Author Topic: Barbarity in America  (Read 5033 times)

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Offline Arkie-06

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Barbarity in America
« on: March 19, 2005, 03:22:34 AM »
Gentlemen, i do not know if this has been discussed yet here regaurding the Terry Schivo case, but if you will go to WorldNetDaily.com and read the article Barbarity in America, it is the most compelling argument i have read lately  concerning the sanctity of human life. It is very good. Read it.
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Offline BamBams

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« Reply #1 on: March 19, 2005, 03:30:23 AM »
Wow!  I'm speechless.  I cannot believe they are still going to do this.  Now it definitely becomes murder.

I am posting this as a link to make it easier to find:

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=43383
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Offline Arkie-06

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« Reply #2 on: March 19, 2005, 03:40:30 AM »
Thanks  BamBams, one of these days i'll learn to do that fancy stuff, but it is Article ID 43381     :grin:
Early to bed, Early to rise, Makes a man Healthy, Wealthy and Wise. :-)

Offline Curtis

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« Reply #3 on: March 19, 2005, 03:56:13 AM »
Lord, please help me to be half the man my dogs think I am.

Contender in 17 Rem, 22lr, 22k Hornet, 223 Rem, 256 WM, 6TCU, 7TCU, 7-30, 30 Herrett, 300 Whisper, 30-30 AI, 357 mag, 357 Herrett, 375 JDJ, 44 mag, 45/410..... so far.

Offline Haywire Haywood

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« Reply #4 on: March 19, 2005, 05:37:34 AM »
The Rabbi makes a compelling argument, and I agree with him that removing the feeding tube is barbaric even tho she will feel no pain or discomfort from it.  The pain and discomfort is going to be for the caretakers that have to watch her deteriorate.

My opinion on whether she should be allowed to die or not would not be a popular one here so I'll just keep it to myself.

Ian
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Offline powderman

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« Reply #5 on: March 19, 2005, 06:37:35 AM »
I've read alot about this case. I've heard it argued that man is playing God by keeping her alive. Thats a crock. Man is useing the knowledge that God gave us to sustain life, thats all. If God wanted her dead, she would be dead. Her heart would explode, or something else would happen, but she would die none the less. Gods will is what folks should be concerned with, not public, liberal opinion.
Where would it stop??? Maybe someone would decide that if any of us were badly injured, or just plain senile, that our quality of life was not worth living. I see a very bad precedent happening here. What about paraplegics? Should they be allowed to live? Of course they should. You only have one life, only God should be allowed to stop it, except for capitol punishment that is. POWDERMAN.  :(  :(  :(  :(
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

Only half the people leave an abortion clinic alive.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAiOEV0v2RM
What part of ILLEGAL is so hard to understand???
I learned everything about islam I need to know on 9-11-01.
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDqmy1cSqgo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_u9kieqGppE&feature=related
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Offline BamBams

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« Reply #6 on: March 19, 2005, 06:40:18 AM »
President's Statement on Terri Schiavo

To: National Desk

Contact: White House Press Office, 202-456-2580

WASHINGTON, March 17 ---- The following is a statement the President made today in regard to Terri Schiavo:

The case of Terri Schiavo raises complex issues. Yet in instances like this one, where there are serious questions and substantial doubts, our society, our laws, and our courts should have a presumption in favor of life. Those who live at the mercy of others deserve our special care and concern. It should be our goal as a nation to build a culture of life, where all Americans are valued, welcomed, and protected – and that culture of life must extend to individuals with disabilities.
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Offline BamBams

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« Reply #7 on: March 19, 2005, 06:44:52 AM »
To: National Desk

Contact: Gary McCullough, 202-546-0054

CLEARWATER, Fl., March 17 /Christian Wire Service/ -- Randall Terry, founder of Operation Rescue, and the President of the Society for Truth and Justice wrote the following letter to Florida Legislators in hopes that they will act to save Terri Schiavo's life:

Dear Senators and Representatives.

As you know, Terry Schiavo is scheduled to begin starvation on Friday, March 18 at 1 p.m.

The unavoidable question with which you must wrestle is this: does a decree by the Supreme Court of the State of Florida, the court of Judge Greer, or any court in the world for that matter, by definition represent "the rule of law?"

