Author Topic: NEW Rifles and Shotguns for 2006? Sneak Preview? (Read 5094 times)

Busta · « **on:** November 06, 2005, 03:10:13 PM »

Looks like Sports South has the new lineup for 2006 posted. The rifles are in bold on the bottom listed with SSSRP. Looks like a 7.62x39 Heavy Barrel w/scope base, .35 Whelen w/scope base, new synthetic combos and a .243 Ultra Varmint w/fluted barrel for the rifles. Too bad there isn't more new caliber choices, but any are welcome.

20978 NEW NP1-235 PUMP 3.5 12GA 28 CTMD WAL $275.45
20979 NEW NP1-206 PUMP 20GA 26 CTMD WAL $230.63
20980 NEW SO3-823 PUMP 20GA 24 RS RB XBL $181.88
20981 NEW NP1-2S6 PUMP 20GA 26 CTMD SYN $212.18
20982 NEW NP1-201 PUMP YTH 20GA 28 CTMD WAL $230.63
20983 NEW NP1-2S1 PUMP YTH 20GA 21 RS RB SYN $212.18
20984 NEW NP1-012 PUMP 12GA 22 RS RB SYN $270.71
20985 NEW NP1-21S PUMP 20GA 21 RX RB WAL $270.71
20986 NEW SB1-11C PARDNER 12GA 28 CTMD SYN $157.98
20987 NEW SB1-20C PARDNER 20GA 26 CTMD SYN $157.98
20988 NEW SB1-25C PAR YTH 20GA 22 CTMD SYN $157.98
20989 NEW SB2-762 HANDI-RIFLE 762X39HB SB 22 $280.24
20990 NEW SB2-135 HANDI-RIFLE 35 WHLN SB 22 $280.24
20991 NEW SC2-S23 COMBO 223/20 22/26 SB SYN $313.39
20992 NEW SC2-S43 COMBO 243/20 22/26 SB SYN $313.39
20993 NEW SC2-S25 COM 22250/20 22/26 SB SYN $313.39
20994 NEW SC2-SO6 COM 30-06/20 22/26 SB SYN $313.39
20995 NEW SC2-270 COMBO 270/20 22/26 SB SYN $313.39
20996 NEW SCY-S23 COMBO 223/20 20/22 RS SYN $313.39
20997 NEW SCY-S43 COMBO 243/20 20/22 RS SYN $313.39
20998 H&R SB2-F43 ULTRA VARMINT 243 24FL SYN $367.60

quickdtoo · « **Reply #1 on:** November 06, 2005, 03:27:35 PM »

The SB2-762 is the same number that was issued this year, Grampa Mike bought one...dunno if it had a heavy barrel though. Bout time they brought back the Whelen, they finally listened!! Too bad it's only got a 22" barrel.

The RMEFs had 26" tubes.

Couger · « **Reply #2 on:** November 06, 2005, 07:08:24 PM »

Thanks Busta ......

Can you elaborate on some the codes listed in the "product descriptions?"

And do the centerfire/20 gauge combo's include Topper Deluxe Classic barrels?

lik2hunt · « **Reply #3 on:** November 07, 2005, 01:24:22 AM »

Well I can already tell that I'm not gonna be able to stand not having one of those 35 Whelens. I may wait until they offer the accessory barrel though. How about some you of more knowledgable and time-blessed people (Quick

) post up some estimated ballistics from the 22" pipe?

myarmor · « **Reply #4 on:** November 07, 2005, 01:24:58 AM »

I am all for the 7.62x39..right now I am having a great time with my SKS, and am a huge fan of bul barreled rifles.
But am I the only one to wonder why NEF/H&R would chamber this round in a bull barrel/heavy barrel?
Why not a 30-06 or 25-06, etc...??
I do like the idea, just seems strange thats all :grin:

Brett · « **Reply #5 on:** November 07, 2005, 01:52:53 AM »

I'm impressed by all the rifle/shotgun combos they are releasing. Rossi must be taking a bite out of their butts with there combo's and matched pairs. I would go for a factory H&R 22-250/20 ga. or .270/20 ga. combo if I didn't already have a .280 Handi and 20ga Topper in the locker. Surprized that the .204 didn't make it into a combo package. That would be a nice set also.

