Author Topic: Need Any Help Offered! Skunked again...In Oklahoma.  (Read 1138 times)

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Offline oklahuntingfool

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Need Any Help Offered! Skunked again...In Oklahoma.
« on: January 03, 2005, 12:22:08 PM »
I've tried calling 15 to 20 times over the last 3 to 4 years with no luck.  I hunt an area where I've killed coyotes while deer hunting.  Last year I saw a bobcat traveling down a creek bank near my stand.  The coyote tracks and poop are all over the area.  
I have tried mouth blown rodent squeakers and rabbit calls.  Last year I bought a PreyMaster electronic call and have used it a couple of times.  No luck.  I use full camo, facenet, and cover scent.  I sneak into an area w/o making too much noise.  

Questions:
1.  Anyone have video tapes they are tired of watching and want to sell cheap?
2.  Anyone live near Edmond/Oklahoma City who would like to give a lesson to an unlucky hunter?


Also, I have seen bobcats along my back property fenceline on a few occasions.  The distance is 130 yards.  I am thinking about buying a .17hmr.  Will this be a good gun for coyote/bobcat at this distance and closer.  I have neighbors and understand this round has less chance at a ricochet and is not as loud as a .22 magnum?  
What is the most economical brand as I don't want a divorce.  I've heard the Savage is a good gun for the money, straight out of the box.  I may try to find and economical .223 if someone can recommend one.

Any advice?

huntingfool@gbronline.com

Offline Wlscott

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« Reply #1 on: January 03, 2005, 01:49:02 PM »
First off, the .17HMR isn't enough gun for bobcats IN MY OPINION.  Get a .223.  As far as an economical .223......Check out the H&R/NEF rifles.  I have one in .223, 45-70 and 7MM08.  They're very inexpensive and plenty accurate.  My .223Ultra Varmint will shoot next to my Colt Accurized AR15 for groups.  

I've been calling coyotes for a lot of years, and I've had the worst luck ever the last two or three years.  Out here in the Panhandle, the coyotes have had the mange pretty bad for the last several years, and I think it's finally taking its toll on them.

Add to that the fact that more people than ever are calling dogs and you've got a pretty dry year.  

I am not a real big fan of electronic calls.  I prefer open reed mouth calls.  They're more versital once you get the hang of them.

I say keep trying.  It sounds like you're doing everything right.  The only thing I would ask is how big is the area you are calling in?  You might be over calling it.  Coyotes are very smart and will get wise to a call if you call one in and don't kill it.

Also always call where you can see a long ways down wind.  Especially if you're calling smart dogs.  They'll almost always circle downwind to scent check an area before coming in.

Keep trying and good luck.
You haven't hunted......Until you've hunted the hunters

Offline skinner

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« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2005, 09:49:31 AM »
Well it sounds like you are going at in the wright way. I have hunted Coyotes for over 30 years and I will tell that they never stop hurting my ego :-D  :-D their will be times that you will call in a coyote and not even know it, if they catch wind of you or if they see you moving about, they will be out of town in no time.
I use both mouth calls and E-Callers, and I like them both. I find that the e-callers come in real handing when hunting in a area that is over called and were the coyotes have become educated you can throw a distress sound that they have never heard and because they are an animal that will take advantage of anything that sounds like it could make a nice snack.
 I to have the prey master caller I have found that the kid Goat distress and the wild piget distress work real well in fact the last time I used the wild piglet I had three coyotes come in.
when making your stand try and make as little movement as you can if you spot a dog only move when he is moving if he stops you stop. there eye site is out of this world. don't let them get you down just keep at it. if you want you can email me if you have anymore guestions I maybe able to see if a friend of mine still has some of is hunting tapes.
skinner

Offline skinner

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« Reply #3 on: January 04, 2005, 05:51:02 PM »
hello oklahuntingfool I talk to my hunting partner and he said that he had a tape from hunter's specialties that he would give up, so send me a email with your addy and we will get you your tape

Offline oklahuntingfool

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« Reply #4 on: January 05, 2005, 07:37:20 AM »
A simple question....would you use a pig or goat distress if your hunting an area where they yotes have probably never heard a pig or goat?  Or does thier natural instinct kick in?

Offline skinner

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« Reply #5 on: January 05, 2005, 10:09:45 AM »
thier natural instinct kick in
they will respond to it because its new, and it sounds like its hurt, which in turn means  bingo its dinner time.

Offline Howler

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Calling
« Reply #6 on: January 07, 2005, 05:58:14 PM »
Im assuming you have access to quite a bit of ground.The most important thing you can do to be more successful is to get to know your area well. Coyotes might only spend a day or so in one given part of there territory so its important to know where they hang out in the day. Knowing your country is important, but knowing where to set & call is just as important.  Stand selection is not just chosen because of wind direction! it also has allot to do with using the terrain & other obstacles to your advantage!  example ---put your wind into places the coyote will be uncomfortable traveling!  they would rather take the easiest rout to get to the sound,but they will also take the easiest rout getting the wind on ya if you make them suspicious!((Thats something to think on))  The great thing about getting to know your area is that when they get wise to the call,(( & they will)) you will  know your area well enough to know where they hold up in the day!  I have taken quite a few coyotes by spot & stalk methods. Sometimes it seems more rewarding!

