Author Topic: S&W 500 or 454 Casull ,Which is Better ? (Read 9363 times)

WD45 · « **Reply #30 on:** October 08, 2003, 07:29:00 AM »

HMMMMMM... If I could just figure out how to attach a good set of grip frames to a 6 inch howitzer barrel .........and then get those marketing boys on board we will probably be seeing posts like.... 44MAG for squirrels, is it enough ?

:-D

Questor · « **Reply #31 on:** October 08, 2003, 07:36:58 AM »

I think I've seen some posts like that. The consensus was that a 475 Linebaugh was necessary and that the 44 magnum was really just a plinking gun.

Paul H · « **Reply #32 on:** October 08, 2003, 07:52:18 AM »

I know Ruger's reputation for quality varies. That said, the SRH's I've personally shot have been as accurate, and sometimes more accurate then the the FA mdl 83. The 480's in paticular have been extremely accurate.

I personally don't think one needs to spend $1500-2000 to get a quality big bore pistol. I'll put my SRH 480 up againsts any big bore in the market, and would take it over those for my hunting needs with an iron sighted sixgun. That said, I do secretely lust for a FA 83 480 ruger w/ 6" octagon barrel

calibros · « **Reply #33 on:** October 08, 2003, 11:41:40 AM »

Hi I am not sure about the size of your Whitetail deer (From Norway you see) but A 3100 lbs Giraffe only went 80 meters after a hit with a 378gr Hard cast .454 bullet traveling at 1350fps and the bullet went straight tru the giraffe (side shot at 80 meters). :grin:

340wby · « **Reply #34 on:** October 08, 2003, 04:23:36 PM »

The more I look at that five hundred Smith & Wesson, the more I realize that purchaseing one would-be a waste of money for me personally, yes it really looks like it would be a great toy yet thinking about it I have come to the conclusion that while it has a lot more power than any handgun I currently own.(but it would not give me any great advantage over what I currently own ) I got to thinking about it seriously, I already owned two dan wesson 445 Magnum revolvers,(which in the 10" barrel length push 310 grain bullets to close to 1600fps) both of them are right at the maximum limit as to weight and size and even recoil that I'm comfortably with, I have yet to recover a bullet from game, my current Dan Wesson magnums will drive a 310 grain hard cast bullet cleanly through a 200 lb.-300 lbs. hog lengthwise and have done so numerous times from several different angles, now it might just be me but I can't see where a 500 Smith & Wesson can improve on that performance. Now I'm a total gun nut and every time I see something like that 500 Smith & Wesson come out I have the urge to buy it. But sometimes just sometimes logic steps in and I realize there's not much use in duplicating what I already own. Now I freely admit I'm not the best shot with a revolver but I can consistently place all my shots in a six-inch paper plate 100 yds. if I can lean my arm against a tree, or shoot from a sitting position, and since my old eyes make shooting past about 150 yd. with iron sights with a revolver, a waste of time, because, that's about the limit for revolver in my hands at least, How do you guys feel about the 500 Smith & Wesson ? Do you see it as any big advance over the 454 or 445 magnums?

that 500 Smith & Wesson sure looks good, and they would make a nice toy, but here's some info
I usually buy brass in boxes of 1000, the last time I bought 1000 pieces of Dan Wesson Magnum brass I payed $210, I see the going price of 500 Smith & Wesson brass is $355 per thousand and the last time I checked with my favorite gunsmith he wanted $900 for the Smith & Wesson pistol. now I'm sure that 500 Smith & Wesson is one nice handgun and if I was was one of those people who wanted to go shoot cape buffalo with a revolver I would not hesitate to buy a pair of them as I'm sure those 440 grains slugs would work just fine in that application, and damn sure would want a second pistol handy if I was 25 to 50 yd. from the cape buffalo and don't get me wrong, if someone handed me a 500 Smith & Wesson I'd be thrilled, in fact I think it's a much better deal than some of the custom revolvers I've seen built on ruger single action revolver frames, I just can't see where it will do a lot more for me than my 445 Dan Wesson Magnum even on game as large as ELK. Here is a picture of a 445 Magnum identical to my Dan Wesson my revolvers

btw these LEE bullets work well

http://www.leeprecision.com/catalog/browse.cgi?1065393373.701=bullmol2.html

C430-310-RF
http://www.handloads.com/loaddata/default.asp?Caliber=445%20Supermag&Weight=300&type=Handgun&Order=Powder&Source=

data link

Smokem · « **Reply #35 on:** October 09, 2003, 01:13:27 AM »

The 454 Casull is more than enough gun for North Americam game. Deer, Bear (of all kinds) Moose, and Elk too. Besides it can be reloaded from mild to wild.

jamie · « **Reply #36 on:** October 09, 2003, 07:38:23 AM »

I' thinking about a .500 S&W necked down to .44.

