Author Topic: Here ya go, Mac!!!! (Read 781 times)

quickdtoo · « **on:** October 31, 2005, 01:17:17 PM »

Fred M · « **Reply #1 on:** October 31, 2005, 03:15:57 PM »

Eh, Mac!

They are only a buck a piece, compared to the German RWS 8x68S at $1.65 each plus shipping.

Who would want this tarnished junk? Maybe a collector?

quickdtoo · « **Reply #2 on:** October 31, 2005, 03:19:24 PM »

A ride in the tumbler will do wonders to that properly head stamped brass!!! I paid almost $2 each for 45-3¼" brass, and it costs even more now!!

Fred M · « **Reply #3 on:** October 31, 2005, 04:25:55 PM »

Tim.

You would totally ruin the value of that antique brass if you cleaned it. Ten cases would be of no use to a reloader. Long time oxidation of brass on both the inside and the out eats up the brass. But they don't look too bad yet.

I have a few real old brass cases that are badly corroded. They are actually green with oxide.

What is it you have to do to buy them?

quickdtoo · « **Reply #4 on:** October 31, 2005, 04:44:46 PM »

I dunno if I'd call em antique, Huntington's still lists .30 Newton brass. They didn't look corroded to me, just tarnished.

To bid, you need to register on Ebay, then place a bid on em. Used brass can be shipped to Canada, just needs to be marked as scrap brass on the customs declaration.

Mac11700 · « **Reply #5 on:** October 31, 2005, 06:22:21 PM »

Thanks Tim

I think I'll pass on these...while 10 would be nice...I have other plans...if I do go 30 caliber...I'll make it a 30 Gibbs...looks like it will clean up the chamber nicely...and it's a whole lot cheaper to reload for :-D

Mac

Fred M · « **Reply #6 on:** October 31, 2005, 07:27:01 PM »

30-280 Gibbs could do it, mayby?

Mac11700 · « **Reply #7 on:** October 31, 2005, 09:04:27 PM »

Well...actually according to The Handloaders Manual of Cartridge Conversions...it should work ok with regular 30-06 Brass..They say; Make from 30-06 brass...Taper expand the neck to .315" dia....F/L size in the Gibbs die.Square the case mouth and fireform in the Gibbs chamber..Case length is 2.50"..neck diameter is .339"...length to shoulder is 2.145"... shoulder angle is 42.55 degree...neck length is .225"... shoulder diameter is .447"...other than that...according to the book...it has a case capacity of 3.5 grains more water in it than the Ackley Improved..71.71 grains as compared to 68.34 grains for the AI..it has a slightly longer shoulder than the AI...if you can call it that...it's .130" as compared to the .099" of the AI.. and a shorter neck than the AI which has .380" as compared to the Gibbs of .225"...which shouldn't be a problem if the chambering is done correctly..It's strickly a fireforming/handloading proposition...but.. it does gain a-bit more than the AI...and data is available for it..a nice gain over the 30-06 depending on who's data you want to believe...but...this is only if I elect to go the 30 caliber route...I still have a burning desire for that long barreled 270..it may wait...everyone should have a good 30 caliber weapon...don't you think :wink: Here's one load that really interest me with it..I figure I should gain around 75-100 FPS more with the 26" barrel..that would put it close to a 300 fps gain over the old war horse..and about 200 fps over the AI according to Nosler #5..

Bullet     Nosler Partition
BulletWeight    165 grs
Powder    IMR 4350
PowderWeight    62.5 grs
Primer    Federal 210
Brass Make    Winchester
Barrel Length    24 (inches)
C.O.L    (inches)
Velocity    3075 fps
Group    0.85 (inches by 3 shot at 100 yds)
Submitted Date    12/7/2004 2:26:00 AM
Submitted By    Jim Tilly
Gun Info    Chambered by Gibbs in Idaho
Comment    15 moose so far sheep next

Mac

Fred M · « **Reply #8 on:** November 01, 2005, 05:46:47 AM »

My concern in a 30-06 Handi chamber would not be the body or case length of the 30 Gibbs. It would concern the the throat and lead in the 06 Handi. That being oversize and long, the Gibbs reamer wont clean it up.

