Author Topic: Cindy Sheehan  (Read 5493 times)

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Offline mjbgalt

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« Reply #60 on: August 24, 2005, 08:12:48 AM »
so you calling him names and taunting someone is sticking to the topic then? i guess we will all just have to relearn the rules here. last i checked it required all of us to act like adults.

and to answer your question about the topic, he was stating why he was on here by drawing a parallel between himself and John Muir and that both are liberals yet still love the outdoors.

you guys just stated how dumb liberals are, but apparently he is not the one who cant stay on topic, keep from calling names, or read comprehensively.

i have been watching this post with interest. i am not a liberal. far from it. but it makes me laugh how conservatives make themselves look like asses by calling names and straying from the topic and trying to bait someone into a fight, and thats considered good behavior? cmon.

if youre going to defend conservatism you need to do it with logic and facts and politely. otherwise you make those stereotypes about us true.

cindy sheehan appears to be being used by the media in their attacks on the president. i dont know if she wants to be or not. but if she IS NOT involved in the attacks and simply wants to protest, who is she hurting? ignore her. if someone here has an opinion otherwise then great i will listen WITH RESPECT and without trying to insult them, challenge them, or  stray from the topic just so i can get an insult in.

you dont have to agree but you do have to act like an adult.

-Matt
I have it on good authority that the telepromter is writing a stern letter.

Offline jh45gun

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« Reply #61 on: August 24, 2005, 01:07:27 PM »
That's True Matt but Politics and Religion brings out the worst in all of us at times and some times even the best of us get carried away. Yea Conservatives may say some dumb things but you know what over in the other isle the liberals sound just as stupid. Even more so to me because I do not like what they have come to represent.
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Offline mjbgalt

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« Reply #62 on: August 24, 2005, 01:33:16 PM »
hey i like all you guys so i wasnt trying to put anyone out but sometimes people need to know when theyre getting close to crossing some lines.

the guy is a guest here as we are and even though some of us dont agree with him, there is no reason to break site rules or put words in his mouth, which i think youll see if you re-read this thread.

people assumed he meant this or that and lumped him in with bad people and labeled him instead of listening to what he said.

he didnt make any personal attacks until someone started in on him, and he seems like a good guy from my PMs with him and from reading his posts.

all liberals arent bad. in fact some i agree with. some are the old guard southern democrats which i can mostly agree with, who would call themselves "liberals."

i dont like liberals either but i recognize the limits good taste and fairness puts on us, or i can say i try to.

i like these debates and hearing what he has to say can either bolster your argument or make you think until you find the truth. either way he is welcome in my hunting camp anytime and i sure hope he isnt run off by all this hate.

be mad at ted kennedy and tom daschle and hillary. theyre the ones causing the problems, not a fellow outdoorsman who calls himself a liberal.

-Matt
I have it on good authority that the telepromter is writing a stern letter.

Offline powderman

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« Reply #63 on: August 24, 2005, 04:08:09 PM »
fe. Gotta disagaree with your asessment of the aclu. Theres nothing American  about them. A nti C hristian L iars U nion, best describes them. If it's morally right, they are against it. If it's wrong, they are all for it. They ARE anti Christian, but back the Godless muslims. Kinda remind me of the dumcrap party, tell ya the truth, theres not a nickles worth of difference. America would be a better place if the aclu crawled back under the rock they came from. POWDERMAN.  :D  :D  :D  :D
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

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Offline williamlayton

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« Reply #64 on: August 24, 2005, 07:47:11 PM »
Whats the score in the game.
Gamesmanship wins no debate with those who will ignore and stick to the issues. Gamesmanship is for those who do not know the issues, understand the issues or can express an opinion clearly.
The issue is-
Does she have a right to be mad?
Does she have a right to protest?
Does she have a right to feelings?
Does she have a right to opinions?
Is she protesting within the law?
Does she need to be heard?
I will answer this question. Yes she needs to be heard, her opinion matters. Her right to stand up and shout to the top of her lungs is important to her.
She has lost one very dear to her and she does not care that he is a hero to anybody, She is hurting and would prefer him alive as opposed to a dead hero. She blames a government that has no feeling about sending others to fend for the rights, read greed, of others. She wants the death of her son to be for a more worthy cause than false pride, greed and power.
Some of you would stand to shout her down without having any basic understanding of this issue than the political propaganda fed to you by those which have no more concern for you than to gain your backing them in their hidden agenda.
Seems to me she has more going on upstairs and understanding of the real issues than some of the things I read here.
Blessings
TEXAS, by GOD

Offline fe352v8

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« Reply #65 on: August 24, 2005, 07:51:48 PM »
I take a rather different view of the ACLU, based on some personal experience.