Offline Old Griz

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« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2005, 06:44:45 PM »
:cb2: I think the best thing for you is the .223. A while back, I think it was Guns and Ammo magazine compared 4 different varmint rifle/scope combos. At the cheap end was the NEF, and the high $ model was a Weatherby. The NEF came in second behind the Savage. The fact that it beat the Weatherby says it is a pretty good shooter and a great value for the money.

I've tried the reed callers, but I can hear them yotes in the distance laughing at me. I can't make one sound like any creature on this planet. I have to stick with the electronic callers. I can push a button.
Griz
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Offline 223Shooter

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« Reply #8 on: January 11, 2005, 09:05:47 AM »
I'm with griz...when I use my hand calls, I sound like a sick cow !!  I use my Loudmouth e-caller all of the time....and once in awhile I get a coyote or two....using my .223 NEF...works just fine.

Offline varmit_master

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« Reply #9 on: January 11, 2005, 11:02:29 PM »
Hi the sound of a distress animal dont have to from there i use a Jackrabbit here in Arkansas and i have never seen a jackrabbit or snowshoe hare BUT they work the coyotes like them some of the best sounds i have used on bobcats is Johnny Stewart yellewhammer woodpecker in distress or Superjack rodent in distress i have used a 512 caller alot and hand calls i just order me a new Fox Pro with remote cant wait to get it in and if you dont want to spend a lot of money on a gun look at a Rossi 223 single shot i had one and with factory ammo Win varmint pack 45gr HP it would shoot a 3/4 inch group and they are worth the money and you can get one for under 200.00 dollars  good luck and if you need any more help e mail me VM :D

Offline oklahuntingfool

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« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2005, 11:21:25 AM »
Went out this morning with my 9 yr old.  Was in the field right at first light, before sunup.  Just for fun, tried the coyote howl that came with the Johnny Stewart Electronic call.  Then later tried the distressed goat.  Called for about 15 - 20 minutes off and on.  Son was behind two round bales and was completely hidden as he is not always perfectly still.  Moved about 1/4 mile over the next hill and called again.
NOTHING AGAIN!
Was bitter cold, son's got cold so we left.
There were coyote tracks, maybe fox, and lots of poop.

Will keep trying.....

Anyone have a .17hmr or a .223 they want to sell.  Still looking for a plain jane, no frills rifle that won't cause a divorce if I bought.

Offline skinner

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« Reply #11 on: January 19, 2005, 11:51:17 AM »
oklahuntingfool sorry to hear that you got skunk again. but keep trying because everytime your out there with your son then it was a great hunt. if you would have called one up and got it that would have been just the icing on the cake. you keep trying its going to happen
skinner

Offline oso45-70

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Predator and Varmint Hunting
« Reply #12 on: January 19, 2005, 01:50:12 PM »
Oklahomahunter,

The art of calling does not offer one instant gratification, When it happens is when you make the kill, But there is no telling when it does happen. Don't give up cause you arn't the only one it happens to. You can ask any of the people that call all the time and they will tell you that they have dry spells too. Don't be afraid to try new ideas. Be aware of the wind direction
and place your self to where you can see the greatest area and watch your back door, cayotes are great at going around you in order to get down wind from you. If some one is going to send you some calling tapes
pay close attention to the time duration between calls. Most newbies try to call too often and too close togather. You must make it as near to what you would think an animal would do in distress. Watch your movement and stay as still as possable. All these things are important and they will came to you. Just takes time but its worth it. I was lucky growing up on a ranch that was miles away from any other people. I called my first yote up in 1948 before all this became a fad And have been hooked on it ever since. Good luck to ya Sir hope you make great caller some day........Joe........
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Offline Glanceblamm

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« Reply #13 on: January 19, 2005, 05:20:51 PM »
Quote
I've tried calling 15 to 20 times over the last 3 to 4 years with no luck.

IMO the math doesn't work out too well. I think the average success rate is one critter per every ten calling sites. Proficiency does go up as you gain experience, changing up calls & throwing the howler in. The important thing is to be there but not in the same place too often. :D

Offline oklahuntingfool

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« Reply #14 on: January 21, 2005, 10:33:31 AM »
Please provide information on locating coyotes.  Is it through howling?  If so, when do you howl, before daylight?  Can you howl after daylight?  How long, etc.

Any help?

Offline Wlscott

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« Reply #15 on: January 23, 2005, 07:50:49 AM »
Usually, you're going to hear 'em howling just before or after sun-up, and sometime in the hour before sun-down.  

