Mueller scopes?

[The deerslayer]

Are these good reliable scopes?

[TheOpticZone]

Deerslayer,

We started carrying these scopes about 4-5 weeks ago and I had the opportunity to look at all the models.  I will have to say that I was very impress with the quality and feature for the price they are going for.  They have a Lifetime warranty.  They have become one of our biggest sellers in the last couple of weeks.  From what I have seen, I would highly recommend them.

[timbertoes]

The one thing i ask myself is ....how  long will they be around?....certainly a factor, and one that any new company would have to deal with, in terms of product image. Since they indicate that the scopes are built in China with parts sourced from all over, will the models purchased now be servicable in the future. And what is Muellers definiton of lifetime ?  Is it the PRODUCTS  lifetime...or the Owner!!  :eek:

[Graybeard]

Hang around a little while. I'm sure Rich the owner will drop in and answer these questions personally. I need to call him anyway so while I'm talking to him I'll ask him to stop by and respond.

[quickdtoo]

The warranty is for the life of the scope as long as the owner has the original sales receipt, doesn't matter if it's the original owner or not.

As for the scopes, they are an excellent buy, I have 3 of em with a 4th on the way from The Optic Zone, who btw has free ground shipping on them right now... Thanks Jon!!....

Mueller customer service is also hard to beat, I've seen a few posts at RFC where a scope received had a small defect and Meuller replaced the scope within a week and in every case the customer was extremely happy with the service and product.

Mueller Limited Lifetime Warranty

[Mueller Optics]

I guess I should have gotten here earlier. Thanks to everyone for helping clear the airways concerning Mueller new line of scopes.

1. How long will they be around?

Mueller plans to be around for generations and is approaching the market as professionally and carefully as possible. What we mean by this is we have no intentions of growing to fast, which can hurt a business. We even decided to pass on the Shot Show this year because we are happy with our current growth rate and have no interest in pursuing to many new clients to early. By growing slowly allows us to build a strong foundation and easily control it. We are also limiting our dealer network to only a select amount of Internet dealers; all other dealers will be required to have storefronts.

2. Will the models purchased now be serviceable in the future?

Mueller is working with many different parts manufactures so if one particular component isn’t available, we can easily have another source produce it. Having everything produced under on roof could cause serious problems should something happen to that source so we made provisions to not let that happen.

3. We have also done many things to reduce costs to give you the best possible price and easily compete with higher priced scopes. An example would be that we sell dealer direct (no distributors). Also, the cost of today’s advertising is outrageous with costs that can exceed $5000 for one ad, in one magazine, for one month. Can you imagine doing this in 10-30 magazines a month? And guess who pays for it in the long run? That’s right, it all gets driven into the cost of the products. How about TV advertising? We just received a call for a 10 second spot on a not so popular Hunting show for 26 episodes at a cost of $17,000…. We are approaching the marketing in a different way and rely on word of mouth endorsements and only advertise in targeted areas that we know will produce results so we don’t have to drive extra costs into the products we offer.

Hope this make you feel somewhat more comfortable about buying a product from Mueller.
Mueller Optics

[The deerslayer]

Well it looks like I'm going to have a mueller scope soon. Thanks for the quick replies

[timbertoes]

so exactly  how long is the Warranty?  I read the info on the linked page, and did not get a clear understanding. there is no actual time frame specified.
am contemplating a shotgun scope by feburary.

[quickdtoo]

Lifetime means for the life of the scope. I have the 2-7x32 Multi-shot shotgun scope, look down the page for my review on it, great scope... :wink:

[mrlizzzard]

I have the Mueller 2x7 and am very happy with it.The lighted dot has such settings it does not get in your way .The scope is clear,very clear, I'm keeping mine and adding the Tactical when it's available.
lizzzard

[JoeRobbins]

Tacticals are in. I got my 4-16 a couple weeks ago. It's mounted, but hasn't been used yet.

Joe

[Mueller Optics]

Tacticals are in. I got my 4-16 a couple weeks ago. It's mounted, but hasn't been used yet.

Joe

What's your initial impression of the scope as far as brightness, clarity design, features, etc...

