Author Topic: How much can you soup up a 357 mag?  (Read 1117 times)

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Offline handgunhuntr

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How much can you soup up a 357 mag?
« on: February 09, 2003, 03:50:42 PM »
I am planning on getting a G2(ha, ha, ha, ha) in 357 mag for deer in a 12" version.  How much can you safely beef up the 357 mag load in 180 gr bullet to have better performance on deer?
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Offline KN

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How much can you soup up a 357 mag?
« Reply #1 on: February 09, 2003, 04:20:05 PM »
Why not just get a 357 maximum barrel?  You can still shoot the 357 magnum from it.  KN

Offline wheelgun

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357mag
« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2003, 02:27:33 AM »
Hey KN i have read that shooting 357mag in max will ring the chamber.I have also read that it is okay to shoot 357 mag in the max.What is your opinion.

Offline Graycg

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How much can you soup up a 357 mag?
« Reply #3 on: February 10, 2003, 08:10:31 AM »
You can load it up hot enough to blow the gun up if you try hard enough with a fast enough powder!

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Offline Bug

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Okay, I'll Ask...
« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2003, 10:26:07 AM »
The .357 mag is to a .38 spl. what the max is to the mag. We all are familiar with +p, and +p+ .38 spl. loadings. Can someone tell me what is wrong with loading a mag to max loads, as long as bullets are seated out to obtain an equal powder chamber volume? This would parallel Elmer Keith's loading of the .44 spl, before the .44 mag. I will grant that the extra case length on the max gives you the opportunity to crimp in the crimping groove provided on jacketed bullets. But, with the generous throats in most T/C barrels, seating out poses no problems. Lee's factory crimp die, or a taper crimp die should take care of the need to crimp jacketed bullets for best ignition. With cast bullets, you could roll crimp wherever you want. Case volume, and hence seating depth, should be okay if COL is the same, whether it is a max or mag case. I have loaded "heavy" .38 spl loads in .38 cases, and .357 cases, interchangeably, using the same bullets, powder charge, and same COL. A chrono and careful case inspection should indicate a slow, steady rise in velocity/pressure until published velocities for the max are obtained. Finally, I WOULD NOT advocate anyone doing this, but it is in my nature to ask "what if". Fire Away,,,Bug.
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Offline PaulS

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How much can you soup up a 357 mag?
« Reply #5 on: February 10, 2003, 11:18:41 AM »
handgunhuntr,
I would go with the .357 Maximum (actually I did) but if you want to get the most from a .357 magnum for hunting try this load:

Reloading Record

TC Contender

Weapon make   Thompson   
Bore-to-sight height (inches)   1.3
Weapon model   Contender   
Twist rate      1 in 14
Barrel length   10 inch   
Serial number   156-2xxxx

Case make                Winchester   
Cartridge head stamp   357 Magnum
Cartridge designation   357 Magnum
Trimmed length (inches)   1.29
Over-all length (inches)   1.59

Bullet make   Speer
Bullet weight (grains)   180
Bullet type                   Flat point
Ballistic coefficient   .245
Bullet diameter   .358

Powder make   Hodgdon
Powder type   H110
Powder charge weight (grains)   16.0
Wad (make and type)                 None
Primer (make and type)   CCI 550

Muzzle velocity(FPS)                   1690
Standard deviation(FPS)             14      
Extreme spread(FPS)                   42
Sight-in-range(yards)      xxxx
Group size(at 25 yards)   .36

This load uses a MAXIMUM charge of powder and you should back it down 5% and work up in small increments. The RIFLE bullet is crimped in the cannelure which makes the cartridge too long for any use other than in single shot weapons. It can be single loaded in some of the lever action carbines but will not feed through the magazine.

The bullet is designed to operate properly in .35 Remington and the velocities out to 100 yards are high enough from a 357 magnum to allow it to function (according to Speer).

This is about the most potent hunting load for the .357 mag and THE most accurate load that I have ever found. I hope this helps.

PaulS
PaulS

Hodgdon, Lyman, Speer, Sierra, Hornady = reliable resources
so and so's pages on the internet = not reliable resources
Alway check loads you find on the internet against manuals.
NEVER exceed maximum listed loads.