The answer must be "no": a judicial decree does not equal "the rule of law." Otherwise, the judicial decrees of Nazi Germany, or Soviet Russia, or Communist China, or Saddam Hussein's Iraq would all be the equivalent of the rule of law. If judicial decrees are the equivalent of the rule of law, then judges can do no wrong; they cannot commit crimes against humanity; and they must not be resisted or disobeyed. The word of a judge would be the rule of law, and judges would reign as an oligarchy amongst us, like gods who walk among men.

Because of your position in the Legislature, Providence has seen fit to make you a part of this battle, and given you the opportunity to help rescue her from a cruel death. Moreover, you have the opportunity to be a part of the larger battle to resist judicial tyranny, and restore justice, the rule of law, and true self government to our state and nation.

As you know, her "death sentence" by starvation and dehydration has been issued by the courts and affirmed by the highest court in our state.

Over the past 40 years, the most sweeping (and most Americans believe the most repugnant) changes on America's political and ethical landscape have been forced upon us by the courts.

You know that the litany of judicial decrees that have unraveled our society is sweeping: removing prayer and the Bible from public schools; removing the 10 Commandments from school hallways and government buildings; striking "under God" from our Pledge of Allegiance; abortion on demand up until the day of birth; allowing the hideous practice of "partial birth abortion;" creating "homosexual marriage" from thin air; unleashing a flood of violent pornography and child pornography in print and on the Internet; telling mothers and fathers that they do not have the right to know if they're 14-year-old daughter is undergoing an abortion; all of these injustices and evils (and many more like them) have come through the judiciary.

But what makes this even more alarming, is that we let them do this. Chief executives and legislative bodies at the federal and state level have wrung their hands in distress, but then bowed in submission to these usurpations of power. Voters in state after state have thrown up their hands in disgust after ballot initiatives have been struck down by ideologues on the bench.

Our founders saw the danger of any political force ruling as despots over us, so they created three separate but equal branches of government. Moreover, in the United States Constitution in article 3 section 2, the United States Congress is specifically authorized to tell the courts that they may not rule on a certain subject. This is the essence of true self government under God; that "we the people" elect officials who represent us and our wishes in the body politic; and when necessary, our elected officials tell judges to "get lost."

The "rule of law" has historically meant that "The Law" rules. The Law is fixed from above by heaven itself. The "rule of law" is the "eternal rules of order" of which George Washington spoke; the "laws of nature and nature's God" of which Thomas Jefferson spoke; the "10 Commandments" of which James Madison spoke. The rule of law is the "self evident truth" that all men are created equal and endowed by their Creator... not the state, but by almighty God... with certain inalienable rights. The purpose of government is to safeguard those God-given rights, and to resist those forces that seek to deny or destroy the rule of Law.

The Declaration of Independence states that when government (including the judiciary) becomes destructive towards those ends, it is the right and the duty of people to resist and confront those powers that seek to destroy life, liberty, justice, and the rule of law.

The unbridled growth of despotic powers that the judiciary has arrogated to itself has long since reached a point of crisis. I'm sure that Thomas Jefferson and George Washington could never have conceived of the heirs of liberty lying prostrate before the feet of the American judiciary.

In the life and death struggle of Terry Schiavo we see the life and death struggle of a free people. I do not believe that I am overstating the crisis we face; nor am I using hyperbole. When judges betray 1700 years of Western civilization and 400 years of American jurisprudence by ordering homosexual marriage, or the removal of the 10 Commandments, or the starvation of an innocent woman (etc.), it represents a crisis of epic proportions.

The mood of the nation is both frustrated and angry with judicial activists. A cry of joy went up all over America when Governor Bush and the Florida legislature passed "Terri's Law" the first time. Finally, we saw a governor and a Legislature that had the courage and the will (as well as the love of justice) to use their constitutional authority to reign in a runaway branch of government. In that moment, you were champions of justice, as well as the rule of law.

But as you know, a howl of complaint rose from that radical minority that has promoted its unjust agenda through judicial decrees and decisions. Any student of recent American history knows that the bizarre agenda of the far left has been shoved down our throat via the courts. What they could never do through self-government via the legislative process, they have done by means of judicial activism. Perhaps they howl for fear that the reign of the judiciary is ending.

And so my friends, Providence has seen fit to once again entrust into your hands the struggle for Terri's life and the justice due her. Moreover, you have an indispensable duty to resist judicial tyranny, and fight to restore self-government and the rule of law to our great but ailing Republic.

