Author Topic: What type of Bullet for .300 savage (Read 1338 times)

Camper · « **on:** July 25, 2005, 09:35:57 AM »

With all the different types of bullets out there , I am lost when it comes to what type of bullet I should be reloading for deer this fall. Last year when using Federal factory 150grs, the bullets exploded in the deer and did not retain a quarter of thier weight. I got into reloading last month because there is only 1 type of factory bullet for the .300 savage (soft point either 150 or 180gr). I am using speer 150gr boat tail soft points in my current loads. I would like to know what would give me the best penetration and mushroom for the .300 savage velocities (2600fps +/-)
Partitions, Ballistic tips, SST's

? Also what should I not be using. I dont want a bullet to act like a FMJ as well. The ranges I shoot are between 30 ang 250 yards max.
Thanks
Camper

Graybeard · « **Reply #1 on:** July 25, 2005, 09:45:22 AM »

Did the bullets last year kill the deer? Did you have any real trouble finding them? Where did you place those bullets? How far did the deer travel after the hit? The answers to these questions will help us form a basis of understanding of why you're unhappy with the performance.

Weight retention is a poor judge of a bullet's performance. I'd rather use the results seen after it hits. If the bullet is properly placed in the chest cavity, ie., heart/lungs does the deer run a short way and fall over dead? If so bullet did it's job to perfection. Did it tip over on the spot? Great but unless CNS is hit don't expect it to happen again any time soon. Did bullet exit? Outstanding. Gives a good blood trail to follow for those non CNS hits that do not drop to the shot. Did it stay inside? If so, not as good as a pass thru in my opinion. More bullet weight or larger caliber will help with this.

Standard ie non magnum rounds do just fine with standard bullets. You do not need premium bullets for non magnum rounds assuming you're using a round up to the job to begin with. Where premium bullets or those with high weight retention features excell is when you're using a round really a bit small for the job at hand, or where you're using a light for caliber bullet to do a job better done with a heavier bullet or when using magnum rounds pushing them a velocities higher than standard cup jacket/core bullets can hold up to.

Dusty Miller · « **Reply #2 on:** July 25, 2005, 10:04:32 AM »

Deer are thin skinned animals that are not at all difficult to kill. I'd stay away from ballistic tips because they destroy too much meat, but any old softnose that hits the boiler room should put down an average sized deer. Its my firm belief that about 99.9% of "failure to kill" shots on deer are caused by the ineptitude of the shooter. (Oh Lord! I wish I could say that I've NEVER been inept with a firearm!!)

Zeke Menuar · « **Reply #3 on:** July 25, 2005, 10:07:08 AM »

I am using ordinary Hornady 165gr flat based Interlocks and RL-15. Works great in my M99-R. Speed is around 2500 fps. Great for deer. If I was going for Elk I would try a Partition in the same weight, pushed a little faster.

ZM

stuffit · « **Reply #4 on:** July 25, 2005, 10:10:26 AM »

Keep it simple. Remington 150 gr Core-Lokts or maybe the 170 grs. Either one will do what you want it to do. Somewhere near 39.5 grs 4064 with the 150 gr or 38.5 grs 4064 with the 170 will do the job for you and then some.
:wink:
stuffit

Ron T. · « **Reply #5 on:** July 25, 2005, 03:47:21 PM »

I'll stick with Ballistic Tips since Nosler realized their error in making the jacket on the original Ballistic Tip bullets too thin and, as a result, they increased the jacket thickness several years ago which should take care of the problems of the early Ballistic Tip bullets.

If you put the bullet through the ribs, just behind the shoulder of a deer, very little meat will be "ruined" since there is very little meat over a deer's ribs... and a bullet into the deer's "boiler room" is a sure "killing" shot.

I worked up a deer-hunting load for my Savage Model 99 in .300 Savage caliber that consistently put 3 shots into ¾ of an inch (or less) at 100 yards from a solid bench rest.

My test loads consisted of 4 different powders - IMR-3031, IMR-4064, IMR-4895 and Varget 4 different standard (not magnum) large rifle primers - Winchesters, CCI, Remington and Federal and 3 different brands of 150 grain, .308 caliber bullets - Hornadys, Sierras and Nosler Ballistic Tips all loaded in once-fired Winchester brass.

All bullets were seated to give the maximum overall length (with bullet) of 2.60 inches.

Working up SLOWLY once I was within 2.0 grains of the maximum load listed in my reloading manuals, I used an incremental increase of 2/10ths of a grain of powder at each new powder load level until I reached the maximum (listed) load.

My best (most accurate with the highest velocity) hunting load yielded a 3-shot group that had an average muzzle velocity of 2680 fps and measured .191 inches @ 50 yards (and averaged ¾ of an inch @ 100 yards) using a 150 grain Nosler Ballistic Tip, boat-tailed bullet in front of 41.5 grains (a MAXIMUM load) of IMR4895 sparked by a standard large rifle Winchester primer in Winchester cases. This load had a maximum velocity deviation of 19 fps (+9 fps / -10 fps).

