Author Topic: could this be it? (Read 1042 times)

bladerunner · « **on:** December 15, 2005, 12:58:16 PM »

ok,where the barrel attaches to the receiver,right where the hinge pin engages....on all 3 of my barrels it looks like it doesn't engage equally all the way across at the bottom of the "u"....could it be my hinge pin is out of round?

all 3 barrels rattle if shaken with the forearm off..the 243 is the least,then the 270 U/C then the 223 is the worst...but all three do it.....MUCH more side to side than up and down,could that still make it shoot bad vertically?

If I'm gonnna keep 'em they hafta shoot at LEAST 1 and a half inch groups at 100 yards

only reason I haven't already sold them is I'm gonna take a hosing and can't afford another rifle right now

PLEASE HELP!!!

quickdtoo · « **Reply #1 on:** December 15, 2005, 01:20:17 PM »

They shouldn't be loose in the frame when the forend is off. I would contact H&R, Gordon if you can get him on the phone, and explain nicely what's happened and ask for his help. Worse case scenario, they might offer to buy back your rifle and barrels as they did for Lik2hunt when he couldn't get satisfaction with his .25-06.

aulrich · « **Reply #2 on:** December 15, 2005, 03:36:19 PM »

It definitly sounds like you should call CS. Just like quick said BE nice. In the mean time, one thing you could try just to see is to take feeler guage and shim the "U". I had a 243 ultra that sounded like yours it took a .0045" shim and it started to shoot just under 1.5" @ 100.

I never did send it back half because I figured it would take half of forever to get it back across the border, and the fix worked. I just used progressivly thicker strips untill the gun would not close and then backed off one thickness.

Another useful trick is to use plasti-guage put it on the breech face and close the gun. That 243 that I had, had a gap of .006". The plasti-guage will give you a good hint to what thickness shim to use., and som infor for NEF CS.

A question for you multi barrel folk, do you think it is worth having seperate forearms for each barrel? Because it does seem that forearm fit is one of the components of accuracy in a handi. Not that I'll get an etxra barrel

(that geography thing) just curious.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #3 on:** December 15, 2005, 03:54:30 PM »

Quote from: aulrich

A question for you multi barrel folk, do you think it is worth having seperate forearms for each barrel? Because it does seem that forearm fit is one of the components of accuracy in a handi. Not that I'll get an etxra barrel (that geography thing) just curious.

There's a lot of merit in that Idea, the only bad thing about bedding a forend is if the frame has multiple barrels, other than having dedicated frame/barrel combos, having a dedicated forend should work extremely well and at minimal cost!! :wink: Forends can be bought at Brownell's who I'm pretty sure ships to Canada.

coop2564 · « **Reply #4 on:** December 16, 2005, 06:00:13 AM »

Bladerunner you have found your problem. My 243 didnt lock up tight and shot all over the place. All 3 of my barrels lock tight now after sending back and all shoot right at moa including my 243 superlight. I have tried three different forends on them since getting the guns to lockup without feeling any slack or bumps and It doesnt matter which forend is on them they still shoot good groups although point of impact might change slightly. I havent had to use any orings or bedding materials. It appears to me that the key to these guns is in the lockup. It took about 5 weeks to get mine back but was definitly worth it. Just me 2 cents.

.308 · « **Reply #5 on:** December 16, 2005, 11:30:24 AM »

That's hard to imagine that their work would get that sloppy. You just got it back from the barrel program with some of those barrels, didn't you??? I have three barrels that fit one frame and five that fit another (it was there about the same time as yours) and none of them rattle. They musta done your barrel fitting on a Monday or a Friday. I'm not making light of your situation, I truly feel for you. If it were me I'd give C/S a call and definitely ask for Gordon. Like others have said, BE nice and try to be patient. Take care...

JPH45 · « **Reply #6 on:** December 16, 2005, 03:44:58 PM »

I found my 38-55 had become loose in the frame this past weekend, took a .002" shim to tighten it back up. Afterward it was shooting 1 1/2" lower than it had been. That was at 50 yards :eek: Made a deal and got my Encore 209X50 back today. Found 375 JDJ 26" heavy barrel NIB for $205.00. Will have to wait till next year to get a 357 Max barrel, but I ain't lookin' back. I'll keep and shoot my 38-55 and 357 Max, they shoot too good to turn loose of, and like you bladerunner, I've too much invested to take that a bath on them. But I'm replacing them as quickly as I can, I refuse to be in the position of having a deer in my sights and a gun that don't work.

I don't think these are bad rifles persay, but they are a crap shoot. In past I've put as many rounds through a single Contender in a year as I ahve through 5 of these rifles in 3 years. I never had the kind of troubles from a TC as I've had from these.

I think it is time to stop kidding ourselves about how good these rifles are, and to begin to be hard and straight with NEF/Marlin about the overall quality and endurance of their product. I'd gladly pay $100 bucks more for a rifle that will work today and 10 years from now without having to be worked on in between, just to keep it shooting.

It is not my intent to come off as dissin' the Handi. I've fired on the order of 8000 rounds through my rifles, my 357 Max has seen over 3000 of those rounds. But when a factory fitted barrel looses it's tightness in 1300 rounds (my 38-55) something is wrong, and bad wrong.

