Author Topic: Super Blackhawk Comes Apart Shooting Devastator Bullets (Read 1600 times)

Phil Tolson · « **on:** June 06, 2005, 02:37:05 PM »

I recently bought the new Lyman Devastator mold in .44 cal and went to the range today to work up a load. The bullets are weighing 275 grains and I loaded them in half grain increments from 18 to 22 grains of 2400. I got one ragged hole shooting the 21.5 grain load and this was the tightest group of all fired but. . . as I was approaching this load I noticed that some of the bullets were coming out of the brass from recoil I guess and the base pin was coming out of the cylinder. I put the base pin back in, fired a couple rounds and it came out again. The bullets were all crimped as tight as I could get them. I ran the press up and then screwed the seater die down until it touched the ram and when I crimped the bullets I ran the brass all the way into the die. I don't think there is any way to crimp them any tighter. My question is what do I do now? How do I keep the base pin in place when firing. What can I do about the bullets coming out the front end of the brass. Is this load too hot or do I have some other problems?

cbrick · « **Reply #1 on:** June 06, 2005, 03:41:45 PM »

Phil,

I highly recommend the Redding Profile crimp die. Seat the bullets and crimp in two seperate steps. This should solve the bullet pulling problem. It did in my FA 454.

Sierra's latest manual calls for 21.4 gr 2400 as max for a 250 gr jacketed bullet. For the 300 grainer 19.1 is listed max. An earlier Sierra manual calls for the same 250 grainer and 23.2 grains as max.

The cylinder pin is a question for a better smith than me so I'll leave it to him.

Rick

Flash · « **Reply #2 on:** June 06, 2005, 03:53:35 PM »

The Lyman max load for the 275 grain cast bullet is 20.4 grains of 2400 which will be 37,000 cup and 1129 fps. What load manual are you working from to have that high grain weight? The load is too hot! You should back off by about 2 grains at least. According to Lyman's manual, you should be approaching rifle pressure with the load you're using so beware. You are hammering your gun to hell and back for nothing.

jh45gun · « **Reply #3 on:** June 06, 2005, 03:55:41 PM »

Sounds like too hot is the problem more than crimping is. I use a Lee factory Crimp die on every thing I reload but even when I did not a regular seating crimping die gave me all the crimp I needed and then some. I just feel you are running these too darn hot. 2400 is a powerful powder it does not take much over to get too darn hot. Jim By the way I am not condemning 2400 it is my favorite powder for cast loads. Jim

Phil Tolson · « **Reply #4 on:** June 07, 2005, 12:25:57 PM »

I used the information concerning grains of powder from an old Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook, it listed a 250 grain bullet at 18 to 22 grains of 2400 so I figured that 275grains was close to 250 and the data should be all right. I don't know how old the handbook is but I think I bought it in the 70's, it cost new $4.95.

I'll drop my loads back a bunch and work up to 19grains hoping to find an accurate load.

Thanks for your input

Flash · « **Reply #5 on:** June 07, 2005, 03:21:54 PM »

Never assume anything while reloading. Follow the reloading manual to the letter and if the bullet you're using isn't listed, find a manual where it is.

jh45gun · « **Reply #6 on:** June 07, 2005, 05:55:10 PM »

Quote from: Phil Tolson

I used the information concerning grains of powder from an old Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook, it listed a 250 grain bullet at 18 to 22 grains of 2400 so I figured that 275grains was close to 250 and the data should be all right. I don't know how old the handbook is but I think I bought it in the 70's, it cost new $4.95.

I'll drop my loads back a bunch and work up to 19grains hoping to find an accurate load.

Thanks for your input

You can take info on a heavier bullet and if your bullet is a bit lighter it does not hurt but you cannot go the other way around take a lighter bullet info and use a heavier bullet as you found out it raises the pressure too much. BUT the best suggestion is to find loads that match your bullet if you can. Otherwise find the nearest bullet that is heaver and use that info as a reference but work up the loads using the lightest load. I like the Lyman info but unfortunately their cast bullets a lot of times are not the same weight as other cast bullets that are popular for the cartridge. Case in point some of the Lyman 45/70 info I have goes from a 322 to a 420 grain bullet.Thats great if you have these moulds but if you are trying to load for a 300 or 350 or 405 grain bullet that is common for the 45/70 you have to look for more info or take the heavy bullet info and use a ligher bullet as in my case I use the 420 info for the 405 but I also look at the 322 info to see how that is so I can get a idea where to start my loads at always start light and work on up as needed. Jim

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #7 on:** June 07, 2005, 08:39:34 PM »

the lee factory crimp die will take care of the crimp jumping and a belt mountain locking base pin will take care of the pin jumping. About any ruger using heavy loads will have that problem I put belt mountain pins in all my rugers. What alloy are you casting them from mine dont go near that heavy when using wheel weight they will expand using alloy as hard as #2 so maybe you can cure it by hardening up your bullets a little and making them lighter only thing is that when you change alloys its no guarentee that the load will still shoot as well. I dont fool with 2400 anymore for top end loads. Its kind of like bluedot in that it goes from good pressures to dangerous with just a small increase in charge weights. Better powders would be 110/296 or lilgun. 2400s finiky pressure problems are really agrevated by mag primmers. I quit using them with 2400 there not needed anyway.

jh45gun · « **Reply #8 on:** June 08, 2005, 05:58:23 PM »

I use 2400 for cast rifle loads only and my 308 Encore pistol but you may as well consider that a cast rifle load and I use 16 to 20 grains. I do not like to hotrod my reloads of anykind jacketed or cast. Jim

Kenneth L. Walters · « **Reply #9 on:** June 10, 2005, 03:55:14 PM »

I looked up your bullet weight and powder on the most recent of RCBS's reloading programs. In the section for Lyman's 46th handbook they list the 2400 grain range for your bullet weight as 16.2 to 20.2. That's for a 265 grain bullet.

So you are using a very slightly heavier bullet with a powder charge about a grain over maximum? Did I understand that correctly? Over maximum loads worry me.

As to the cylinder pin pulling out there are speciality firms that make replacement pins that, I'm told, are excellent. REALLY good. You might look into that.

As to the bullets pulling out, there are ways to solve that BUT just maybe you should back off the powder charge instead. Just a suggestion.

512 · « **Reply #10 on:** June 23, 2005, 11:47:53 AM »

2400 powder has gotten slightly faster in the last few years. even with the old lots of it i have gotten in to trouble by going up .5 to 1.0 gr. (get a rod and pound the brass out)
loyd is right. back off or use a diff powder and get the latch and pin from kelly. i have been testing them in a 45 and 500 and have had no problems yet. they are way harder than stock. best solution out there.
512