 45LC's in a 454 cylinder like you would 38spl in a 357mag or 44spl in a 44mag? If such is the case, why bother with extra cylinders? ...unless you wanna shoot the ACP rounds.

inluvwithsara · « **Reply #24 on:** December 06, 2004, 03:35:51 AM »

to unlock the true potential of the rounds, RELOAD!!!!
44 is fun, as is 45 colt...but with reloading(responsibly) they become a gun that is more flexable...I am anxiously awaiting Ruger to make a 480 or 454 in the Super Blackhawk hunter line...I love FA's and they are a work of art...but way out of my price range...
Reloading though makes it afordable to shoot as much as you'd like...take my 44's for instance...the cheapest I find ammo for is about 16 bucks for 50...$20 for cowboy loads in 44 special...I reload at 6 bucks a box of 50...full magnums, or soft cowboys...(not saying a cowboy is soft...)
In 45 colt, you can out mag the 44mag, or make a all day plinker...in 454 or 475...man...you can do so much more on the top end...BUT ALWAYS USE MANUALS, DON'T GET DUMB WITH THE, WHAT HAPPENS IF i FILL IT TO THE MAX VOL OF THE CASEING...
speaking of casings...I am a huge Starline fan...

Get a Dillon 550 and enjoy the other side of shooting!!!

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #25 on:** December 06, 2004, 08:17:44 AM »

but they wont make me a blued case hardened one Scott and they wont make a .500

Quote from: TScottO

Truly fine SA revolvers start and end with Freedom Arms. Anything else for a big bore is just a substitute. The custom jobs are real nice and well built when you have a good Smith perform the work but the materials used in customized X-brand guns are not on par with FA. There are benefits to having a custom built Ruger as opposed to a FA but its not because the gun is stronger or made of better quality steel. The main reason is you can shoot longer bullets in customs because Rugers have a longer cylinder. Other than that, its simply cosmetics. Cosmetics can be added to FA guns if you wish to have them sent off to someone like Bowen.

People have guns they prefer and thats all well and good. No matter how strongly someone feels or how proud they are their gun will never be FA quality, BFR, custom built Ruger, it doesnt matter.

I have the 45 Colt cylinder for my 454 and to be honest, I never shoot it. I would have been better off spending that money on 454 loading components. The only difference in down loading the 454 as opposed to loading 45 Colt is that you spend a little more powder than you would in a 45 case to get the same velocity. You are also using up the life on 454 brass which is a little more expensive. All and all, the cost savings is probably offset by the price of the cylinder alone not to mention having to be set up to load 45 Colt cartridges. To me, the additional cylinder is a waste of money.

Be Safe,
Scott

targetshootr · « **Reply #26 on:** December 06, 2004, 10:30:15 AM »

Quote from: inluvwithsara

I am anxiously awaiting Ruger to make a 480 or 454 in the Super Blackhawk hunter line...

My theory is that Ruger probably won't make a single action in 480 or 454 because, for all intents and purposes, they make the BFRs and would be cutting into one of their customers market if they did.

As for reloading, the reason I don't load much 454 much as I do 44s and 45s is because you have to do a change over, from large pistol to small pistol primers.

And wouldn't it be great if FA offered different finishes on their guns. That's one reason I also like custom guns. A deep blue or case coloring or what ever else, means a lot to a lot of gun cranks.

Golsovia · « **Reply #27 on:** December 06, 2004, 01:36:28 PM »

The difference between the Rugers and BFRs is not that one is better - though one may be- the big difference is that MR offers different and novel types of revolvers.

I certainly don't agree that Rugers are not finished as well nor that they are not as strong. For example, look at the difference in the frame thickness at the sight cut-out here:

I don't think the BFR matches the Ruger in strength here unless they are doing it with superior metallurgy in which case their metal mass overall is overdone.

In terms of finish, the BFR also lacks in quality with the brushing and polishing being overdone to the point where edges are "washed" and areas that should be straight or flat aren't.

I do believe the BFR is line bored if I remember some of the info that was packed with mine. I have never scoped mine (though it is drilled and tapped for a scope) but it seems to shoot pretty well with open sights- at least as well as I can see open sights these days. :?

The Rugers are a lot of gun for the money. They would certainly put the BFRs to shame in like calibers as much as Ruger builds for them. (I do think Ruger should build a single action for the 480.) Clearly neither the Ruger nor the BFR are in the same league as the semi-custom (FA) or the full custom guns. Magnum Research was wise, I think, to build for the novelty type market, in this case the really big guns. I don't think they'd still be around if they were going head to head with the others presently carrying the mainlines.

TScottO · « **Reply #28 on:** December 06, 2004, 01:53:31 PM »

True dat Lloyd :lol:

Knight0334

Other makes of guns such as Ruger and Tarus do not have chambers that are as tight and precise as FA. In their guns you can shoot either 45Colt or 454 Cassull with out problems.

When shooting 45 Colt cartridges in 454 cylinders a ring of residue will build up. With out this ring being completely removed and squeaky clean and with the tight FA chambers and the 454 being such a high pressure round in the 60k range the amount of space that residue ring takes up causes much larger than normal pressures to occur. In point, a damaged gun due to this will not be warranted by FA. With the chamber being squeaky clean will be fine.

The long term problem is that continuous shooting of 45Colt in FAs tight chambers will eventually cause the chamber walls to erode at the case mouth and throw the tolerances out of spec, again causing pressure and extraction problems. FA says not to shoot 45Colt in the 454 cylinders and will not honor the warranty due to such damage. Its best just to pay 48 extra bucks for 500pcs of 454 brass as opposed to 45 Colt brass.

As you well know the price of brass depreciates quickly with each reload. In the end the cost of brass is minimal. The most expensive cost of reloading is bullets. Pushing a 300gr bullet at warm 45 Colt velocities, 1200fps, you will get many many reloads out of one piece of 454 brass.

Be Safe,
Scott

targetshootr · « **Reply #29 on:** December 06, 2004, 02:19:09 PM »

Thanks for posting pics, Golsovia. I'm working on a deal for 45 colt BFR which will be a lot less than a custom five shot conversion. And it appears the grip frame is identical to a Ruger. The one thing I'm not crazy about is the square trigger guard which would have to go. How would you compare weight between the two? The stainless Blackhawk I had felt like it was made of lead.