Dance · « **Reply #37 on:** October 10, 2003, 02:54:04 AM »

I have a 7.5 inch SRH 454 and have around 750 454 rounds and 1000 45 Colt rounds through it and the accuracy and quality are great. I have no doubt that the FA may be a better gun, based purely on what I have read and the price difference, yet for the money I really like my Rugers. Caliber choice between a 454 and 500? Hands down I would choose the 454. With the SRH you can shoot 454 and 45 colt, so have a wide range of power levels from the mild loaded 45 for light work to loading the 45 to equal to or better performance then the 44 magnum. Then bust out some 454 for the heavy work. Ease of getting ammunition/reloading componants goes to the 454 also. Its quite easy getting dies, brass, bullets, molds, etc for a 45 colt/454 Casull versus the limited choices for the 500. If the 500 gets to be more popular I am sure this will even out though. Just seems to me that the 454 is much more versatile overall. Having said all that I will probably end up, eventually, buying a 480 ruger or 500 LOL Just to have one to monkey around with, although I may be more inclined to get another 454 SRH

454Puma · « **Reply #38 on:** October 12, 2003, 06:19:06 AM »

WilBill
Hmm let see, the 454 has taken every game animal on the planet! The 500 S&W if it stay's together past 80 rounds probably will also- you just need to put it in anything other then a S&W. Plus at a buck a round most of us can't afford it anyway! And since I have my Rossi to complement my SRH I have the best of bought worlds. The 454 is more then you need for most white tails but if you must have a nut. :grin:

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #39 on:** October 12, 2003, 07:52:10 AM »

I know the S&W500MAG is here to stay. They said the same thing about the 454Casull when it came out. As for reloading the S&W500, at first there were limited reloading components, but now there are 3 companies making dies, primers and powder are no problem. Bullet manufactures are coming out of the wood work, Cast Performance, Hornady, Barnes, Hawk, and I think Speer is coming out also with .500 bullets. Brass is no problem Jamison Int. and Starline have plenty. I found a bullet caster in Montana, Montana Bullet Works and he make 4 different bullet weights for the 500. He also makes bullets for any rifle or pistol. If you look at reloading, there are guys loading the 500 down to 44MAG performance. Now how is that for versatility. Ease of getting ammunition/reloading components are the same as most other guns now.

454Puma, There are some guys in there 1000 th rounds of shooting and the gun has not fell apart. I have only shot my 150 times but not one problem to report. I speak from experience you speak from opinion. I am sure if the gun was going to fall apart you would have heard about it by now. If you want to here people opinions that have S&W500 then go to the Smith & Wesson board and read all the posts on the S&W500. I have both a Smith & Wesson and the BFR in S&W500. And both shoot like a dream. Please, this was not a flame. It may sound like it but it is not meant to be.

Rich Jimbo · « **Reply #40 on:** October 12, 2003, 04:10:28 PM »

Redhawk,
You remind me of me! Talking about opinions vs. experience. Have you noticed that the people that own a S&W 500 don't have negitive feedback like the people that do not have a 500....but they sure have strong opinions? By the way, which one [the BFR or the Smith] would you recomend for hunting? You are the only one qualified to answer this question!!! Rich

454Puma · « **Reply #41 on:** October 13, 2003, 05:58:37 PM »

Redhawk1

Please jump over to the link below -interesting damage to a 500 S&W cylinder after just 80 rounds!!! Action got loose-cylinder timing off you tell me if there not something wrong with the 500? :shock:

http://forums.sixgunner.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=6646

Never heard of these problems with the Ruger SRH 454!! I may not own a 500 but pictures speak for themselves!!! Smith were never known to be a strong action! Give me a Ruger any day!

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #42 on:** October 14, 2003, 01:40:21 AM »

Rich Jimbo, I would have to go with the BFR. I personally like to shoot in single action mode, you can do it with both but the BFR seamed a little more balance to me.

SingleShotShorty · « **Reply #43 on:** October 14, 2003, 02:40:08 AM »

Plain and simple the S&W 500 as well as the 480 Ruger are answers to questions that no one asked. Ruger and S&W just had to have a caliber with their name on it. The 44 mag is all a man could ever need for whitetail or elk for that matter. Good shot placement will never be overcome with bigger is better.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #44 on:** October 14, 2003, 06:22:08 AM »

454Puma, OK you showed me one gun out off thousands made, show me one gun manufacture that does not have a problem now & them. I have seen a BFR in the 450 that had a problem with the cylinger shaving where the belt on the cartridge sits in the cylinder, but that one thing does not make a BFR or a BFR in 450 bad, Stuff happens. I still bought a BFR in 500MAG. Look at the sticking problem Ruger has in there 454 Casull. I had a Ruger that rounds got stuck in the cylinder after firing. By your account Ruger should stop making the 454 Casull due to a problem in the cylinder. Also the problem in the S&W500 with the cylinder rotating backward was resolved.

SingleShotShorty, I agree with you 100%. Good shot placement will never be overcome with bigger is better. But good shot placement with bigger better

I also love my 44MAG but there was just something about the S&W500 that made me want one.... or two LOL

But if I was bear hunting and got charger, I would sure want a 500MAG over a 44 MAG any day.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #45 on:** October 15, 2003, 10:59:58 AM »

Well, I just got back from the range and shot 100 full load 440 gr. 500MAG's out of my Smith & Wesson 500. Again not one problem, no signs of any unusual wear. I am about 200 past the 80 break down 454 Puma posted.

MS Hitman, I paid $852.00 for my BFR in 500MAG and it is no where a spin off of Ruger. You seem to like Freedom Arms, that is good they are a quality gun. But I can do the same thing with either of my S&w500 MAG's. Also does Freedom Arms make a 444 Marlin or 45-70 or 450 Marlin.. NO.. :shock: Also do you own a Freedom Arms or BFR or S&W500? Or have you at anytime? :wink:

MS Hitman · « **Reply #46 on:** October 15, 2003, 05:23:31 PM »

Redhawk1,

As a matter of fact, I own three Freedom Arms revolvers. If one has a .475 Linebaugh, like I do, a .444 Marlin, .45-70. or a .450 Marlin isn't really necessary. Same pretty much can be said for shooting a .454 Casull, if you have a Freedom Arms revolver. Did I mention I have three of them? I have shot and handled BFRs and the S&W .500 and I don't have anything for either of them. The .500 S&W in an Encore is a good hunting round in my opinion. Yes, I've shot one them also in case you are wondering. While I'm at it and we're 'fessing up to what we've shot; I'm partial to the Linebaugh Long cartridges as well. Don't own one, but I got access to 'em.

TScottO · « **Reply #47 on:** October 15, 2003, 06:36:27 PM »

Its all pretty simple really. When someone wants to buy the best non-custom revolver made. They buy a FA. There is not a non-custom gun comes close to the quality of a FA or the support you get from their manufacturing facility. Ruger, BFR, SW or any other company you can think of is a far cry from a FA. There is nothing wrong with the above mentioned guns, we all have them but they do not compare. I also have three FAs and everyone one of these guns shoot 3/4 at 25 yards. There is no such thing as buying a FA and shooting it to decide if its a keeper or not. People do not realize this. As far as the old buffalo rifle rounds go, in reality, you are not going to gain anything over the big bore rounds specifically designed for a six gun. The amount of powder they hold is more than will fully ignite in a normal length six-gun barrel. Eight, ten and twelve inch barrels are not what most bog bore addicts consider to be normal length barrels for a five or six-gun.

Where S&W failed with the 500 was the rush they put on this gun to get it on the market. There wasnt enough time spent in R&D before this gun was put into circulation. Im sure S&W will do what it takes to correct things but shame on them for the burden they have placed on the 500 owners and the unsafe position some of these 500 owners are in. I have failed to see one single thread about the 500 where someone hasnt mentioned having a problem with their firearm. I know three people that have one of these and two of the three have had cylinder lock up problems and or cylinder face imperfections. Smith and Wesson really needs to give attention to this issue if not recall the guns that are on the market. Could you imagine someone hunting dangerous game with a revolver that has had the number of problems this gun has experienced?

This is just how I see it

Good luck and be safe,
Scott

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #48 on:** October 15, 2003, 08:14:18 PM »

Between my 2 S&W500, I have over 600 rounds shot. Not one problem at all with cylinder lock up or rotating backward. Also if you want feedback from guys that have thousands of rounds through there Smiths, go to the Smith & Wesson board and they have posts there with there experiences. Some of the guys had posted early in production of the first run of the Smith & Wesson's, there was a problem with the cylinder unlatch problem. The problem was found and corrected. No more problems reported sense. So not to drag this out any further, I have very happy with my BFR and Smith & Wesson in the 500MAG. And it is obvious you all are happy with you Freedom Arms.

If everyone bought one gun we would not have choices.

Rich Jimbo · « **Reply #49 on:** October 16, 2003, 05:35:16 PM »

Redhawk,
Shame on you for fighting with these experts! You know they are experts because they say things like, " I've read all the articals..." or "I have several friends that..." or "I've LOOKED at the S&W 500 and..." You don't need to have first hand experience to be an EXPERT. God must love strong opinioned [little experienced] people....He made so meny of them!
You know who I ask about which S&W 500 [BFR or Smith] that I should get....it was'nt any of those experts. I seek out the player not the spectator.
My FA 454, RSRH 480, S&W 44, T/C 45/70, and DE 50 AE have spent a lot of time in my safe sinse I got my BFR in 444...and when my BFR in 500 S&W arrives, it'll join the others. I'll post my EXPERIENCES.

MS Hitman · « **Reply #50 on:** October 17, 2003, 01:24:31 AM »

Yeah Rich,

I surely know what you are talking about. Seems the turkeys whixh gobble the loudest have the least to say. Just like the post above.... oh, that's your's.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #51 on:** October 17, 2003, 05:06:15 AM »

Rich, do you like the 444 Marlin in you BFR a lot? I have a Marlin 444P and I love it. I was thinking of getting a 45-70 or the 444 in BFR to add to my collection. I also have 2 rifles chambered for the 45-70.

What I find funny about some people is they down all other guns except what they have. If you don't shoot what there shooting and it's not the most expensive it's no good. Well, to give some of the guys here that think that way, you know who you are. I can afford any gun I want. Price has never been a factor. But why buy a gun that costs $1500 to $2000 when a gun under $1000 will do the same thing. OK, it does not have a highly polished finish and extra fancy grips. But I get my guns for hunting and shooting. I don't put them in a gun cabinet and tell everyone that comes over, Look at my pretty gun that cost $2000. :roll: I have not had any problems with most gun manufactures if there was any problem with there guns. But I also have not experienced any major problems with any gun I have bought. Now when it comes to optics I do like Leupold due to the quality and warranty. But I also buy Bushnell also.

Rich Jimbo · « **Reply #52 on:** October 17, 2003, 05:08:56 AM »

I was wondering who my last post would draw out, a player or a spectator? It was an expert that "handled" a S&W 500! Their last post had no facts or experiences, just insults. After reading that last post, I think they should have "handled" a dictionary!

willis5 · « **Reply #53 on:** October 17, 2003, 06:08:54 AM »

off topic much? :-)

myronman3 · « **Reply #54 on:** October 17, 2003, 02:56:14 PM »

i am with the hitman on this. it seems rich and redhawk have no problems suggesting that others "lack experience". this isnt the first post which you two have thrown accusations freely at folks who dont share your opinion. and in throwning the "dictionary" accusation out there, clean your house before you complain about others (proof-read your own posts). alot of this is folks sharing their experiences and opinions in an informal setting. there is no need to flame folks because they have different opinions than yours. accept the fact that folks are entitled to theirs, and there is no need try to put them down for it. i have disagreed with you before on different subjects, and recieved the same treatment. and i dont believe i stooped in return. the only thing that doing what you are doing accomplishes is it makes folks think less of you. and that is a shame...

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #55 on:** October 17, 2003, 04:29:01 PM »

myronman3, Please address your concerns with me directly. Not addressed to Rich and Redhawk. That way I know which subjects you find me guilty of.

I did not flamed anyone in this thread. I agreed the Freedom Arms was a fine handgun. I also don't bad mouth other firearms because I don't have one or heard someone had one and it was bad. My comment about giving an opinion when a person has not shot a particular gun, How can they give it a fair evaluation? As soon as someone starts with I have a friend, I know where it is going. Me personally I will give advice on something I have personally handled and shot and can give correct and hands on feedback for. As far as if someone does not agree with me, I don't mind at all, as long as they can give me there hands on experience. Maybe I sound a little on the defense, but I should be able to respond with my experiences and question there opinion without it turning into an argument.

Thank you
Redhawk1

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #56 on:** October 17, 2003, 04:35:48 PM »

WildBill, I owe you an apology. This post got of topic. But in all the posts there is a lot of good points. I hope can make a choice, and decide which gun will suit your needs and let us know what you decided. Just enjoy what ever you decide on.

Redhawk

myronman3 · « **Reply #57 on:** October 18, 2003, 03:43:33 PM »

redhawk-fair enough. i have stated before that one doesnt need to own something to know it aint for them or what they consider practical. kind of like eating a crap sandwich; i dont need to do it to know i dont want to.
i havent shot a bfr. i have handled them. i wouldnt pass up a chance to shoot one; or the 500 sw. but that doesnt mean i am going to buy one for the chance to do so. i know from my past experiences with other guns to know what i will and wont spend my pesos on. hopefully you will get many safe years of enjoyment out of yours.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #58 on:** October 18, 2003, 05:46:19 PM »

myronman3, Thanks...

buckenbass · « **Reply #59 on:** October 22, 2003, 08:23:46 AM »

I wanted to comment sooner but I had no personal experience with the 500 and did not want to get bashed ..Haa Haa
Well I now have both 454 and .500 S&W in a encore and i shoot a friends 454ruger often..
And my choice is .500 S&W... WHY both the ruger and my encore 454 is non breaked and my .500 is breaked and has less recoil then the 454 ,,the .500 with out the break has only a little more recoil than the 454 SO .500 S&W all the way for any thing that moves..