I have two case length for the Gibbs 2.50 and 2.460 the 06 is 2.494and the min chamber length is 2.502" for the 06.

Never seen wildcats getting longer when fire forming. Stretching cases from the word go is not a good idea. I would use 280 cases without a bullet to fire form the Gibbs. the 2.540 case works well with a nose bevel for head space. About as simple as it can get.

The Gibbs is about as good as a 300 H&H. I had one some body twisted my arm to get it.

The standard 30R Blaser would solve all the Handi chamber troubles. It is right up there with 300 H&H. That is one fine 30 cal rimmed case and a factory loading. It would cost a few extra bucks for brass but that be the end of it. Of course you need a good bore to go with it.

Mac11700 · « **Reply #9 on:** November 01, 2005, 07:03:40 AM »

Fred:

If and when I do this..it won't be done from a 30-06 barrel...it will be done on the 26"- 25-06 barrel...and mine has a short leade and fairly tight neck and chamber to begin with..so it won't be cleaning up a 30 cal to start..I looked at the shorter 25 Gibbs...and did a-lot of reading on it..seems to be really rough on the barrels and shortens life accordingly..some only getting 2000 rounds before replacing....The Blazer is another option of course...and I would like to read more on it...but my searches have only come up with hits on the actual rifles and such..nothing on dimensions or data for it...and I only have data from Barnes#10 Cartridges of the world..

Mac

Fred M · « **Reply #10 on:** November 01, 2005, 09:21:38 AM »

Well that is a lot different. My Gibbs drw shows a 27 deg shoulder and a length of 2.460???

30R Blaser
Rim 0.525", thickness 0.052"
Diameter above the rim 0.475
" " at shoulder 0.441
Base to shoulder 2.274
Base to neck 2.408
shoulder angle 20 deg
Neck length 0.257+-
Psi Rating 58740

QuickLoad Prediction not a loading recommendation..

165 gr Hornady Interlock
65.7gr H4350
Vel 2994 26" barrel
Ft/lbs 3285
57510PSI
Case vol to overflow Ho2 75.01gr
Propellent burnt 97.19% ( a very good burning factor)
Any load for the 30-06 can be used as starting load for the 30R Blaser.
The usable volume difference between the 06 and the 30RBlaser is 11.4%

The quoted Gibbs load is too hot for a Handy at 64.8kpsi Everybody likes to run the Gibbs hot. That is how you get the high velocities :lol:

Bullet Nosler Partition
BulletWeight 165 grs
Powder IMR 4350
PowderWeight 62.5 grs
Primer Federal 210
Brass Make Winchester
Barrel Length 24 (inches)
C.O.L (inches)
Velocity 3075 fps

Mac11700 · « **Reply #11 on:** November 01, 2005, 08:39:47 PM »

Fred:

The dimensions are straight from R.Gibbs in the book I mentioned and quoted from...so..you might have some different dimensions depending on who did the workup...the 25 Gibbs is closer to your sizes...

The loading data isn't as fast as the original data contained in PO Ackley's vol.#2 for it from him...nor was the manufacture of powder named...or lenght of barrel...so it could be based on a much longer barrel...or the velocities were calculated..not cronographed..As with any of the improved cartridges....100-200 fps gain...is about the norm for them...and...going with the 26" barrel...you can add roughly another 100fps depending on powder......but who's to say it will be accurate at those velocities..ehhh :wink: I still think getting 3200fps with the 130 grain .277 Nosler partition will be just the ticket...and it shouldn't be too hard to do after Wayne at Oregunsmithing gets finished with it...I'm estatic at what I'm getting with my 338-06 from him..and am looking forward to seeing what the heavy weights will do with it...the 210 factory loads are pretty great...and Quick has had some good groups from his with even heavier bullets...so it looks very promising...He and I are in complete agreement...it I had to choose only 1 Handi to keep...and have to loose the rest...the 338-06 would stay...atleast till he builds me another so I can compare them...

Mac