Haywire Haywood · « **Reply #6 on:** November 07, 2005, 01:58:18 AM »

I'm probably going to look at one of the Whelens. I'm kinda partial to the 35 cal since the Maxi.

Ian

Edit: Just noticed those prices.... Yeesh :eek: Looks like their heads have swollen a tad.

.308 · « **Reply #7 on:** November 07, 2005, 03:08:05 AM »

Praise be, 35 Whelans again. I had about given up. :grin:

quickdtoo · « **Reply #8 on:** November 07, 2005, 05:42:31 AM »

Those prices aren't what they sell for, they're list, you can compare them to what Walmart sells em for, use the Walmart prices. Maybe Blue Bayou will post the UPCs for the new firearms.

Like I said earlier, the SB2-762 is already available, has been, maybe the HB is a typo at Sports South, Grampa Mike didn't say anything about it being a heavy barrel.

Quote from: GrampaMike

Went to a gun show today hoping to find a NEF/H&R that I wanted for my collection? In the whole show there were only two. First was a used 38-55 Target in very good shape, asking price $350. I passed even though I wanted it. The other was a NIB SB2-762, 7.62mm x 39, basic stock, no sights, 22Â” barrel, scope base. This one I bought, didnÂ’t even know they offered the 7.62mm x 39 as a whole rifle. Anyway, got my monthly gun fix. I feel much better tonight!

http://www.graybeardoutdoors.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=69445&highlight=sb2762

Mac11700 · « **Reply #9 on:** November 07, 2005, 05:43:24 AM »

One of these days they are going to actually listen to us...and bring out what we want and have asked for....I don't understand what their reasoning is..we are using a single shot...and a 26" barreled Handi is still shorter than a 22" bolt gun.....to rob a fine outstanding cartridge such as the Whelen of 4" of barrel...from what they had already offered...just doesn't make good sense to me...

Like2hunt...figure about 100 fps slower than the book loads that use a 24" barrel in testing the Whelen...and who knows on using the factory load...since it was tested out of a 26" tube...and did not even get close to the velocity advertised anyway....

Still though...better than not having it at all I guess...

Mac

bajabill · « **Reply #10 on:** November 07, 2005, 06:13:03 AM »

It just figures that they would bring the whelen back after I just got the 357 mag. Well, not reason to ream the mag to a max I guess.

I always go back to expansion ratios before I get too upset about barrel length. And I like to think in general terms, not absolutes - we never no these data absolutely. So, the Whelen is a necked up 06 case, compared to the 25-06 which is necked down. The bore area and volume is roughly double that of the 26-06 sibling and 35% more than the parent 30 cal. I dont believe the whelen is starving for every extra inch of barrel as much of some other chamberings that are closer to being "overbore" if we can use that illusive term. Then, for the general guidelines of FPS per extra inch of barrel, I would swing to the lower end of the range rather than the uper end of the range. I think one of my more concerns with the Whelen is the aggresiveness (lack of) of the reloading data, especially compared to the 338-06. Granted, I have not looked exhaustively at a lot of whelen data. I would get one of the USA 1 Load Loadbooks for it eventually.

Now, I have almost resolved that my whelen will be a rebarreled LH Savage project gun. We will see how I flip this over and over the next year or so.

Mac11700 · « **Reply #11 on:** November 07, 2005, 06:48:28 AM »