When I was in public elementary school, every morning, after saying the pledge of allegiance, our teachers would lead us in a prayer.  Some insisted upon ending them with, “in JesusÂ’ name amen”.  In first grade I raised my hand and told my teacher that our family was Jewish, and we did not believe in Jesus, she sent me to the principals office.  My parents were called; they asked if the prayer could be simple ended with just amen.  This was not acceptable to the school, so they asked if I could just sit quietly, they were told that my not participating would be a distraction. So, from 1957 until 1962, I was made to stand in the hall, during morning prayers so as not to disrupt the classroom.

For several years, after prayer led by and at the direction of public school district employees, was prohibited, many of my classmates insisted upon sharing JesusÂ’ “love” with me after school.  Being children, these ecumenical meetings were not always of a verbal nature.  What I learn during these meetings was to ignore taunts, but never drop your left when you throw a right.  While I lacked the “power” of the lord, I did manage to smite several jawbones of an ass.

When the Nazis / KKK wanted to march through Skokie, it was the ACLU that fought for their free speech rights.  Naturally I am not a big fan of Nazis or the KKK, but the ACLU was right to advocate for their right to free speech.

There is not a single case where the ACLU has acted to prohibit an individual from exercising their right to pray or exercise their religion.  Any student can pray in school, but a school cannot compel, in any manner, a student to pray.

With the erosion of the guarantees provided in the Bill of Rights, by the government in the name of security, it has been the ACLU that has challenged the government.

I often detest the clients they represent, but I fully support the reason they do it.  The Bill of Rights is too important to trust to the “good intentions” of the government.

My biggest complaint with the ACLU, is their inability to notice the Second Amendment, it deserves the same advocacy as the other nine, and, in fact, a great deal more, in that it can ultimately insure the preservation of all ten.

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Offline ironglow

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« Reply #66 on: August 24, 2005, 10:37:48 PM »
Sheila; thanks for your  explanation of how the terrorists like to exploit any WEAKNESS they see in US ..their enemy..the Great Satan...
   
   I will attempt to historically extrapolate upon that clear thinking...

     The Commies of Vietnam saw that their "fellow travellers"  ( Fonda, Kerry and all those idiots that rioted in the 1960s streets) in the US were making inroads into the country's resolve, so they launched the Tet offensive and killed hundreds more American troops...to further divide the American people..It worked !! A "limp- wristed" congress "cut and run",  pulled the financial rug from under our forces...

   The terrorist forces in Iraq saw Spain weakening...losing their resolve..so their cohorts hit Spanish railways in an attempt to split the Spanish people and get them to "cut and run"...it worked !...they cut...they run...

  The terrorist forces thought they saw a divide in the Brit's resolve, so they hit the UK transit system...the UK is not Spain..they didn't cut and they didn't run...
   
   Would God bless us with all Americans showing that kind of resolve..!

   When elections or any other significant stride is made in Iraq...the terrorists attack whichever Iraqis they think they can most easily dissuade from fighting..police, Iraqi troops in training etc.

   Wherever the terrorists think they see a crack they "plant a bomb" in it !

   They will strike hard anywhere they think they perceive a schism...

   Those who show such signs of weakness or wavering in our TOTAL COMMITMENT to fight terror...  are, in my opinion, inviting attack on America or more roadside bomb attacks on  our troops...

    If you are one who is  publicly showing these cracks in resolve....think again...it may be your son or daughter, niece or nephew that gets blown apart by a roadside bomb.....SELAH...

   I say this because, like Cindy Shehan, I too have a stake in this conflict...and I dislike and distrust any fellow American that invites increased attacks upon our troops (or my neighbor, nephew or grandson) by exhibiting a "cut and run" attitude !
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline williamlayton

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« Reply #67 on: August 25, 2005, 03:25:27 AM »
I would, rather, advocate to revoking of Visas and, if necessary, citizenship in this country to any found harboring, assisting, monetarily contributing to the assistance of, or engaging in any act or attempted act of terrorist in this country.
I would even suggest that countries who would harbor such individuals be restricted or, even denied, visas. I think we can get a better handle on controlling this concern by these actions than the way it is being done now. I also believe it would lead to stronger bonds and better dialogue with these countries.
There are better ways.
Blessings
TEXAS, by GOD

Offline powderman

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« Reply #68 on: August 25, 2005, 03:34:39 AM »
fe. I'm sorry for you being put in that situation as a child, but even sorrier that you don't know Jesus Christ, the day will come when you will. The Jews, of all people, should know the truth, after all, they were there, but they don't. Don't kid yourself thinking the aclu is about helping anybody but themselves. They are no more than devils disciples. Their goal is the destruction of Christianity, and America. Like I said, nothing American about them. POWDERMAN.  :(  :(  :(  :(  :(  :(
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

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Offline doc_kreipke

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« Reply #69 on: August 25, 2005, 05:24:43 AM »
Powder, my friend, I hope I'm misinterpreting that last comment about Jewish folk, but, if not, it may serve as nice evidence for fe's point.  :?