The only vocalizations I've heard at mid day are warning barks when they've busted me.  
 
If I am calling a set, and I hear a bunch howling, I'll usually try to hit 'em with return  challenge howls and barks.  challenge howls are shorter and choppier.

If you want to try to prompt them to howl in order to locate them, try a long drawn out howl.  This is called a lonesome Howl and is used by coyotes to locate others of their kind.  Sometimes they'll answer it, sometimes they won't.  If you do get an answer, even if if is a long ways off, sit still and keep your eye's open, especially this time of the year.  Most times a pair will come in to try to run off the intruder.  

Keep trying and you'll get it.   Just takes time and practice.
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Offline oso45-70

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« Reply #16 on: January 23, 2005, 09:54:06 AM »
Oklahomahunter,

Another thing you might try is to get in touch with all the land owners in the area you wish to call in and ask them where they see the most cayotes. they are better able to tell you where the largest consentration of yotes are, They may even give you permission to hunt on their land.
WIscott gave you some good tips, The main thing is to get out there and try all the things you have picked up on this thread. good luck and have a safe day.........Joe.........
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Offline Swift One

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« Reply #17 on: January 24, 2005, 02:26:38 AM »
The 3 biggest factors that I pay close attention to is stealth, wind, and calling areas.

[/b]STEALTH:  One of the biggest factors in Predator hunting.  Being quiet is 50% of the game in my opinion.  Slamming car doors, interior lights and alarms, exsessive talking  metal clanging metal, and just too much noise in general will ruin a hunt before it gets started.  thinm about getting in the field just before first light.  How quiet is the air?  It's almost eery.  Every sound seems to be amlified by 100%.  Crunchy snow, dried leaves and thick brush all are your enemy.  Walk slow and mentally pre-scout your approch to the stand.  As far as parnters go. You can be as noise disciplined as you want but if your partner is a bull in a china shop, the odds are going to be in the pred's favor.  it took me 3 partners to finally find the right one.  The guy I am with now is a ghost in the woods and can shoot like a sniper.  Couldn't ask for a better partner.  Bottom line is, if you are serious about your pred hunting, get a partner that is too.

make sure that gear you are carrying is secured and silent.  Make sure your gun barrel isn't clanging on anything, your clothes are quiet (I have had terrible experiences with carhart material), and your gear in general is secured close to your body so it doesn't get hung up on the foilage you are walking through.

WIND: ALWAYS use the wind to your advantage. because, believe me, the yotes will use it to theres.  When approaching your stand, have the wind in your face or crossing your nose.  NEVER walk with the wind at your back.  When calling, have the wind in your face or again, crossing your nose.

I generally like to set up cross wind.  When setting up crosswind, I like to have a large obstacle at my back like a large creek or something that the yote cannot cross and would result in him sneaking up on me.  In front of me is an open area so I can see the yote going down wind.  If I have a partner, I will have him placed 50-100yds down wind to watch my backside. If I am setting up with the wind in my face, I like to have good visibility on both sides of me so I can see the dog circling.  Again, if I have a partner, I will have him 50-100yds down wind watching my backside.


CALLING AREAS  A deer hunter can hunt every day of the deer seasons for 20yrs on a 40 acre plot of land and be content.  Probably will tag out every year if there are alot of deer in the area.  A predator hunter on the other hand, cannot have enough land.  A seasoned (and what I consider a pro) Coyote hunter once told me that ideally, a yote hunter shouldhave enough land accesibility to call in one area only once or twice a season.  Most of us however, do not have enough access like that.

I am building my land accessibility so that I can get away with calling an area maybe 6 times a year.  You can revisit land that you have called on but there is a way to do it.  You cannot go calling one plot of land every day for a two week period using the same sound and expect to call in dogs.  I like to call an area, wait a couple of weeks, then return using a different sound, setting up ina different location, and if possible, calling at a different time of the day.  Those states that allow hunting at night can really use this to trick the dogs.  If you go in the first light hours on day, return 2 weeks later and try calling after dark.

Access to as much land as possible will really pay off in the long run.  especially if you are the only predator hunter that the landowner allows access.  Hope this helps.
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Offline oklahuntingfool

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« Reply #18 on: January 28, 2005, 01:53:55 AM »
Another quick question....if you use coyote pup barks or distress noises during the time of year there are no pups, will that scare them off or does natural instint kick in for them to investigate?

Offline Wlscott

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« Reply #19 on: January 28, 2005, 03:59:47 AM »
It's kind of hard to tell if it scares 'em off or not, because the ones you scare off, you usually don't know are there :)

Actually, I don't think it does.  I've called in dogs all times of the year using pup squeals and barks mixed in with distress prey sounds.  

Right now IS, however the best time of the year to use coyote sounds because they are paired up and breeding.  They become very territorial.
You haven't hunted......Until you've hunted the hunters