Author Topic: Cannon Worm? (Read 3641 times)

Santa Dave · « **on:** January 27, 2006, 06:37:53 PM »

Ok, now that the "cannon worm" has bitten me.

and I have a Cannon (small) coming , Where would I find a real cannon worm in golf-ball size?
I can do the sponges, and even a shepard crooks rammer . I could make a brass worm , but the regs say steel. So now what?

Dave
PS does anyone have a date for Casper 2006 yet?
SD

kappullen · « **Reply #1 on:** January 28, 2006, 06:04:05 PM »

You need to make a double sided spring winder.

It's not really a hard thing to do.
There are some spring winding websited that show some basic tools and metbods.

http://home.earthlink.net/~bazillion/intro.html

This one has much good information and some links that may also help.

The worm in this picture was wound of 1/4 " diameter hrs in such a rig.

I used a slotted mandrel, with a double sided wire guide made from junk with old sparky and a torch.

Keep your body parts clear of the wire!

Kap

Squire Robin · « **Reply #2 on:** February 04, 2006, 12:04:14 PM »

I was struck dumb just after Christmas when the site logged me off and then the password stuff went all wrong :shock: Great to be back

What a lot of turns on that worm, surely one turn is enough?

best regards

Squire Robin

Artilleryman · « **Reply #3 on:** February 04, 2006, 05:29:24 PM »

I have wondered about the number of turns also, but I have found that they always had a reason for what they did that made sense.

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #4 on:** February 05, 2006, 03:35:29 AM »

Quote from: Artilleryman

I have wondered about the number of turns also, but I have found that they always had a reason for what they did that made sense.

Good point.

THanks Squire Robin for posting the picture!

I like the threaded hole - that says a large nut would be an easy place to start. Also hints at a fixture onto which the nut could be bolted for doing the tourch work in wrapping the tines.

Squire Robin · « **Reply #5 on:** February 05, 2006, 06:01:05 AM »

That's a commercial musket worm and only 5/8" diameter. I can't remember what it's for but it sure looks right for a cannon, apart from the thread :wink:

Santa Dave · « **Reply #6 on:** February 05, 2006, 07:38:32 AM »

Kap, you make it all sound so simple! "just make a double sided spring winder!" Belive me, that is beyond my capabilities! most of my shop now is Dremel size!
By the way the "Christmas Mortar" is coming along nicely. The side rails are done I have yer to find an extra long drill for the cross bolt holes but have had some health issues and the shop is down stairs.
Dave

opatriot · « **Reply #7 on:** February 05, 2006, 10:23:08 AM »

Gday Dave .....Im feel your pain ...if i cant make it with primitave tools , hammer drill and hacksaw im out of luck .......I just finished makng mine ...if this post works you can take a peek at it....http://photos.yahoo.com/difabiojr@sbcglobal.net .......I took brass rod 3/16 th,s ...., spun it around appropriate size dowel and ..wala .......I know everybody uses steel ..but this worked better for me ........Oh I also used to live in HELL but GOT OUT !!!!........happy sunday ...davey

GGaskill · « **Reply #8 on:** February 05, 2006, 12:24:45 PM »

Correct link from above post

A way to make a single point worm is to take a loosely wound compression spring of the right diameter and cut the coiled end off.

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #9 on:** February 05, 2006, 02:26:58 PM »

So, is that an I-did-it-myself made coil, or did you start with an actual coil spring?

Any road, how is it attached to the base piece and how is that attached to the pole?

LOOKS GOOD!

opatriot · « **Reply #10 on:** February 05, 2006, 03:00:46 PM »

Please Forgive me spellin folks ......Thanks GGaskill for coverin me back.........Do they make compression springs 1.75" ,where would they stock them ?? ..........thanx...........davey

GGaskill · « **Reply #11 on:** February 05, 2006, 05:33:26 PM »

It was a real compression coil spring from a real hardware store. Most real hardware stores have a spring department with around 50 or so common types of springs. I picked one that would fit the bore and took it home. It has a brass plug in the bottom with a 1/4-20 screw sticking out to screw into the multi-head cleaning rod you see it attached to. The spring is supposed to be soft soldered to the plug but I am not sure there is a really good joint there, although is has not come apart. But you could just fit a dowel inside the spring and make a worm with a dedicated handle.