William, I strongly agree with ya on that last post!
-K

Offline fe352v8

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« Reply #70 on: August 25, 2005, 09:17:40 AM »
Doc,

I believe it is a tenet of Christianity, that salvation is only available to those that accept Christ, so I cannot begrudge, any who would ascribe to the belief.   From an ultra-orthodox view, some Jews believe that Christians, by their praying to Jesus, are worshiping a false god

It is only when such beliefs are used as justifications for actions or are espoused to cause actions with the intent to cause injury to another that I become concerned.

While, it might have been phrased more gently, I think in the context of the post, that Powderman was expressing concern for the adherents of Judaism, it is unfortunate however, that this same concern is apparently not available to all who ascribe to differing faiths.

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Offline Savage .250

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« Reply #71 on: August 25, 2005, 10:24:06 AM »
Politics aside, The lady lost her son and she has every right to grieve,
  protest, what ever.  
   Everybody has a view of this war, be it for  or against but when a loved one is lost i`m not about to criticize her or question her motives. Just my humble opinion.
   Air Force...1952
 
   " The best part of the hunt is not the harvest but in the experience."
" The best part of the hunt is not the harvest but in the experience."

Offline jh45gun

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« Reply #72 on: August 25, 2005, 01:39:47 PM »
By all means she has the right to grieve and she has the right to protest too. Her son got killed protecting that right. That said I still say Protesters Suck and she is doing more to dishonor him than she would be by just grieving. I could even see her anger if there was a draft but there is not he joined of his own free will. To me that makes a great difference, How can you blame the President or the Country when the son is the one who made the choice to join and maybe go into harms way? There is no guarantee when you sign on the dotted line!
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Offline fe352v8

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« Reply #73 on: August 25, 2005, 02:50:46 PM »
You mean only the protesters, whose views are different from yours, donÂ’t you?

Weird how free speech is good only when it is agreeable, to some.

Maybe she blames him because:

There are no weapons of mass destruction, there is no evidence of a link between 9/11 and Iraq, and there is no evidence that Saddam was planning, or even capable an eminent attack on US interests.  You remember these, donÂ’t you?  These were the reasons give for going to Iraq in the first place.

Casey Sheehan signed on the dotted line, and without a doubt he kept his word, he fought like a man and he died like one.  His character has been clearly demonstrated.  In contrast, the man who sent him, has yet to acknowledge, that the reasons original given for Iraq, have thus far proven to be unfounded, and continues to link Iraq with terrorism.   Not only did soldiers die because of the bad information, but also even after it was known that the information was bad, this President cannot acknowledge it.  Sending someone into harms way, because of bad information is one thing, maintaining the validity of that information, when the evidence is to contrary, is a far greater dishonor.

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Offline powderman

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« Reply #74 on: August 25, 2005, 03:12:32 PM »
Quote from: doc_kreipke
Powder, my friend, I hope I'm misinterpreting that last comment about Jewish folk, but, if not, it may serve as nice evidence for fe's point.  :?

William, I strongly agree with ya on that last post!


DOC. FE explained my feelings better than I did. I in no way meant to infer anything bad about the Jews. It was said that the Jews killed Christ, yet, they were only fulfilling the prophesy, I don't believe they had a choice. I am concerned about the Jews and believe that the day will come when all mankind will recognize Jesus Christ as the Messiah that he was, and is.
If I offended anyone by my comments, I sincerely appologize. POWDERMAN.  :D  :D  :D  :D
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAiOEV0v2RM
What part of ILLEGAL is so hard to understand???
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Offline Sheila

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« Reply #75 on: August 25, 2005, 03:47:18 PM »
Fe, who cares about weapons of mass destruction, and who cares if there was a link  between 9/11 and Iraq, and I think Saddam was a threat to this country. This is a war against terror. The main reson for going to Iraq, is to free the people over there. The Irqaies want us over there, its the terrorists who don't want us over there.
[


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Offline IntrepidWizard

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« Reply #76 on: August 25, 2005, 04:02:52 PM »
There are no weapons of mass destruction, there is no evidence of a link between 9/11 and Iraq, and there is no evidence that Saddam was planning, or even capable an eminent attack on US interests. You remember these, donÂ’t you? These were the reasons give for going to Iraq in the first place.