Everyone is looking for feedback on our scopes so please feel free to give your initial impression and even follow-up once you use it.

Thanks for your support
MO

[goose7856]

Rich, I also just purchased the Tactical.

First impressions are well, great. First off, very quick shipping. Good packaging. The only thing bad about the packageing was that on the outsie of the box it talks about the features for the 4-16x40IGR Sportdot, but I guess since I was one of the first to buy the Tactical, the boxes just havent been made yet.

First impressions about the actual scope:

Positive:
Very clear to my eyes. I had actually forgotten that the mildot will illuminate, which is great also. I find that suring the day to see it, you need to put it on the higher levels, but at night, I checked and on about "4" it seemed to be the best. Adjustable objective goes wayyyy past the 15 yard mark, idk if all the scopes do this, but at one point I got scraed it was going to start unscrewing itself, but it finally stopped. I would bet it can focus well under 10 yards but have not tried yet. Great power range also (4-16). I have not done a side by side comparison, but it seems VERY comparable with my Nikon Buckmaster 4-12x50 AO....so I would think when I compare those two, they are "apples and apples".

Negatives:
The power ring is very stiff. It almost took two hands to turn the first time I turned it. Hopefully, it will losen up some with use. The only other thing is that when turning the AO at about the 30 yard mark, there seems to be a slight bump/pause, but then it keeps turning smoothly. I tried to see if it was just once, but it seems to happen everytime. Nothing thats a big deal, but I thought I should just mention it.

I will post tonight after I compare my Nikon BM and the Mueller Tactical at dusk. Then we will see the real winner!!

Hope this helps in your decision.

P.S. Rich, if there is anything you would like me to take off of this post will you PM me. I am sorry for saying the few negatives, but I thought to be fair, I should also mention them.

Thanx alot
     

[WNY_Whitetailer]

I am wondering if Mueller is going to get into manufacturing extended eye relief or pistol scopes in the future?  I would be interested in a pistol scope for sure.  Maybe a 2x or 2-6x scope...

[Mueller Optics]

Goose, that was a great non-bias initial evaluation. Most people believe our reviews are bias because some of them come from our dealers when in fact they didn't become dealers until after their review.

The power ring will loosen up somewhat over time and has somewhat tight tolerances initially. Having them to loose initially will loosen up even more over time and then when taking shots, the power ring will move so we opted to have them on the tighter side. Work it a few times and it should feel much better.

Once the AO reaches a ceratin point, another function begins so thats what your feeling and thats normal

Your right the AO will go past the lowest and highest mark because everyone's focusing ability is different and a exact setting of the lowest 15yd mark may not work for everyone so it will travel farther but there is a stop so no need to worry.

WNY_Whitetailer
Heres a sneak preview of what will be available in March or April of this year but no pricing as of yet:
http://www.muelleroptics.com/test/MX1.jpg

Thanks again
MO

[goose7856]

Thanx Rich, like you said, I tried to make it as fair as possible.....i will give another review after the scope is mounted, ect, etc.....but hopefully tonite I can do a fair test to compare the NB to the Mueller Tactical......never got the chance to last nite :oops:

[WNY_Whitetailer]

Ahh...Very nice looking red dot...I'll have to look into it when it comes out...That silver one would look nice on top of a Taurus 357 Mag Revolver...Oh boy...Here we go again.

[timbertoes]

so again, what is the lifetime ?   how many years?

[Graybeard]

so again, what is the lifetime ? how many years?

Guess I don't understand your problem with the definition of life time. Do you know how many years you will live? Don't think any of us do.

Life time warranties never cover a set number of years. They are generally defined as either the life time of the original purchaser or the life time of the item. I'm real clear on the former but less clear on the latter. I generally however take it to mean as long as they can obtain parts for repairs or it will be replaced with a new one.

Maybe Rich will stop back in and clarify his meaning of it.

[timbertoes]

what is the lifetime of the scope(s).

i.e. how long is the scope expected to last before the warranty will no longer apply.