The life of Terri Schiavo, and the threat we face from activist judges are of grave importance to the citizens of Florida. In the big picture, TerriÂ’s life and our struggle for self-government and the rule of law may be the most critical items on your agenda right now.

50 or 100 years from now, students of history may well view this as one of those seminal moments in the life of a nation. They may view the epic struggle in which you are now a player as a key battle that restored true self-government and the rule of law to our nation.

Or, God forbid, our descendents could look back on this moment, and see that an innocent woman was cruelly starved to death, while those in authority wrung their hands and said "there's nothing we can do." They may view this as another key battle in which the life of our republic ebbed away, and we languished as subjects of an Imperial Judiciary.

I and millions of other Floridians, as well as millions of Americans from across the country are praying you will have the wisdom, the strength, and courage to stand for Terri and for the rule of law in this key moment of our nation's history. May God make you equal to the task.



Randall Terry,
President, The Society for Truth and Justice
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Offline Curtis

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« Reply #8 on: March 19, 2005, 08:18:45 AM »
I think I will take this as a lesson and stop putting off making a living will.  I do not want my family to have any doubt about what to do and I SURELY do not want what little of my hard earned $$ I am able to leave them upon my death eaten up by the lawyers as they argue my fate.

The responsibility for the decision to resuscitate or not and the decision to apply extraordinary life-prolonging means should rest squarely on my shoulders.  It would be neglectful and unfair for me to expect them to bear this burden.

Curtis
Lord, please help me to be half the man my dogs think I am.

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Offline jh45gun

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« Reply #9 on: March 19, 2005, 08:46:28 AM »
My mother died basically of old age and she signed a order not to rescesitate not becuase she did not want to live but the doctors told us as frail as she was life saving measures would break most of her ribs and she could wind up vegatative. When folks get older and ready to die the appetite goes and they slowly stop eating that is what my mother did and while she was in no pain to speak of (except for being so skinny her bones hurt her lying in bed ) in reality her body basically starved its self to death and her last couple of days were in a coma like/sleep state. This is normal for folks who die of old age the hospice folks gave me a book outlining this and it was my mother wrote the book her body followed the script right down the line. Believe me it was not really pleasant to watch and it was frustrating seeing her not eat knowing the out come. At the age of 87 my brother and I did not want a feeding tube nor did she as we knew it would just delay the end which we knew was coming let God take her in his way when it was time. Trust me it was no fun watching here waste away so I know what Terri's folks are going through. Jim
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Offline fe352v8

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« Reply #10 on: March 19, 2005, 09:29:02 AM »
It is a sad situation.  Taking the parents at their word, and her husband at his (which is tough considering his living arrangements) both are noble reasons.  However the husbandÂ’s position, fulfilling her wishes, is the less logical of the two.  If she is no longer, who she was, that is her brain damage is so severe that she no longer posses a self-identity; would it really matter if her wishes, as the husband claims, were ignored?  If it is money driving the issue then the husband could relent and sell his story for a made for TV movie.  Her parents would be happy, the settlement would continue to pay for her care, the husband would look noble, he let her live for the living, and she would never know the difference.

What is truly sad is that ending the life of a person in a coma for fifteen years plus, by starvation and dehydration, can cause a greater urgency to act around the world, then the death of many children from the same cause everyday.

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Offline Haywire Haywood

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« Reply #11 on: March 19, 2005, 09:49:57 AM »
Quote from: Mary Schindler
"We laugh together, we cry together, we smile together, we talk together," Mary Schindler told reporters as supporters maintained a vigil outside the hospice where her daughter is cared for. "Please, please, please save my little girl."


Blatent lies.  Maybe in her twisted mind they do, but reality is a very different from her imagination.  I almost said grief-stricken, but after 15 years how much of that can be left?  I expect it's more bitterness against the husband now than grief.

Powderman, I am curious, You seem to be very adamant that life is life and we have no right to take it but you make an exception for the death penalty.  Can you explain your stance on this?  Don't get me wrong, this is one of the few times that I think I can agree with you.  I'm very pro-death penalty.  I think we need to speed up the process considerably.  Death row need only be a few cells, not dozens.

Ian
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Offline Leftoverdj

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« Reply #12 on: March 19, 2005, 10:57:23 AM »
BamBams, please do a Google on "Randall Terry" and find out exactly what kind of murderous crazy you are quoting.

I'll say what Haywire is too diplomatic to say. The video you have all seen is a fake and you have been told a pack of lies.