Fe,I guess the UN,Clinton,Kerry,Hillary,the Brits,French,CIA,FBI and on and on just don't count when a Liberal wants to say that Bush is a terrorists and the Terrorist that killed her son are Freedom fighters.See people like you have no sense of truth so you fabricate and fabricat.
Government is not reason; it is not eloquence; it is force! Like fire, it is
a dangerous servant and a fearful master. -- George Washington

Offline Sheila

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« Reply #77 on: August 25, 2005, 04:24:22 PM »
Those are the kind of people terrioists love. I bet there are some terroists reading this forum now, and reading what Mr.Fe is saying. I bet they want to give him a big hug for that.
[


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Offline ironglow

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« Reply #78 on: August 25, 2005, 04:25:57 PM »
That old, tired WMD argument by the Libs is a straw dog...
  Yes, WMD were mentioned along with many other reasons..
 
   FE, have you already forgotten that our entry into Iraq was to back up some 14 resolutions by the UN that the UN was too cowardly to back up..
   Things like mass murder, mass torture, using WMD (gas) on his own people, harboring terrorists, firing on our planes that were enforcing the "no fly" zone, expelling the inspectors and many other reasons.

  Shucks; just his stealing of UN funds in the "oil for food" charade by the UN is enough to warrant being thrown out of power..
 
   No surprise the UN did not act though...those wonderful celebrities at the UN were too busy lining their pockets with oil-for-food money and raping little girls in Africa..

     About WMD...Ted Bundy killed a number of women..since he was not carrying a dead body around with him when he was caught, does that mean he NEVER did carry a dead body ?....DUH...  same goes for WMD..

   We hear Libs whining continually over imaginary crimes as reported by Michael Moore....
     
     Why is it we NEVER hear the Libs condemning REAL crimes by the UN ?

More "liberal logic" I guess...
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline jh45gun

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« Reply #79 on: August 25, 2005, 05:30:50 PM »
I think Protesters suck for the following reasons FE. First they protest for environmental reasons now that would not be so bad because we all need a planet we can live on. The bad part is these idiots with their concerns have caused more damage than good. Case in point not allowing drilling of oil when it has been shown that animals adapt to the areas they drill and in a lot of cases it has been benificial to their environment opening up areas for grazing ect.  Or not allowing selected cutting of forest land so the forest just burns up because it is not being managed right as we have seen in the west. These same folks are the ones who protest against hunters and fisherman. Since this site is dedicated to those pursuits so I would think you could understand why I hate them. Then there are the anti war protesters. Boy I really hate these folks as they show division in our country, they did during Nam and they are now. All this does is give the enemy a wedge to work against us. As far as I am concerned if your a war protestor you are guilty of treason. You know what the common link is with these folks every damn one of them is a liberal imagine that. So you come to this hunting and fishing site and say your a liberal then get your nose out of joint when the boys and girls get a little rough here. As far as I am concerned hard to blame them.
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Offline IntrepidWizard

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« Reply #80 on: August 25, 2005, 06:06:50 PM »
Government is not reason; it is not eloquence; it is force! Like fire, it is
a dangerous servant and a fearful master. -- George Washington

Offline IntrepidWizard

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« Reply #81 on: August 25, 2005, 06:08:28 PM »
delete
Government is not reason; it is not eloquence; it is force! Like fire, it is
a dangerous servant and a fearful master. -- George Washington

Offline jh45gun

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« Reply #82 on: August 25, 2005, 06:51:57 PM »
Good old Pat Boone I never knew he was related to Danniel. Glad to see a celeb who does not think like a liberal! Thanks for the link Wiz.  Boy your link shows what a nut she is.  I know our liberal here will make a comment about the pro war protesters do I hate them since I said I do not like protestors. Since these pro war folks are supporters of the war how can they be called protesters?????? So it is Protesters VS Supporters  :lol: (I can hear a joke coming from some one)  As far as these supporters making a appearance they would not be there nor would they ever would if not for the likes of Sheehan or Kerry or the Likes of Fonda. It is these types of folks that are so screwed up that make normal folks come out in opposition just to show that this country is not all made up of kooks. Jim
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Offline fe352v8

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« Reply #83 on: August 25, 2005, 08:13:39 PM »
Weird things I saw

“Fe who cares about weapons of mass destruction, and who cares if there was a link between 9/11 and Iraq, and I think Saddam was a threat to this country.”

Why?

“Fe,I guess the UN,Clinton,Kerry,Hillary,the Brits,French,CIA,FBI and on and on just don't count when a Liberal wants to say that Bush is a terrorists and the Terrorist that killed her son are Freedom fighters.See people like you have no sense of truth so you fabricate and fabricat.”

What I wrote:

“Sending someone into harms way, because of bad information is one thing, maintaining the validity of that information, when the evidence is to contrary, is a far greater dishonor.”