Ohh...there's plenty of reloading data for the 35 Whelen...all right...you don't have to worry about that...and cutting 4" of barrel off of it will reduce the velocity of it considerably....sure...you can maximize any load for the barrel by manipulating your powder choices and charges...but you still won't get near the max velocities from the shorter tube with the same loads.The 338-06 is a great cartridge...but so too is the 35 Whelen...and I certain it won't matter to a few folks who don't care about barrel lenght... just as long as they do offer it...I care about it though...and I want the option of the longer barrel...you get more velocity out of them with factory and handloads...giving more bang for the buck with them...they balance better...and most of the time they are more accurate than the shorter tubes in the Handi...there are more hunting situations than the deep woods/brush gun crowds want to believe...and some of us have those long shots available where we hunt...so...having an extra 200 fps to start out with can mean a-lot at 300-400 yards...when using the heavier 250 grain bullets...just look at the difference between the 250 grain Speer...and the 250 grain Nosler partiton..the Speer #13 list a 22" barrel...and the Nosler #5 list a 24"...they are using up to 4-5 grains more powder with the shorter tube and getting 200 fps slower velocities than what the Noslers loading are...While this doesn't mean a-lot to some....to others like me it does...because I know what velocity is being sacraficed by cutting back a 26" tube...

Mac

Sourdough · « **Reply #12 on:** November 07, 2005, 08:18:23 AM »

I have a 26" .35 Whelen Handi, just one problem, too long to fit on the handlebars of my fourwheeler or snowmachine. With the shorter tube it will fit where I carry my 30-06 Handi. Have contemplated cutting the barrel off, but just could not bring myself to do it. Now I don't have to, I'll be buying one as soon as Wal-Mart can get them in. I regularly shoot my 22" 30-06 at 500 to 700 yards, so I don't see a big disadvantage. This problem can be worked around.

Mac11700 · « **Reply #13 on:** November 07, 2005, 08:39:46 AM »

Sure it can be worked around...but...the point is " Why" ?...Why not give us the option of the longer barrels...? That's what burns my backside... :evil:

Mac

myarmor · « **Reply #14 on:** November 07, 2005, 09:32:00 AM »

I'm with ya Mac. I mean why is it that we only have 2 calibers with 26" barrels-25-06 and 280? There are several calibers that could benifit from it, and it blows my mind that NEF/H&R only carrys the 308 in a 22" configuration-though I am happy at least you can get it in a Bull Barrel-but still.
I hope some more news comes through as this unfolds.

Varminter · « **Reply #15 on:** November 07, 2005, 09:36:01 AM »

I saw this on sports south last night but didn't have time to post about it. I can already tell you as soon as i see a 35 whelen it's going home with me. No matter the cost. So of those shotguns end up in my safe as well.

Cottonwood · « **Reply #16 on:** November 07, 2005, 09:42:04 AM »

Yep, the .35 Whelen will do good...

I currently thinking about changing out a Springfield BA in .243 Win to a .358 Winchester. There is just something about a 35 caliber rifle as well as my other favorites.

.308 · « **Reply #17 on:** November 07, 2005, 09:47:43 AM »

Maybe it ain't what all of us want, but at least it's a step in the right direction, more calibers to choose from. I'll take one any way I can get it. :wink:

Norseman112 · « **Reply #18 on:** November 07, 2005, 10:22:16 AM »

Nice to see them bring the 35 Whelen back. To bad they don't offer it in 26" barrel.......I would buy one.

Norse

Fred M · « **Reply #19 on:** November 07, 2005, 11:23:56 AM »

Mac and Norseman.

Consider the following arm chair mathematics.

26" minus 4 inches = 22" The barrel saving is 4" per barrel this equates to one new barrel for every 5.5 barrels produced. A considerable saving, a whopping 15.5%. And consumers be go to hell. It is a crappy deal.

I don't believe in any barrel length on a SS rifle under 24". There are many good reasons for that and all benificial to the user.

Of course I am an opinionated consumer.

hellacatcher · « **Reply #20 on:** November 07, 2005, 11:27:40 AM »

I am one who couldn't wait----bought a 35 whelan Remington 700 CLD last year I am here to tell you that is one impressive cartage. I do wish H&R had brought one out sooner they knew it was a item that many wanted. The same thing happened with the 204 they had it in there catalog at least 6 mo. or more before they brought it out and my mouth watered too long bought one in a savage. Not saying any thing wrong with the H&Rs I sure do have a closet full and plan on more, but I sure don't under stand some of the things they do.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #21 on:** November 07, 2005, 11:30:51 AM »

Quote from: Fred M

Of course I am an opinionated consumer.