The barbarity is not in removing the feeding tube, but in cutting open a woman's belly for that tube and force feeding her against her wishes for all this years. The original placement was forgivable in the hope that a recovery, even a partial recovery, was possible, but it should have come out when it was found that the cerebral cortex (thinking part of the brain) had rotted away. That was over ten years ago.
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Offline BamBams

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« Reply #13 on: March 19, 2005, 11:18:12 AM »
I don't need to do a google on him.  I worked with him for several years.  I know him like a brother, and I'd work with him again if God ever gives me that opportunity.  He hasn't murdered anyone.  50% of what you read about him is complete fiction and left wing conjecture written by pro-death abortion "rights" activists.  They are the murderers my friend.

You seem to be speaking as if you know the Schiavo family as well as I know Randy?  I will tell you one thing, in all the years I've known him, he may have made some mistakes, but he never told me a single lie, nor have I witnessed him lying to anyone else.  If he says she's not a vegetable, then she's not.

And it's not only Randy's testimony I believe either.  Pat Mahoney is also down there along with Randall Terry.  I know him also, and the same confidence I have in Randy, I also have in Pat.   I have spent time behind bars with these men.  You really get to know someone that way. And there are others, but you wouldn't know their names unless you have spent years out of your life watching babies get incinerated on site while mothers walk out the door, and the same people who write about Randy on the Internet throw bags of urine at you and threaten to prick you with HIV infected needles.

My advice to you?  Don't become a liberal, propaganda parrot.
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Offline powderman

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« Reply #14 on: March 19, 2005, 11:52:02 AM »
HAYWIRE HAYWOOD. I'm anti abortion, and pro death penalty because an innocent child has done nothing to deserve to be put to death. A murderer, rapist, etc, has earned that right by his, or her, misdeeds. I believe there should be people assigned to investigate the cases being appealed. This process should be done daily, like a regular job. At the end of a year, two at most, the execution should be carried out. No reason for appeals to last 20-25+ years. In the mean time our tax $s pay for these scum to live. They get 3 square meals a day, all clothing furnished, FREE medical care, cable tv, exercise equipment, etc, and they pay for none of this. They have no water bill, electric bill, no heating bills, no food expenses. We have to budget our groceries into my check, and sure can't afford cable tv. The only ones who get ahead with 20 + years of appeals are LAWYERS, and felons, sure isn't the public. POWDERMAN.  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

Only half the people leave an abortion clinic alive.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAiOEV0v2RM
What part of ILLEGAL is so hard to understand???
I learned everything about islam I need to know on 9-11-01.
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDqmy1cSqgo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_u9kieqGppE&feature=related
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Offline fe352v8

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« Reply #15 on: March 19, 2005, 01:05:50 PM »
I think framing this as a conservative liberal issue, is to trivialize it.  This is not even a pro-life, pro-choice issue.  The issue is did this women express her desire to be maintained in this manner or not, and whether it is the parents or is it the husband, that is accurately expressing those desires?  

This is an issue of selfishness, her parentÂ’s want what they want, and the husband (giving benefit of doubt here) wants what she wants.   I think life is for the living, if her brain damage, is a severe as is widely reported, she is already dead except for breathing.  What ever her desires might have been they no longer matter to her.  I think the husband should allow the parents to have what comfort they can find and move on with his life.  My father desired to be cremated, my grandmother, his mother was opposed; we buried him against his wishes.  He was dead what difference would it make to him, it brought my grandmother many years of comfort, being able to visit a grave.  Giving comfort and compassion to this womanÂ’s parents is a far more loving act than fulfilling the desires of a person who is all but dead in a secular sense.

What motivates those so opposed to the removal of this womanÂ’s sustenance, by others, is open to conjecture.  I am sure though, it runs the gamut, from those whom are spiritual motivated, to those less divinely motivated.