If you learn something is not true, but keep claiming its true is that lying or do you call it leadership?

“Those are the kind of people terrioists love. I bet there are some terroists reading this forum now, and reading what Mr.Fe is saying. I bet they want to give him a big hug for that.”

I have been quite consistent, in stating that I opposed invading Iraq, but have been equally vocal in stating that now that we have, we should deploy the additional necessary resources to crush the insurgency.  When it comes to war I am for, smash a fly with a sledge hammer, itÂ’s known as the Powell Doctrine.

“Then there are the anti war protesters. Boy I really hate these folks as they show division in our country, they did during Nam and they are now. All this does is give the enemy a wedge to work against us. As far as I am concerned if your a war protestor you are guilty of treason.”

This says it better than I ever could

“So what’s it called if during war you criticize the President for any reason?
Treason.
And how long does this war go on (and this is where this theoryÂ’s really pretty clever)?
Forever.”

(Dick CheneyÂ’s Primer On The Constitution, from OBLIVIOUSLY ON HE SAILS, by Calvin Trillin)

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Offline ironglow

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« Reply #84 on: August 26, 2005, 12:56:00 AM »
Wiz;
   That news story on World Net Daily about Sinny Sheehan is a riot ! She and her liberal fuzzy headed friends are "channeling" up dead folks....Hmmmm..
 
  Seems I recall a time when old "Hillarity" Clintoon claimed when she first arrived to help disgrace the White House, that she was channeling up and talking to Eleanor Roosevelt and Mahatma Ghandi...Hoooeee !

   Wish I could add the theme song from "Twilight Zone" to that news story !

   Best thing that can be done is to LET CINDY RUN HER CLACKER !

  Each time she does comment, it comes out like some drug foggy, paranoia induced nightmare fit for the Twilight Zone Zone ! She and Hillarity ought to get on well...secretly that is, since Clintoon is trying hard to pretend she is a "hawk" these days...LOL

   ( I always marvel over a bunch of Democrat politicians that have to hold conferences in order to decide what their "core values" are. It appears to this old blacksmith that if they have to do that , they don't have any true core values !)

   It is hard to believe that there are apparently some, even in this forum, would like these " Puff the Magic Dragon" types to be in charge in this country.

   It well explains why so many Libs are  of the agnostic/athiest persuasion, their heaven is La-La land...

   Poor Sinny; she doesn't even have her theology right....people do not " become angels"..
  Angels are beings created for their job title of "messenger", which the name angel translates to.

    So here's the Twilight Zone tune...do-do...do-do-do-do......LOL
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline jh45gun

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Cindy Sheehan
« Reply #85 on: August 26, 2005, 05:13:03 AM »
I agree with Bush's decision not to meet with her if he set that precident  every nut case in the country would be camped out at the White House Gate.
Said I never had much use for one, never said I didn't know how to use it.

Offline Mike357mag

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IntrepidWizard truth of saddam aiding B Laden
« Reply #86 on: August 26, 2005, 12:58:03 PM »
Do you want the truth read page 134 on the 911 report saddam offered B Laden asylum and wanted him to relocate to baghdad.  Thats good enough for me.  Wow I guess if I had months to destroy and move evidence of WMD to another country, I bet you would not find any in back yard either.  If the UN would have enforced their sanctions on Iraq and followed through a lot of thing would be different.  The un is about as effective as the league of nations.  The league of nations could have acted on their own resolutions and treaties and prevented WW II but they did exactly what the un is doing now "NOTHING".  Saddam did not meet the un resolutions by allowing searches in a timely matter so what are you suppose to do fine him $25.00 or make him write I'm sorry on the black board 100 times.  If he will not comply their is no choice but force any other action would not get any results.

Mike H

Offline powderman

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Cindy Sheehan
« Reply #87 on: August 26, 2005, 02:27:02 PM »
MIKE. Agreed Sir. HadI been president when saddam refused to allow the un teams entry, I would have sent in cruise missles to the site and totally destroyed it, then asked, what else don't you want us to see????? POWDERMAN.  :D  :D  :D  :D
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

Only half the people leave an abortion clinic alive.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAiOEV0v2RM
What part of ILLEGAL is so hard to understand???
I learned everything about islam I need to know on 9-11-01.
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDqmy1cSqgo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_u9kieqGppE&feature=related
http://www.illinois.gov/gov/contactthegovernor.cfm

Offline IntrepidWizard

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Cindy Sheehan
« Reply #88 on: August 26, 2005, 02:31:13 PM »
THE FOUNDATION"Patriotism is as much a virtue as justice, and is as necessary for the support of societies as natural affection is for the support of families."
Benjamin Rush
 

The beleaguered Left has recruited a pawn to pitch its phony anti-war agenda.