An opinionated something or another!!!

:-D :-D :-D :wink:

Norseman112 · « **Reply #22 on:** November 07, 2005, 01:26:17 PM »

I hear ya Fred, you made some good points.

Norse

Cookiemann · « **Reply #23 on:** November 07, 2005, 01:49:01 PM »

Please pardon the comparison BUT if ya muff enough shots, the other guy is gonna run the table on ya. How many more shots do the NEF/H&R guys think they have left??

I certainly hope they get it together before its too late. Rossi isn't that far from stealing the game.

nomosendero · « **Reply #24 on:** November 07, 2005, 01:51:16 PM »

Mac is absolutely correct. I would understand the 22" in a bolt gun, but not
in a single shot as the receiver on a bolt gun is usually 4" or so. The 26"
handles well & the slight wt. helps in recoil. It also puts the muzzle blast further away from the shooter. If someone wanted a short barrel, it is
inexpensive to have it cut to any length you want that is legal.

Fred M
I am afraid you are on to something! It reminds me of Walmart selling
their shirts with the short tails. They can sell 10 million of these too short
to keep tucked in shirts & have enough material left over to make another
million an a half shirts. Every day low prices but high shirts I guess.
I think they should have done it with the skirts instead!!!

quickdtoo · « **Reply #25 on:** November 07, 2005, 02:01:37 PM »

Quote from: Cookieman

Rossi isn't that far from stealing the game.

If Rossi doesn't get their barrel program going, they're the ones that are gonna loose. They've been stalling on it for years....I personally don't think it's ever gonna happen. If they ever do, then they're provide some more competition for H&R...which would be good, it may wake up Marlin!

http://www.rossiusa.com/main/barrel-program.cfm

Mainer · « **Reply #26 on:** November 07, 2005, 02:58:27 PM »

.35 Whelen??!! :-D I'm excited!!! :grin:

With respect to handling and ballistics, maybe you guys are right and H&R didn't make the best decision by chosing a 22" barrel. However, from a business point of view it appears they may have done the least amount necessary to get a bunch of us to run out and buy new rifles. Maybe they're wiser than we think. I think Fred's right on the money with his 22" barrel = lower production cost formula.

Ed in AL · « **Reply #27 on:** November 07, 2005, 03:16:59 PM »

It was established earlier that the HB on the 7.62 barrel designation was incorrect. Do you think there is a possibility the barrel might be 26" on the Whelen? It could be a typo.

We need to wait and see, or call CS and see what they say. :wink:

quickdtoo · « **Reply #28 on:** November 07, 2005, 03:28:00 PM »

That's always possible. Me thinks that a compromise barrel length of 24" would be nice, I have a 7x64 Brenneke Handi with 24" barrel that is real nice handling, I think it would be a good length for them to produce.

Fred M · « **Reply #29 on:** November 07, 2005, 05:49:53 PM »

Tim.
I agree! A 24" barrel on a 35 Whelen Handy would make it very handy indeed. Something desirable for a woods rifle.

This would not sacrifice much in velocity since the cartridge uses relatively fast powders.

I am simply in love with that 24" barrel on the 257 Roberts and will build another one in a different caliber.

Went over to my friends machine shop today and searched for the best milling cutter with the biggest radius to do another 24" octagon barrel, which is just sitting around. Rather than selling it I make it into a what?

6x47FM. 6x47HBR 6x222RemMag, 6mm International all with a 1-12" twist.
This will be a long range varmint rifle with 55 to 60gr bullets. Also these cartridges are dated technology but that is all you can make out of a 223 for a low density varminter.

It will be simple to design the octagon since I have made up an MS Excel program last year. If the rebore turns out like the 257 Roberts the it will shoot int a 1/4" with three shots. .

The barrel will be a bit heavier than the 257R but with the same taper as the 24" bull barrel.

The scope for it will be a 6-24 Bushnell 4200 which is being used at 6x for HBR shooting, or a 6x24 Sightron.

Ron Smith has most of the reamers and I have two myself.