Case formming a 222 - 223 into the Fireball?

[Doe]

Just got my 221 form Die from midway - figured that all I need "NOT" they say need to get a Trim Die also, didn't say that in the order book- already spent $57 on the form die $21 more for the trim die. Any way my Question would be how does the trim die work, does it have to be put on a mount or do you just use your hand and turn the brass or die in your hand? Never form a case into another case before is it easy?

[Hairtrigger]

Will neck thickness be an issue once you have formed the case?
Why can you not put the formed case into a regular case trimmer as if it were a 221 that had streched a bit?
Just asking.
IMHO you have already spent almost enough to buy 500 pices of new brass now you need to spend a bunch of time...
I can see forming cases for obsolite calibers but not for a caliber that is available new

[Robert357]

From what I know you can improvise and not get the trim die.  It will require more handwork and maybe a few spoiled cases, but it probably isn't necessary.

I have never fire formed for .221 fireball, but when I was a kid, I sure wanted one of those bolt action remington handguns.

The following is an interesting link and article with lots of pictures on fire forming for the Japanese 7.7x58.  I has some tips on case trimming that may or may not work for you and your fireball round.

http://www.surplusrifle.com/shooting2006/srtype99/index.asp

I have an Ariska type 99 and have made some brass for it, although I now have a good supply of Graf & son brass for that 7.7x58 rifle.

Good luck and let us know how it goes.

[Reed1911]

Since you ordered it from Midway, and considering the cost you have already paid, provided you have not used them I would return them.
You'll end up paying S/H; but you can return them via USPS and do it for about 5 dollars. The reason I say this, is that not only are you going to need a trim die, but you will still have to trim them in a normal case trimmer, chamfer the mouths, thin the necks, and then load. You will be much ahead of it all if you just buy the brass.

Case forming is not terribly difficult, but I agree with Hairtrigger, there is no need to waste time on forming brass if a commercial supply is available, unless you just have that much free time laying around.

[Doe]

Good advice guys. I bought the dies just incase they stop making the 221 fire ball case. U-know preventtive measure. Just wanted to know why? there is a need for a trim die? Like the other guy said can't we just use a form case die and then tirm it in the trimmer? Anybody?

[Questor]

221 fireball brass is readily available. You don't need to bother making it.

[skb2706]

Don't have a form die but I did try making .221 brass from .223....one of those days when I had too much time. You can do it with just a size die....little at a time and stopping to trim midway thru the process. It would compare closely with sweeping the gymnasium floor with a toothbrush.
.221 brass lasts thru several loadings......some of mine have 8 plus loads thru them. So buy up a few hundred and never worry about itagain.

[RugerNo3]

You don't need to worry about the 221 Fireball case being discontinued. The various Whisper cartridges rely on that brass at SSK Industries. The 444 Marlin and the 225 Winchester are also used for his cartridges.

[Hairtrigger]

Also the fact that Remington made the Clasic in 221 Fireball is a good sign that brass will continue to be available

[Steve P]

After you put the brass thru the forming die, you put the trim die in the press then use a hack saw to cut off the excess neck that sticks up thru it when you pull the handle. .  You are talking of hours of work with little benefit.  Like they said before, go buy the brass.

Those forming dies are really only worth the $$ when you have to get brass that is not readily available.  I presonally prefer shooting to reloading and the RP 221 brass is excellent.

Steve

[ricciardelli]

Why go through all that?

Remington is currently producing .221 brass, and the last time I checked it was around $100 for 500.

[Doe]

Why go through all that?

Remington is currently producing .221 brass, and the last time I checked it was around $100 for 500.

Cause I only work 3 days a week and I get BORED!! Pluse I pick up brass at the range and have lots of 223 cases. :grin:  

[victorcharlie]

There seems to be some renewed interest in the fireball.  I see a lot of people posting about it as it fits the needs of a lot of the fur hunters.  As it gains popularity, bass availability is much more certain.

Good point about the whispers........I was thinking my next purchase might be a hornet or k hornet, but some people have accuracy issues with hornets and from what I read they don't seem to be as easy to reload for.  That makes the 221 fireball even more attractive to me.......

Keep us posted please........

[skb2706]

Even after all the free advise you got here and you still want to make .221s out of .223s.........you don't need a form die. You can do it with a size die for a FB and nothing else til you're ready to trim them. It is of course your $57 and your time.

[Slamfire]

Man I got 500 cases in the middle 70s and still have mor'n half of 'em left, that's a lifetime supply for me.  

[Questor]

Doe:

You're a prime candidate for getting into bullet casting. That will take a lot of time and will give you something constructive to work on.  Doing it the most time-consuming way is also the most inexpensive way.

As for the Fireball, I consider it the thinking man's 22 hornet.  Ballistics can be tuned down a bit to 22 hornet velocities, better variety of bullets is available, and the brass is much better. It's an easy cartridge to reload.

I recommend IMR 4198 powder. I repeat: IMR.