 

 

Army Specialist Casey Sheehan died valiantly—heroically serving "the men beside him." His mother's actions minimize his noble sacrifice.
Liberty is often not easy, and in the rough-and-tumble of human life, it can be downright ugly.

"[Republicans are] not just wasting money; they're... massively growing government."
Connecticut's complaint about No Child Left Behind doesn't go far enough—federalism is the real issue here.


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Publisher's Note
After months of research and preparation, The Federalist Patriot launched new HTML and PDF formats this week. There were many reasons for developing the new formats, not the least of which is the fact that each edition must go out flawlessly to hundreds of thousands of subscribers. We've received accolades from most readers accompanied by some complaints. Most of the latter were from those of you who subscribe to the HTML format and found the font to be too small. That has been rectified with this edition—though because our readers utilize a wide variety of e-mail software and browsers, some may still have problems with the font. In addition to the three formats we now offer (text, HTML and PDF), which are user-selectable from the "Manage Your Subscription" link, we'll be offering a fourth option—a printer-friendly HTML version with no graphics. We will continue to improve these formats as we hear from you. As always, we are honored to count you among our Patriot readers.

TOP OF THE FOLD
Moore Useful Idiots...
V.I. Lenin called Western Leftists who sided with Socialists in political debates "useful idiots." He's been dead for 81 years, but there appears to be no shortage of Michael Mooronic idiots lending aid and comfort to those seeking to destroy the "beacon of liberty" today.

Recently, this column warned that re-emerging anti-American movements were gaining momentum. That essay "Spitting on The Few, The Proud..." outlined the Left's anti-war modus operandi between 1968 and 1973, noting how elitist politicos like George McGovern and Ted Kennedy, joined by glitterati like Jane Fonda and Tom Hayden, came together to rally adolescent fervor. The resulting spectacle—one created by young protesters and promoted by Walter Cronkite and the Left's nightly newscast dezinformatsia machine—was a major factor in dissuading public support for the defense of South Vietnam.

That spectacle also, by extension, cast a pall over everyone in a military uniform, including those coming home in flag-draped caskets. American military personnel were viewed with seething glares and subject to spitting and name-calling from "enlightened youth" and their protagonists who tagged all military personnel personae non gratae. The entirety of them were even labeled "war criminals" by none other than John Kerry.

Today, Kennedy, Kerry, Fonda and their ilk are still at it, but they have not had much success since 9/11, when America virtually and rightly united behind President George Bush's campaign against asymmetric Jihadi threats and their host nations—collectively known as Jihadistan.

In recent weeks, support for the Iraq campaign of the Long War has begun to wane in some circles—not because of 58,000 casualties as in Vietnam, but because, once again, as America's finest are defending liberty at home by fighting for freedom in critical regions abroad, the beleaguered Left has recruited a pawn to pitch (perhaps hurl) its phony anti-war agenda across the nation. For a solid month, the Leftmedia has focused its broadcasts and headlines on Ms. Cindy Sheehan and her well-funded road entourage. The network talkingheads have in fact awarded her "Peace Mom" heroine status—which provided a big political break for the Left.

Sheehan's 24-year-old son was killed in action in Iraq last year. President Bush met with her shortly after his death at her request, and Sheehan said of that visit, "I have a new respect for him because he was sincere and he didn't have to take the time to meet with us. I now know he's sincere about wanting freedom for the Iraqis. I know he's sorry and feels some pain for our loss, and I know he's a man of faith."

What a difference a few media lights can make. Now this peacenik poster child says Mr. Bush is an "evil maniac," a "lying bastard," and a "filth spewer and warmonger." In addition, she's asserted that the President and his "band of neo-cons" wanted the 9/11 attack "to get their neo-con agenda through." "We are not waging a war on terror in this country," protests Sheehan, "we're waging a war of terror. The biggest terrorist in the world is George W. Bush!" Sheehan has been hounding the President around the countryside asking for another meeting, but why would President Bush dignify such remarks by meeting with her?

Army Specialist Casey Sheehan enlisted, and then re-enlisted in April of 2004, in order to go to Iraq. Two weeks after arriving there, he volunteered for a rapid-rescue force deployed to help save fellow soldiers from an ambush by Shiite militia outside Baghdad. Casey died valiantly—heroically serving "the men beside him."

Cindy Sheehan, of course, has every right to free speech, but Ms. Sheehan is also responsible for the exercise of that right. Her crusade is not about "grief," as her Angry Left cronies claim; it is about the arrogance and selfishness that uniformly characterize the Left's causes célebres. Her fallen son deserves the gratitude of all Americans, yet Ms. Sheehan's actions merely minimize his noble sacrifice.

