Author Topic: 500 mag vs. 460???? (Read 2508 times)

kgillard · « **on:** January 14, 2006, 04:39:04 PM »

Hello all,

I'm probably getting ready to ask a question that's been asked before, but I haven't found it yet, so here goes....

How much difference in the 500 mag and the 460? My daughter's fiance is getting ready to buy a 500 mag and I've been looking at the 460. I know you can shoot up to a 440 grain bullet out of the 500, but what's the largest you can shoot in the 460? I'd like to mainly go deer and elk pistol hunting, so does either round far out do the other for that type hunting? Of course, if I get the chance, I'd like to bear hunt also...
Thanks in advance,
Karl

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #1 on:** January 14, 2006, 06:09:58 PM »

kgillard, 440 gr. bullets in the 500 Mag is not the largest you can go. I have shot some 700 gr. bullets out of the 500 Mag. Hornady make 500 gr. factory loads for the 500 Mag. As far as the 460 Mag, I think the biggest factory load is like 395 gr. But I think there may be some guys casting larger bullets.

If S&W came out with the 460 Mag before the 500 Mag. The sales of the 500 Mag would not have been as good. The 460 is my favorite round. I have two 500 Mag's and two 460's Mags. In my opinion the 460 could take any game in North America.

mbartel · « **Reply #2 on:** January 15, 2006, 01:50:30 AM »

If you are not a handloader, then the .460 has a wider variety of factory ammo to choose from. You can shoot at the very low power level (.45 schofield cowboy loads from Black Hills), or the top .460 loads, and all of the .45 Colt and .454 Cassul loads in between.

If you do handload, then you can load the .500 up or down the power scale as you see fit.

So....if you don't handload, I suggest the .460. More versatility.
If you do handload.....then either one will do nicely.

mbartel · « **Reply #3 on:** January 15, 2006, 01:55:57 AM »

If you are not a handloader, then the .460 has a wider variety of factory ammo to choose from. You can shoot at the very low power level (.45 schofield cowboy loads from Black Hills), or the top .460 loads, and all of the .45 Colt and .454 Cassul loads in between.

If you do handload, then you can load the .500 up or down the power scale as you see fit.

So....if you don't handload, I suggest the .460. More versatility.
If you do handload.....then either one will do nicely.

kgillard · « **Reply #4 on:** January 15, 2006, 06:00:38 AM »

Redhawk,

Why is the 460 your favorite round? Is this due to availability of ammo; flat shooting; recoil; variety of ammo, etc.? Thanks,

Karl

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #5 on:** January 15, 2006, 06:47:27 AM »

I like the less felt recoil, longer range capability, also it is a little easier on the hand and wrist when shoot a lot at the range. I am not concerned with the ability to shoot the 45L/C's or the 454 Casulls, but it is nice to be able to shot all of them. I prefer the 460 Mags. Now I do like my 500 mags, but for some reason I just like the 460 better, hard to explain. The only down fall to all of the big bore guns with muzzle breaks is the flash and how loud they are, but nothing a set of Walker game ear muffs won't cure.

wyocarp · « **Reply #6 on:** January 15, 2006, 08:14:24 AM »

Quote from: mbartel

If you are not a handloader, then the .460 has a wider variety of factory ammo to choose from. You can shoot at the very low power level (.45 schofield cowboy loads from Black Hills), or the top .460 loads, and all of the .45 Colt and .454 Cassul loads in between.

If you do handload, then you can load the .500 up or down the power scale as you see fit.

So....if you don't handload, I suggest the .460. More versatility.
If you do handload.....then either one will do nicely.

Does the ability to shoot different loads really add to the versatility of a gun? Why would anyone want to shoot a .45 colt out of a .460? If you want to shoot .45 colt, buy a cowboy action pistol and do so. If I wanted to shoot .38's I wouldn't buy a .357. I let someone shoot a couple of my .500's just yesterday and his comment was they were very comfortable to shoot. They had some mildly loaded 700gr. cast bullets in them. The availability of factory ammo is also limited by where one lives. I know if I had to buy ammo for either the .460 or the .500 in the town that I live in, I wouldn't shoot very much. If one of these guns is on the shopping list, reloading should be as well. If you don't, I doubt that many will shoot enough to be efficient with either because of ammo costs and using the .45 colt would be like driving a porsche in a driveway.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #7 on:** January 15, 2006, 11:57:13 AM »

Quote from: wyocarp

Quote from: mbartel
If you are not a handloader, then the .460 has a wider variety of factory ammo to choose from. You can shoot at the very low power level (.45 schofield cowboy loads from Black Hills), or the top .460 loads, and all of the .45 Colt and .454 Cassul loads in between.