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Offline Arkie-06

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« Reply #16 on: March 19, 2005, 03:50:23 PM »
IMHO the bottom line is that Terry Schiavo is alive, she has done nothing worthy of death. Man kind does not have the pleasure to take human life whenever it is conveniant for him. It is the Almighty that gives and takes life, and whenever it is time for her to pass on He will bring it to pass. To me it is beyond sick to even consider starving a human being to death, i really can't believe that they are even debateing this. It is against the law to starve  an animal, they will put you in jail if you do that, and yet most people polled over a CNN voted it was OK to allow her feeding  tube to be removed and allow her TO STAVE TO DEATH.  What is wrong with people? No matter what kind of high- fuleten philosiphy somone  would argue for her to  " die with dignity',  it is just plain wrong.  :noway:  :(
Early to bed, Early to rise, Makes a man Healthy, Wealthy and Wise. :-)

Offline Dubious Dan

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« Reply #17 on: March 19, 2005, 04:41:32 PM »
I have a lot of mixed feelings about this case, mainly because all I know about it I've gotten from the talking heads in the media. I've heard that her cerebral cortex has atrophied and for practical purposes is gone. If this is the case, Terry Schivo has been dead for 15 years already and all that is left is a shell. If the cerebral cortex is gone then so is Terry Schivo. Terry Schivo feels no pain, Terry Schivo is not aware of her surroundings and there is no point in keeping the shell alive. On the other hand, if she is already dead, keeping the shell alive causes her no harm and if it gives her family comfort to believe there is still hope I can see no harm in it.

I understand that the family has reported what they believe is higher brain function. I don't know if that is what they are witnessing or not. I work in the medical field and many years ago there was an anencephalic infant on the unit I was working. All it had was a brainstem. It would have never have developed into a thinking self aware person. It would however cry, nurse from a bottle and its eyes would appear to follow moving objects. It also had heart defects and didn't survive very long.

Offline powderman

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« Reply #18 on: March 19, 2005, 04:47:48 PM »
ARKIE06. Well said Sir, I agree. POWDERMAN.  :D  :D  :D  :D
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

Only half the people leave an abortion clinic alive.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAiOEV0v2RM
What part of ILLEGAL is so hard to understand???
I learned everything about islam I need to know on 9-11-01.
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDqmy1cSqgo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_u9kieqGppE&feature=related
http://www.illinois.gov/gov/contactthegovernor.cfm

Offline Haywire Haywood

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« Reply #19 on: March 20, 2005, 12:58:18 AM »
Quote from: Arkie-06
IMHO the bottom line is that Terry Schiavo is alive


IMO her body is functioning on it's own but Terry hasn't been "alive" for 15 years.


Ian
Kids that Hunt, Fish and Trap
Dont Steal, Deal, and Murder


usually...

Offline fe352v8

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« Reply #20 on: March 20, 2005, 01:20:08 AM »
Well fear not congress and the President are going to help.  I just hope the government does not help me any more than they have been, of late.

life is no joke but funny things happen

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life is no joke but funny things happen

jon

Offline BamBams

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« Reply #21 on: March 20, 2005, 03:25:44 AM »
Who are WE to determine whether or not someone else's life has value?

That decision should be left between God and the person.

I know people who have mentally/physically challenged children that will have to be cared for, fed and transported as babies, for all their lives, yet they will TELL you that these children bring tremendous joy into every life they touch.  Other's would have aborted them, or placed them into the care of others to avoid the inconvenience and expense involved in caring for and loving them.

To allow the courts to decide to kill, yes KILL, Terry is to set a precedent in this country wherein the judiciary can decide the "value" of a human life.  This is the train that could eventually lead us straight into something analgous to Hitler's eugenics programs which sought to eliminate any humans deemed "inferior" and "useless."  -- anyone who could not "contribute" to society -- anyone who placed a "burden" upon others.  

If you don't think there are people who want this in our country, then simply read the biography and history of Margaret Sanger who founded "Planned Parenthood."  She not only worked directly with Hitler's eugenics people after her husband sent her off to Germany, but there are also numerous quotes, and letters of hers, speaking about her efforts to control the breeding of the blacks, the mentally inferior, and the poor.  It's an alarming subject, but true nevertheless, and I hope you'll research it and not take my word for it.  So if you cannot see the connection and understand why a multitude of pro-life/anti-abortion organizations are also up in arms about Terry's fate, hopefully this will enlighten you a little.

These people, starting today, will be bringing food and water to Terry to show the world that there are still people in this country who value life. They already expect that they will be arrested and taken to jail for this.  They also have families and children who will suffer because of this.    

The Schindlers, and extended family, beside loving Terry with all their hearts, are aware of these things also. This has been documented, and discussed by them.  They not only love their daughter, but they realize the other issues involved and love their country as well - not failing to mention their God.