Despite Sheehan's disgracing of her son's sacrifice, the rest of his family issued the following statement: "[We] lost our beloved Casey in the Iraq War and we have been silently, respectfully grieving. We do not agree with the political motivations and publicity tactics of Cindy Sheehan. She now appears to be promoting her own personal agenda and notoriety at the expense of her son's good name and reputation. The rest of the Sheehan Family supports the troops, our country and our President, silently, with prayer and respect." The statement was signed "sincerely" by "Casey Sheehan's grandparents, aunts, uncles and numerous cousins."

Indeed, those closest to the President, and most objective observers, would agree with this assessment of his sense of obligation as Commander in Chief. "I've been with the President of the United States when he has met with the families of those brave young men and women who have sacrificed all," says Senator John McCain. "I have seen his compassion, I have seen his love, I have seen his concern. So any charge of insensitivity or uncaring on the part of this president is absolutely false... I'm sure he wouldn't like to hear me say this, but I saw him afterwards. He was very, very grieved."

Objectivity, however, has never been the guiding principle of Leftmedia "journalists." To wit, no headlines have featured or news leads have featured comments from the parents of Army Cpl. Forest Jostes, 22, who served with Casey Sheehan in the 1st Battalion, 82nd Field Artillery Regiment, 1st Cavalry. On 4 April 2004, Forest died beside Casey in the same battle with Jihadis.

Last week, Forest's parents, Von and Diane Ibbotson, had this to say about his death: "We were at a crossroads, but we decided from the day he died that we were going to honor him, his sacrifice. We support the President, and we have made a conscious effort to not make this political."

Of Ms. Sheehan's behavior, Forest's parents said, "We both lost sons in the same battle, but the similarities pretty much end there. Cindy Sheehan has a right to protest, wave signs, march or whatever, a right she wouldn't have had it not been for men like our sons. My son gave his life for the freedom we enjoy in this country; I hope that the Iraqi people have that someday. We feel sympathy for Mrs. Sheehan, but we're angry because she presumes to speak for so many. I resent the fact that she says she 'speaks for the millions' and is the face of the Gold Star families. That is not so."

President Bush echoed those sentiments on Monday, saying, "She doesn't represent the view of [families of those KIA] I have met with."

Cheers completely overwhelmed the jeers this week as President Bush addressed thousands of military families in Idaho. While there, the President introduced Pocatello resident Tammy Pruett, who now has four sons in Iraq, and whose husband and a fifth son served there last year. "Tammy says this—and I want you to hear this: 'I know that if something happens to one of the boys, they would leave this world doing what they believe, what they think is right for our country.' America lives in freedom because of families like the Pruetts."

Of course, so do our nation's anti-war protesters. As was the case three decades ago, the revived anti-war movement is casting its long shadow over our Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen, Marines and Coast Guardsmen. Nowhere is this more regrettably evident than at Walter Reed Medical Center in Washington, DC, where hundreds of Patriots are recovering from severe wounds suffered in Iraq.

This week, protesters marched outside the facility's entrance, chanting amid mock flag-draped caskets with signs reading "Maimed for Lies" and "Enlist here and die for Halliburton." They taunted veterans entering and leaving the facility with angry slogans like "George Bush kills American soldiers." Walter Reed has been a primary treatment facility for American Patriots of all ranks for nearly a century. It's the place where Generals Pershing, MacArthur and Eisenhower died. It certainly should not be defiled by such contemptible rabble.

Protest organizer Medea Benjamin, one of Ms. Sheehan's backers, has also backed communists in Vietnam and Nicaragua and recently said of her visit to Cuba, "It seemed like I died and went to heaven." (Perhaps she should return posthaste!) So, we've come full circle. As was the case decades ago, the so-called "anti-war" movement is really the manipulation of useful idiots like Cindy Sheehan in support of a much larger political agenda—that inspired by V.I. Lenin.

If Sheehan and her lemmings were really interested in preventing senseless death, their attention is grossly misguided. In the two years since 19 March 2003, there have been approximately 1,450 Patriots killed in action defending our nation as part of Operation Iraqi Freedom. Consequently—indeed, since 11 September 2001—our Armed Forces have kept the warfront with Jihadistan far away from our homeland. Perhaps Ms. Sheehan should become the spokesperson for the 14,500 men, women and children who died on American highways last year as a result of alcohol abuse.

Editor's Note: We would appreciate comments on the current war protests from our military readers and their families. Please enter your comment at our Opinion Survey Page and note your Service Branch affiliation.