If you do handload, then you can load the .500 up or down the power scale as you see fit.

So....if you don't handload, I suggest the .460. More versatility.
If you do handload.....then either one will do nicely.

Does the ability to shoot different loads really add to the versatility of a gun? Why would anyone want to shoot a .45 colt out of a .460? If you want to shoot .45 colt, buy a cowboy action pistol and do so. If I wanted to shoot .38's I wouldn't buy a .357. I let someone shoot a couple of my .500's just yesterday and his comment was they were very comfortable to shoot. They had some mildly loaded 700gr. cast bullets in them. The availability of factory ammo is also limited by where one lives. I know if I had to buy ammo for either the .460 or the .500 in the town that I live in, I wouldn't shoot very much. If one of these guns is on the shopping list, reloading should be as well. If you don't, I doubt that many will shoot enough to be efficient with either because of ammo costs and using the .45 colt would be like driving a porsche in a driveway.

As a matter of fact it does. The 460 has a lot more versatility than the 500 Mag. I say that being a 500 Mag owner and a 460 Mag owner. Not everyone wants to shoot the 460's all the time. Some are happy with the 45 L/C's. You may not think it is practical, but other find it is. It is all a matter of opinion. Now I don't shoot the 45 L/C's in my 460, I like the 460 Mags, I also shoot the 454 Casulls on the odd occasion. I don't see the need to buy a cowboy action pistol just to shoot 45L/C's.
You don't always have to drive a Porsche fast to enjoy it. JMHO.

jro45 · « **Reply #8 on:** January 17, 2006, 08:42:48 AM »

I own the 500 S&W Mag. It will shoot a 270 gr bullet 200 yds. It is the worlds most powerful handgun with factory ammo made for it. It shoots the 500 gr bullet at 1420 fps. I don't shoot lead in it. It will shoot the 400 gr bullets at 1620 fps and the 350 gr bullet at 1780 fps.

kgillard · « **Reply #9 on:** January 17, 2006, 12:26:51 PM »

Well, I for one want the ability to shoot various calibers/rounds in the same gun. Why would I buy a .38 when I could buy a .357 and shoot both. A whole lot cheaper to buy or reload .38 special as compared to .357mag and I can go "plinking" all day long.

Also, I have about 1,800 loaded rounds of .45LC and all the equipment to reload a shoot everyday. Left overs from my Cowboy Action days. I can't imagine what it would cost to "plink" with the .460. Not being independently wealthy, I can atleast get some use out of my gun.

Guess its all a matter of preference and understanding. Not to get under your skin wyocarp, but your argument makes no sense to me. Your first comment/question, "Does the ability to shoot different loads really add to the versatility of a gun?" Duhhhh!

jro45 · « **Reply #10 on:** January 18, 2006, 04:18:02 AM »

Good shooting to you

cadjak · « **Reply #11 on:** January 20, 2006, 07:59:41 AM »

Quote

If you are not a handloader, then the .460 has a wider variety of factory ammo to choose from. You can shoot at the very low power level (.45 schofield cowboy loads from Black Hills), or the top .460 loads, and all of the .45 Colt and .454 Cassul loads in between.

Take a look a the loads available from Ballistic Supply. Owned and operated by true 500 shooters, Bill and Leona Bramlett. The 500 S&W is the only cartridge they load and their products range from a 350gr at 800fps (what recoil?), to the monster 700gr hard cast at 1200fps (WHAT RECOIL!) and a lot of good loads between them. Their prices are good, for factory loaded ammo, and their components are top quality. Starline brass, CCI benchrest primers, Honady XTP bullets etc.

I plug their products whenever I can, because the Bramletts are decent folks making a good product in a very competetive world. They helped me out when I needed a special load done for Alaska. They got it to me in time and it was a great load.

http://www.ballisticsupply.net/Default.aspx?tabid=252105

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #12 on:** January 20, 2006, 10:29:00 AM »

Quote from: cadjak

Quote
If you are not a handloader, then the .460 has a wider variety of factory ammo to choose from. You can shoot at the very low power level (.45 schofield cowboy loads from Black Hills), or the top .460 loads, and all of the .45 Colt and .454 Cassul loads in between.