The other day, member's of Terry's own family, not her parents, heard her express that she wanted to live.  This was also heard by a police officer.  I find it really hard to believe that a sister, an inlaw, and police officer would conspire together to make up something like this.  On the other hand, you have her husband, who stands entirely alone saying otherwise.  Five family members and now a policeman also; four who have known her from birth vs. a husband who refuses to surrender guardianship stating that the reason is because he wants her death wish to be fulfilled.  

For almost every doctor that states Terry is a vegetable, the Schindler's have  doctors who say otherwise, So what makes Terry different? She has to be fed differently than we do and doesn't have full brain capacity.  This does not make her "dead." BUT in the eyes of some, it does make her worthless - simply not worth caring for.

A baby does not feed itself, and neither can it speak, or do a single thing for itself. It can only express emotion, yet we feed them and care for them because we LOVE them, but we cannot LOVE an adult who needs this type of care?  Why not?  Simple.  We expect any adult to get off their proverbial arse and contribute to society rather than burden and inconvenience society.  Yes, we have become that SELFISH in this day and age.

The parents want to care for and love Terry. It's not about MONEY for THEM. There is NO more money involved here that they can put into their pockets anyway.  The money would be placed into escrow, by their own wishes, and allocated for Terry's specific care and needs.  Furthermore, these folks were "set" financially prior to having to defend Terry's life from her husband.  I might add, that they have spent nearly every dime they had in doing so.

It was her husband who initiated that lawsuit, and it's a fact that his lifestyle did change upon receiving the money.  There was no escrow or accountability involved there.  It was also not very long after Terry was injured that this man started sleeping with someone else and having children - all the while remaining married to Terry, and refusing to give up any control.  And of course, his sole reason being that he wants to fulfill her wish to die.  This he knows because, he claims, she made a statement to this effect while watching a television show years ago.  When it comes right down to it would you want someone deciding your fate because of something you said while under the influence of a television drama even though there was no serious discussion with that person about the matter?  When and IF she dies, he inherits all the money and is not accountable in any way for how he spends it - just like now, but with the added benefit of also not having to explain himself to anyone.   The Schindler's have held him to the wire on that money for years once they saw where much of it was going.  This is why there is a riff between them.

Whatever the case may be, he also wants to deny her continued love.  He wants to deny her a family who earnestly wishes to take upon themselves the responsibility to care for her.    

To those who would agree in taking her life because of her condition, I suggest that it would be easier for you to begin with anyone in your OWN family having alzheimer's, anyone born crippled, anyone too old and frail to contribute to society, and anyone likely to be born with down's syndrome.  They are all worthless, and a burden on us.  For some it will be a little too late to get them to sign a living will, but hey, you can't always get things your way anyhow.  Pretty soon it won't even matter what "they" might want.  The courts will be able to decide if they should live or not. You can then simply take your lame, worthless person to court and get on with your life!

In fact, we should just go ahead and get rid of anyone who cannot feed themselves or communicate well, for we only value, and commit ourselves to the lives of those who can give back to us.  We haven't a clue what love is.  Our hearts have become as cold and hard as stone.  But hey, we're so tough, we're straight to the point, and we do love ourselves -- so more power to us!  And we gotta remember, it's money that makes our world go round! -- especially now that love and God are gone - those tended to interfere with what we want also.

The fact that our government, in a case like this, can just decide to take a life, inspite of that life having a support system in place, and family who loves her, literally millions of people who care about her AND want to help with their time, energy and money, etc, should give you a glimpse into the future of our world.  It should serve to show you the lack of value for human life, and the lack of commitment and love in our society.  This ought to really wake you up.  If it doesn't, I only know one other thing to say:  You should go looking for your heart, you lost it somewhere, and with it, the ability to love expecting nothing in return.

I agree with Bush.  If there is any possibility of an error regarding what TERRY WANTS, then we should always err on the side of life.