For a 1.75" spring, consider garage door springs. They are tension springs so they would need to be raised to a red heat and stretched out some to spread the coils. They are way too long for just one worm but you might be able to find a broken one at a garage door shop and use it since there is no risk of the garage door falling on you if your worm breaks, which it wouldn't do anyway.

kappullen · « **Reply #12 on:** February 06, 2006, 12:34:10 PM »

Santa Dave,

I forget everyone dosen't have tons of equipment in their garage.

Seriously, I believe one of those pages has some very primative

winding setups done with all thread and a block of wood.

Be careful handling spring wire, or any type of wire around power equipment.

Kap

Powder keg · « **Reply #13 on:** February 06, 2006, 01:09:29 PM »

What do you mean Kap? Everyone Dosen't have a machine shop in there garage? I supose now you are also going to tell me now that there isn't a Santa Dave :-D :-D :-D

Squire Robin · « **Reply #14 on:** February 06, 2006, 01:45:31 PM »

Quote from: opatriot

Do they make compression springs 1.75" ,where would they stock them ??

Lee Spring go up to 1.96" diameter to fit a 2" hole. Good selection :-D

http://www.leespring.com

Santa Dave · « **Reply #15 on:** February 06, 2006, 06:36:27 PM »

Lee makes springs
right at 1.687" (My bore) Cut one, mount it sand it down for clearance, SOUNDS Great!
Maybe they should be in the referance lists!
Thanks guys! (I knew you would come through!)
Dave :grin:

Double D · « **Reply #16 on:** April 07, 2006, 04:53:00 PM »

Quote from: Squire Robin

Lee Spring go up to 1.96" diameter to fit a 2" hole. Good selection :-D

http://www.leespring.com

Added to the list finally!

dominick · « **Reply #17 on:** April 08, 2006, 08:28:24 AM »

Any thoughts on using stainless steel for construction of a worming tool head? Is there a spark problem with stainless if removing a charge bag that misfired? (thoroughly soaked of course)

GGaskill · « **Reply #18 on:** April 08, 2006, 10:07:53 AM »

Can't see any greater danger from stainless than from wrought iron or spring steel.

CaptTHighbiter · « **Reply #19 on:** April 12, 2006, 02:37:41 AM »

I have four barrels:

1.786 ( golf ball)

1.5"

1.312

.875

I just ordered coil springs from Associated Spring in st st. Lets see how hard this is going to be. At least I will get 4 shots at screwing it up!

Any further suggestions on how to proceed? Anneal the springs? Would a single tine work?

Santa Dave · « **Reply #20 on:** April 12, 2006, 07:30:25 AM »

Capt-sir:
The only thing I can think of is possably a problem with the shape not matching the breech end of the bore and of course you'd have to turn it twice as many times to get the same cleaning effect.

Dave

kappullen · « **Reply #21 on:** April 12, 2006, 09:33:15 AM »

Monday I went to the local packing and rubber house (o-rings, graphited yarn, gasket materials, etc.) for another project.

They had nice little packing pullers for pulling out graphited yarn from valves etc.

These pullers are perfect worms for cannon up to the 3/4" bore size.

Larger may be avalible.

Search "packing pullers" and yea shall find!