Offline PaulS

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Re: 357mag
« Reply #6 on: February 10, 2003, 11:26:32 AM »
Quote from: wheelgun
Hey KN i have read that shooting 357mag in max will ring the chamber.I have also read that it is okay to shoot 357 mag in the max.What is your opinion.


Wheelgun,
I ruined my first .357 Maximum chamber by shooting .357 Magnum loads in it. The ring in the chamber was deep enough to cut the longer Maximum cases at the length of the magnum cases in just a few shots. 38 spl cases are ok because the pressure is not high enough to ring the chamber but at magnum pressures the chamber will be ruined. If you do shoot 38 specials be sure to clean the chamber before shooting the maximum cases as the maximum will imbed any residue into the chamber wall and cause craters.

PaulS
PaulS

Hodgdon, Lyman, Speer, Sierra, Hornady = reliable resources
so and so's pages on the internet = not reliable resources
Alway check loads you find on the internet against manuals.
NEVER exceed maximum listed loads.

Offline Paul H

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How much can you soup up a 357 mag?
« Reply #7 on: February 10, 2003, 12:27:02 PM »
In a 10" 357 mag I was able to push 200 gr cast 1700 fps, which was definately as hard as you can push it.  The problem is, the factory 357 mag barrels have crummy chambers, and it refused to group better then 1" at 25 yds.  

I would imagine a 12" 357 mag could push a 180 gr bullet 1800 fps, but as the others suggest, get a 357 max, as you'll be able to get 2000 fps, maybe a tad more.

Offline UMB

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How much can you soup up a 357 mag?
« Reply #8 on: February 10, 2003, 01:30:24 PM »
I've got a 15" Bullberry 357 Rem Mag Match barrel for my Encore. It does very well at 100 yards with  max loads of 2400 and 158g hp/xtp. I tried some 180g ers and couldn't get them to group. Maybe the twist is not fast enough. Could be something to consider. 8)

Offline KN

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How much can you soup up a 357 mag?
« Reply #9 on: February 10, 2003, 02:29:46 PM »
I've never had the bad experience of ringing a chamber so Im really no expert. Paul S has some comments on the subject that make sense. I don't really know why you would want to shoot mags from a max barrel. Just tone down your load and use max cases. Just my opinion.  KN

Offline Bug

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I agree, But...
« Reply #10 on: February 12, 2003, 11:14:01 PM »
Paul S. brings up a point I hadn't thought about - ringing a Max chamber with Mag brass. My question was intended to be about using .357 Maximum loads in a .357 Magnum chambered barrel, with the bullets seated out to .357 Maximum COL. This should enable one to get Maximum performance out of a Magnum barrel. It wouldn't work on revolvers or lever actions, due to the cartridge length, but seems like it would work in a long-throated Contender, or H&R. Y'all tell me what YOU think.  Bug.
It's The Little Things That Matter.

Offline PaulS

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How much can you soup up a 357 mag?
« Reply #11 on: February 13, 2003, 08:39:21 PM »
Bug,
If you seat a bullet .3 inches out from normal in a 357 mag case you will have to push your bullet into the chamber ahead of the case and then chamber your cartridge. There just isn't enough room to do it that will give you the same powder space as the Maximum.

PaulS
PaulS

Hodgdon, Lyman, Speer, Sierra, Hornady = reliable resources
so and so's pages on the internet = not reliable resources
Alway check loads you find on the internet against manuals.
NEVER exceed maximum listed loads.

Offline Bug

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Hmmmmmm...
« Reply #12 on: February 14, 2003, 04:29:41 AM »
I will accept what you say. I can't say I've been there. I do know that I certainly have loads(in .357 mag. cases) that have bullets seated greater than the 0.030 depth. I just don't know how much more, right now. Looks like more hands-on research is apropriate before I say much more. Have to check the manuals, and do some measuring. I did find out that MY .357 Mag. bbl won't allow bullets to be seated out far enough. though. Later,,,,,,,,Bug.
It's The Little Things That Matter.