So you disagree with that?  Tell us who you really are?
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Offline Arkie-06

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« Reply #22 on: March 20, 2005, 04:01:46 AM »
BamBams, i agree   with your exortation 100%. :agree:  :agree:  :agree:  :agree:  :agree:  Very well said!            Terry Schiavo is alive. I have seen her on television smiling with her family. Is this not in itself a sign of life?   And do we really know that she will feel no pain if she is allowed to starve? And we have people in this country who will jump thru thier hind end to save the spotted owl, circus elephants, whales ,dogs  and cats, cave bats, dung beetles, worms,  the rain forrest, the list goes on and on. Ask a liberal if it is alright to kill a Bald Eagle and of course they will tell you no.  But they really can't decide what to do about human life?
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Offline powderman

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« Reply #23 on: March 20, 2005, 04:47:17 AM »
BAMBAMS. Most excellent post Sir. POWDERMAN.  :D  :D  :D  :D  :D  :D
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

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Offline Num_1_Dad

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« Reply #24 on: March 20, 2005, 05:07:16 AM »
Quote from: Dubious Dan
On the other hand, if she is already dead, keeping the shell alive causes her no harm and if it gives her family comfort to believe there is still hope I can see no harm in it.


Who is paying to keep her life "sustained"? Medical insurance or is the husband footing the bill??

Quote from: BamBams
To allow the courts to decide to kill, yes KILL, Terry is to set a precedent in this country wherein the judiciary can decide the "value" of a human life. This is the train that could eventually lead us straight into something analgous to Hitler's eugenics programs which sought to eliminate any humans deemed "inferior" and "useless." -- anyone who could not "contribute" to society -- anyone who placed a "burden" upon others.


Jack Kevorkian (sp?) was jailed for "assisted suicides". What's the difference here? The courts stopped him, so why is this being allowed???
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Offline BamBams

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« Reply #25 on: March 20, 2005, 05:39:25 AM »
Num_1_Dad:

On the insurance question:

I'm not 100% positive on that one.

Call this phone number: 972-240-9370

You may get an exact answer.  Ask for "Flip." He is flying out to Florida tomorrow to be with Terry while she is dying.
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Offline BamBams

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« Reply #26 on: March 20, 2005, 05:59:44 AM »
As to the Kevorkian question:

Judge Greer SHOULD be in jail!  He just might go there -- especially after ignoring congressional supeonas the other day ordering the Shiavo's to appear in court!  The judiciary is not permitted to do that, but evidently the Dishonorable Judge Greer enjoying playing God right now.
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Offline BamBams

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« Reply #27 on: March 20, 2005, 06:39:10 AM »
TODAY'S NEWS! 3-20-05

Congress Announces Deal in Schiavo Case

Federal lawmakers have agreed on a bipartisan bill to prolong the life of Florida woman Terri Schiavo, House Majority Leader Tom DeLay said Saturday.

"We are confident that this compromise addresses everyone's concerns," DeLay said at a news conference. "We are confident it will... restore nutrition and hydration to Miss Schiavo."

In an unusual move, the U.S. Senate will convene late Saturday and the House will meet Sunday to push forward legislation that would put Schiavo's case in federal court.

Schiavo's feeding tube was removed Friday by order of a Florida court. Without it, she is likely to die within two weeks.

Schiavo has been attached to the feeding tube for 15 years after suffering heart failure that led to brain damage. Medical experts have said she's in a "persistent vegetative" state. AND SOME SAY SHE ISN'T YOU MORON!

Her parents have been fighting her husband over her fate for years. Her husband and guardian, Michael Schiavo, has been fighting to have her feeding tube removed, claiming his wife would not want to be kept alive artificially. Her parents, however, oppose the tube's removal and believe her condition can be improved with rehabilitation.

The House and the Senate each passed a bill last week that would keep Schiavo alive, but the two bills were different enough that both sides couldn't reach a compromise.

On Friday, the U.S. Supreme Court denied an appeal by the House to intervene in the cas
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Offline dukkillr

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« Reply #28 on: March 20, 2005, 06:57:54 AM »
the various elected officials who keep injecting their morals into this make me sick.  The only good thing to come out of this case is the attention it's given to people to talk about this issue with their families.  I pray I never find myself in the situation as Terri's husband, and if I do, I pray that other people won't try and inject themselves into a situation that has nothing to do with them.

Offline Arkie-06

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« Reply #29 on: March 20, 2005, 07:40:54 AM »
In my mind that is what makes this country( the good-ole USA) the best country in the world, just because it was founded upon high morality. I think if our founding fathers were to see what is going on today they would probably try to form a new country. All in all , this particlar case can (which has been stated  by other folks)  set in motion some frightning scenarios. It has happened before, could it happen again? I think it could if people don't speak out. Like has been said , where does it end?  Why not get rid of all the handicapped, mentally ill,  etc etc. Im thankful we have  elected officials who have high morality :)
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