Author Topic: Bullet Casting Alloys  (Read 1415 times)

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Offline unclenick

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Bullet Casting Alloys
« on: January 09, 2005, 06:55:27 AM »
Veral,
 
I notice some outfits sell ammunition that employs water-quenched hard cast bullets that they say are low antimony alloy to avoid shattering.  I recall reading somewhere that what makes it possible to water-harden lead alloys is the inclusion of a tiny amount of arsenic, which wheel weights apparently have.  My objective is a water-hardened bullet alloy that won't be brittle enough to disintegrate when it hits bone in cold weather.  
 
Of course this raises a half-dozen questions:  
 
 (I'll bracket my answers and and put them with your questions to make it easy to follow for anyone reading.)
 
How low does the antimony percentage in a bullet alloy have to go to avoid cold weather shattering?  (The lower the better. So for the coldest weather performance, use just enough antimony to get the hardness needed to obtain desired velocity.  For revolver use, just wheel weight metal water quenched will not let you down.  For higher velocity rifle use, dilute the WW with half  or three quarters lead and oven harden.  Optimum hardness for rifle use will be 16 bhn with the very low antimony alloy.)  
 
Can wheelweight alloy bullets shatter hitting bone in cold weather?  (Yes, when fired from rifles.  I find that 20 bhn bullets turn to powder with very shallow penetration, with impact velocities of about 2600 fps and higher at temperatures below 0 F.  Follow above procedure outlined above.)  
 
How much arsenic has to be present for water hardening to work? (A trace and WW alloy has it, and one is probably wise to use it unless they cannot find junk wheel weights.  Try scrap metal dealers, and most tire shops have contracts for their scrap weights and won't sell to individuals.  Many commercial casting alloys don't.  Ask the manufacturer if you want to experiment with their alloy.)  
 
Is the degree of water hardening a factor in the tendency to shatter in cold weather (BHN 20, 25, 30, 35)? (Yes, along with speed.  i.e. If the hardness is high enough to eliminate deformation at the speed of interest, it will not shatter except on impact with very large bones.  I believe my book will inform you quite well on the particulars.  But you can test on water filled one gallon plastic jugs, shot at very close range with gun and ammo at the temperature of interest, and ammo loaded at a bit higher velocity than will be used on the hunt.  It the bullet will penetrate a piece of 2X plank placed behind the water jug it will kill game cleanly.)
 
Does the addition of a couple percent of silver help (I've seen some bullet makers advertise this alloy)? (Trust me.  NO MANAFACTURE PUTS EVEN ONE PERCENT SILVER IN THEIR ALLOY!  They could not afford to use more than a trace, and only a trace will improve castibility, and make bullets much more shiny, but I cannot detect any other advantage.  I melt off about a two inch length of 1/8 inch diameter no lead plumbers solder per 20 lb pot of any alloy I use, just for those two advantages. Most hardwares sell this solder and the very common Trustworthy brand is fine.  If not that brand, read the label and be sure it contains silver.  The rest will be tin and a small amount of antimony. )
 
 
Thanks,
Nick

Offline Veral

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« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2005, 09:08:03 AM »
I've put my answers with the questions above, to avoid confusion because there were so many.
Veral Smith

Offline unclenick

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« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2005, 02:49:06 PM »
Veral,

Thanks for the detailed answer.  Regarding your book, I have a copy I bought back in the late 80's or early 90's, along with a lapping kit and hardness measuring tool.  It didn't occur to me to go back through the book on the hardness/shattering question (read it too long ago) but I will.  That is, of course, unless you have added enough new material to make it a good idea to buy a new edition?   Is that the case?

Also, I have used the old lapping kit, but still have some abrasive (goes a long way).  Have you changed or improved your formulation and method any?  Should I buy a newer kit, or am I still up to date?

By the way, my Dad's stainless steel Savage .308 has a slight tight spot in the barrel that seems to resist firelapping out.  Is Savage using steel as tough as Ruger?  If so, I just need to keep at it until it finall shoots out.

Thanks,
Nick

Offline Veral

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« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2005, 12:47:38 PM »
If the book you have is the second edition, you'd do well to get the third, which has over double the information.

   If the lap compound you have is soft and black, it is the same as I sell now, and will never go bad till the container breaks from age.  If you have the early brown and hard material, you'd like the new better, that there is nothing wrong with what you have.  Better to use it and spend your spare coins on things you need.  Like molds primers powder etc!

   I haven't heard that Savage stainless is hard to lap.  However, the old brown lap compound would have trouble cutting a bad restriction out if the steel were abrasion resistent.  The newer black and soft compound and much more agressive.  Either way.  Don't quit lapping till a push through slugs goes through smoothly.  You'll be glad you were persistent.
Veral Smith