My absolute BEST group @ 50 yards measured .112 inches and consisted of a 150 grain Nosler Ballistic Tip bullet with a muzzle velocity that averaged 2647 fps in front of 41.1 grains of IMR4895 sparked by a standard large rifle Winchester primer in Winchester cases. This load had a maximum velocity deviation of just 13 fps (+6 fps / -7 fps). I didnt try shooting this group at 100 yards, but Im sure it would yield an excellent group at that range.

All groups were fired using my 3x-9x by 40mm variable scope set on 9x at both 50 and 100 yards.

Incidentally, these groups were fired & these muzzle velocities attained from my 1953 late EG Savage Model 99 lever-action rifle with a 24-inch barrel using a rifle rest and sandbags off a very solid bench-rest on a 78ºF to an 85ºF day (11 AM til 3:30 PM) with very little wind on June 24, 2002.

The final chronographed IMR4895 loads (averaging 2680 fps) consisting of 41.5 grains of IMR4895 were fired when the temperature was estimated to be 84ºF to 85ºF.

Earlier tests in May @ cooler temperatures (73ºF) yielded an average muzzle velocity of 2664 fps using 41.5 grains of IMR4895 with all other components the same as the above hunting load.

I hope this gives you some insight into what you might try in your rifle. Approach maximum loads with caution. The above load (41.5 grains) of IMR4895 is a MAXIMUM LOAD... as well as a very slightly compressed load, but it gave NO "high-pressure" signs in my rifle.

Strength & Honor

Ron T.

Kragman71 · « **Reply #6 on:** July 25, 2005, 05:06:09 PM »

Camper,
I would not use a boattail bullet in the 300Savage cartridge.The neck is too short;use a flat based bullet,like the Hornady Interlock.I use the 150 gr #3031 and the 170 gr#3060 bullets.They both work fine at he ranges that you say that you hunt.
I also do not care how far the bullet travels after penetrating the deer.I don't want a bullet that will help me track a deer for a hundred yards.I want a bulloet that expands and kills the deer on the spot.i 've found that the Hornaday Interlock does just that.
FYI My top vel with the 170 grain bullet is only around 2400FPS.I'm suere that i can improve on that a little,but will probably not get 2500FPS ever.
good luck,
Frank

beemanbeme · « **Reply #7 on:** July 25, 2005, 05:40:55 PM »

Good posts. I think any mid-range 150-165gr bullet will do a good job for you. Avoid the speciality or premium bullets. That is to say, a Speer Hot Core bullet is better for your needs than a Speer Grand Slam. A Remington Core Lokt bullet (or any of the comparible bullets of another brand) would be ideal for you.
While folks brag about their "bang, flop" shots, it doesn't always happen that way. Too many factors. If the deer moves off a short ways before falling, the bullet has still done its job.

Dusty Miller · « **Reply #8 on:** July 25, 2005, 09:38:14 PM »

Try to keep this in mind, there is not a deer on the planet that cannot be taken with a 25 caliber bullet and they max out at 120 gr. I GUESS that relevent to this discussion!

HL · « **Reply #9 on:** July 26, 2005, 01:32:09 AM »

The only bullet I have used in my 300 Savage Contender is the Hornady 130gr. Spire Point. Never had a problem with them. Never lost a deer to them, nor did they appear to be overly destructive. Usually complete pass through with the bullet with a good exit channel.

beemanbeme · « **Reply #10 on:** July 26, 2005, 03:44:57 AM »

I'm gonna guess that a 150gr ROUND NOSED bullet would be ideal and classical. It ought to do a good job out to 250 yards or so.
Actually, in checking some of the books, the .300 doesn't lag too far behind the .308 so any bullet that would be appropriate for a .308 should work in a .300Savage application.

Camper · « **Reply #11 on:** July 26, 2005, 04:47:34 AM »

I guess there is no perfect answer to the questions I asked.
I appreciate all the knowledgeable replies so far. To answer your question GrayBeard "Did the bullets last year kill the deer? Did you have any real trouble finding them? Where did you place those bullets? How far did the deer travel after the hit?"
Yes and I don't know to the first question, yes and no for the second question, Shot placement was 2 CNS, 1 neck( shooters mistake) 2 boiler room possibly three, 2 dropped on the spot, one travelled 60 yards one travelled 80 yards and one I could not find.
The issue that I keep on going over in my head is that the bullet I pulled from the neck shot was fragmented all to hell this was a 245 yard shot , the deer lived all night and I tracked him in the morning and had to shoot him. I almost gave up deer hunting as I felt horrible. The the ones that had travelled some distance after being hit both had fragments of bullets in their vitals and I could not find the chunk of lead. The one deer that I lost was a doe that walked broadside 40 yards away , I had a rest and lots of time to take the shot, I squeezed the trigger with the scope zeroed in on the deers vitals, the deer's ass end went up in the air (assuming a heart shot). I could not find a blood trail or the deer and we searched the area thoroughly for a long time and I mean a long time. All of the deer shot were with 150 gr federal pointed soft points. I never had this problem with the 180 gr factory loads so I just wanted a bullet that would stay together like the 180gr but have the benefits of better ballistics like the 150 gr.
Kragman 71 wrote
I would not use a boattail bullet in the 300 Savage cartridge.The neck is too short;
I am also interested in why boatails are not recommended for the .300 savage cartridge could you please explain a little further