Kap

Doc Brown. · « **Reply #22 on:** May 19, 2012, 09:39:06 AM »

Is there any place out there that sells double helix worms in various sizes or made to order. Or is there any kind of book out there that tells you how to make one. I have this book here that talks about a double helix worm. Its not in front of me but let me try to quote it. "Double helix worms are hard to make. You can buy them or have a gunsmith with skill make them for you." The book is garbage and I have another book where W.F.G makes a single coil not double helix. I really want to buy or be able to make the double helix worm. I bought a spring from advanced auto and heated it up and stretched it in a contraption I devised. Then I cut it in half and tried to somehow make the double helix that way but I ran into a problem. You need a left hand spiral and a right hand spiral so the spring was no a waste of 5 bucks and now I'm going to try a piece of 1/8" round bar or something similar to bend around a bar but I'm worried my efforts may end in another screw up. Thanks.

Double D · « **Reply #23 on:** May 19, 2012, 10:20:05 AM »

Check with board sponsor Dominick Carpenter he makes worms to sell.

Zulu · « **Reply #24 on:** May 19, 2012, 12:16:32 PM »

Quote from: dockholidaiy on May 19, 2012, 09:39:06 AM

Is there any place out there that sells double helix worms in various sizes or made to order. Or is there any kind of book out there that tells you how to make one. I have this book here that talks about a double helix worm. Its not in front of me but let me try to quote it. "Double helix worms are hard to make. You can buy them or have a gunsmith with skill make them for you." The book is garbage and I have another book where W.F.G makes a single coil not double helix. I really want to buy or be able to make the double helix worm. I bought a spring from advanced auto and heated it up and stretched it in a contraption I devised. Then I cut it in half and tried to somehow make the double helix that way but I ran into a problem. You need a left hand spiral and a right hand spiral so the spring was no a waste of 5 bucks and now I'm going to try a piece of 1/8" round bar or something similar to bend around a bar but I'm worried my efforts may end in another screw up. Thanks.

dockholiday,
There are two spirals and they go in the same direction. If they went in opposite directions they would run in to each other.
If you are interested, PM me for a price.
Zulu
By the way. That three piece set on my libraray wall is for sale at $360 plus shipping and packaging. I ship then in light weight PVC conduit to prevent damage. 1 1/2" Oak staffs and walnut heads with oak pegs to secure the heads. Made for a 3" bore. Long enough for a Parrott or an Ordnance rifle. Looks great hanging on the wall!

Wall mount is extra.

Doc Brown. · « **Reply #25 on:** May 19, 2012, 01:47:31 PM »

Quote from: Double D on May 19, 2012, 10:20:05 AM

Check with board sponsor Dominick Carpenter he makes worms to sell.

I sent him pm yesterday but no response yet. I like Zulu's worms though. Heres a pic of the double helix I was trying to make.

Zulu · « **Reply #26 on:** May 19, 2012, 03:20:00 PM »

Quote from: dockholidaiy on May 19, 2012, 01:47:31 PM

Quote from: Double D on May 19, 2012, 10:20:05 AM
Check with board sponsor Dominick Carpenter he makes worms to sell.

I sent him pm yesterday but no response yet. I like Zulu's worms though. Heres a pic of the double helix I was trying to make.

The spirals are going in the same direction.
Zulu

Doc Brown. · « **Reply #27 on:** May 19, 2012, 04:20:03 PM »

It looks so easy to make with a heavy spring but every time I look at it it makes my head hurt. Are you sure they are going in the same direction on the pic I posted It looks like they are different to me.

Double D · « **Reply #28 on:** May 19, 2012, 06:08:46 PM »

Ofcourse they are going in thew same direction, if they went in opposite direction they would cross over each other.

GGaskill · « **Reply #29 on:** May 19, 2012, 07:15:57 PM »

For any chance of making one of those easily, you will have to make some tooling to hold the barstock while you are bending it. It needs an open slot across one end for the round to go through while bending and to slide off the fixture when it is done.It will need a bolt on handle so you can clamp and otherwise manipulate it while forming. It would be nice to have grooves on the sides to guide the forming but those would be hard to do unless you can do helical milling.