Take a look a the loads available from Ballistic Supply. Owned and operated by true 500 shooters, Bill and Leona Bramlett. The 500 S&W is the only cartridge they load and their products range from a 350gr at 800fps (what recoil?), to the monster 700gr hard cast at 1200fps (WHAT RECOIL!) and a lot of good loads between them. Their prices are good, for factory loaded ammo, and their components are top quality. Starline brass, CCI benchrest primers, Honady XTP bullets etc.

I plug their products whenever I can, because the Bramletts are decent folks making a good product in a very competetive world. They helped me out when I needed a special load done for Alaska. They got it to me in time and it was a great load.

http://www.ballisticsupply.net/Default.aspx?tabid=252105

What does it take to qualify as a true 500 shooter. I have been shooting two of them for over 2 years now. :-D

cadjak · « **Reply #13 on:** January 20, 2006, 01:31:32 PM »

Quote

What does it take to qualify as a true 500 shooter. I have been shooting two of them for over 2 years now

You definitely qualify. T-Shirt and laminated membership card are on the way. :wink: :wink:

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #14 on:** January 20, 2006, 05:01:08 PM »

Quote from: cadjak

Quote
What does it take to qualify as a true 500 shooter. I have been shooting two of them for over 2 years now

You definitely qualify. T-Shirt and laminated membership card are on the way. :wink: :wink:

I will be looking in my mail box. LOL :-D

wyocarp · « **Reply #15 on:** February 01, 2006, 03:09:03 PM »

I guess it isn't the first time that I disagree with the majority. I feel the variations of the possible loads in the .500 make it a better gun than the .460. The performance of the .460 has been over exagerated in my opinion. I guess I am not a fan of using a lot of different bullets in the same gun. I've yet to have any brass go bad with the .500 which lowers the shooting cost down to an unbelievably low cost when added to casting my own with free lead.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #16 on:** February 01, 2006, 05:06:43 PM »

Quote from: wyocarp

I guess it isn't the first time that I disagree with the majority. I feel the variations of the possible loads in the .500 make it a better gun than the .460. The performance of the .460 has been over exagerated in my opinion. I guess I am not a fan of using a lot of different bullets in the same gun. I've yet to have any brass go bad with the .500 which lowers the shooting cost down to an unbelievably low cost when added to casting my own with free lead.

wyocarp, I own two 500 Mags and two 460 Mags. I reload for both and the recoil on the 460 Mag is a lot more manageable then the 500 Mag. Now I have shot well over 4000 rounds in all of my 500 Mags. I don't mind the recoil, but for long distance shooting the 460 Mags beats the 500 Mag. Just how was the performance of the 460 Mag exaggerated? I have done a lot of shooting out to 150 yards and I hold dead on and consistently hit a 4 inch clay target. Reloading aside, the person that does not reload can shoot the 460 a lot cheaper than the 500 Mag.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #17 on:** February 01, 2006, 05:10:37 PM »

Quote from: wyocarp

I guess it isn't the first time that I disagree with the majority. I feel the variations of the possible loads in the .500 make it a better gun than the .460. The performance of the .460 has been over exagerated in my opinion. I guess I am not a fan of using a lot of different bullets in the same gun. I've yet to have any brass go bad with the .500 which lowers the shooting cost down to an unbelievably low cost when added to casting my own with free lead.

wyocarp, One more question, Have you shot the 460 Mag yet? Or are you basing your opinion on just that, your opinion.

wyocarp · « **Reply #18 on:** February 02, 2006, 06:25:38 AM »

Well, it's all about opinions. We have a steel target at 200yds. at our range here that I have no problems hitting with the 500.

When at the range the other day, there was a guy who said a friend of his shot an elk with a 50 BMG. He said it took him hours to find it. So the questions is, how far do you want to shoot with a handgun?

A bear I shot last year with my .500, I spotted probably a mile away. I stalked him to within about 30 yards. It was very exciting as my son and I came over the last little rise, not knowing where the bear would be since we hadn't been able to see him for a while. And then for him to be that close was awesome. Using a 50 BMG, I could have shot him from where I spotted him, but how much would that have been? The challenge of using a pistol is to get closer, not to shot a rifle bullet out of a pistol in my opinion.

By the way, my three of a kind .500's,460 high, I believe beats your two pairs. Just kidding with you.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #19 on:** February 02, 2006, 06:58:46 AM »

wyocarp, I like to get up and personal when handgun hunting, but when I see the animal of my dreams 150 yards and no chance foe a stock, I will be glad the 460 is on my side.

I had you beat before I sold one of my 500 Mags. I had a full boat. 500's over 460's :-D

wyocarp · « **Reply #20 on:** February 02, 2006, 09:13:40 PM »

Redhawk1, it's fun bantering with you. At 150 yds. It's mine with the .500.