Thanks again everyone
Camper

ricciardelli · « **Reply #12 on:** July 26, 2005, 07:06:11 AM »

Sierra 150 grain SPT ProHunter on top of Varget From 37.5 grains to 44.5 grains and Remington 9-1/2 Primer

beemanbeme · « **Reply #13 on:** July 26, 2005, 12:02:43 PM »

At deer hunting ranges, the difference in trajectory between a 150 and a 180 ain't gonna really compute. If you want the best of both worlds, get some 165gr Rem Core Lokts. At a conservative estimate, I've kilt about a kazillion white tails using that bullet from a 30-06. :grin:

Siskiyou · « **Reply #14 on:** July 26, 2005, 06:15:42 PM »

I am loading for a Rem 722 in .300 Savage. This rifle has been in the family for over 45 years. It always did a good job with Remington and Winchester 150 grain loads for my Dad.

I have taken it to a different direction by reloading. While the 150 grain Hornaday set a high standard I switch to 165 grain Nosler PT, and 165 hornaday's pushed along by IMR4064. Not to knock the 150 grain bullets, but deer stealing bears set a slightly higher standards. And I have a good supply of 165 grain Remington Cor-Lokts.

I also recommend AA2015 with 150 grain bullets.

The bottomline is I favor the 165 grain loads.

Kragman71 · « **Reply #15 on:** July 27, 2005, 04:44:18 PM »

Camper,
The reason that I don't use boattail bullets in the 300 Savage is that they are longer then the same weight flat base bullets;with less bearing surface on the barrel.
The 300 Savage cartridge has a very short neck,and is less "user friendly" then cases like the 30/40 Krag,with a long neck. Remember that you have to keep the OL short enough to work through the magazine. The OL for my Savage "99 is 2.55 Max.
Frank

Camper · « **Reply #16 on:** July 28, 2005, 05:37:22 AM »

Kragman,

this I assume prevents you from using max loads as you can only compress the powder so much

I have only loaded single shots in my 99 I will have to see if I can load the full rotary magazine with the boattails that I have been using.

One more thing, you mentioned "less bearing surface on the barrel.

what are the do's and don't of having your bullet seated in the rifling (I am assuming that is what you are talking about)

Thanks
Camper[/b]

biglmbass · « **Reply #17 on:** July 28, 2005, 08:02:43 AM »

Camper,

If you'll send me a PM with your mailing address I'll send you some magazine articles about the .300 Savage & reloading for this in the Model 99 lever action.

Approx. two weeks ago I asked for info on the .300 Sav on this forum and similar msg boards and kindly received copies via mail from other forum members. I'd be glad to do the same favor for you.

Kragman71 · « **Reply #18 on:** July 30, 2005, 06:40:31 PM »

Camper
So far,my only interest in the "99,is with rounds that will go through the magazine;it's a hunter's riflefor me.
Also,I developed loads with jacketed bullets when I first got it.Now,allmy loads are with cast bullets,which I will use exclusively for hunting. That's why I never worried aout the Max velocity that I can get with
If you are loading the bullet farther out then the magazine will accept,boattail bullets are no problem at all.I would be intrested to know if you get better accuracy with them.
Frank

Seedsntrees · « **Reply #19 on:** August 16, 2005, 08:02:00 PM »

Try the Nosler 170 grn Round Nose Part. over RL-15.

It drops Wisconsin Whitetails like a brick! Have not loaded anything else since I first tried this load. Do not exceed the OAL in a Mdl 99 Savage.

Lone Star · « **Reply #20 on:** August 17, 2005, 05:38:15 AM »

If you find the factory bullets too fragile, the Speer BTs may not be what you are after. These bullets are designed for long range use and are much softer than the HotCore bullets Speer sell. If it were my M99 I'd use the HotCore bullets before I used the BTs.

I have used the Nosler 150-grain Ballistic Tips in my .300 Contender with great success - over two dozen deer harvested between me and a hunting partner. My muzzle velocity was 2400 fps, a bit lower than out of a rifle. That could make a difference in bullet performance, particularly at short range. :cry: