Author Topic: BAR Users (Read 5417 times)

Rick Teal · « **on:** November 20, 2002, 07:08:24 AM »

Great Idea for a forum!

I hunted for years with a Remington 742 in 30-06, and loved the thing. I found I was a much more confident (and therefore, accurate) field shooter when I used the autoloader.

After many years and thousands of rounds, I wore the thing out, and it began to jam on a regular basis. I bought a (relatively) unused replacement, and its' bolt jumped the rail before I was ever able to hunt with it. This soured me on autos, and I've been using pumps and levers ever since.

I'd now like to get back into an autoloader, and was wondering about a BAR in .308. When I first bought my Remington in 1973, I felt it had a better "feel" than the Browning. Now that I'm considering the Browning again, I'd appreciate the input from BAR users as to the feel, smoothness of use, carryability, sight aquisition, etc. of the BAR, and whether this is something that can simply be learned through familiarity, or do you feel it must be there at the get-go as it was with my Remington back in '73?

Any comments or ideas would be appreciated.

jhm · « **Reply #1 on:** November 21, 2002, 03:01:48 AM »

tom i have owned both and both have their good points but the gun has to FIT you. you are the one who will be hunting and doing the shooting with it if the old remington fit you and you liked it dont think twice about looking into a new rem 7400 . I personally like the rem. better myself it just comes up to my sholders and swings better to me. good luck. JIM

jhm · « **Reply #2 on:** November 21, 2002, 03:05:22 AM »

sorry rick I got you and Tom mixed up in the name game here. kinda like going to a family reunion after being gone 20 yrs. JIM

wareagleguy · « **Reply #3 on:** December 03, 2002, 02:53:25 PM »

Rick,
I have the BAR 308. I am a true blue bolt action fan until that sweet little dude came into my life! My wife bought the gun for me two years ago. I use the cheap Winchester ammo from Wal-mart and it shoots great.

I have never had any problems with the gun and groups very well.

Zachary · « **Reply #4 on:** December 04, 2002, 09:33:07 AM »

brdavis,

I was thinking about getting that same gun. What type of groups do you get at 100 yards and what kind of scope are you using?

Zachary

acearch72 · « **Reply #5 on:** December 07, 2002, 03:35:54 PM »

My father in law has shot a Rem 742 in 30-06 for 30 years. He mentioned to me this year that he had thought about a BAR, so being the good son in law that I am, I went out and bought him one for Christmas. It is a sharp looking well made gun and I was favorably impressed with the quality.

I took it to the range today to sight it in and I wasn't too impressed with the groupings that I got. Best I could do was about 1.5" @ 100 yds. Now I am used to shooting a bolt gun that does 1/2" groups consistantly, so maybe I am expecting too much from an autoloader. Would some of you autoloader experts give me some advice here.

Also I was shooting a 180 gr. Winchester soft point. My father in law swears by the 180 gr. bullets, so I tried his favorite. He likes the round nose variety which I can't find. Maybe they don't make them any more?

Anyway, any advice on the accuracy and what is the best 30-06 load would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks a bunch.

deerhunter · « **Reply #6 on:** December 09, 2002, 03:00:57 AM »

I have never used a BAR, but I love my Rem Sportman 74 in .3006

there was a decent review of the BAR at the following website:

http://www.chuckhawks.com/bar.htm

Mikey · « **Reply #7 on:** December 10, 2002, 08:43:16 AM »

Hay acearch: You mentioned 1.5" groups at 100 yds and that you weren't satisifed with the accuracy.

A number of years ago I worked over a buddy's new 7400 autoloader in 06. One of my favorite cartridges. I have had some bolt and M1 garand experience with the 06 but had to do some research on the 7400 before I could get it to group respectably.

I tried a whole bunch of accuracy loads for autoloaders - they differ from bolt accuracy loads in that you need to use the faster burning powders to maximize powder burning efficiency in the autoloader. I also tried a whole bunch of different bullets. But, both my buddy and I are/were sold on the 180 grain bullets.

There are a couple of things you can do to close up the groups for that BAR. The first is to check the fit of the forestock to the action, especially where the forestock butts up to the action. That needs to be flat and as 'square' as it can be so there is no stock shifting left to right or up to down. Then, you need to look at the front of the forestock to see what part of it, any spacers or end caps are impacting on the barrel. You need to relieve those so none or nothing impacts on the barrel at the far end. Also, you need to look at any screws or bolts that mount the forestock to the barrel - if they tighten down too much or put tension on the barrel your groups will open up. You basically have to 'free-float' that barrel as much as possible.

And, of all the crazy things. You said your BAR (or your Dad) prefers the old WW round nose 180 grainer. The 7400 preferred the Rem 180 round nose. There were some better groups with the handloads but not by enough to go crazy about it. But, after the stock work the groups closed to an inch at 100 yds. My buddy takes the thing out every year, groups three at the 'x', takes it huntin', cleans it and puts it away for next year. Your BAR should be able to do the same.

This is Mikey and I hope this helps.

coug2wolfs · « **Reply #8 on:** December 12, 2002, 04:58:23 PM »

Rick

When I came back from Nam in.....70, my Bro-In-Law had just put the kiss of death on all of the current remington autos and had bought up a BAR in -06. Of course he jammed the bageez out of that too :wink:

Being as I had just wrapped up a tour with the m14 and 16 I thought I knew enough about the gas autos to "fix" his problem. To this day, he's still got it, and it NEVER jammed again!

In the BAR -06, 54 grains of H414 under a 165 spitzer flatbase of about any manufacture, and with a Federal 215 primer, that will get a man sub MOA in 99% of the Browning autos. They shoot!

Myself, I carried one, a 7 mag BAR up in Vermont one year deer hunting. I was a lot younger then, but that gun near broke me. For whatever reason, I never did warm up to the older BARs, the newer ones seem to "feel" a little better, but I still don't cotton to em.

The Rem autos always seemed to fit me better. I took more than one deer out when none of his feet were on the ground with those old rems.

Like anyone else, I like hoss power, and fire power. But these days the hoss power busts me up, and the fire power wears me down as most of the rifles are just plain to danged heavy.

I have a new BLR in 308 which I love, it's on the books at 6.5 pounds. Man it sure don't feel like it weighs no 6.5 pounds! Maybe because the Wby UL -06 weighs 5.5 and I got spoiled. But if Wby can do it, why can't Browning build a 5 pound auto or lever?

We gotta carry these things for miles in order to get a shot at something, why so heavy? Never could figure that one out :wink:

Hmmm, a fluted ss bbl on a BAR with a slimmed down reciever, light synthetic stock.....in 308, with a pachmeyer decelerator, ported, 20 in bbl... MAN I could lay down some lead with that puppy!

Around these parts we call the BARs timber choppers :wink:

Coug

wareagleguy · « **Reply #9 on:** December 13, 2002, 04:46:44 AM »

Sorry it took so long to respond zack.

I get right at one inch groups. I'm using a Leupold 3.5X10X50 VeriXIII with Leupold bases and rings. I like the scope but it's a bit much. It's a spare scope I had so I used it.

I have taken 4 deer with this gun and yet to loose any. I took it with me this year to Colorado as a backup gun. When we got to Colorado we stopped by a shooting range and I sighted in. One of the instructors was really impressed with the gun and shot it a few times. After sighting in at two inches high at 100 yards it was hitting 4-1/2 inches low at 350 yards.

acearch72 · « **Reply #10 on:** December 14, 2002, 01:12:12 PM »

Thanks to all who offered suggestions on my BAR accuracy question.

Since I last posted, I tried 3 different 180 gr. loads. They all grouped 1.5" to 4" @ 100 yds.

Today I tried some Fed Prem 165gr Nosler Ballistic Tip and my situation improved qute a bit.

My 1st 2 shots were about 1/2" and the 3rd about 1.5" out. I shot several groups starting with a cold barrel and got the same results each time. For 4 shot groups again the 1st 2 shots about 1/2" apart and the next 2 about 1.5" away. I guess that I will just have to attribute this to a hot barrel after 2 shots causing loss of accuracy.

Anyway, if father-in-law can't get him with the 1st 2, the next 3 being a little off ain't gonna matter.

I was surprized that I did not have to change my zero going from the 180gr to the 165gr. It was right-on both loads.

animal · « **Reply #11 on:** January 14, 2003, 05:00:37 PM »

I just handled a BAR lightweight in .308. Very impressed with the weight and ease of aiming. I'm saving my pennies to either get the BAR or Rem pump with the walnut stock.

Pecos Clyde · « **Reply #12 on:** January 22, 2003, 05:45:13 PM »

I have owned a BAR II for about two years now. The caliber is.338 win mag. That is the heaviest caliber browning makes in this model. I have it topped with a redfield 4x12 scope, and shoot winchester factory ammo in it. From the bench I have had 3 shot cloverleafs with it. I am not exaggerating, I swear. I am well over 6ft tall, and perhaps that is why this rifle seems like it handles easily for me. The magazines are expensive. I have five total and paid $40.00 for each of the 4 I bought

The recoil is about equal to my model 70 .270, or, almost non-existent. The ballisticts are just about unbeleiveable reference the ft pounds of energy this caliber generates. It was my retirement gift to myself. Now, I want to sell it. I got a bad case of the cowboy action shooting virus, and need to sell the BAR for a 45-70 pedrosoli or BPCR.

6bits · « **Reply #13 on:** January 23, 2003, 06:30:53 PM »

Rick Teal all I can say is you got a 742 and it didn't jam or hang up the first week, you must have gotten a good one. Most of them were junk and ended up having more problems than Congress in 10 years meeting on the hill. I had bought a new one back in the 60's and it had a bad barrel on the gun, wrong height sights from the factory on it, as well as having a clip that was flimsy for reloading. That rifle would not keep 4 shots on a 2 x 2 piece of plywood at 75 yards. A real joke of a gun.

Now the Browning Bars are the best in a semi auto hunting rifle on the market. Saying that I don't like the way the clip swings down for reloading. Yes, they are a bit on the heavy side. I bought my wife a .270 model about 3 or 4 years ago (just couldn't pass up the burl walnut stock) this rifle shot 5 shots into a nickel size hole at a 100 yards. It was just plan to heavy for her carrying.

I also owned a 300 win mag in the Bar and it would throw the 3 and 4 shot off by 2 inches every time out the gate, no matter what kind of factory ammo you feed the rifle. Figured it must be something besides the stock and bedding causing the problem and unloaded it for another bolt action. I tried some reloading for the rifle, but no dice just didn't respond to the changes. I got rid of the rifle!

Last year I bought another BAR in a 338 mag, beautiful again stock wise, it is the Cats Meow no question what so ever. It shoots just about anything I feed it without a hang up and is accurate also with everything no matter of bullet weight in factory loads, it will shoot under 1.6 inches every time out the door at 100 yards off the bench. I have worked up several hand loads for the rifle and that made a big difference in the MOA group size, down to under .750 MOA shooting 210 grain Barnes blue X bullets. :grin:

Pecos Clyde · « **Reply #14 on:** January 23, 2003, 06:38:57 PM »

6bits,
As you can tell from my previous post (just before yours) I too have become a convert. Dang, I am so impressed with this .338 BAR I own. The caliber has such versital ballistics with all the different bullet weights. I have never fired a bolt action in .338, but I imagine they would have enough recoil to get your attention. I know the Remmington BDL I had in 7mm mag had a helluva wallop, so much so that I sold it shortly after having acquired it.

animal · « **Reply #15 on:** January 25, 2003, 03:43:42 PM »

Why is the BAR lightweight .308 with a 1 in 12 twist? I always thought 1 in 10 was standard.

southernshooter · « **Reply #16 on:** March 27, 2003, 02:17:03 PM »

Just another Bar lover. Had a Remington 7400, jammed some and not too accurate. Bar has never jammed. Accuracy with Boss is amazing! Very light recoil in 30.06.

RandyWakeman · « **Reply #17 on:** March 29, 2003, 04:50:49 PM »

Quote from: 6bits

Now the Browning Bars are the best in a semi auto hunting rifle on the market. Saying that I don't like the way the clip swings down for reloading. Yes, they are a bit on the heavy side. I bought my wife a .270 model about 3 or 4 years ago (just couldn't pass up the burl walnut stock) this rifle shot 5 shots into a nickel size hole at a 100 yards. It was just plan to heavy for her carrying.

:grin:

No doubt! Soft shooting, reliable, and the last caribou + Newfoundland moose fell to the BAR MKII in .270 (150 gr. factory Win parition golds).

'Course, my dad has been piling up whitetail for his with the original BAR.

southernshooter · « **Reply #18 on:** April 09, 2003, 12:06:15 PM »

I had always wondered about some older looking BARS I see around. Asked a dealer what is the difference between my newer Bar (says made in Belgium assembled in Portugal on it) and the older ones (plain, no scroll work on the receiver) He said the newer models have an improved gas system. He also said he has been shooting the old style for years and they don't give any problems either. When I first saw a Bar I thought they looked too much like a semi auto shotgun but after trying other semi autos I find they are by far the best. (I guess you get what you pay for, they cost twice as much as a Rem. 7400 but 10 times better)

Graybeard · « **Reply #19 on:** November 27, 2019, 05:25:30 AM »

Let's bring this one back up and see if folks might want to talk more about it.

Bob Riebe · « **Reply #20 on:** February 04, 2023, 06:41:25 PM »

Browning BAR vs. BAR MK2 vs. BAR MK3 vs. BAR MK3 DBM

https://www.optics-trade.eu/blog/browning-bar-vs-bar-mk2-vs-bar-mk3-vs-bar-mk3-dbm/

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #21 on:** February 04, 2023, 10:07:37 PM »

never owned either and dont have a use for them. That said most of the rems i shot did ok but some didnt run well and any ammo had to be small base sized if you used reloads. The browning? Well honestly ive only shot one and thats my nephews 270. It seems to run fine and shoots 130 corelock ammo into 1.5 inch 5 shot groups so its accurate enough for most work.