Quote of the week...
"A time of war is a time of sacrifice, and a heavy burden falls on our military families. They miss you and they worry about you. By standing behind [their sons and daughters] they are standing for America. America appreciates the service and the sacrifice of the military families. Now we'll honor their sacrifice by completing their mission." —President George W. Bush

On cross-examination...
"The news media have done Cindy Sheehan no favor. They only let a grief-stricken mother embarrass herself; it has been painful to watch. It's past time to shift the spotlight back to her brave son and his surviving comrades, where it has always belonged." —David Gelernter, writing in The Los Angeles Times

Open query...
"Since her first meeting with the president, she has called him a 'lying bastard,' 'filth spewer,' 'evil maniac,' 'fuehrer' and the world's 'biggest terrorist' who is committing 'blatant genocide' and 'waging a nuclear war' in Iraq... Sheehan is symptomatic of something that in 2008 could cause the Democratic Party a sixth loss in eight presidential elections. That something is a shrillness unlike anything heard, in living memory, from a major tendency within a major party... Do Democrats really want to embrace her variation of the Michael Moore and 'Fahrenheit 9/11' school of political discourse?" —George Will

The BIG lie...
"You know Iraq was no threat to the United States of America until we invaded." —Cindy Sheehan

This week's "Braying Jackass" award:
"You sound more informed than most U.S. Congresspeople, so maybe you should run [for Congress]." —MSNBC'S Chris Matthews to Cindy Sheehan

From the warfront with Jihadistan...
Liberty is often not easy, and in the rough-and-tumble of human life, it can be downright ugly. Nowhere is that more apparent than in the effort to draft the new Iraqi constitution. Originally scheduled for completion on 15 July, squabbling among the three major groups in Iraq, the Kurds, Shiites and Sunnis, forced Iraq's leaders to extend the deadline for another week, with a draft finally being submitted to parliament minutes before the end of the new deadline. A final vote by parliament was delayed three days to allow more time to secure support from the Sunni leadership. The Sunnis, a minority in Iraq but long the source of suppression of the majority Kurds and Shiites under Saddam, now object to their minority status and question several key areas of the new constitution.

It is clear from the new constitution's text that the Iraqi leadership truly desires a modern democratic state, but by enshrining Islam as the official state religion, Iraqi officials created a seemingly impossible dilemma. For example, sections of the Iraqi constitution read as follows: "No law can be passed that contradicts the fixed principles of Islam's rulings. No law can be passed that contradicts the principles of democracy. No law can be passed that contradicts basic rights and freedoms mentioned in this constitution." Clearly, the first sentence contradicts the next two, but this is realpolitik in the fractured world of the Middle East, where borders were drawn at random in the waning days of the British Empire.

The Patriot editors would like to make a few observations about this Iraqi constitutional process
Government is not reason; it is not eloquence; it is force! Like fire, it is
a dangerous servant and a fearful master. -- George Washington

Offline Leverdude

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Cindy Sheehan
« Reply #89 on: August 26, 2005, 02:54:30 PM »
The UN is a waste of time & energy, but, if someone is to help the poor impoverished Iraq it should be them. They shoulda enforced their resolutions too but didn't. We felt threatened & did what needed being done for our security. Now we're done. I'm not a liberal but I'm not bound by anything that says I need agree with a mistake & thats what we're making. A big mistake.

I supported the war but as our President said its over. Why waste resources & lives on our former enemies? Especially since most seem to agree that any Muslim is a bad one. :roll:
Even if you guys are right & they would come here if we weren't in Iraq, what right do we have to attract these whacko's to Iraq at the same time we say we just want to help them.  The only reason we're still there is to save face. Nobody's got the guts to say this aint working & pull out.

While I dont much like the way this womans going about things she's got a right to feel the way she does. If we had left after the president said we won he'd likely be alive, along with some 1600 others. Maybe they would have given their lives in Afganistan or somewhere else looking for the real terrorists instead of policing a bunch of Godless heathens. :roll:

As far as these guys reading this or even our papers or watching the news about us, who cares? Do you honestly think thats what drives them? I'd think it more likely pisses them off to have Americans running their countries, dictating what Gov't will be acceptable & such. Generally treating them like children. It may be appropriate, they may act like children, they may kill each other more than we like & run their countries in ways we dont appreciate, but you know what? Thats the way they are. Look at a map of the region & show me a truly peaceful place.
I say we pull out & let em rot. Search out the terrorists where they hid instead of being a target & if the new liberated Iraq acts up just do it again. Heck we only lost a couple hundred in the war so it would save Americans anyway.

Nothing about this is cut & dry. Liberal & Conservative mean less & less as this drags on. That this is dividing us should be enough for our leaders to call a time out & THINK a little.

We are giving the terrorists what they want right now. How can that be good?
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