Author Topic: Is This A Fix???  (Read 624 times)

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Offline JPH45

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Is This A Fix???
« on: October 31, 2005, 05:37:14 PM »
I haven't wanted to post too much in a while, I don't have a good feeling about Handi's and NEF these days. Sent in a frame this spring for fitting with a 38-55 barrel. I couldn't be happier with the barrel, shoot's like a house afire.... when the dang thing ain't misfirin'. Didn't have that problem before I sent it to NEF to be fixed. They fixed it alright, redid the trigger job I had done, which was working just fine I'll have ya know, and sent me back a rifle that misfired at least once every 20 rounds if not twice every 10.

I ain't sending it back to NEF.... If you can't figure that one out, stay in the dark, I aint' gonna explain it. I have replaced every part in the lock work except the trigger and hammer. At this point, the pins have been out so many times they are beginning to back out from recoil alone.

Anyway, on a hunch, I switched primers from "Large Rifle" (I'd been using Winchester) to "Large Pistol Magnum" of Federals persuation. The Mag Pistol primers have a softer cup than the rifle primers, my guess is that they should ignite with a lighter strike. Of 30 rounds so far, no misfires. Better than I was getting by far.

The 11.4 grains of #107 I've been using (substitute Blue Dot using cannister powder) shoots just fine, But the harder to ignite rifle powders are not as good as they were. The 24.5 grain WC680 load (AA1680 for those using cannister grades) does not shoot quite as well with the magnum pistol primer, shows a decided vertical stringing, a sure sign of incomplete ignition and resultant velocity variation, but certainly more than good enough for poking holes in deer at 70 yards or less. Tomorrow I am going to try a loading of 25.5 grains of 4198. My current can is Hodgdon brand, but IMR is the same thing, so take your pick. If that works out well enough, I'm going to try ten rounds of WC846 (at 24.5 grains), depending on lot# it runs from BL-C2 on the slow side to H335 on the fast side. This powder produces very accurate loads, but is dirty because of the low pressures resulting from the low expansion ratio (too much bore diameter, too little case capacity)

I believe the Mag Pistol Primer is a working solution to my misfire problem, but it does limit me to the accuracy I can expect as it is not as efficient at lighting the powders best suited for maximum velocities from this cartridge.

It would be nice to trust NEF to resolve this. Problem in my thinking is they created this condition in correcting  something they percieved as a problem that was not. Funny thing is they sent me back a trigger just as light as the one I sent to them, but mine was not misfiring.

Such is Life.
Boycott Natchez Shooters Supplies, Inc

Offline quickdtoo

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Is This A Fix???
« Reply #1 on: October 31, 2005, 05:55:36 PM »
You have a pm!!! :wink: And that doesn't mean Post Misfire!!! :-D  :-D  :-D
"Always do right, this will gratify some and astonish the rest" -  Mark Twain

Offline Fred M

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Is This A Fix???
« Reply #2 on: October 31, 2005, 06:35:59 PM »
JP
Your problem sounds like the one I had.

Check your firing pin resistance with a hook attached to a trigger scale.
Tie the trigger back so the tranferbar stays up mine was 45 oz. Take a coil off the firing pin return spring. Get it down to around 22oz.

Increase firing pin projection to 0.041".

Try a new hammer spring if you have one.

Use Federal Large Match primers or straight Federal large primers, they are the softest. The pistol primers don't have the energy for good ignition with rifle powder. The Federal Large Magnum primer would work with BL-C2. With your expansion ratio you may find the mag sparks to your liking?

I use the Fed Mag Primers with H414 in very cold weather like 10F in my 25 Hunter.

CCI and Winchester primers are harder then Federal.

I know for myself I never send any of my Handi's to H&R as long as I can get parts. But I don't know why they want to frig around on the action when they only supposed to fit a new barrel.

Next time you send for a barrel take all th guts out of the action before you send it. But they may not like that?
Fred M.
From Alberta Canada.

Offline bladerunner

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Is This A Fix???
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2005, 03:04:04 AM »
I know from reading all this that i'm going to get all my barrels before i start customizing anything  :roll: I don't reload (yet)so i'm stuck with factory primers.I'm like ya'll,I don't understand why they have to screw around with something that's working.I understand law suits,but they are only supposed to be fitting a barrel,I don't see how they are liable for something that was done before (or for that matter AFTER) it was sent in
Good shot placement + well constructed bullet = DEAD
 
                               Matt B.

Offline JPH45

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Is This A Fix???
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2005, 01:04:24 PM »
Thanks Fred, I was concerned about shortening the firing pin return spring, last thing I need to have happen is just enough of the firing pin to hang out on opening to break it off :evil: I'm ready to break one off in NEF as it is :evil: Am getting a hammer spring, and I will investigate the firing pin spring further. I'm going to head down to the local hardware and see what they have for similar springs.

Bladerunner, that is exactly the approach to take. Anything YOU do to the lockwork, NEF will undo, it's a lawyer thing. Wish I could get a lawyer to blast 'em for unrequested work. It's hard to blame 'em though in todays idiotic lawsuit climate. Perhaps Mr. Bush signing that antilawsuit bill will begin to undo the idea that uninvolved third parties are responsible for the actions dink heads. Better yet would be the return of the commonsense idea that an individual is responsible for what they do. This would mean that if I lighten a trigger, I'm responsible, not NEF. I can't imagine it being any other way actually. It takes a lawyer to sell the idea that NEF is responsible somehow, and in the end only the lawyers benefit. Do I smell a target here??? Would it be possible to find a lawyer to sue other  lawyers for being idiotic???? :)  :roll:  :-D  May God save us from the lawyers.
Boycott Natchez Shooters Supplies, Inc

Offline .308

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Is This A Fix???
« Reply #5 on: November 01, 2005, 02:23:52 PM »
Quote from: JPH45
  May God save us from the lawyers.
In the politically correct world we are headed for you could probably be sued/jailed for saying that.  :evil:

Offline Fred M

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Is This A Fix???
« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2005, 03:25:23 PM »
JP.
My Handi is perhaps the only one that has not got a single spring that has not been changed, shortened, replaced with another or otherwise modified.

I have a big selection of springs, but for that firing pin return spring I did not have a substitute. So I shortened it about one coil. As long as you make sure there are no hang ups or burrs in the seat or the pin hole 20oz is plenty to hold the spring back.

One thing about that return spring it is easy to adjust if you do it on a grinder rather than snipping a piece off. Grinding it to shorten always leaves a flat seating face, and you can test it as you go along.

There is a certain minimum weight you need for the return spring, not so much for the firing pin to return but the spring loaded transfer bar leaning on the pin from behind.

One more little snippit. Loosen the hammer extension, file a small relieve on the bottom and move that extension down as far as it wil go. This will speed up the hammer. You can calculate by how much, but I won't bore you with that. That extension should much lighter.

My ignition system works absolutely flawless now. With a new hammer spring you should be ok too.

Yes the cheating and lying lawyers are the same all over. At present they are trying to bail out a bunch of crooks in our government.
Fred M.
From Alberta Canada.