This very problem has been discussed at length in past, and has existed for at least as long as the 3 years I've been a member of the "Internet Handi Rifle Club". I don't think the factory doesn't know the problem exists. The question is will the factory find and correct the problem, not just on a returned gun, but out on the factory floor before the gun leaves the door. So far, the factory has not done this, as evidenced by this thread, and it is them that I have lost faith in, not the rifle.

NEF, If you are listening, please act to restore my faith, I too want to believe in my rifles but it is hard to do when there are other far more reliable choices out there.

jeff223 · « **Reply #7 on:** December 16, 2005, 04:13:05 PM »

dont think you can go wrong with the Encore John.i made a switch awhile back too as you already know.sure i still have some NEFs on hand but i shoot the tender more than ever.i live in the shotgun zone here in Michigan so most of my hunting is done with the muzz loader,TC Contender and the NEF slugguns.the slugguns stay nice and tight because they dont get shot all that much.when you pay $2.00 a pop for slugs that kind of slows a person down some.my 223 is tight still and its had many rounds through it.dont know what to say about that one. must be a very good one

hellacatcher · « **Reply #8 on:** December 16, 2005, 05:17:24 PM »

They are good guns for what they are but some time a person gets tired of working on one just to get it where another brand would be out of the box. Of all I have I got maybe two or three that are where they should be. My 22 hornet used to be dang good but now has opened up I have fooled with it almost all I want to. Not saying it wasn't fun for awhile but I have other things to keep me busy. May come back to the hornet another day or may trade it off later.

Mac11700 · « **Reply #9 on:** December 16, 2005, 07:28:23 PM »

I dunno what to think on some of these rifles..From the way some folks speak of them..it sounds like they started off with a batch of lemons...and from a-lot of other folks..no major problems at all....nothing but cherries & creame...I may not put 1500 rounds thru my rifles now-a-days in a given year...close...but not that many anymore..none of them have expanded the frame barrel gap..I just measured all of them again....I almost wonder if a person could find out the serial numbers of all of these lemons...and could see if they are all from the same batch...it might start making more sense to me if they were...

I've put a-lot of real heavy loads thru a few of mine in the past ...and never did any of the groups open up drasticly enough that I had to worry...I don't think I'm going to start now...but time will determine if I do start having problems...then...I will either beef up the lug with better steel and refit it...or move on to another type single shot..I'm sure if one is going to fail...it will be the one that has the largest case head and that only gets heavy loads thru it and has for the last 400 rounds..

Mac

quickdtoo · « **Reply #10 on:** December 16, 2005, 07:57:18 PM »

I'm wonderin if anyone lubes the pivot on their rifles? I use either Tetra grease or Molyfusion on mine, but I don't shoot 1500 rounds a year, either. But if someone does, I would think the soft underlug would wear loose against the hard pivot pin. Something to consider. :wink:

JPH45 · « **Reply #11 on:** December 17, 2005, 01:27:29 PM »

I was sent a sample of some grease, and that is what I used, don't have the tube now, so who knows what it was, but it's still on the hinge pin.

One of the great things about this site is that a bit of reading will keep a Handi shooting a long time. Once I get a centerfire barrel on my Encore I may then send my rifle back and let them work on it, but as I'e already said, I've lost faith in NEF. Perhaps I'm just hanging on.....

Brett · « **Reply #12 on:** December 17, 2005, 03:01:28 PM »

Is it a QC thing, a design flaw or poor materials which is causing actions to loosen up long before they should. I wonder if Rossi's single shots (an almost identical design) has the same issues that we keep hearing about in the NEF/H&R's. One thing for sure is that I keep my hinge pin and lug well greased. It doesn't take a genius to know that bare metal rubbing against bare metal is going to cause wear which will eventually cause problems.

hellacatcher · « **Reply #13 on:** December 17, 2005, 03:44:22 PM »

When you buy one you have certain expectations of the gun or car or anything else. If that is not meet then there is disappointment. After trying one thing after another you get tired of trying to get it where it should be. I am not saying I don't have some I am dang proud of like my 357max. But when I can buy a different style and get out of the box where I want to be with out polishing the chamber or putting "O" rings on a stud or a dozen other things that pops up here then what is one to think. Sorry fellows been a long day. Up at 5am out to the woods then meet Dennis at the gun range where we had to punch stuck cases out of a 223 and a 243 both had been polished--chamber where dry remember we both have been here awhile now if that had happen while hunting I would not have ben a happy puppy. Time to shut up and go to bed. Agin sorry for letting go.

TOMMYY01 · « **Reply #14 on:** December 18, 2005, 09:42:14 PM »

All the handis that I've bought has been the whole gun, no acc. barrels. As of this post I've not had a problem with any of them. I believe, that maybe if the QC and QA programs were up to where the CS is, they probably would be a better gun. In years past, american made products, have been second to none. Can't say that anymore! It's goin' to take the manufactering section of american made products, to produce better quality and then work on geeting the trust back that they have lost of the american people! :wink:
tommy