.....................

but on 2nd thought, i guess it not that important.  probably going to be a while before I am personally in the scope buying mode, so I will just keep reading the reviews.

peace  

[goose7856]

no scope is made with a certain "life expectancy". Each scope is different. It depends what you do with it, etc......they are covered for LIFE that is all you should need to know, and I am sure they try and make them so they last your LIFE, so they dont have to pay for new ones if bad materials are used in the first place.

[victorcharlie]

Mueller:  How much would the price of your product increase if it were assembled in the USA?
 
How much margin is in your product?
 
When it is at least assembled in the USA I'll think about giving it a serious look.  Until then......I'm looking closer to home.........
 
convince me that I'm thinking incorrectly and I'll buy one tommorrow......

[timbertoes]

no scope is made with a certain "life expectancy". Each scope is different. It depends what you do with it, etc......they are covered for LIFE that is all you should need to know, and I am sure they try and make them so they last your LIFE, so they dont have to pay for new ones if bad materials are used in the first place.

its not my intention to just stir the pot, but sir, your post makes no sense whatsoever. it also not for you to say what I need to know. unless you are going to buy it for me. I have 27 years exp. in consumer and industrial  product development. there is in fact a lifetime for products, including scopes.

in fact, the first likely thing to "go"  on your scope is the coatings.  But since you probably wont believe me, do your own research.
why dont you call the scope makers and find out things like what kind of glass is used. there is more than one kind, to say the least.  when you read advertsiments on scopes, you should realize that many of the "neato" sounding blurbs are nothing more than the normal way optics are made.

there is the whole internet at your fingertips, have at it. you might even run across the telescopes I have built. built with a life expetancy at that, about 5 years. coatings.

[timbertoes]

Mr. Goose, snce your profile shows you to be a Student, I am sure you can appreciate the educational value of the following information.

when you buy a nikon, or Loopy or other brand, here is what your money is buying:

it's just FYI/entertainment ....
*******************************************************
here is the results from the US Guv's patent office website.
Note Weaver has a Patent for a Semi-Auto Rifle!

Leupold
PAT. NO. Title
1 6,691,447 Non-telescoping riflescope adjustment mechanism
2 6,519,890 Radial detents for rifle scope adjustment
3 6,469,829 Equalized pivot mount for riflescope
4 6,359,418 Replaceable battery module
5 6,351,907 Spiral cam mechanism for rifle sight adjustment
6 6,279,259 Rifle scope adjustment mechanism
7 D427,658 Rifle sight power adjustment ring
8 D421,286 Low profile rifle sight
9 6,005,711 Variable optical power telescopic sight with side focus control
10 D414,835 Clamp jaw for telescopic sight mount
11 D413,153 Rifle sight objective adjustment ring
12 5,035,487 Method and apparatus for releasably mounting an optical device
13 4,643,542 Telescopic sight with erector lens focus adjustment
14 4,408,842 Telescopic sight having lens holder tube with half socket pivot mount
15 4,395,096 Variable magnification telescopic sight having reticle centering mount
16 4,393,595 Tube adjustment gasket and rifle scope employing same


BURRIS
PAT. NO. Title
1 6,449,108 Synthetic erector lens mount
2 5,771,595 Scope tube adjusting and locking device
3 5,680,725 Positive-aligning quick mount
4 5,363,559 Telescope inner tube locking device and method
5 5,020,892 Aperture control for telescopic gunsight
6 4,703,576 Scope mount for Ruger rifles
7 4,497,548 Variable-power riflescope with range-compensating reticle and a field stop diaphram centered off the optical axis
8 4,033,046 Riflescope reticle

NIKON

NIKON has THOUSANDS of Patents....though it seems none for Riflescopes.
Results of Search in db for:
((AN/nikon AND SPEC/rifle) AND SPEC/scope): 0 patents.
Results of Search in db for:
(AN/nikon AND SPEC/rifle): 0 patents.
Results of Search in db for:
(AN/nikon AND SPEC/firearm): 0 patents.