I don't buy much ammo from stores but I stopped at two of the largest in the area. In Ft. Collins, CO. Jax and Sportsman's Warehouse. I didn't look to see what they had specially for the .500, but both places only had the Hornady 200 gr. bullet that looks like a rifle bullet on a donut diet. That was the only option in .460. Both places had more than one option for the .500. And, both places had the .460 in their cases. The kid behind the counter at Jax was quick to tell me that the .460 would send that bullet at around 2100 fps. Of course I'm not impressed because the .500 will do that with a 300 gr. bullet.

I'll bet either gun works better than trying to post replies on this forum using aol.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #21 on:** February 03, 2006, 02:04:44 AM »

Quote from: wyocarp

Redhawk1, it's fun bantering with you. At 150 yds. It's mine with the .500.

I don't buy much ammo from stores but I stopped at two of the largest in the area. In Ft. Collins, CO. Jax and Sportsman's Warehouse. I didn't look to see what they had specially for the .500, but both places only had the Hornady 200 gr. bullet that looks like a rifle bullet on a donut diet. That was the only option in .460. Both places had more than one option for the .500. And, both places had the .460 in their cases. The kid behind the counter at Jax was quick to tell me that the .460 would send that bullet at around 2100 fps. Of course I'm not impressed because the .500 will do that with a 300 gr. bullet.

I'll bet either gun works better than trying to post replies on this forum using aol.

I just got a sample of some 300 gr. cast bullets form Ranger Rick for the 460. mag. They are pointed like the Barnes bullets. I am going to give them a try in my 460 Mag. Yea, I am not a big fan of the 200 gr. Hornady bullets either, I would rather use a good 240 gr. XTP from Hornady. Boy do I know what you mean about AOL.

jro45 · « **Reply #22 on:** February 03, 2006, 03:13:26 AM »

I've been shooting my 500 for over 2 years now. Myself and Redhawk got our 500s about the same time. About a week apart, same dealer. Great gun the S&W 500.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #23 on:** February 03, 2006, 08:48:29 AM »

Quote from: jro45

I've been shooting my 500 for over 2 years now. Myself and Redhawk got our 500s about the same time. About a week apart, same dealer. Great gun the S&W 500.

When you going to shoot some case bullets in your 500 Mag.

jro45 · « **Reply #24 on:** February 04, 2006, 02:59:10 AM »

Redhawk asks When will I shoot some cast bullets in my gun. My answer is : I don't really know. I know with a skirt on them they won't lead your barrel. I don't know, just haven't done it yet. I'm not putting down lead, but really don't have any for my 500 to shoot. Maybe I'll see you at the range with your 500 and you'll let fire one of your's. Then I will have fired a cast bullet.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #25 on:** February 04, 2006, 08:00:48 AM »

Quote from: jro45

Redhawk asks When will I shoot some cast bullets in my gun. My answer is : I don't really know. I know with a skirt on them they won't lead your barrel. I don't know, just haven't done it yet. I'm not putting down lead, but really don't have any for my 500 to shoot. Maybe I'll see you at the range with your 500 and you'll let fire one of your's. Then I will have fired a cast bullet.

I'll do better than that, when I see you at the range I will bring you some 575 gr. cast bullets and the load data and you can load some up for yourself.

jro45 · « **Reply #26 on:** February 04, 2006, 09:00:44 AM »

All we have to do find a day when can meet then. I'll be at the range monday around 8 to 9 o'clock. If that works for you let me know.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #27 on:** February 04, 2006, 03:40:47 PM »

Quote from: jro45

All we have to do find a day when can meet then. I'll be at the range monday around 8 to 9 o'clock. If that works for you let me know.

I got a Dr. appointment in the morning. If not at the range you can e-mail me and maybe we can meet some where and I can give you some of them 575 gr. bullets.

Seakayaknc · « **Reply #28 on:** February 07, 2006, 02:37:29 PM »

Where does the Thompson Center 308 Pistol fall into this discussion of most powerful? I have one and love it...granted it isone shot. But if you can hit what you aim at....one is all you need ...

Thought?

Thanks

Ed

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #29 on:** February 07, 2006, 04:29:53 PM »

Quote from: Seakayaknc

Where does the Thompson Center 308 Pistol fall into this discussion of most powerful? I have one and love it...granted it isone shot. But if you can hit what you aim at....one is all you need ...

Thought?

Thanks

Ed

In the power factor it is not close to the 500 Mag. But it is still a great round.