Nikon Binos:
Results of Search in 1976 to present db for:
(AN/Nikon AND SPEC/binoculars): 89 patents.
Hits 1 through 50 out of 89




Simmons
PAT. NO. Title
1 6,508,026 Rifle scope with side indicia
2 4,669,833 Spotting scope with alignment viewer
3 D288,210 Spotting scope

TASCO
Results of Search in db for:
(AN/Tasco AND SPEC/rifle): 0 patents

Bushnell
PAT. NO. Title
1 6,542,302 Lens coating to reduce external fogging of scope lenses
2 D417,679 Rifle scope with zoom

Weaver
1 6,293,041 Rifle rest
2 D282,864 Semiautomatic rifle
3 4,072,396 Focussing objective mechanism for telescopic rifle sights
4 3,979,848 Adjustable base and mount for firearm optical sight
4,172,634 Cam follower for variable power scopes


B&L
Results of Search in 1976 to present db for:
((AN/bausch AND Lomb) AND SPEC/rifle): 4 patents.
Hits 1 through 4 out of 4

PAT. NO. Title
1 4,950,064 Carbon fiber riflescope housing
2 4,554,744 Switch assembly for riflescope
3 4,248,496 Riflescope with data display in field of view
4 3,990,155 Riflescope elevation adjustment assembly

[Mueller Optics]

Lifetime Warranty:
"We will repair or replace it for the life of the scope. The warranty is void if damage results from unauthorized repair, alteration, or misuse. If parts are no longer available, we will replace the scope with another scope of comparable value and function".

victorcharlie;
Having the scopes produced in the USA would significantly increase the price putting us in a much higher price bracket where there is much more compitition. This would make it extremely difficult to compete being a new company. We know there is a whole in the market for quality scopes in the price range we are in and that was our intent when we developed the line. Our plan was well thought out and we worked extremely hard to make availabe a higher quality scope line at a more affordable price.

How much is our margin? You really donk think I'm going to post that do you?

We are doing many things to keep as much work here as possible and recently switched our over-seas shipping sevices to UPS instead of using the original serives that were provided to us and we will continue to do as much as possible as we move forward.

Thanks again
MO

[goose7856]

sry timber if you felt disrespected, and yes there are probably millions of technacalities, but to me life is life......if your use it and it breaks (w/o you breaking it on purpose), then you get it repaired or you are given a new scope. To me thats plain and simple. When you find out if the company is good or not is when they either stand behind their product (Like leupold has the history of doing), or neglecting the item. Maybe that is too simplistic, but there is only so much the consumer needs/can look into. You will always find some ind of fauly with every company. Just outway the good and bad, and choose?!

[Graybeard]

We seem to have some folks in this thread just for the purpose of making attacks on a GBO advertiser and/or products not made wholly in the US. If the only reason you are here is to make such attacks you'd be well advised to move on. You can move on to other topics, other forums or other sites. You'll find I have precious little patience with trouble makers at GBO.

[Zachary]

I myself have been following these posts and, while I initially believed the inquiry regarding the definition of lifetime warranty to be reasonable, now similarly believe it to be argumentative just for argument's sake.

I was going to wait just a little while longer before I put on my moderator's hat, but GB already made our point.

Zachary

[milanuk]

The two things I want to see before buying a scope for anything other than a rimfire (and heck even then I'd prefer to see this information first) are:

1)  A chart listing reticle subtensions at min/max powers.  Shouldn't be hard for the manufacturer to produce, but sometimes it's like pulling friggin' teeth from an old hen w/ some.

2)  Values for how many minute of windage and elevation are availabe.  Again, not a big deal for a rimfire scope, or perhaps on a centerfire .224 or .243 class gun, but for where the ranges start extending, and the requirements start stacking up... buyers need to know how much they are going to have to compensate w/ canted bases, shims, inserts, etc.

Anybody here have that data for these scopes.  If the manufacturer does, I really wish they'd actually post it on their website as something more substantial than what they have now.

Still very interested in these scopes,

Thanks,

Monte

[Mueller Optics]

Hi Monte,
All of our finger adjustable, target style turrets, have 60moa which is fairly broad considering the fine 1/8moa clicks.

Is there a specific model you would like the reticle substension on? I will be more than happy to get that info for you.

Best Regards
MO